Rumor: Trade Rumors/Proposals 2018-2019 (Part 16)

[Riceroni]

I don't like him that much, but I do think if someone were to trade for him now they'd get a great deal. His value has never been lower and I don't see him being worse than a 60 point player in the near future. I'd do that proposed deal and run.

If he was on our team and getting 50-60 points on a great contract, you'd f'ing love him

 

[danielpalfredsson]

We traded Duschene for a mid late first and a 3rd (Davidson). We traded Stone for a late first (EB). Stone basically came with an 8 year deal.

You can't compare the dynamic of trading a UFA to trading a player with term.

Even Stone getting an extension doesn't make it the same thing, because there is still the dynamic there where if the team doesn't pull the trigger on the best offer, they are going to lose the player to free agency.

If Nylander was a UFA, a 1st/2nd/Demelo would probably be on par with what he'd get. Maybe a bit high. He's not a UFA. He's signed for five more seasons, and in the proposed scenario the Leafs further inflate his value by paying his July 1st bonus. It just doesn't make a lot of sense.

Lol Carolina isn't trading Pesce for Nylander. Nylander isn't worth even close to that much.

NHL Rumors: McKenzie Updates On William Nylander And Potential Teams Interested - MyNHLTradeRumors.com

“It gets complicated, and here’s why. We said all along that a team like the Carolina Hurricanes were interested, and they are – but for the right price. So our sense of it is that Brett Pesce would be available to the Toronto Maple Leafs, but Jaccob Slavin wouldn’t be. And I do expect that the Carolina Hurricanes and the Toronto Maple Leafs will continue to have dialogue over the course of the week.”

You're making it sound absurd, but it's not like I am floating this idea of Pesce for Nylander out of thin air. It was a prevailing story when Nylander was holding out. There is a quote from Bob McKenzie above on the situation.

I get that things have changed in the last few months. The Hurricanes are on a deep run. The Hurricanes also were able to add some offense without dealing one of their defenders. Nylander also had a down season. With Nylander, I think teams who liked him won't let a down season after holding out and missing training camp hurt their evaluation of him that was based on a much greater sample size.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Maybe Ristolainen for Nylander and unite the brothers in Buffalo. Toronto gets their RD. Although if you listen to Toronto fans Liljegren is right there ready for the next step and Sandin is the second coming. Some Leafs fan actually started a Sandin vs Brannstrom poll. Its not going as he'd hoped at this point.

 

[Sweatred]

You can't compare the dynamic of trading a UFA to trading a player with term.

Even Stone getting an extension doesn't make it the same thing, because there is still the dynamic there where if the team doesn't pull the trigger on the best offer, they are going to lose the player to free agency.

If Nylander was a UFA, a 1st/2nd/Demelo would probably be on par with what he'd get. Maybe a bit high. He's not a UFA. He's signed for five more seasons, and in the proposed scenario the Leafs further inflate his value by paying his July 1st bonus. It just doesn't make a lot of sense.



NHL Rumors: McKenzie Updates On William Nylander And Potential Teams Interested - MyNHLTradeRumors.com

“It gets complicated, and here’s why. We said all along that a team like the Carolina Hurricanes were interested, and they are – but for the right price. So our sense of it is that Brett Pesce would be available to the Toronto Maple Leafs, but Jaccob Slavin wouldn’t be. And I do expect that the Carolina Hurricanes and the Toronto Maple Leafs will continue to have dialogue over the course of the week.”

You're making it sound absurd, but it's not like I am floating this idea of Pesce for Nylander out of thin air. It was a prevailing story when Nylander was holding out. There is a quote from Bob McKenzie above on the situation.

I get that things have changed in the last few months. The Hurricanes are on a deep run. The Hurricanes also were able to add some offense without dealing one of their defenders. Nylander also had a down season. With Nylander, I think teams who liked him won't let a down season after holding out and missing training camp hurt their evaluation of him that was based on a much greater sample size.

I don’t think any team would give a first plus for Willy. Maybe a late 2019 1R pick at best and most of those teams don’t have the cap space. He was a mess this year on and off the ice.

 

[stempniaksen]

People are way too quick to turn on/write off Willy Nylander, imo.

Wait until next season, when he gets a full training camp and (likely) goes back to playing full-time with Matthews. I suspect he'll be back to pacing at 60+ points, he's too good not to.

If he's available I seriously hope Dorion takes a run, even though the price would (likely) be quite high. This kid is in the right age bracket and would instantly become our most talented forward (not our best, but the guy is dripping with talent). He'd also fill an organizational weakness on RW (not that it should matter at this stage of the rebuild, but still).

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Ceci + Tierney/2nd + 2nd for Nylander, Zaitsev and Marleau (assuming we have a 2nd buyout window opened)

We buyout Marleau and he re-signs there

Leafs clear ~15.5mil in cap space, not counting Ceci, and we add ~15.5mil in cap hit but only, like, 25k in real salary (assuming we send them Tierney)

We get Nylander, who would probably be our top fwd next year at least.... also, his salary is only 700k next year. Essentially, we'd be getting Nylander for 24.7mil over the next 5yrs, which is an absolute steal.

Zaitsev isn't great but he is an NHL DMan on the right side. After July 1st, which is when the trade would have to happen, Zaitsev is only owed 1.5m. We'd be getting him for 19.5m over 5 yrs, which is 3.9 mil but his contract doesnt have a bonus in the lockout years, so it could be 15m/4 years, or 3.75m per year. Not a great deal but not crippling.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

I don't think we have anything that is a match to get Nylander, unless the Leafs inexplicably really like Ceci and we take Zaitsev.

If the Leafs deal Marner at the draft because they don't want to give him the Matthews contract, it wouldn't surprise me to see them try and package deal Zaitsev and Marner. That would be a good chance to get someone to take Zaitsev's contract. Marner will have a ton of value, so maybe they could pull it off.

Worst case scenario for everybody else would be the Leafs dealing Marner and Zaitsev for a package with one of the top two picks in the draft coming back to them, and then something absolutely ridiculous like Toronto getting another superstar free agent for the second season in a row. They would have basically traded Marner+Zaitsev for Top Free agent (Panarin, Duchene, Karlsson, etc)+Hughes or Kakko. In the short term, that would put them over the top.

 

[BondraTime]

Nylander is going to be a very, very good offensive winger.

The guy is 22, and he never had a training camp nor first few months of the season.

Any team would be lucky and happy to have him, it just so happens that the Leafs are stocked on offensive forwards ahead of him making big bank (Or will be). It just seems so simple to understand that he should be traded to fill the need on D, which if the Pesche rumours were true should have been made immediately.

 

[Sweatred]

Nylander is going to be a very, very good offensive winger.

The guy is 22, and he never had a training camp nor first few months of the season.

Any team would be lucky and happy to have him, it just so happens that the Leafs are stocked on offensive forwards ahead of him making big bank (Or will be). It just seems so simple to understand that he should be traded to fill the need on D, which if the Pesche rumours were true should have been made immediately.

I’m the first of the WN bandwagon. He looked apathetic and ineffective. Duclair is about the same age. It’s hard to predict what he will do next season. I’m glad it’s not my money.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

People are way too quick to turn on/write off Willy Nylander, imo.

Wait until next season, when he gets a full training camp and (likely) goes back to playing full-time with Matthews. I suspect he'll be back to pacing at 60+ points, he's too good not to.

If he's available I seriously hope Dorion takes a run, even though the price would (likely) be quite high. This kid is in the right age bracket and would instantly become our most talented forward (not our best, but the guy is dripping with talent). He'd also fill an organizational weakness on RW (not that it should matter at this stage of the rebuild, but still).

There is little doubt in my mind that Nylander ends up a star winger.

Thing is, this was the year to go deep with a cheap roster.

 

[stempniaksen]

There is little doubt in my mind that Nylander ends up a star winger.

Thing is, this was the year to go deep with a cheap roster.

You might be right.

I'm fairly high on some of their younger guys who I think can step into the lineup next year on ELC's and I think they can shed cap if they absolutely have to (Gardiner and Hainsey are UFA's and they could move Kadri/Kapanen/Johnson/Zaitsev if needed). Things are obviously tight with 4 guys making $38+ million, but I think they can pull it off for another season or two. I'm not impressed by their drafting outside the top two rounds in the Dubas era, so maybe that catches up with them beyond that.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

I'm starting to get a Hoffman vibe from Nylander. Dude has some incredible talents....but he's missing something at the NHL level that will keep his value separate from what his raw stats suggest.

 

[Tuna99]

I'm starting to get a Hoffman vibe from Nylander. Dude has some incredible talents....but he's missing something at the NHL level that will keep his value separate from what his raw stats suggest.

Both are afraid of the middle of the ice.

 

[stempniaksen]

I'm starting to get a Hoffman vibe from Nylander. Dude has some incredible talents....but he's missing something at the NHL level that will keep his value separate from what his raw stats suggest.

I understand the comparison because they are both offensive wingers, but at Nylander's age Hoffman had 4 NHL games under his belt with no goals or points. I guess if you're under the impression Nylander has somehow stagnated in development I guess it might be an apt comparison, but I think he's got a lot more to show (certainly more than he showed this season).

 

[Ouroboros]

Do we think there is any truth to Ray Ferraro's recent speculation that the Senators might be interested in trading for Loui Eriksson? Or is it just a guy who doesn't realize how easy it will be for the Sens to hit the cap floor?

The only deal that seems to make sense is something around Eriksson for Bobby Ryan, with the Senators adding a pick or two for the cash savings. Once the Canucks pay Eriksson's bonus on July 1st, he's only owed 9M vs Ryan's 22.5M.

Something to think about I guess.

 

[Micklebot]

Do we think there is any truth to Ray Ferraro's recent speculation that the Senators might be interested in trading for Loui Eriksson? Or is it just a guy who doesn't realize how easy it will be for the Sens to hit the cap floor?

The only deal that seems to make sense is something around Eriksson for Bobby Ryan, with the Senators adding a pick or two for the cash savings. Once the Canucks pay Eriksson's bonus on July 1st, he's only owed 9M vs Ryan's 22.5M.

Something to think about I guess.

Yeah, that adds up, we trade for arguably the worse player and give up the extra asset...

 

[Ouroboros]

Yeah, that adds up, we trade for arguably the worse player and give up the extra asset...

The Senators have paid picks for purely financial reasons in the past, and will likely continue to do so.

Hard to put a price on a 13M cash savings with a negligible cap impact.

 

[Micklebot]

The Senators have paid picks for purely financial reasons in the past, and will likely continue to do so.

Hard to put a price on a 13M cash savings with a negligible cap impact.

Sadly, I agree...

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Do we think there is any truth to Ray Ferraro's recent speculation that the Senators might be interested in trading for Loui Eriksson? Or is it just a guy who doesn't realize how easy it will be for the Sens to hit the cap floor?

The only deal that seems to make sense is something around Eriksson for Bobby Ryan, with the Senators adding a pick or two for the cash savings. Once the Canucks pay Eriksson's bonus on July 1st, he's only owed 9M vs Ryan's 22.5M.

Something to think about I guess.

Sounds like a Melnyk wearing his POHO hat move

 

[Ouroboros]

Another Eriksson possibility:

We send Vancouver a couple of our short-term salary dumps [Boedker and Condon?] and we get Eriksson and a pick in return. If this happens after July 1st it saves Melnyk 5M on the 19/20 payroll and is essentially cap neutral. It adds 6M in cap for the following 2 seasons for a total cash outlay of 8M.

Similar to the Dion Phaneuf deal I guess.

 

[Sensmileletsgo]

There's an article from NHL.com today with Duchene saying he is going to test free agency. He said Columbus is still an option, but it's difficult to imagine him waiting until free agency to sign with Columbus and giving up that 8th year.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Do we think there is any truth to Ray Ferraro's recent speculation that the Senators might be interested in trading for Loui Eriksson? Or is it just a guy who doesn't realize how easy it will be for the Sens to hit the cap floor?

The only deal that seems to make sense is something around Eriksson for Bobby Ryan, with the Senators adding a pick or two for the cash savings. Once the Canucks pay Eriksson's bonus on July 1st, he's only owed 9M vs Ryan's 22.5M.

Something to think about I guess.

It's just him throwing out an idea.

It doesn't make any sense as a cap dump trade. He is owed too much cash. This includes a 4M lockout bonus.

Eriksson for Ryan in some form might make sense, but Eriksson's lockout bonus is 2M larger than Ryan's bonus.

 

[dumbdick]

Did Duchene play well enough to get re-signed by the jackets? I heard a quote from Matt that sounded suspiciously like the shit he said here about being open to staying (which was clearly bullshit in retrospect).

 

[dumbdick]

There's an article from NHL.com today with Duchene saying he is going to test free agency. He said Columbus is still an option, but it's difficult to imagine him waiting until free agency to sign with Columbus and giving up that 8th year.

He has the jackets where Bobby Ryan had us. Player has all the leverage and can go for the jugular.... unless you're a class act like stone of course.

 

[Ouroboros]

It's just him throwing out an idea.

It doesn't make any sense as a cap dump trade. He is owed too much cash. This includes a 4M lockout bonus.

Eriksson for Ryan in some form might make sense, but Eriksson's lockout bonus is 2M larger than Ryan's bonus.

I don't think an extra 2M in bonuses should discourage the Senators from cutting 10+M off their total payroll. If money is that tight then the team should be folded. Mostly I don't see an incentive for Vancouver to do an Eriksson/Ryan swap.

I think my second proposal [Eriksson and futures for Condon and Boedker] makes more sense. Sens get an immediate 5M reduction in payroll, dump unwanted contracts, add futures, and add 18M to their cap [over 3 years] for essentially 3M in cash once you factor out the 6M owed to the dead weight going to Vancouver.