This Is Your Tempe Talk

[The Feckless Puck]

Or this guy.

View attachment 549410

You want another bankruptcy?

It appears Meruelo has reduced the number of floors for the housing units in his project to appease Sky Harbor some.

Have to do more digging after work.

Maybe that's what the Coyotes will end up doing too - digging. Putting some of those floors underground (if they can break through the rock, that is - that was one of the reasons why we never built a subway system in Phoenix).

 

[TheLegend]

You want another bankruptcy?

It wouldn’t even make it there.

 

[TheLegend]

Maybe that's what the Coyotes will end up doing too - digging. Putting some of those floors underground (if they can break through the rock, that is - that was one of the reasons why we never built a subway system in Phoenix).

Article was in BoH from Fox10.

They (Coyotes) said out the original announcement they could remove a couple of floors if need be.

Sounds like they were pushing to the max occupancy but allowing for some negotiating room.

 

[JasonDemersWasOkay]

If cutting down on the amount of apartments is what it takes to get the airport out of it, whatever.

It’s all about the arena anyways

 

[Edenjung]

Maybe that's what the Coyotes will end up doing too - digging. Putting some of those floors underground (if they can break through the rock, that is - that was one of the reasons why we never built a subway system in Phoenix).

Ask the fins.
Helsinki is build on stone and a lot of facillities and other stuff is underground.
Even a hockey stadium, a church (semi-underground), public pool, cart-track, etc.
They have 10 Million square meters of tunnels and rooms underneath the city.

https://www.hel.fi/static/liitteet/kaupunkiymparisto/julkaisut/esitteet/esite-02-19-en.pdf

They could help with such endeavors.
Its also a good idea in hot climates. As being underground is much cooler than above.

 

[TheLegend]

Well I did some digging......

Phoenix Business Journal ran a story on the meeting with the airport board this evening.

I have my impressions posted in BoH but I'm not going to repost the whole damn thing because it's got a lot of quoted chunks in it....

So y'all can click on this link and hold your nose.

CXLIII - UPDATED 6/3 - Coyotes arena deal takes next step after Tempe council votes to open negotiations

It seemed obvious that not everyone is committed considering their landlord evicted them. You mean a landlord which has an alternate motive. You may want to take a closer look at all the pieces on the chess board.

hfboards.mandatory.com

(OR if you only need Cliffs...
-- The heights of the housing unit buildings have been lowered by two stories..
-- The cranes they plan to use will be lower than even the one Carvana used to build their building right across the street (they pointed out neither the airport nor FAA ever complained about that one.) The tallest crane of all of them will only be used for around 21 days.

 

[MIGs Dog]

Well I did some digging......

Phoenix Business Journal ran a story on the meeting with the airport board this evening.

I have my impressions posted in BoH but I'm not going to repost the whole damn thing because it's got a lot of quoted chunks in it....

So y'all can click on this link and hold your nose.

CXLIII - UPDATED 6/3 - Coyotes arena deal takes next step after Tempe council votes to open negotiations

It seemed obvious that not everyone is committed considering their landlord evicted them. You mean a landlord which has an alternate motive. You may want to take a closer look at all the pieces on the chess board.

hfboards.mandatory.com

(OR if you only need Cliffs...
-- The heights of the housing unit buildings have been lowered by two stories..
-- The cranes they plan to use will be lower than even the one Carvana used to build their building right across the street (they pointed out neither the airport nor FAA ever complained about that one.) The tallest crane of all of them will only be used for around 21 days.

I did clink the link and read. . Is there any concern about the arena height? I did a little research and found that T-mobile arena in Vegas is built roughly on grade and rises to a height of 145 ft, while Little Cesaers arena in Detroit has the ice sheet 40 ft below grade and therefore extends only 75 ft above ground. As others have mentioned, going subterranean might mitigate some concerns.

 

[Jakey53]

Completely agree, but muscle flexing doesn't change the reality. If ownership is willing to suffer the losses, they can keep the team here.

Not with no arena. Bettman said that himself.

Just going to point out butts in seats are butts in seats.

At this stage it doesn’t matter who’s sweater is on the butt in that seat. Meruelo needs to squeeze all the revenue he can out of this for the next 3 years while he gets his arena plan rolling.

IF he gets the arena plan going.

 

[GhostofTommyBolin]

I did clink the link and read. . Is there any concern about the arena height? I did a little research and found that T-mobile arena in Vegas is built roughly on grade and rises to a height of 145 ft, while Little Cesaers arena in Detroit has the ice sheet 40 ft below grade and therefore extends only 75 ft above ground. As others have mentioned, going subterranean might mitigate some concerns.

I was wondering if Meruelo and Co. would go this route, also. If the LCA in Detroit didn't have lighted signs on it that gave it away, you could drive up pretty close to it and not even know it's an arena. The outer shell is brick and windows almost all the way around, almost giving the appearance of an old brick office building that's like four stories high.

 

[moosemeister]

There is a crane right by the Art center on tempe town lake right now. I know it's a little further west but it isn't a very small crane by any means. haha

 

[Knights2017]

There is a crane right by the Art center on tempe town lake right now. I know it's a little further west but it isn't a very small crane by any means. haha

There are a few in the general area.. nothing burger of concern if this was a normal shopping center/office park. The arena is the ONLY reason Sky harbor has a problem.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

I think that Meruelo has one last play to make if the Tempe deal falls through, and that's with an Indian Nation. My bet wouldn't be on Talking Stick, but would be on the Gila River Nation, at Wild Pass. Huge amount of land, no zoning or rehabilitation issues, on the corner of the 10 and the 202. Shovels could hit the dirt the day after an agreement was signed. Great optics vis a vis minority ownership in a white man's game and a small bit of redress.

 

[Knights2017]

I think that Meruelo has one last play to make if the Tempe deal falls through, and that's with an Indian Nation. My bet wouldn't be on Talking Stick, but would be on the Gila River Nation, at Wild Pass. Huge amount of land, no zoning or rehabilitation issues, on the corner of the 10 and the 202. Shovels could hit the dirt the day after an agreement was signed. Great optics vis a vis minority ownership in a white man's game and a small bit of redress.

Still a bit of a location issue if it's Gila River though. But huge difference is that Chandler, Gilbert, and even Scottsadale would find the location more doable compared to Glendale's road trip.

Salt River is a better option for viability. I don't think it gets there, the Tempe deal will be approved once the new Council is in place (My opinion with ZERO inside information)

 

[TheLegend]

I did clink the link and read. . Is there any concern about the arena height? I did a little research and found that T-mobile arena in Vegas is built roughly on grade and rises to a height of 145 ft, while Little Cesaers arena in Detroit has the ice sheet 40 ft below grade and therefore extends only 75 ft above ground. As others have mentioned, going subterranean might mitigate some concerns.

The original plans shown to the board had the arena roof sitting lower than the housing units.

 

[jmichael7753]

Marina heights when it was built used some pretty large cranes. Its a mile and a half or so down the road but still in the flight path.

 

[IronFinn]

I think a more appropriate comparison for the new ticket price would be the average lower bowl ticket price at GRA v ASU, as ASU only has a lower bowl. Let's compare apples to apples, shall we?

Agreed, but I didn't think I had any good solid information on GRA lower bowl prices to compare to.

So I dug some more, and I found an old 2017-2018 price sheet for all lower bowl seats. Again, doing some rough math, including the fact that the ends are nearly 2/3rd of the lower bowl seats, and adding in some increases for sports ticket inflation, I came to an estimate of ~$100 per seat in the lower bowl this year. I did my best to account for full STH prices, half season ticket price, and gate prices with estimates for each. I assumed that of the 2,750 STH seats that Gutierrez had told us about, that 2/3rd were lower bowl and 1/3 were upper bowl. My estimate landed in the $95-$105 range, so I just went with $100/seat.

Does that seem reasonable to others?

Assuming that is close, we are talking $100/seat at GRA as compared to the $200/seat at ASU that I came up with yesterday.

 

[TheLegend]

I know it’s just me…. but I get the feeling a meteor is going to hit ASU and wipe everything out before anything else (including another Katie Strang article) would cause ASU to boot the Coyotes out of their lease at the MPA.

 

[0point1]

I think that Meruelo has one last play to make if the Tempe deal falls through, and that's with an Indian Nation. My bet wouldn't be on Talking Stick, but would be on the Gila River Nation, at Wild Pass. Huge amount of land, no zoning or rehabilitation issues, on the corner of the 10 and the 202. Shovels could hit the dirt the day after an agreement was signed. Great optics vis a vis minority ownership in a white man's game and a small bit of redress.

Just did a quick check of Google Maps from (Old Town) Scottsdale to Wild Horse at 6PM weekdays and it's 25 to 45 minutes.

An alternative location might be 101 & 202. Not the one in Tempe but the one in Chandler. It's Gila River land, undeveloped and 10 minutes closer to Tempe and Scottsdale. 15 to 35 minutes from Tempe and Scottsdale is pretty damn good. Similar time from Downtown Phoenix as well. Could build a casino right next to the arena.

 

[rt]

Just did a quick check of Google Maps from (Old Town) Scottsdale to Wild Horse at 6PM weekdays and it's 25 to 45 minutes.

An alternative location might be 101 & 202. Not the one in Tempe but the one in Chandler. It's Gila River land, undeveloped and 10 minutes closer to Tempe and Scottsdale. 15 to 35 minutes from Tempe and Scottsdale is pretty damn good. Similar time from Downtown Phoenix as well. Could build a casino right next to the arena.

Well it’s only 19mi from my house. So I like it. Buuuut still FEELS like far away from the center do the city.

 

[More Cooley]

Article on cranes;

Coyotes call foul on Sky Harbor's claims that Tempe arena construction would cost airport millions

After officials from Sky Harbor said the construction of the proposed Arizona Coyotes arena in Tempe would cause numerous delays and losses of millions of dollars, the National Hockey League franchise’s development team accused the Phoenix Aviation Department of fabricating those results.

www.abc15.com

 

[TheLegend]

Article on cranes;

Coyotes call foul on Sky Harbor's claims that Tempe arena construction would cost airport millions

After officials from Sky Harbor said the construction of the proposed Arizona Coyotes arena in Tempe would cause numerous delays and losses of millions of dollars, the National Hockey League franchise’s development team accused the Phoenix Aviation Department of fabricating those results.

www.abc15.com

That's just a small part of the Phoenix Biz Journal article.

There's another part of the article I didn't get to yet that said the Coyotes current revenue sourcing at the MPA is going to be 70% less than what they would normally receive at GRA.

While the Coyotes wait on Tempe and squabble with airport officials, the team is preparing for its move into a smaller interim arena on the Arizona State University campus in Tempe. The team has entered into an agreement with ASU to be a tenant of its multipurpose arena that is currently being constructed.

While the Coyotes have said to the East Valley and on ASU’s campus as better than playing in Glendale and Gila River Arena, the mainstream hockey press has scoffed at the idea of a NHL team playing multiple years in a college hockey arena that only seats 5,000 spectators.

Gutierrez told the Business Journal earlier this year that the team had such little revenue in Glendale that it won’t notice any financial difference playing in Tempe. He also said that being in Tempe would allow the team to get more and better sponsors.

The Coyotes recently signed a deal with the arena’s management company, Oak View Group, to create a partnership on advertising and sponsorships for the new arena. While the deal could help the Coyotes secure new advertisers for its temporary space, the team will also now have to split advertising revenue with OVG.

Bill Sakiewicz, the Coyotes' chief business officer, said the team will have about 70% less advertising and sponsorship inventory to work with at the smaller ASU arena than the team did at its former home, Gila River Arena in Glendale.

“We’re going to need to come up with new innovative executions for sponsors, both inside the arena, and more importantly, outside the arena and all year round in that Scottsdale-Tempe-Mesa corridor,” Sakiewicz said.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Just did a quick check of Google Maps from (Old Town) Scottsdale to Wild Horse at 6PM weekdays and it's 25 to 45 minutes.

An alternative location might be 101 & 202. Not the one in Tempe but the one in Chandler. It's Gila River land, undeveloped and 10 minutes closer to Tempe and Scottsdale. 15 to 35 minutes from Tempe and Scottsdale is pretty damn good. Similar time from Downtown Phoenix as well. Could build a casino right next to the arena.

So Glendale 2.0.

 

[rt]

So Glendale 2.0.

It’s not ideal but it’s not as bad as that. Doesn’t it still cut the distance even from Paradise Valley by a third?

But it’s definitely not one of my top two spots.

 

[Dirty Old Man]

^Yeah that location would be way too good for me. Only 4 miles.

 

[Mosby]

Anyone here thinking of scooping up one of these condos at the TED?