Today's Meeting: Any News???

[dem]

Gary always handles a grilling well...

He always comes out looking good after the annual Ron Maclean grilling IMO..

 

[Leafer4Life]

The beginning of January.........

 

[slosharksfan*]

I don't care what anyone thinks of him, I'd want Bettman to represent me in a court case. This guy takes "The Weasel Way" to a whole new level. :lol

...and THAT'S the meeting. I don't think Strachan and Goodenow will be exchanging love letters anytime soon. Some real passion there.

do ya think he would be willing to represent me in my case if i asked? and would he bill me per hour or have a one time fee

 

[Slats432]

Cant be Jagr

Jagr has money to fund a proper "edumafacation" this guy cant seem to discuss anything beyond "Na na, my dad can beat up your dad "

How about a general "knock it off" for everyone and let's nicely and politely bash those involved in the controversy and not each other....

Thank you.

 

[hockeytown9321]

What about the players giving up arbitration for a stiff tax, no cap?

 

[Donnie D]

Gary did an excellent job explaining his side and defending it in front of the press. I would expect nothing less. No matter what posters say in this and other boards, he is a very smart gentleman.

I would also expect that Bob will do an equally good job when his chance comes up in a half hour.

These folks have differences in opinions. Doesn't mean that either of them is stupid.

 

[A Good Flying Bird*]

You have been warned for insulting other posters. If you enjoy the hockey discussions here then you have to cease and desist or you will continue to receive the punishments for breaking the rules.

Hey Slats.
I have a question.
If so and so posts about Goodenow and the players being stupid morons, isn't he essentially calling everyone who agrees with them stupid morons?

Or vice versa.

 

[Slats432]

A lot of people get caught up in your side/my side.....

There are shades of grey on both sides. I support the owners only because my owners are 38 guys that are cash out of pocket, no chance to turn a profit without a 50000 fan Heritage Classic, about a snowball's chance in Hell to win a cup.

In a small market you need this thing corrected or the chance to survive or let alone win a cup isn't there.

 

[Kaiped Krusader]

I don't know what press conference the rest of you were listening to but I thought the ticket question was one of the ones he handled best.

When pressed on why there wouldn't be a ticket cap if there was going to be a salary cap, he pointed out that ticket prices in one market have no bearing on ticket prices in another. Salaries in one market have a big impact in salaries in all markets, however.

Two things stuck out to me that I thought were handled cleverly

- The adoption of a graduated rollback depending on player salary. This was clearly designed to divide the union. There are a lot more guys making $1M and less than there are guys making $5M or more. Will it work? Not by itself, but it might put pressure on the NHLPA leadership from the rank-and-file.

- The "partnership" that will give players 54% of revenues. As he pointed out, the NHLPA's system proposed 56% - but that's assuming the future of salaries stays where Goodenow projected them. Goodenow knows he's BSing everyone with those figures and that salaries will just shoot right back up. Bettman's trying to force his hand on this point - to see if the players really would accept living with that figure or if they'll inflate back up to 73-74% like they expect.

 

[A Good Flying Bird*]

Gary did an excellent job explaining his side and defending it in front of the press. I would expect nothing less. No matter what posters say in this and other boards, he is a very smart gentleman.

I would also expect that Bob will do an equally good job when his chance comes up in a half hour.

These folks have differences in opinions. Doesn't mean that either of them is stupid.

He's a smart man at the weasel's game.

But he's been a terrible commissioner.

 

[Slats432]

Hey Slats.
I have a question.
If so and so posts about Goodenow and the players being stupid morons, isn't he essentially calling everyone who agrees with them stupid morons?

Or vice versa.

I would have to say no.

 

[A Good Flying Bird*]

I don't know what press conference the rest of you were listening to but I thought the ticket question was one of the ones he handled best.

When pressed on why there wouldn't be a ticket cap if there was going to be a salary cap, he pointed out that ticket prices in one market have no bearing on ticket prices in another. Salaries in one market have a big impact in salaries in all markets, however.

.

Which is Bettman's way of saying "Yes, as we screw over the players, we plan to continue screwing over the fans."

No one should have ever considered a different outcome as realistic.

 

[A Good Flying Bird*]

I would have to say no.

Why not?
These posts, often, are designed to inflame tensions on the boards, and nothing else.

 

[Digger12]

I'll be curious to see if the media will be as friendly to Goodenow when he has his conference...

 

[no13matssundin]

On topic of FLYLine, he is incendiary, yes. But he is also insulting to no end, he derides people if they disagree with him and, more often than not, just berates people and calls them names. Thats not hockey talk and has no place here on these boards. Im glad the Mods have spoken up.

 

[p.l.f.]

we must have a salary cap

goodenow can act tough,
but even with a salary cap it would still be the best paying league.

 

[waffledave]

Bob says the NHL's proposal is not a basis for negotiations.

 

[me2]

Which is Bettman's way of saying "Yes, as we screw over the players, we plan to continue screwing over the fans."

No one should have ever considered a different outcome as realistic.

Unless you share all TV revenue, local and otherwise a ticket cap can't work. Some markets are more reliant on tickets than TV, others can use TV to subsidise tickets.

a) some teams are going backwards and even after a salary rollback would still be heading backwards if they dropped the tickets by a similar amount.

b) I expect some teams that benefit the most would rollback tickets, Toronto, Philly, NYR, Detroit. If they slash $30m off their payrolls they'd be silly not to make a ticket reduction for PR purposes.

c) Is it Bettman's role to cap ticket prices? Is it in his job description? I doubt he has the power. Asking Bettman to cap ticket prices is like Mike Moore asking senators to sign their children up for the army. Pure publicity stunt because Mike knows nobody has the right to sign anyone else up for the army but it makes good TV. If the press want an agreement on ticket capping they should be asking the owners directly.

 

[no13matssundin]

Bob says the NHL's proposal is not a basis for negotiations.

Most people on here know that Im in favor of a cap, but I do recognize that the player's rollbacks were a start. That being said, Goodenow's responses calling the rollbacks as not a acceptance of the financial issues is completely mindboggling. I mean, come ON. why else would ya do that? To tick off your constituency? Last week the PA puts forth a rollback that saves the NHL hundreds of millions dollars that goes beyond the Levitt report, then Bob comes in right now saying that it isnt a recognition of the NHL financial woes and that the Levitt report is garbage....

Right.

 

[MasterD]

"The NHL's proposal included a fluctuating salary cap that would commit 54 per cent of league revenues to player costs. The cap would be as low as $34.6 million and as high as $38.6 million.

The league also tweaked the union's rollback proposal: Players making $800,000 or less would not be affected under the league's counter-offer. For players making $800,000 to $1.5 million, the rollback would be 15 per cent and then scales upwards to a maximum 35 per cent for players making more than $5 million."

From the Sportsnet posted earlier.. don't know about you guys, but I think this is actually quite fair IMO

sure the 10% of richest playes of the league would go home crying, bu tthen again role playing guys like, let's say, Steve Bégin, would not be doing his job for whatever small salary he does -24%.

Sure that's not what the NHLPA wants, but it'd be a pretty good system IMO.

If I were Bettman, I'd meet them, and tell, listen, we want that. Now, we can readjust those numbers! Do you guys want 60% instead of 54%? Ok, no problem, we'll do that for you, just give us this instead.. etc etc

It's a good basis for negociations, the only thing I see that's wrong is that they may be asking for a lot. You want you cap Gary? Well instead of going with a cap AND the 24% rollback, maybe take 10-15% rollback and a 60% cap?

 

[me2]

What about the players giving up arbitration for a stiff tax, no cap?

I seriously doubt it. Arbitration is the best way to extort money out of weaker clubs. If it wasn't for arbitration Nashville, the Pengiuns etc could decide they would have a player cap of $2-3m/y for star players. Heatley and Kovalchuk would be forced to take $2-3m/y until they were 31, while stars on other teams are getting $10m/y. And the NHLPA wouldn't stand for that.

 

[RandV]

People who think the owners are the sole reason for salaries getting out of hand need to pick up a dictionary and look up a little word known as "collusion".

But anyways, nhl.com has put up a comparison of the offers, and one thing stands out for me that seems really screwed up.

Players receive 54% of Hockey-Related Revenues (increase over prior offer of 53.2%)

Individual Clubs are obligated to spend no less than 51% and no more than 57% of their 1/30 share of Hockey-Related Revenues

No Payroll Tax -- requires guesswork, continues payroll disparities, and is inflationary

Says the same thing in the full write up to. With the 1/30 share thing, do they mean that all cities have an equal share in the league, ala communism, or is it capitalist and your share is what you bring in. Because if it is, it does not set a cap at like $35-40 mill or whatever, like people are saying. Let's make up some numbers here, and say the Avalanche brings in $100mil for the season, while the small market Oilers only rake in $50mil US. According to the "their 1/30 share", the Avalanche will have a payroll in the 51-57 million range, whereas the Oilers are limited to 25.5-28.5 million salary range. Ok, this would guarantees the financial well being of the league... but it completely $%&*%#@ over the fans! Just when the Colorado's and Detroit's were starting to decline too, you're gonna lower the UFA age to 30 and let them continue to spend more than other teams. God help us if the Rangers ever get it together.
Unless they're going 1/30th the Commie way, then I'm all for it.

 

[craig1]

Name a business in this world that depends on the strength of all competitors to be successful.

Wothout competition, entities are not able to realize certain efficiencies such as infrastructure, etc. Oil companies share refineries, etc....Also too, monopolistic agencies become complacent and sloppy in their dealings since there is no outside pressure to become better. Please see basic Supply and Demand models for an understanding of why monopolistic structures don't work well. Firm tend to stray from basic overall valuation concepts such as those put forth by Modigliani and Miller (Nobel laureates) that allow for a firm to maximize its size and value.

 

[mikeg]

Man this was slimey. And then he suggested that ticket prices would probably go down, knowing fully that tickets in markets like Toronto and Montreal would still be very high.

If I remember correctly here in Montreal our tickets are some of the lowest in the league, this is because our arena is the largest, and the beer's about 30$.

as for the slimey remark, he stated the truth, some teams would go down in price, probably the dallas' of the league and some would stay the same, here in montreal, which actually ownership already said ticket prices will not change regardless of what happens.

if you want slime just listen for a reporter named al strachan and you'll be covered in it...

cheerio
mike

 

[waffledave]

If I remember correctly here in Montreal our tickets are some of the lowest in the league, this is because our arena is the largest, and the beer's about 30$.

as for the slimey remark, he stated the truth, some teams would go down in price, probably the dallas' of the league and some would stay the same, here in montreal, which actually ownership already said ticket prices will not change regardless of what happens.

if you want slime just listen for a reporter named al strachan and you'll be covered in it...

cheerio
mike

Well, I'm from Montreal too and ticket prices are not exactly cheap. Maybe for crappy seats but if you want something decent in the reds you're looking at $100+ a ticket.

Forget about food and beer. $15 for a hotdog and beer. Rediculous.