Friedman: Toronto and SJ could pursue Panarnin as a rental.

[DoobieDubas]

I mean you are just showing why you shouldnt be in charge of a team. Regardless of winning a cup it is important for players and fans to know you can win every year and be contenders. Trading your best player for scraps just to get something isnt showing a commitment to.winning. Maybe from a fans narrow pov of just wanting to feel like you lost out on getting something in return if he leaves it.makes sense but as a business it makes no sense to sell at bargin prices just to act like you didnt lose out. Lets see our Roster...

Defense
Jones
Werenski
Savard
Murray
Nutivaara
Kukan
Carlsson
Peake
Gavrikov

That defense is not only stacked but there is 1 player over the age of like 25 in savard. Theres 3 not on the team that we feel could easily make the team and Kukan after years of most of us feeling he should be there and having a great AHL allstar season finally has room with JJ gone and next year Gavrikov is finally out of his KHL contract to come over to an already stacked D where we will likely have to trade Murray or Savard. So we dont need D or prospects there.

Goalies
Bob
Korpisalo
Elvis
Tarasov
New finish guy who was the best Liiga goalie and has only been passed over in drafts because size

Thats not even counting our AHL guys. We are stupid deep in goalies so again no point.

Forwards

Panarin PLD Atkinson
Jenner Wennberg Anderson
Foligno Nash Bjorkstrand
Milano Dubi Sedlak


Prospects- Foudy, Texier, Khril, Davidsson, Abramov

RW we are 100% set. We xould use a 4th line guy but prospects and older vets can fit there not auper important.

LW outside of Panarin is very average. We dont NEED one but there are a couple that could use more development like Milano taking a step but for the most part again not much needed. Minor upgrades but if we did that we would need to move one with. Like Milano+ for better LW.

C is again not horrible. It is now with the addition lf nash probably like exact middle. Both PLD and Wennberg are 1B type centers. Wennberg has gotten better evey year but last year and that was because he played most of the year with a back injury. So even if he doesnt improve but produces at the season befores pace hes a 60pt good 2 way playmaking C. Dubi at 4C and Nash as a 3 is perfect. So if we could again trade Wennberg+ for a slughtly better C sure you can upgrade but where.


So seeing the roster what would you Trade Panarin for? We absolutely dont need D, G, or RW and only need minor upgrades with the LW and C. So what mives do you make? Our best prospects are Cs and LW. So we might already have our upgrades in the system.

My friend I agree with your points but the guy wants to leave or am I mistaken? If he wants to stay then sign that guy asap. If he wants to leave after this year id trade him and not for scraps you will get a boatload for him that will add to your core your referring to. What would you take from edmonton if they offered for him? You could sell it beautifully...mcdavid and panarin instead of mcdcvid and meh

 

[CBJFan827]

My friend I agree with your points but the guy wants to leave or am I mistaken? If he wants to stay then sign that guy asap. If he wants to leave after this year id trade him and not for scraps you will get a boatload for him that will add to your core your referring to. What would you take from edmonton if they offered for him? You could sell it beautifully...mcdavid and panarin instead of mcdcvid and meh

Kailer Yamamoto, Ryan Strome, Caleb Jones, and a pick.

We won't get that.

We also don't know what Panarin wants. I doubt Panarin knows what he wants, other than hope Columbus fans won't hate him after all this.

 

[mikeyp24]

Good to know. You’re only further proving my point anyhow. Joe Thornton had back to back 90 assist seasons and still never won a Cup. PLD has 48 points in his career. He’s obviously not a #1C.

Exactly goes to show you 1 player doesnt win a cup whether your 1C has 90 or 50 points you need a whole team to win thanks for proving my point further.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

Exactly goes to show you 1 player doesnt win a cup whether your 1C has 90 or 50 points you need a whole team to win thanks for proving my point further.

Here is a list of teams who have won a Stanley Cup with a #1C the caliber of PLD:

 

[mikeyp24]

My friend I agree with your points but the guy wants to leave or am I mistaken? If he wants to stay then sign that guy asap. If he wants to leave after this year id trade him and not for scraps you will get a boatload for him that will add to your core your referring to. What would you take from edmonton if they offered for him? You could sell it beautifully...mcdavid and panarin instead of mcdcvid and meh

He hasnt expressed desire to leave. He has just said he isnt sure if he wants to sign here 8 years. He has said he loved the coach, teams, and fans and if it was 2 years the deal would be over. So he told management that that he is unsure about signing him long term and its rumored there are a few teams he would be willing to sign long term. Its possible he signs here or walks. But based on our team make up it would be stupid to waste a year of maybe winning a series in the playoffs for a rental price for Panarin.

 

[mikeyp24]

Here is a list of teams who have won a Stanley Cup with a #1C the caliber of PLD:

Looks like the number of games you watch him play then

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

Looks like the number of games you watch him play then

“Watch the games nerd!” Yeah, what an argument. Literally the worst one out. You have literally no evidence to back the notion that PLD is a #1C because none exists because it simply isn’t the truth.

The average Stanley Cup #1 center, over the past 10 years, has been either a 70 point scoring Selke winner, or a 90 point scorer. PLD would need to add 22 points to his output and become a Selke level defensive center, or he would need to score 42 more points in order to match up to the average Stanley Cup #1C. And yeah, I’ve watched PLD play, and he’s not a #1C. My argument immediately blows yours out of the water because we’re tied in baseless anecdotal evidence and so my actual statistical evidence that puts PLD in an entirely different class from Stanley Cup #1Cs.

#1 Centers are the most important thing in Stanley Cup Playoff hockey, by far. People are saying that Columbus is going into this coming season no worse than Washington went into last season, but that simply isn’t true. Washington had a perennial 70-80 point center who was one notch below Selke level and another 70+ point center who had yet to break out. Columbus is missing a center that can compare to either of those guys and so they actually do look worse than Washington did at the start of last year. On no planet is PLD comparable to Backstrom or Kuznetsov and you should be willing to admit that if you watch him so much, because your favorite team got curb stomped by this very team with two #1Cs. Kuznetsov had 3 goals and 4 assists against your team, Backstrom has 2 goals and 6 assists, and PLD had 2 goals and 2 assists in that series.

Speaking of telling people what they do and don’t watch; you should start watching more Stanley Cup Playoff hockey, and paying very close attention to the #1Cs on each team that wins the Stanley Cup, and the #1Cs on the “Cinderella story” teams that lose after a few rounds. It’s the biggest factor that always seems to separate them. While you’re at it, you should really review the playoff series where your favorite team blew a 2-0 lead to a team with two #1Cs because your team had none, and then come back into this thread and try to tell me PLD is anywhere near Backstrom and Kuznetsov. Really, just see if you can watch him get his pants taken down and his bottom spanked by Kuznetsov and Backstrom, and then come back into this thread and tell me he is a Stanley Cup #1C.

 

[mikeyp24]

“Watch the games nerd!” Yeah, what an argument. Literally the worst one out. You have literally no evidence to back the notion that PLD is a #1C because none exists because it simply isn’t the truth.

The average Stanley Cup #1 center, over the past 10 years, has been either a 70 point scoring Selke winner, or a 90 point scorer. PLD would need to add 22 points to his output and become a Selke level defensive center, or he would need to score 42 more points in order to match up to the average Stanley Cup #1C. And yeah, I’ve watched PLD play, and he’s not a #1C. My argument immediately blows yours out of the water because we’re tied in baseless anecdotal evidence and so my actual statistical evidence that puts PLD in an entirely different class from Stanley Cup #1Cs.

#1 Centers are the most important thing in Stanley Cup Playoff hockey, by far. People are saying that Columbus is going into this coming season no worse than Washington went into last season, but that simply isn’t true. Washington had a perennial 70-80 point center who was one notch below Selke level and another 70+ point center who had yet to break out. Columbus is missing a center that can compare to either of those guys and so they actually do look worse than Washington did at the start of last year. On no planet is PLD comparable to Backstrom or Kuznetsov and you should be willing to admit that if you watch him so much, because your favorite team got curb stomped by this very team with two #1Cs. Kuznetsov had 3 goals and 4 assists against your team, Backstrom has 2 goals and 6 assists, and PLD had 2 goals and 2 assists in that series.

Speaking of telling people what they do and don’t watch; you should start watching more Stanley Cup Playoff hockey, and paying very close attention to the #1Cs on each team that wins the Stanley Cup, and the #1Cs on the “Cinderella story” teams that lose after a few rounds. It’s the biggest factor that always seems to separate them. While you’re at it, you should really review the playoff series where your favorite team blew a 2-0 lead to a team with two #1Cs because your team had none, and then come back into this thread and try to tell me PLD is anywhere near Backstrom and Kuznetsov. Really, just see if you can watch him get his pants taken down and his bottom spanked by Kuznetsov and Backstrom, and then come back into this thread and tell me he is a Stanley Cup #1C.

I mean he is as much as Thorton...

 

[Chuck Norris Trophy]

Who is Panarnin?

 

[CBJx614]

“Watch the games nerd!” Yeah, what an argument. Literally the worst one out. You have literally no evidence to back the notion that PLD is a #1C because none exists because it simply isn’t the truth.

The average Stanley Cup #1 center, over the past 10 years, has been either a 70 point scoring Selke winner, or a 90 point scorer. PLD would need to add 22 points to his output and become a Selke level defensive center, or he would need to score 42 more points in order to match up to the average Stanley Cup #1C. And yeah, I’ve watched PLD play, and he’s not a #1C. My argument immediately blows yours out of the water because we’re tied in baseless anecdotal evidence and so my actual statistical evidence that puts PLD in an entirely different class from Stanley Cup #1Cs.

#1 Centers are the most important thing in Stanley Cup Playoff hockey, by far. People are saying that Columbus is going into this coming season no worse than Washington went into last season, but that simply isn’t true. Washington had a perennial 70-80 point center who was one notch below Selke level and another 70+ point center who had yet to break out. Columbus is missing a center that can compare to either of those guys and so they actually do look worse than Washington did at the start of last year. On no planet is PLD comparable to Backstrom or Kuznetsov and you should be willing to admit that if you watch him so much, because your favorite team got curb stomped by this very team with two #1Cs. Kuznetsov had 3 goals and 4 assists against your team, Backstrom has 2 goals and 6 assists, and PLD had 2 goals and 2 assists in that series.

Speaking of telling people what they do and don’t watch; you should start watching more Stanley Cup Playoff hockey, and paying very close attention to the #1Cs on each team that wins the Stanley Cup, and the #1Cs on the “Cinderella story” teams that lose after a few rounds. It’s the biggest factor that always seems to separate them. While you’re at it, you should really review the playoff series where your favorite team blew a 2-0 lead to a team with two #1Cs because your team had none, and then come back into this thread and try to tell me PLD is anywhere near Backstrom and Kuznetsov. Really, just see if you can watch him get his pants taken down and his bottom spanked by Kuznetsov and Backstrom, and then come back into this thread and tell me he is a Stanley Cup #1C.

I mean... The kid is 19... That's not too bad for your first full season in the NHL when literally everyone was saying it was a mistake for him to be drafted 3rd.

Let's have this conversation in a few years. How many kids come into the league and are immediately 1Cs in the league? While he may not be a true 1C, he's on the path to becoming one.

 

[bansheebeat]

I mean he is as much as Thorton...

Wait, are you are saying that Joe Thornton - maybe the best passer of the last couple decades, and 16th ALL-TIME in points - isn't more of a #1C than PLD?

 

[Nashology]

Lol...Thornton had like 10 less points in 35 less games last year than PLD.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

I mean he is as much as Thorton...

In the years that the Sharks had their strongest teams and still lost, it often was because he was out-performed by the other team’s #1C. The funny thing is that even with his poor playoff performances, Thornton is still in a class of player that PLD will likely never enter. Thornton is totally not relevant to this thread, though.

I mean... The kid is 19... That's not too bad for your first full season in the NHL when literally everyone was saying it was a mistake for him to be drafted 3rd.

Let's have this conversation in a few years. How many kids come into the league and are immediately 1Cs in the league? While he may not be a true 1C, he's on the path to becoming one.

We can have that conversation, in a different thread right now or in a few years because it’s a completely different conversation and it’s not on topic. He might be on that path, but he’s not at that level right now.

The initial statement was that the Jackets, right now, are no worse of a team than the Capitals were going into the 2017-2018 season. I’m saying that is incorrect because the Capitals had 1 superstar center and 1 budding superstar center who already had a season in their career where they played at that Stanley Cup #1C level or at least close. And this is relevant to the topic at hand because a suggestion was made that the Jackets should just keep Panarin and try to win this year since their roster is no worse than Washington’s was at the start of the year. That isn’t true.

Wait, are you are saying that Joe Thornton - maybe the best passer of the last couple decades, and 16th ALL-TIME in points - isn't more of a #1C than PLD?

Yeah, there’s obviously this as well - I didn’t want to derail the thread too far off topic.

 

[Leafs4life29]

Hyman ++
Leivo + Carrick + 2nd
1st + Johnson

Choose one.

Here’s what I choose, Leivo and a second in 20 or 21 and possibly a lower end prospect, as the Leafs aren’t interested in any more then a rental or they can have a 3rd round pick instead of a lower end prospect , the pick is still in 20 or 21 nothing from 2019 I like this draft class it’s so strong and I don’t want to give up any picks in it. Cheers.

 

[Jackets16]

“Watch the games nerd!” Yeah, what an argument. Literally the worst one out. You have literally no evidence to back the notion that PLD is a #1C because none exists because it simply isn’t the truth.

The average Stanley Cup #1 center, over the past 10 years, has been either a 70 point scoring Selke winner, or a 90 point scorer. PLD would need to add 22 points to his output and become a Selke level defensive center, or he would need to score 42 more points in order to match up to the average Stanley Cup #1C. And yeah, I’ve watched PLD play, and he’s not a #1C. My argument immediately blows yours out of the water because we’re tied in baseless anecdotal evidence and so my actual statistical evidence that puts PLD in an entirely different class from Stanley Cup #1Cs.

#1 Centers are the most important thing in Stanley Cup Playoff hockey, by far. People are saying that Columbus is going into this coming season no worse than Washington went into last season, but that simply isn’t true. Washington had a perennial 70-80 point center who was one notch below Selke level and another 70+ point center who had yet to break out. Columbus is missing a center that can compare to either of those guys and so they actually do look worse than Washington did at the start of last year. On no planet is PLD comparable to Backstrom or Kuznetsov and you should be willing to admit that if you watch him so much, because your favorite team got curb stomped by this very team with two #1Cs. Kuznetsov had 3 goals and 4 assists against your team, Backstrom has 2 goals and 6 assists, and PLD had 2 goals and 2 assists in that series.

Speaking of telling people what they do and don’t watch; you should start watching more Stanley Cup Playoff hockey, and paying very close attention to the #1Cs on each team that wins the Stanley Cup, and the #1Cs on the “Cinderella story” teams that lose after a few rounds. It’s the biggest factor that always seems to separate them. While you’re at it, you should really review the playoff series where your favorite team blew a 2-0 lead to a team with two #1Cs because your team had none, and then come back into this thread and try to tell me PLD is anywhere near Backstrom and Kuznetsov. Really, just see if you can watch him get his pants taken down and his bottom spanked by Kuznetsov and Backstrom, and then come back into this thread and tell me he is a Stanley Cup #1C.

Joe Thornton (19 years old) - 81gp, 16g, 25a, 41pts, 69pim, +3

Pierre-Luc Dubois (19 years old) - 82gp, 20g, 28a, 48pts, 49pim, +8

Who knows if Dubois will become as good as Thornton, but he is already ahead of where he was at the same age. So, quit acting like he is a finished product at 19 years old.

 

[Jackets16]

Here’s what I choose, Leivo and a second in 20 or 21 and possibly a lower end prospect, as the Leafs aren’t interested in any more then a rental or they can have a 3rd round pick instead of a lower end prospect , the pick is still in 20 or 21 nothing from 2019 I like this draft class it’s so strong and I don’t want to give up any picks in it. Cheers.

He is worth more than that as a rental.

 

[Leafs4life29]

they've already done that with the addition of Tavares

spending because you have a buck in your pocket doesn't always make good sense

So getting Tavares and basically creating a nightmare matchup down the middle for every team who plays against you was a bad idea, it was it that adding a 38 goal scorer who plays a 200 ft game a bad idea, or was it a bad idea to just simply add one of the premier players in the league to your roster in his prime to your team and the down side is what that he’ll be good for 6 of those 7 years oh that simply breaks my heart. In his 7th year I don’t care if one of the younger kids has to push him around the ice in a skatechair (same as wheelchair but you know). Cheers

 

[Dzonna]

“Watch the games nerd!” Yeah, what an argument. Literally the worst one out. You have literally no evidence to back the notion that PLD is a #1C because none exists because it simply isn’t the truth.

The average Stanley Cup #1 center, over the past 10 years, has been either a 70 point scoring Selke winner, or a 90 point scorer. PLD would need to add 22 points to his output and become a Selke level defensive center, or he would need to score 42 more points in order to match up to the average Stanley Cup #1C. And yeah, I’ve watched PLD play, and he’s not a #1C. My argument immediately blows yours out of the water because we’re tied in baseless anecdotal evidence and so my actual statistical evidence that puts PLD in an entirely different class from Stanley Cup #1Cs.

#1 Centers are the most important thing in Stanley Cup Playoff hockey, by far. People are saying that Columbus is going into this coming season no worse than Washington went into last season, but that simply isn’t true. Washington had a perennial 70-80 point center who was one notch below Selke level and another 70+ point center who had yet to break out. Columbus is missing a center that can compare to either of those guys and so they actually do look worse than Washington did at the start of last year. On no planet is PLD comparable to Backstrom or Kuznetsov and you should be willing to admit that if you watch him so much, because your favorite team got curb stomped by this very team with two #1Cs. Kuznetsov had 3 goals and 4 assists against your team, Backstrom has 2 goals and 6 assists, and PLD had 2 goals and 2 assists in that series.

Speaking of telling people what they do and don’t watch; you should start watching more Stanley Cup Playoff hockey, and paying very close attention to the #1Cs on each team that wins the Stanley Cup, and the #1Cs on the “Cinderella story” teams that lose after a few rounds. It’s the biggest factor that always seems to separate them. While you’re at it, you should really review the playoff series where your favorite team blew a 2-0 lead to a team with two #1Cs because your team had none, and then come back into this thread and try to tell me PLD is anywhere near Backstrom and Kuznetsov. Really, just see if you can watch him get his pants taken down and his bottom spanked by Kuznetsov and Backstrom, and then come back into this thread and tell me he is a Stanley Cup #1C.

A player that wouldn’t even make leafs team at the C position, is not a contenders #1 centre. PLD is good but not even close to being that good. A lot of busts in that draft year tbh.

 

[Fro]

Here’s what I choose, Leivo and a second in 20 or 21 and possibly a lower end prospect, as the Leafs aren’t interested in any more then a rental or they can have a 3rd round pick instead of a lower end prospect , the pick is still in 20 or 21 nothing from 2019 I like this draft class it’s so strong and I don’t want to give up any picks in it. Cheers.

@Cor stop making troll accounts

 

[Cor]

@Cor stop making troll accounts

Cheers.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Joe Thornton (19 years old) - 81gp, 16g, 25a, 41pts, 69pim, +3

Pierre-Luc Dubois (19 years old) - 82gp, 20g, 28a, 48pts, 49pim, +8

Who knows if Dubois will become as good as Thornton, but he is already ahead of where he was at the same age. So, quit acting like he is a finished product at 19 years old.

Nobody is saying he's a finished product as a 19 year old but to say PLD next year being what he is puts Columbus in no worse a shape than Washington when they started last season is quite a different thing. Also, there's a bit of context needed. Thornton at 19 was treated like a 3rd liner when he probably should've been treated more like a 2nd liner at the time. Dubois did it as a 2nd liner in average ice time. It wasn't until Thornton was 20 that he started to get top ice time.

 

[Leafs4life29]

I'd guess 1st + quality prospect (or lesser roster player) + conditional 1st on him resigning.

Okay 1st in 20 not from 19 I know it may be higher but maybe not it’s just I really like the 2019 draft I think it could be one of the best ones in memory and a quality prospect no Leaf roster players other then a Leivo and I only say him because the kid deserves a chance to play, I think if he had been given minutes rather then siting in the box he could have been really good, not Marner or Nylander good but a step down good possibly better then Brown no offence to Brownie. In any hand I think it could take a while to get him back into proper game shape, possibly a year of something not quite of what you’ll end up with but afterwards a damn good player a solid 20+ goals 3rd line not sure about 2nd but a real good 3rd liner. One more season in the pressbox and you might as well write him off he’ll be done. Cheers.

 

[Wings4Life]

Hyman +

Not a fan of Hyman. The Pascal Dupuis of the Leafs, but even worse hands.

 

[Baksfamous112]

So getting Tavares and basically creating a nightmare matchup down the middle for every team who plays against you was a bad idea, it was it that adding a 38 goal scorer who plays a 200 ft game a bad idea, or was it a bad idea to just simply add one of the premier players in the league to your roster in his prime to your team and the down side is what that he’ll be good for 6 of those 7 years oh that simply breaks my heart. In his 7th year I don’t care if one of the younger kids has to push him around the ice in a skatechair (same as wheelchair but you know). Cheers

All while you lost a 36G winger and 50-55 Pts center. Not sure how or why you see the Leafs as a better/upgraded team with Tavares but minus JVR/Bozak/Komarov and most likely Gardiner gone as well next year. Down the middle is the only place where you guys are strong. Rest of the lineup is meh

 

[NDiesel]

“Watch the games nerd!” Yeah, what an argument. Literally the worst one out. You have literally no evidence to back the notion that PLD is a #1C because none exists because it simply isn’t the truth.

The average Stanley Cup #1 center, over the past 10 years, has been either a 70 point scoring Selke winner, or a 90 point scorer. PLD would need to add 22 points to his output and become a Selke level defensive center, or he would need to score 42 more points in order to match up to the average Stanley Cup #1C. And yeah, I’ve watched PLD play, and he’s not a #1C. My argument immediately blows yours out of the water because we’re tied in baseless anecdotal evidence and so my actual statistical evidence that puts PLD in an entirely different class from Stanley Cup #1Cs.

#1 Centers are the most important thing in Stanley Cup Playoff hockey, by far. People are saying that Columbus is going into this coming season no worse than Washington went into last season, but that simply isn’t true. Washington had a perennial 70-80 point center who was one notch below Selke level and another 70+ point center who had yet to break out. Columbus is missing a center that can compare to either of those guys and so they actually do look worse than Washington did at the start of last year. On no planet is PLD comparable to Backstrom or Kuznetsov and you should be willing to admit that if you watch him so much, because your favorite team got curb stomped by this very team with two #1Cs. Kuznetsov had 3 goals and 4 assists against your team, Backstrom has 2 goals and 6 assists, and PLD had 2 goals and 2 assists in that series.

Speaking of telling people what they do and don’t watch; you should start watching more Stanley Cup Playoff hockey, and paying very close attention to the #1Cs on each team that wins the Stanley Cup, and the #1Cs on the “Cinderella story” teams that lose after a few rounds. It’s the biggest factor that always seems to separate them. While you’re at it, you should really review the playoff series where your favorite team blew a 2-0 lead to a team with two #1Cs because your team had none, and then come back into this thread and try to tell me PLD is anywhere near Backstrom and Kuznetsov. Really, just see if you can watch him get his pants taken down and his bottom spanked by Kuznetsov and Backstrom, and then come back into this thread and tell me he is a Stanley Cup #1C.

K what....you seriously lost everyone when you said the worst argument out there is actually watching a game.....come on, wake up. If someone has never seen someone play, then how can you take their argument as valid?