Too many New York teams?

[Tommy Hawk]

If there is no owner in pretty Manchester then it really doesn't matter what an Nhl team wants unless it wants to buy a team and put it there.
And no Texas isn't happening agsin.
What makes these teams valuable is that there is only 30 of them.
The board of governors is not going to devalue their investments in allowing conditional franchise loopholes.
You want a team you gotta buy an existing one.
Just like minor league baseball.

Or unless it finds an owner in the Manchester area. And before Texas no one that it would happen and the NHL runs the league so if an NHL teams wants an AHL team and no one is willing to sell, they will still get their team either by hook or by crook.

 

[wildcat48]

Here’s the theme of this thread: Why don't we move every team in New England and New York with the exception for Providence and Rochester because their affiliation is nearby?

My response: You have no idea what you're talking about. We can speculate and make suggestions. This is a message board and that’s part of what happens, but some of what I've read here is just outlandish and completely ridiculous.

 

[CJNewman]

Here’s the theme of this thread: Why don't we move every team in New England and New York with the exception for Providence and Rochester because their affiliation is nearby?

My response: You have no idea what you're talking about. We can speculate and make suggestions. This is a message board and that’s part of what happens, but some of what I've read here is just outlandish and completely ridiculous.

Thank you I couldn't agree more I've been waiting for someone else besides me to finally say that.

 

[Tommy Hawk]

Here’s the theme of this thread: Why don't we move every team in New England and New York with the exception for Providence and Rochester because their affiliation is nearby?

My response: You have no idea what you're talking about. We can speculate and make suggestions. This is a message board and that’s part of what happens, but some of what I've read here is just outlandish and completely ridiculous.

No one has said that and what has been mentioned in the past as outlandish and ridiculous has come true. No on thought the Phantoms or the Rivermen would be sold yet they were. Frostbite Warrior predicted the Phantoms would be there, no one predicted the move from Omaha to QC then to Abbotsford.

No one predicted a move from Manitoba to THunder or even Atlanta to Winnipeg. Who predicted the failure of the I and the 6 teams joining?

So while two of you think these are outlandish, they aren't it is just speculation and with the rumour of 6-7 far western NHL teams wanting their affiliations in the far west the teams have to come from somewhere. Right now they are affiliated with Utica, Adirondack, OKC, Worcester, Manchester, Norfolk, and Portland. Of those teams Adirondack, Norfolk, and Portland are NOT owned by the NHL team so where do you think the NHL team will get a team to move? They gotta buy from somewhere. Hershey, WBS, and Providence won't sell. Chicago won't sell. Charlotte, Milwaukee, GR, Iowa, LE, and Rockford won't sell. Toronto and Hamilton won't sell. Rochester, Albany, Bridgeport, and Hartford are owned by the NHL team.

So what teams are left? Springfield, Binghamton, Syracuse, Norfolk.

Not so outlandish is this process of elimination. Then you have cities that built new arenas such as Manchester that would probably like to fill with a team. Portland owners would probably not go down without a fight. The Syracuse and Springfield owners have been complaining about losses for years.

I really do not care where they move the team but some of you on here keep wanting to know where the teams will go and when possible locations are thrown out you trash them.

 

[tenpinsplit]

i dont know where the 5600 people are that manchester claims to have every game night because they arent watching the game, every game highlight i see there are more yellow chairs than people watching the game.

 

[Rumblick]

Very few people will know what's happening before it happens, and even fewer would be chatting on here. Just sit back and enjoy the ride.










Yeah, I can say things like this cause one thing I do know - Hershey's not going ANYWHERE. :d

 

[Crunchrulz]

Syracuse ranks in the middle of the AHL attendance average playing in a building that holds 6100 fannies on a good day and was built in the 1950s. Dolgon makes noise in an attempt to get the locals to consider a replacement arena about the size or a bit smaller of the awesome beast in Grand Rapids.

 

[go comets]

Syracuse ranks in the middle of the AHL attendance average playing in a building that holds 6100 fannies on a good day and was built in the 1950s. Dolgon makes noise in an attempt to get the locals to consider a replacement arena about the size or a bit smaller of the awesome beast in Grand Rapids.

I can't see syracuse losing their team. If the canucks leave utica, the crunch will draw utica fans in. Syracuse's biggest issue is they need to do something with that building.........

 

[ZekeA]

Syracuse ranks in the middle of the AHL attendance average playing in a building that holds 6100 fannies on a good day and was built in the 1950s. Dolgon makes noise in an attempt to get the locals to consider a replacement arena about the size or a bit smaller of the awesome beast in Grand Rapids.

"Crunchrulz":

Dolgon can make all the noise he wants about a new building in Syracuse not to happen just way too much money to build a new building. Look at the cost of the new building in Allentown~~!!!!!!!

God only knows what a building like the one in Grand Rapids would cost as that is bigger than the one in Allentown...

I would hate to even think what a building like in Grand Rapids would cost to build today, that would scare me~~!!!!!!!!!!!

Upgrade the building you have now~~!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Cities & Counties in the northeast are having a very difficult time making ends meet...........

 

[Govment Cheese]

Deal to build an 18,000-seat sports and entertainment arena in Virginia Beach. VB is around 20 minute drive from Norfolk. Think this might have an affect on the availability of the Admirals or a the very least raise the asking price.
http://hamptonroads.com/2014/05/va-beach-council-picks-privately-funded-arena-plan

 

[Shootmaster_44]

The thing everyone assumes is that Manchester will stay in the AHL. But isn't the Verizon Wireless Arena either owned or managed by the Kings' parent company AEG? As is the Citizens Business Bank Arena in Ontario. The Manchester Monarchs and Ontario Reign are also owned by AEG. Thus, I assume that if the Monarchs move to Ontario and force the Regin out of the CBBA, the Kings will simply move the ECHL Reign to Manchester.

That scenerio (providing I have the ownership/management of the Manchester arena right), is the most probable solution. Since Manchester fits in to the ECHL footprint, I can't see the league telling AEG that they cannot move their franchise to Manchester. If they said no, AEG would simply fold the team I am sure, as they would have no place to play, once AEG evicts them from the CBBA.

 

[wildcat48]

The thing everyone assumes is that Manchester will stay in the AHL. But isn't the Verizon Wireless Arena either owned or managed by the Kings' parent company AEG? As is the Citizens Business Bank Arena in Ontario. The Manchester Monarchs and Ontario Reign are also owned by AEG. Thus, I assume that if the Monarchs move to Ontario and force the Regin out of the CBBA, the Kings will simply move the ECHL Reign to Manchester.

That scenerio (providing I have the ownership/management of the Manchester arena right), is the most probable solution. Since Manchester fits in to the ECHL footprint, I can't see the league telling AEG that they cannot move their franchise to Manchester. If they said no, AEG would simply fold the team I am sure, as they would have no place to play, once AEG evicts them from the CBBA.

SMG manages the VWA, not AEG. The Monarchs lease with the VWA expires after the 2015-'16 season. Manchester could attempt to get another AHL franchise or lure an ECHL franchise. I've even heard rumors that the QMJHL might look at Manchester if became avail. That will play out once AEG moves the Monarchs to xx city.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Deal to build an 18,000-seat sports and entertainment arena in Virginia Beach. VB is around 20 minute drive from Norfolk. Think this might have an affect on the availability of the Admirals or a the very least raise the asking price.
http://hamptonroads.com/2014/05/va-beach-council-picks-privately-funded-arena-plan

false rumor, has been bandied about ever since the Admirals were promoted in 2001, Gov, besides, Ken Young owns both the Admirals and Tides, it's laughable because Norfolk owns Scope.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

SMG manages the VWA, not AEG. The Monarchs lease with the VWA expires after the 2015-'16 season. Manchester could attempt to get another AHL franchise or lure an ECHL franchise. I've even heard rumors that the QMJHL might look at Manchester if became avail. That will play out once AEG moves the Monarchs to xx city.

and if both Manchester and Worcester extend, then what?

 

[Clinton Comets EHL]

The thing everyone assumes is that Manchester will stay in the AHL. But isn't the Verizon Wireless Arena either owned or managed by the Kings' parent company AEG? As is the Citizens Business Bank Arena in Ontario. The Manchester Monarchs and Ontario Reign are also owned by AEG. Thus, I assume that if the Monarchs move to Ontario and force the Regin out of the CBBA, the Kings will simply move the ECHL Reign to Manchester.

That scenerio (providing I have the ownership/management of the Manchester arena right), is the most probable solution. Since Manchester fits in to the ECHL footprint, I can't see the league telling AEG that they cannot move their franchise to Manchester. If they said no, AEG would simply fold the team I am sure, as they would have no place to play, once AEG evicts them from the CBBA.

According to the ECHL, every city fits in their footprint. The ECHL would fail in Manchester, too many high school, D1 hockey and Bruins only 40 miles away.

 

[BGIGZ]

i dont know where the 5600 people are that manchester claims to have every game night because they arent watching the game, every game highlight i see there are more yellow chairs than people watching the game.

The Verizon Wireless Arena is a 10,000 seat arena. So, if looks half full, it's because it is half full.

 

[Crunchrulz]

Zeke, the building that the Crunch play in is part of a complex known as the Oncenter. It is supposed to be a multi use facility, unfortunately the age and condition of the War Memorial causes major events to go to Turning Stone Casino or the SRC Arena on the campus of Onondaga Community College. Dolgon is looking for an arena is the 8500 seat range with VIP Suites. The County paid a bunch for a under attended baseball stadium to house the local AAA baseball team that has a terrible location and even worse food. There is a footprint across the street from the Oncenter that could be used to build the new arena. The arena would host other events in addition to the Crunch, bringing a bit of life and hope to a section of Syracuse that is rapidly becoming a ghost town except on hockey nights. If you take a chance to actually listen to what Dolgon is saying, he makes sense. There have been issues with the baseball team not paying various costs for use of thier county owned stadium while Dolgon does not have the same issue with his county owned facility. If you are a landlord, do you throw a bone to the renter who pays his/her bills on time and puts an average of 5500 fannies in an arena built in the 1950s that holds 6100 or the renter who has a history of not paying bills on time and is lucky to average 3500 seats in a stadium that holds over 12000?

 

[ZekeA]

Zeke, the building that the Crunch play in is part of a complex known as the Oncenter. It is supposed to be a multi use facility, unfortunately the age and condition of the War Memorial causes major events to go to Turning Stone Casino or the SRC Arena on the campus of Onondaga Community College. Dolgon is looking for an arena is the 8500 seat range with VIP Suites. The County paid a bunch for a under attended baseball stadium to house the local AAA baseball team that has a terrible location and even worse food. There is a footprint across the street from the Oncenter that could be used to build the new arena. The arena would host other events in addition to the Crunch, bringing a bit of life and hope to a section of Syracuse that is rapidly becoming a ghost town except on hockey nights. If you take a chance to actually listen to what Dolgon is saying, he makes sense. There have been issues with the baseball team not paying various costs for use of thier county owned stadium while Dolgon does not have the same issue with his county owned facility. If you are a landlord, do you throw a bone to the renter who pays his/her bills on time and puts an average of 5500 fannies in an arena built in the 1950s that holds 6100 or the renter who has a history of not paying bills on time and is lucky to average 3500 seats in a stadium that holds over 12000?

"Crunchrulz":


Yes I remember your building well having been there many many times years ago....... Take the Adams avenue exit off 81 and you are a block or two away....

I watched the Nats there and would try to get to all the games when the Celtics would visit..... I was blessed with watching the
Great Bill Russell play, as I consider him the best athlete I ever watched as he dominated the game like no one else has before or since..............

I first started going to hockey games up in Syracuse in 1973 when the Blazers would host the "Broome Dusters" back in the old NAHL. God I loved those games each team had their own personality they gave you what they had and man did they fight.....

OK enough history from me......

As for wanting a new building yes it would be nice for the benefits that you pointed out as stated by Dolgon....

A quick question is your building in that bad of shape???? As I am in my late 80's now so I just can Not go to road games anymore..... Would love to go on the road my mind says yes but my legs Ect say no and tell me stay home you old fart........................

Also I must realize that Syracuse is over 3x larger than Binghamton and it has greater needs than Binghamton....

Down here they have updated our Arena with new seats, new glass, new boards, & a new lighting system the past few years...... I consider Binghamton a great place to watch a Hockey game as the fans are so close to the ice........

Being a much bigger area you tell me the county loses bookings to other buildings, not that big a problem down here as we have the Arena and SUNYS field house + our area is smaller so bigger events do Not come here......

The only thing that would concern me is the cost of a new building dam they are expensive + always seems to be cost over runs.....

What would that add to a ticket price, per game?????

As for luxury boxes not in favor of them BUT they bring in a lot of $$$$$$ so they are here to stay.....

We have AA baseball but the stadium is privately owned they do not draw that well..................

Sad that your War Memorial is just too small for the events you could book IF you had a bigger arena.....

What would a new 9K building cost today???????

Could the county absorb that cost in these very hard economic times in upstate NY????????????????

I can also see Dolgon's point as he pays his rent on time as the other owner is lax in doing that......

I wish I had the right answer for you not an easy question + the tremendous cost involved.....................

From my quick look at the situation up there is yes a new building would be very nice for the County..... It would help the area around it & perhaps stimulate that area......

+ from what you tell me it is needed.... I just worry about the cost and how much it would add to the rent Dolgon would have to pay Ect.... I grew up during the depression so I am very cost conscious on spending $$$$$ just due to how times were when I was growing up.............

Before I type a novel will close now + my hands start to get tired on me after I type for awhile.............................

 

[Clinton Comets EHL]

I can't see syracuse losing their team. If the canucks leave utica, the crunch will draw utica fans in. Syracuse's biggest issue is they need to do something with that building.........

Not this Comets fan.

 

[Clinton Comets EHL]

"Crunchrulz":
[mod]
.............................

Who is going to build a new building in Syracuse? Seriously, it would be decades!

 

[go comets]

Who is going to build a new building in Syracuse? Seriously, it would be decades!

just watch how fast the dome gets replaced!!!!! if syracuse was smart the would keep the dome for football and put up a dedicated basketball and hockey arena.

 

[Clinton Comets EHL]

just watch how fast the dome gets replaced!!!!! if syracuse was smart the would keep the dome for football and put up a dedicated basketball and hockey arena.

The Dome is a dump for anything. Worst aluminum bench seats in history. If you are ove 4'9", your knees hit.

Build an arena for BB and hockey? 20,000 seats? Never happen.

 

[Nightsquad]

I think if the Devils and Albany don't come to terms it's only natural to think the Rangers would land in Albany. Albany doesn't have anemic attendance because they don't care about hockey, when your poorly run AHL team (the Devils affiliated teams that have plagued Albany for years) it's kind of hard to compete with Union College who have established their place among NCAA programs, and have done it well. It's really tough to chose between run and gun shoot and score NCAA product over the AHL's continued direction of development above prospects over overall on ice success. One has to believe the NY Rangers are the best fit for Albany NY, and Albany a good fit geographically as well. Albany and the Tri-City district has a lot of transplanted New Yawkers lol. Not to mention Albany is getting ready to embark on arena renovations, and going to build a new convention center located behind the arena connected by walkway with that connected to a brand new Mariott Hotel.

 

[go comets]

I think if the Devils and Albany don't come to terms it's only natural to think the Rangers would land in Albany. Albany doesn't have anemic attendance because they don't care about hockey, when your poorly run AHL team (the Devils affiliated teams that have plagued Albany for years) it's kind of hard to compete with Union College who have established their place among NCAA programs, and have done it well. It's really tough to chose between run and gun shoot and score NCAA product over the AHL's continued direction of development above prospects over overall on ice success. One has to believe the NY Rangers are the best fit for Albany NY, and Albany a good fit geographically as well. Albany and the Tri-City district has a lot of transplanted New Yawkers lol. Not to mention Albany is getting ready to embark on arena renovations, and going to build a new convention center located behind the arena connected by walkway with that connected to a brand new Mariott Hotel.

I seriously doubt anyone goes in to Albany when all this western movement is done. Adirondack has a better fan base than albany.The devils inquired this Summer about coming back to Utica.Albany will be without a team shortly.... As well as a couple other cities......

 

[JungleJON]

"Crunchrulz":


I first started going to hockey games up in Syracuse in 1973 when the Blazers would host the "Broome Dusters" back in the old NAHL. God I loved those games each team had their own personality they gave you what they had and man did they fight.....

I'm from Johnstown, PA orginally and my first game was Johnstown vs. Syracuse in the old EHL, then the following year the NAHL started up. Have been to Syracuse and Binghampton. We were in Binghampton for the final home game of your teams first season. Still remember how the team went around and thanked the fans at the glass after the game. We always enjoyed out trips there, especially when we won.

The NAHL was a blast and even though at the most it had 8 or 9 teams, it seemed like you hated them all. Though for the Jets, Syracuse was always our biggest rival.