We need a series of KRONWALLED avatars which show him lining up his victims just before the moment of impact.
I'd do more but most of the images I can find are of him after initial contact or are too blurry due to the speed he has coming at them.
We need a series of KRONWALLED avatars which show him lining up his victims just before the moment of impact.
This nonsense about the Norris trophy being "reputation-based" doesn't exist anywhere outside of HFBoards.
And since when does the powerplay not matter?
Also, claiming Konstantinov "owned Detroit" when he only got Norris trophy consideration twice; in 1995-96, where he was solidly 4th and Lidstrom was solidly 6th), and 1996-97 (where he was barely 2nd and easily could have finished 5th - as he did in the All-Star Team voting, while Lidstrom was 6th); and considering how Lidstrom shut down Eric Lindros in the 1997 finals, is a pretty big exaggeration.
Believe what you want. But the Norris is a reputation trophy -- more than most.
Of course the powerplay matters. But the PP is only a small part of a defenseman's job. It doesn't even have to be done by a defenseman.
That is no exaggeration at all, about Vladdie owning Detroit.
People liked Lidstrom. People in Detroit LOVED Konstantinov.
Even with the SCF, Konstantinov was still considered as the heart and soul of the Detroit defense.
Lidstrom was considered an offensive defenseman who was solid in his own end -- not elite.
I don't know of any Wings fans at all that held Konstantinov in higher regard than Lidstrom.
He was a great defenceman, but he was always #2 at best on the Wings blueline.
I'm guessing that you're 30 years old or younger and don't have a good appreciation for how revered Vladdie was in Detroit from 1995 to 1997
Konstantinov jerseys were all over Detroit.
This was a dude who could could score end to end, who made brilliant passes, and who hit like Kronwall and scrapped in the corners.
Why didn't Konstantinov score 60 points a year? Because he wasn't used on the first unit PP. Simple as that.
He was used first unit PK and Lidstrom was first unit PP
He was one-of-a-kind. Every bit as good as Lidstrom. Better, in fact, those couple years.
best video is probably this one
By the way--- In Both Years the Vladdie and Nick were in the Norris voting, Vladdie finished higher than Nick in Norris voting
Maybe I'm just missing your point here. If you were claiming that fans preferred Konstantinov in the same way Wings fans preferred Osgood to Hasek than I agree. Fans don't often pick their favorites based on who was the better player, personality and style has a lot to do with it.
Konstantinov's rougher style of play was more popular with Wings fans in the 90's because most of us had been accustomed to the Bruise Brothers and Lidstrom was as far from that style as can be.
Lidstrom was always the better player though even if he didn't have as many fans early in his career.
And Norris Trophy voters in Konstantinov's final two seasons disagree with you.
the Norris is a reputation trophy
Took voters a couple years to figure out just how good Lidstrom was. Once they did it was hard to get that trophy off his mantle.
I'm bathing myself with the tears being shed in the Kronwall thread on the main board right now. Hilarious how butt-hurt so many people are over his hits.
http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=145895&page=5And Norris Trophy voters in Konstantinov's final two seasons disagree with you.
1997
Norris Trophy (Defenseman): 1. Brian Leetch, N.Y. Rangers, 494; 2. Vladimir Konstantinov, Detroit, 178; 3. Sandis Ozolinsh, Colorado, 176; 4. Chris Chelios, Chicago, 172; 5. Scott Stevens, New Jersey, 171; 6. Nicklas Lidstrom, Detroit, 60; 7. Darryl Sydor, Dallas, 45; 8. Ray Bourque, Boston, 45; 9. Eric Desjardins, Philadelphia, 21; 10. Oleg Tverdovsky, Phoenix, 9.
Can't find the 96 awards
Here's a quote:
"If Konstantinov had been born in Moose Jaw he would win the Norris Trophy every year" ..... Brendan Shanahan
At one point, Lindros called him the best defenseman in the league.
Lidstrom had the points.
But Konstantinov was better at that stage in their careers.
Took voters a couple years to figure out just how good Lidstrom was. Once they did it was hard to get that trophy off his mantle.
Has he even clobbered anyone this year? I can't remember any.
Kronwall is currently tied for 5th in Norris voting, according to USA Today. Thoughts?
USA Today doesn't watch the games. And gets their info from stats such as G, A, PTS and talking to the idiots in our local sports media.
USA Today doesn't watch the games. And gets their info from stats such as G, A, PTS and talking to the idiots in our local sports media.
Kronwall is currently tied for 5th in Norris voting, according to USA Today. Thoughts?
The Konstantinov vs. Lidstrom debate was very real. I actually always came down on Lidstrom side, but Konstantinov was right there and for a lot of people better. They were a two headed monster and Lidstrom just continued getting better, we will never know with Vladdy unfortunately.
But I have to say it is pretty funny to watch The Fading Captain/Captain Bob make an argument based on Norris votes. Guess when it helps your case right buddy? However, lets dismiss it at every turn when arguing Lidstrom's 7 Norris Trophies and 4 cups and magically place Pronger over him for no reason even though they were against each other in all of those seasons.
But when someone says most Detroit fans thought Lidstrom was better or liked Lidstrom more, I bring out the Norris voting-- Konstantinov had a much higher profile than Lidstrom did. And using Norris voting is a piece of evidence to make a point about PUBLIC PERCEPTION...
I would watch yourself before making that accusation. Saying he doesn't know how to read makes you look bad when you leave out an essential part of his argument. You essentially left out that last bit Zetterberg Era added, the one where Lidstrom won 7 Norris trophies, yet you constantly argue that they weren't meaningful... Or something on the lines of Chris Pronger being better. He's essentially pointing out your hypocrisy and lack of integrity when it comes to arguing.What Norris voters think says nothing about I think.
But when someone says most Detroit fans thought Lidstrom was better or liked Lidstrom more, I bring out the Norris voting-- Konstantinov had a much higher profile than Lidstrom did. And using Norris voting is a piece of evidence to make a point about PUBLIC PERCEPTION...
My arguments about why Konstantinov was better than Lidstrom at the time have nothing to do with Norris voting
So learn to read bud.
So you're suggesting Norris voters have never been wrong?
What Norris voters think says nothing about I think.
But when someone says most Detroit fans thought Lidstrom was better or liked Lidstrom more, I bring out the Norris voting-- Konstantinov had a much higher profile than Lidstrom did. And using Norris voting is a piece of evidence to make a point about PUBLIC PERCEPTION...
My arguments about why Konstantinov was better than Lidstrom at the time have nothing to do with Norris voting
So learn to read bud.