Tony Marinaro on why Subban was really traded

[oobga]

I never got the "bad teammate" angle with Subban. He's always come across as a pretty inclusive fun loving guy. Maybe some guys don't like how he is able to do all the brand/self promotion stuff away from the rink? I don't think that's his problem though, that's what big name and very popular players can do these days.

 

[Lilou]

Why should we care if they do? That's basically the crime PK is accused of in Montreal, even if he did nothing illegal or immoral. He actually behaved in the COMPLETE OPPOSITE of immoral with his massive contributions to a children's hospital.

Players are expected to be invisible, well f*** that, there's no reason players shouldn't have a personality. The Canadiens are getting everything they deserve, the SCF appearance couldn't have happened to a better more deserving guy

my friend you have to understand that mtl is the most backwards organization in hockey. Don't expect them to make any sense. This is a team that only wants francophone coaches so they do not offend their french viewers. They alienate the majority of nhl coaches because they want to be PC. Look at the organization from management down to the prospects. They really are one of the worst run teams.

 

[HabsCowboysOwn]

That trade was a disaster from day 1 but you'll still find members of the BargainBin crew adamantly defending it on our board. I really hope PK wins the cup and come back here to shove it down their throat.

 

[EdAVSfan]

He doesn't care yet he continuously keeps commenting on the trade, he clearly doesn't care.

Hmmm, I think he's responding to a question. Rather than just randomly saying something like this.

 

[Price is Wright]

Why would we want NHL players acting like NFL/NBA players?

What does that even mean?

 

[Viqsi]

He doesn't care yet he continuously keeps commenting on the trade, he clearly doesn't care.

He keeps getting asked.

 

[417]

Honestly speaking I would love for dinosaurs like Bergevin to leave the game. I get that PK isn't a "conformist" and no disrespect to Weber who's a great player but Montreal will lose the trade in a few years.

You're kidding yourself...we're talking about the sport of hockey.

The majority of coaches/management/owners are dinosaurs.

 

[417]

Why would we want NHL players acting like NFL/NBA players? If you want that, just watch basketball or football. I like that hockey players are more like Golfers than basketball/football players. The game itself is the entertainment, not the player personalities.

Hmm...so much whitespeak in this post, you're not even attempting to hide it.

 

[hagelin1381]

I really hope PK writes a book or something after he retires because it sure would be an interesting read

 

[TT1]

He keeps getting asked.

You know what Weber did? He stopped answering questions related to the trade and said that he moved on and is focusing on his current team.. so people stopped asking him questions related to the trade.

PK loves answering those type of questions, he's a diva.

 

[Maukkis]

You know what Weber did? He stopped answering questions related to the trade and said that he moved on and is focusing on his current team.. so people stopped asking him questions related to the trade.

PK loves answering those type of questions, he's a diva.

Well, you could always compare the amount of flak Weber and Subban got while playing for their former teams. As far as I know, Weber was a very respected captain of the Preds, whereas Subban was the management's scapegoat in Montreal. I don't think Weber has any hard feelings towards Nashville. I wonder if Subban was treated differently, and thus does not think the same way?

 

[oobga]

You know what Weber did? He stopped answering questions related to the trade and said that he moved on and is focusing on his current team.. so people stopped asking him questions related to the trade.

PK loves answering those type of questions, he's a diva.

At least he answers those questions way better than Hall does

Among these guys, Hall, Weber, Subban. Subban is the only one that still doesn't know why he was traded. Hall knows it was to fix the disaster right side on the Oilers D. Weber knows it was so Nashville could get a younger better version of himself. Subban, who knows.

 

[Inkling]

You know what Weber did? He stopped answering questions related to the trade and said that he moved on and is focusing on his current team.. so people stopped asking him questions related to the trade.

PK loves answering those type of questions, he's a diva.

More likely that Weber doesn't get asked because there's nothing that he could possibly contribute to the discussion. The Montreal media don't care why Nashville thought he was expendable.

Subban is the only one that still doesn't know why he was traded.

I'm sure Subban knows, but he's not going to give the reasons or his view of the reasons while he is still in the league and may have to deal with these people in the future. Maybe someday after he's retired he'll write a book.

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

This is true as it relates to athletes and fan-perception. The issue with Subban was reportedly between him and his teammates. At some point, we have to choose the more plausible scenario: 1) Subban was the victim of an orchestrated smear campaign by the organization and media; or 2) Subban was a pain in the ass in the locker room. Considering that stars get traded every year with none of this backlash, I'll go with pain-in-the-ass over conspiracy theory.

For me, Subban is a fantastic talent and cool guy who, unfortunately, simply got under the skin of too many teammates and coaches. Personally, I'd rather hang out with a smart, expressive guy like him than the typical monotone jock, but I'm not a pro athlete.

I suspect the answer lies somewhere in the middle, honestly. Montreal feels like an old boy's club where you're supposed to act a certain way. I get more than a few 1970s vibes. That was never going to jive with a personality like Subban. I mean, look how petty Therrien was banning the triple low-five which many fans adored. Subban didn't toe the proverbial line and I do firmly believe Bergevin and Therrien simply did not like him. When the season collapsed, Bergevin took advantage in the hopes fans would welcome "change." It backfired immensely as Subban had become the face of the franchise by this point. It's rather telling the amount of fans who legitimately want Nashville to win even if it were against Montreal.

 

[Viqsi]

You know what Weber did? He stopped answering questions related to the trade and said that he moved on and is focusing on his current team.. so people stopped asking him questions related to the trade.

PK loves answering those type of questions, he's a diva.

Except that PK keeps answering those questions with "I've moved on and I'm focusing on Nashville, I love Nashville", and folks still keep asking. Although that's admittedly in no small part due to the fact that one of the traded players is now playing for the Cup while the other's team quietly faded out in the first round.

 

[DMR]

You know what Weber did? He stopped answering questions related to the trade and said that he moved on and is focusing on his current team.. so people stopped asking him questions related to the trade.

PK loves answering those type of questions, he's a diva.

Or maybe he's not a robot and gets enjoyment out kicking a little mud in the eye of a franchise that clearly deserves having a metric ton of it thrown at them. I'm sure Weber is showing steely resolve and square-jawed "leadership" on the putting green.

 

[Lshap]

I suspect the answer lies somewhere in the middle, honestly. Montreal feels like an old boy's club where you're supposed to act a certain way. I get more than a few 1970s vibes. That was never going to jive with a personality like Subban. I mean, look how petty Therrien was banning the triple low-five which many fans adored. Subban didn't toe the proverbial line and I do firmly believe Bergevin and Therrien simply did not like him. When the season collapsed, Bergevin took advantage in the hopes fans would welcome "change." It backfired immensely as Subban had become the face of the franchise by this point. It's rather telling the amount of fans who legitimately want Nashville to win even if it were against Montreal.

I agree Therrien probably disliked him. His actual comments about Subban were condescending and arrogant as hell. But Bergevin? I don't see it. There's no day-to-day relationship between GM and player. They don't work directly together or have regular contact. Even during contract talks 90% of discussions are with the agent. Today's GMs are much more insulated from players than in the 70s; I can't see them making trades based on personal feelings.

The people most closely affected by a player's personality are teammates. Teammates work alongside each other every day and spend the most time with each other away from the job. Teammates will be the ones who develop likes and dislikes for each other. I can see a locker room of typical low-key jocks getting annoyed by someone so much louder and in-your-face than the rest of them. Doesn't mean you still can't be friendly and high-five someone who annoys you (The counter-arguments are a little silly, to be honest: "Look - Markov kissed him! They like each other!", "Look - Price low-fived him! They're friends!"). It just means being annoyed isn't a 24/7 state; plus, NHL players are hyper-aware of what not to say in public.

Like I said, none of this makes Subban a bad guy. It simply suggests his tone grated on his more stoic teammates (this is, after all, the roster that voted Mr. Stoic for captain). Subban was a huge presence in Montreal. Bergevin knew the move would be hated but did it anyway, most likely to appease, in order, 1) an unhappy locker room and 2) a dumb coach. Ultimately, Bergevin made a hockey move, but only as a response to a group-dynamic problem.

 

[Lshap]

Or maybe he's not a robot and gets enjoyment out kicking a little mud in the eye of a franchise that clearly deserves having a metric ton of it thrown at them. I'm sure Weber is showing steely resolve and square-jawed "leadership" on the putting green.

It doesn't matter how you or I define Subban, Weber, or every other NHL player. In a locker of robots, the non-robot is the one who doesn't fit.

 

[Gnashville]

The Number 1 thing I have noticed about Subban in Nashville is the team embraces everything he does. In his yearly Christmas video the team opened the Pro Shop for the kids he was with and gave them whatever they wanted. Roman Josi was in it with him and was helping the kids get their presents. When he returned to Montreal and visited the hospital Fisher and Josi was with him and helping him. Maybe that was the case in Montreal but I have seen criticism of his charity work also. Predators allow more access than most teams and several videos from inside the locker room throughout the season shows him being loved by his teammates and not being a cancer.

 

[LeafsNation75]

I never got the "bad teammate" angle with Subban. He's always come across as a pretty inclusive fun loving guy. Maybe some guys don't like how he is able to do all the brand/self promotion stuff away from the rink? I don't think that's his problem though, that's what big name and very popular players can do these days.

When Michel Therrien banned Subban and Price from doing that high five after they won a game, I wonder why did Subban get the attention from that and not Price? At least I remember the media asking P.K. what was the reason and it's like Price wasn't even apart of it.

 

[Wats]

I kind of doubt it was just Max, that's way too simplistic and convenient of a media narrative.

If you've played a sport like Hockey you've met guys like PK who are kind of dressing room jokers, which are amusing and fun but often don't have an off switch so they take things too far when people are trying to get their focus on. A lot of athletes, especially at that level are pretty serious (you have to be to get to that level) so that kind of behaviour grates on them after a while. PK being such a showman all the time, even in the room close to gametime, and even to the extent that he's on the celebrity circuit definitely would have been a source of friction.

Was management too aggressive by moving to trade him instead of trying to work out the problems or waiting for him to mature a bit? Maybe, but they were kind of boxed in by the pending NTC kicking in July 1st so figured this situation was deteriorating on it was their one chance to be able to easily shop him.

Price was injured the year it blew up though and they usually are the two top players on the team to joke around when they were winning.

 

[RickP]

He doesn't care yet he continuously keeps commenting on the trade, he clearly doesn't care.

To be fair, he's the subject of an E60 episode, so of course he's going to comment on the trade. If Weber was the subject of E60 or a similar show, I doubt he would just avoid the question and not comment on the trade.

 

[Jets4Life]

That trade was a disaster from day 1 but you'll still find members of the BargainBin crew adamantly defending it on our board. I really hope PK wins the cup and come back here to shove it down their throat.

That would be hilarious considering that Patrick Roy did it in 1996, and the Canadiens have not won a Stanley Cup since 1993.

 

[Viqsi]

I agree Therrien probably disliked him. His actual comments about Subban were condescending and arrogant as hell. But Bergevin? I don't see it. There's no day-to-day relationship between GM and player. They don't work directly together or have regular contact. Even during contract talks 90% of discussions are with the agent. Today's GMs are much more insulated from players than in the 70s; I can't see them making trades based on personal feelings.

The people most closely affected by a player's personality are teammates. Teammates work alongside each other every day and spend the most time with each other away from the job. Teammates will be the ones who develop likes and dislikes for each other. I can see a locker room of typical low-key jocks getting annoyed by someone so much louder and in-your-face than the rest of them. Doesn't mean you still can't be friendly and high-five someone who annoys you (The counter-arguments are a little silly, to be honest: "Look - Markov kissed him! They like each other!", "Look - Price low-fived him! They're friends!"). It just means being annoyed isn't a 24/7 state; plus, NHL players are hyper-aware of what not to say in public.

Like I said, none of this makes Subban a bad guy. It simply suggests his tone grated on his more stoic teammates (this is, after all, the roster that voted Mr. Stoic for captain). Subban was a huge presence in Montreal. Bergevin knew the move would be hated but did it anyway, most likely to appease, in order, 1) an unhappy locker room and 2) a dumb coach. Ultimately, Bergevin made a hockey move, but only as a response to a group-dynamic problem.

That makes sense, but it does also suggest that he wasn't the problem. Stood out, sure, and certainly wouldn't be the one to fit in, but that says to me that the Stoicism Coalition needed to go.

Of course, I have a very different idea of what sort of team dynamic is most likely to succeed than Montreal management, apparently.

 

[Dream Big]

If you are able to view this at the 4:00 minute mark? When I saw it I was surprised at the reactions of the rest of the team sitting around as PK read out the line up. I'm not sure why PK was announcing the players that way. His d partner reacted like PK was going to hit him. I thought it was enlightening.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/...n-bruins-pk-subban-chara-krejci-talbot-weise/