Value of: Torts Losing His Damn Mind

CommissionerGordon

Registered User
Mar 10, 2017
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Panarin will not re-sign. Like how Tavares wouldn't re-sign. Or Karlsson wouldn't re-sign. It's like when your team sucks, the player, especially with hockey guys, they care more about winning than they do about the money. The money is nice, and they'll take a hometown discount if the team will win, and sacrificing a few extra mil is like, what the hell, I don't really need it, and we'll be better off as a team. Panarin doesn't strike me as a guy that takes less money. He's more like a mercenary. He doesn't strike me as a guy who stays in Columbus. He's more brash and bold and about the limelight and who can blame him it sounds like a dream.

I think the Blue Jackets could use a hockey player that doesn't really care about the money that wants to play and is a good, young player with upside. This would be Jake Guentzel. They're also kind of weak at center and their depth there doesn't really strike me as dynamic. If they can get someone that fits their style of play as a skilled grinder that plays a two-way game and is a crab in front of the net that gets some cheap goals they'll be better at that position. This is basically what Derick Brassard brings to the table.

The Penguins, if they're willing to give up Guentzel, would be a nice trade partner to land Panarin. They have a ton of depth at center and Brassard would be a nice addition to the Blue Jackets. You can give me tears. but he's another guy that strikes me as a guy who doesn't really care about the money - most hockey players are. So, if you give him $6m a year that will be more than enough for Brassard. I'm not looking at Brassard as a rental, but as a nice piece that keeps moving the Blue Jackets in the right direction. I think this trade improves the Jackets short-term, vaulting them into the 100 pt discussion, as opposed to a distraction all year round that is detrimental to the team and they have a down year and fall in that 80-90 pt range. Probably picking 12-15th.


I like this trade for the Penguins because they have depth at center that they can afford to lose. Outside of Kessel, they don't have any wingers that make Crosby and Malkin better. This would finally give Malkin his winger. The Penguins seem to like to pair their wingers with a center and Malkin-Panarin and maybe it's time to go with Crosby-Kessel. This solves Kessel's problem and when you put Hagelin on that top line you got the speed and Crosby's playmaking ability instead of Bonino, Sheahan, or Brassard.



PIT trades Jake Guentzel, Derick Brassard, Brian Dumoulin, and 2019 1st rd pick to CLB for Artemi Panarin and Ryan Murray


On Murray and Dumo swap. Murray brings better skating and a better stick. Columbus would want a defenseman going back the other way. A 1st rd pick completes the overpay. I'd like to hear why this isn't a good deal and why it's not of value. This deal is also cap compliant.
 

Eric Robson

Registered User
Jan 5, 2018
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Funny enough the value is there, but I cant see Pits doing that. They've already proven with that core that they can win the cup.
 

Gurglesons

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Dec 18, 2009
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I’m not normally a Pens homer, but your assessment of Jake and Dumo is really off.

Jake could easily be a 70 pt winger this year.

Dumo is at worst a # 3 defenseman on his best days he is the Penguins Vlasic.

And you’re asking us to trade Brassard and a 1st for a moderate upgrade on Jake and Ryan Murray.

NONONO NONONO
 

Tweed

Registered User
Jun 25, 2006
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I'd love to have Panarin, and I'm sure Murray would be great, but I don't want to abandon the proven magic of Guentzel + Sid, and Dumo as our only shutdown guy. I also really like Jake and Dumo.

I just feel like we'd be giving up way too much term-certainty, and cost-certainty... for what we might hope amounts to a lateral move. We'd have another hole at 3C. After spending the better part of last year worrying about 3C before we got Brass, I really don't want to go back into that headspace. I also want to see what a healthy & comfortable Brassard can do... I have a good feeling about him.
 

mikeyp24

Registered User
Jun 28, 2014
5,959
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No on Brassard and no on trading Murray this year. Murray and Atkinson are 2 of the more underrated players in the league 1 because size and the other because injuries.

Also Panarin to the Pens would never happen via trade unless beyond stupid overpayment. Why give the best player in your teams history to your rival? No sense...
 

DudeWhereIsMakar

Bergevin sent me an offer sheet
Apr 25, 2014
15,668
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I think Torts will be in Columbus for a while after he helped push the franchise forward. Even when they suck Torts will remain there.
 

rynryn

Reluctant Optimist. Permanently Déclassé.
May 29, 2008
33,315
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Torts was just on Sirius. I had a screaming 4yo in the car with me so i didn't catch if he named specific cities but He did say he appreciated Panerin being upfront and honest about his intention to play in a "big" city and i would imagine that'd be LA, Chicago, or NY
 

Drake1588

UNATCO
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Jul 2, 2002
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As a Caps fan... yeah, the Pens are getting borked pretty badly here. Panarin is dazzling, but he is still a rental. Yet going the other way, Dumoulin alone is an excellent young defenseman. With the number of years that he is under team control, and at a $4.1M contract for five more years, he is arguably the most valuable asset in the deal. Add Guentzel, add Brassard, and toss in a pick, and ... this is a very unrealistic haul for Columbus.

Panarin is an excellent player, but his rental status means that he is worth a tremendous rental-type haul at the deadline in February: One first rounder (#25 to #31 overall) plus a good to very good prospect. Perhaps another pick, like a second rounder.

That's about all one last year under contract is worth, even for a player as good as Panarin. This is why it might just be best for the Blue Jackets to keep him and let him walk in July. Their stellar team should get a last kick at the can together.
 

SEALBound

Fancy Gina Carano
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Jun 13, 2010
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Strong, STRONG no from the Penguins.

When I was reading, I'm like Guentzel for Panarin...hmmmm...still no but it's an interesting trade.

Then you say Penguins add 2C Brassard...and a top pairing dman Dumoulin...AND a 1st...and CBJ tosses in a 2nd pairing meh dman.

JFC no. You had something...then you killed it.
 

major major

Registered User
Feb 18, 2013
14,598
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Panarin is an excellent player, but his rental status means that he is worth a tremendous rental-type haul at the deadline in February: One first rounder (#25 to #31 overall) plus a good to very good prospect. Perhaps another pick, like a second rounder.

That's about all one last year under contract is worth, even for a player as good as Panarin. This is why it might just be best for the Blue Jackets to keep him and let him walk in July. Their stellar team should get a last kick at the can together.

Agreed on the rest of it, but that is your idea of what constitutes a "tremendous rental type haul"? A late 1st and a good prospect is the regular return for a low-end first liner rental. That's the Andrew Ladd package. You're not the only one doing this - I've seen several posts where folks say that is what the return should be. Heck maybe that's all it would be. But you'd think Artemi Panarin, the guy who nearly knocked off the Caps by himself, would be worth at least double what Ladd got.

And if he's not, I agree that the Jackets should just go for it.
 

Riptide

Registered User
Dec 29, 2011
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Yukon
PIT trades Jake Guentzel, Derick Brassard, Brian Dumoulin, and 2019 1st rd pick to CLB for Artemi Panarin and Ryan Murray


On Murray and Dumo swap. Murray brings better skating and a better stick. Columbus would want a defenseman going back the other way. A 1st rd pick completes the overpay. I'd like to hear why this isn't a good deal and why it's not of value. This deal is also cap compliant.

f*** no for Pittsburgh. It's a shame that you spend that much time writing something 95% of Penguin fans will say no to.

On a side note, even if someone is a "better skater then Dumoulin", Dumoulin's skating and stick is easily good enough as it is to the point that we don't need an upgrade on him - unless your talking a Fowler type of blueliner who's a top pairing guy. And I'd take Dumoulin over Murray every day of the week - especially when Murray needs a new contract.

As for the trade itself, why the hell would Pittsburgh move Guentzel, Brassard, Dumoulin and a 1st to downgrade to R.Murray and pick up a rental in Panarin? Guentzel is going to be fine, and he will make a lot less than Panarin.

This would make more sense if you swapped Maatta in instead of Dumoulin. I still wouldn't do it, but at least then you're "better skating" angle would make a lot more sense.
 

Bluto

Don't listen to me, I'm an idiot. TOGA! TOGA!
Dec 24, 2017
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It would make Pitt better... but it would also make Columbus a huge threat due to their deptch. Just not a trade you make as a conference rival.
 

Tom Hanks

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Nov 10, 2017
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Yeah....nah

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Tom Hanks

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Nov 10, 2017
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It would make Pitt better... but it would also make Columbus a huge threat due to their deptch. Just not a trade you make as a conference rival.

No it would not.
 

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