The truth about this team

[Big Lurk]

If healthy Galchenyuk will likely hit 50 points.

With better coaching Desharnais isn't our 1st line center, Allen doesn't get a sniff of ice time, and likely one of Gilbert/Weaver are #7 guys.

What is meant by on paper is looking at the roster and not how the coach uses them. We have a crappy coach who makes this team worse then it truly is. So on paper we have a much better team. I'm not sure I'd say contender, unless talking just about the East.

EDIT: By the way LA has 2 players on pace for more than 50 points this season, so I'm not sure that's a good measure of if a team is a contender or not.

Well the coach's name is on that paper too, he's an integral part of the teams success or failure.

They still have a better defensive system, a better coach, a better PP, their 1st line C has more than 2 goals, pretty sure their goal differential is better, too.

We have better left wingers. But on RW, C, and D they have better players than we do.

 

[Kriss E]

So this truth that you have uncovered about our team is that:

We're not that good..

Damn, insightful stuff.

There's absolutely no reason for us to be playing so poorly. The structure is the main issue.

 

[Haburger]

It's actually the opposite... we have one of the top teams on paper in the East. The system we use, if you can call it a system, just gets destroyed by every other coach in the league, no matter the other team's roster.

HUH? We don't have one of the top teams in the east on paper.this team has had problems scoring and nothing at all has been done about it.until this issue is addressed this the team we have to live with.

 

[Sorinth]

They still have a better defensive system, a better coach, a better PP, their 1st line C has more than 2 goals, pretty sure their goal differential is better, too.

We have better left wingers. But on RW, C, and D they have better players than we do.

I'm not trying to say that we are as good or better than them but it's not because they have more 50 point scorers then we do.

In terms of talent I'm not sure they are better than us, but they play as a team whereas we play shinny and that's the biggest difference.

And if you look at it player by player I don't think their defence is better, they just look better because they actually play a system whereas we run around like a chicken with it's head cutoff.

If we played as a cohesive unit we have the potential to be a contender, which is why on paper we could be considered contenders. The OP of this thread said the roster lacks talent and so it's not the coaches fault.

 

[Kriss E]

Well the coach's name is on that paper too, he's an integral part of the teams success or failure.

They still have a better defensive system, a better coach, a better PP, their 1st line C has more than 2 goals, pretty sure their goal differential is better, too.

We have better left wingers. But on RW, C, and D they have better players than we do.

The cup winners have a better roster, sure. What's your point though?

 

[Big Lurk]

I'm not trying to say that we are as good or better than them but it's not because they have more 50 point scorers then we do.

In terms of talent I'm not sure they are better than us, but they play as a team whereas we play shinny and that's the biggest difference.

And if you look at it player by player I don't think their defence is better, they just look better because they actually play a system whereas we run around like a chicken with it's head cutoff.

If we played as a cohesive unit we have the potential to be a contender, which is why on paper we could be considered contenders. The OP of this thread said the roster lacks talent and so it's not the coaches fault.

Agreed

 

[habsfanatics*]

Parenteau is adequate in the middle six.

I had doubts of this when we acquired him, I think if there's enough talent in the other holes, you're probably right, but this team is extremely thin in some key winger/center positions.

 

[Agnostic]

I am looking for my 10 year old essay on the problem with the Habs centre position, it must have got deleted on my last computer upgrade. It is still valid to this day.

There are a couple of people here who blame the high price of milk on Therrien, and DD has been an obstacle to a cure for cancer for how long now?We should just scoop them up in the middle of the night and dump their bodies in a river.

I don't buy any of it.

I think Bergevin warned us this wasn't necessarily an ECF team, or at least a perennial one. He is slow baking the defence, keeping and acquiring draft picks, keeping nimble with some good management of the books. This brings a good long term outlook.

Shorter term you have to grit your teeth and wait for a big league centre . Not only do they not grow on trees but there aren't even enough of the impactful type to be spread across a 30 team league. Bring on expansion !

I have a current hate on for Pittsburgh and Edmonton. Pittsburgh got the lions share of luck off a lucky (or rigged) lottery draft to go with years of first overall picks, Edmonton has been stockpiling but can't find the launch code to get a very talented team off the pad.

Montreal had a Koivu and kicked him in the groin for years for not being better for a team that was almost expansion quality on the ice. Today we have a fairly deep team in search of a new Koivu.

Timing and luck is everything in this business.

 

[Hackett]

Its been a season of extremes. They are not as good as their first quarter indicated and not as bad as their recent stretch of losses.

It's almost as if the record is in the process of correcting itself right now.

This group had a really poor stretch last season, which I think hit rock bottom in a 5-0 home loss to Washington. They managed to pull themselves out of that rough patch, and based on that, I think this group has what it takes to get out of the current slide.

Overall, I'm not too concerned, but it just makes games frustrating to watch in these times.

 

[deandebean]

This team is not a contender. We surely lack a coach, yes, but we lack much more than that. We signed 2 number 6-7 d-men, traded for another and we have them play in the top 5. Not a good situation.

On the top-6, you need more than what we have. And you can win all the faceoffs you need, fact of the matter is you need to score. Heck, even Jim Roberts scored at least one.

 

[nyhabsfan]

Team is a contender on paper.

Not with that defense.....

 

[Nicko999]

Not with that defense.....

And not with those forwards... who is gonna score the goals aside from Pacioretty?

 

[Scintillating10]

Find out what we have for a GM in next few months. It's one thing to acquire good parts to fill roles. Another to make that big trade for top scorer we need. I've seen a lot of GM's be only able to take a team so far.

 

[bigtimehockeyfan999*]

http://montrealgazette.com/sports/h...-real-no-1-centre-to-replace-david-desharnais


this pretty much sums it up...we need a real number 1 centre....we\ve always needed a real number 1 centre ....we haven't had one since..........

 

[K2MyEverest]

I think they should have go all in with the youth movement too. Bergevin said before the season that it was a transition year. Don't have our expectations too high even after a Eastern Conferences Finals. He did some great moves getting rid of dead weight such as Moen and Bourque for two players in their final contract years. It helped with the cap situation for next year but having Gonchar (who's playing decent, can't whine about his play really) and Allen (a disaster) just pushed Beaulieu and Tinordi a little further in the depth charts and instead of devellopping in the NHL full time this season, they're still in the AHL. If it was supposed to be a transition year, let the kids play and do their mistakes and learn about the game.

At the same time, it was a brilliant move to free some cash for next season and Bergevin already closed on Gallagher deal so that's a good thing. I just hate the fact that we're having one of the oldest defensive squad in the league. Since Gonchar is playing quite well, I think Tinordi should be the one who should be playing in the NHL right now. We need a defensive first oriented d-man more than a offense first like Beaulieu.

Another thing that is bugging me and like everybody said here, is the lack of production up front. The lack of commitment too. Desharnais, Plekanec and Eller is fairly weak at the middle and we're even weaker on the wings. Bergevin should get rid of DD and place Galchenyuk at center for good. Just look at him play and we can all agree it would be an instant upgrade over DD. Chucky and Patches playing together could do some great damages. Galchenyuk is a playmaking center. We can all see this by looking at him play. He's got an amazing shot and will use it when he can but he always try to pass first. He's often the first guy getting back on defense on his line even if he's not playing center right now. That's another sign that he's ready to swich to center position.

Trade DD with a prospect and a pick, I don't really care, get a winger for him to help on the wings and switch Galchenyuk to center. It would upgrade our lineup instantly. Galchenyuk, Pleks and Eller is a great 1-2-3. Trust the kids a little more. Bring back Tinordi if Allen, Weaver can't sustain the pace. If this is going to be a transition year, embrace it. We'll make the playoffs anyway, who cares if it's first in the east or at wildcard position.

 

[NobleSix]

The roster is continuing to trend in the right direction. The coaching and the systems however, are not. The style that this team employs does not compliment the players it employs.

 

[japhi]

The team is on the right track... just be patient. We just need more TALENT.

I've made this point over and over. Some posters would lead you to believe that we just need to change the lines, fire the coach,or get rid of a player, but at the end of the day we are playing as good as we should with the talent we have. We are missing a few peices - our 4th line is useless, the D is a little crusty, and we need a top 3 C/LW. Not huge gaps, MB should be able to get us there over the next 2-3 years but it will take time.

We have a team on the upswing, lots of good talent in the pipeline and a great young core group. But we are in year 1 or 2 of a 10 year push where we should be in the hunt every year.

 

[japhi]

HUH? We don't have one of the top teams in the east on paper.this team has had problems scoring and nothing at all has been done about it.until this issue is addressed this the team we have to live with.

This is BS, on paper we are a middle of the pack team. We don't have a player that's that's a threat to crack 71 points. We have a top 6 RW that a bottom feeder in Colorado wanted to get rid of. We have a fourth line C that 30 points in his last 180 games. His winger couldn't crack the Jet's lineup. Our backup goalie is 25 and has played 17 games in the NHL. 2 of our top 8 D were give away's from other teams.

I think MB has done a very good job and love where this team is headed but this in not a great team on paper.

 

[Smokey Thompson]

HUH? We don't have one of the top teams in the east on paper.this team has had problems scoring and nothing at all has been done about it.until this issue is addressed this the team we have to live with.

With guys like Patches, Galchenyuk, Plek, Gally, Sekac, Eller, Pap on offence and Subban, Markov, Beaulieu on defence, there's no reason this team shouldn't be scoring so few goals and there's definitely no excuse for the horrible PP.

The team should be playing a quick transition and skating game with controlled zone entries and puck possession. Instead, this coach has the forwards waiting for stretch passes at the opposite blue line and then dumping those stretch passes in. By the time our forwards have the puck, they're below the goal line and more often than not lose it to bigger, stronger defensemen. Our forwards have the speed and ability to skate the puck past these D on the rush, but instead they're told to completely disregard their speed advantage and try to outmuscle them along the boards.

Case and point, the game vs Dallas... Dallas employs a handful of Huge and slow defensemen who can be easily exploited (the way wingers exploit Emelin's skating), but instead we put ourselves at a disadvantage and our forwards simply get manhandled downlow after dumping it in non stop. Dallas gives up the most goals per game because of their slow and bad defence, but our speedy, skilled offence couldn't even exploit them because of the stupid system our coach has in place.

 

[Nicko999]

With guys like Patches, Galchenyuk, Plek, Gally, Sekac, Eller, Pap on offence and Subban, Markov, Beaulieu on defence, there's no reason this team shouldn't be scoring so few goals and there's definitely no excuse for the horrible PP.

Plekanec is a fine #2C, he is a 50 pts forward at this point of his career.
Galchenyuk is looking great but let him see score more than 31 pts in a season shall we?
Gally is a 20/20 guy.
Sekac is a rookie. Don't expect him to score more than 10-15 goals this year.
Eller is a third line center.
PAP is a 40 pts guy max.

Beaulieu has yet to score a goal in the NHL and has not looked good at all.

Not sure where those goals will come from.

 

[Sorinth]

This is BS, on paper we are a middle of the pack team. We don't have a player that's that's a threat to crack 71 points. We have a top 6 RW that a bottom feeder in Colorado wanted to get rid of. We have a fourth line C that 30 points in his last 180 games. His winger couldn't crack the Jet's lineup. Our backup goalie is 25 and has played 17 games in the NHL. 2 of our top 8 D were give away's from other teams.

I think MB has done a very good job and love where this team is headed but this in not a great team on paper.

The last 3 seasons Pacioretty has averaged 66.8 points over an 82 game season. So to say he isn't a threat to crack 71 points isn't true, especially if we stop playing him with Desharnais. And Galchenyuk could break out at any time, especially if he's moved to center.

30 points in 180 games is about 14 points a season. That seems entirely reasonable for a 4th line center, especially if he brings other things to the table which Malhotra does.

Not that it matters but Colorado wasn't a bottom feeder when they got rid of Parenteau, in fact they were a top team thought to be on the cusp of being a contender. They got worse with that trade and are now a worse team (Obviously not all due to losing Parenteau).

 

[japhi]

The last 3 seasons Pacioretty has averaged 66.8 points over an 82 game season. So to say he isn't a threat to crack 71 points isn't true, especially if we stop playing him with Desharnais. And Galchenyuk could break out at any time, especially if he's moved to center.

30 points in 180 games is about 14 points a season. That seems entirely reasonable for a 4th line center, especially if he brings other things to the table which Malhotra does.

Not that it matters but Colorado wasn't a bottom feeder when they got rid of Parenteau, in fact they were a top team thought to be on the cusp of being a contender. They got worse with that trade and are now a worse team (Obviously not all due to losing Parenteau).

Max has never broken 66 points over a full season so I'm going to have to reject your 66 point average. Max had 60 points last year and is on pace for 58 this year.

The AVs have been a bottom feeder the past 5 years, they had a good regular season last year but didn't make it out of the first round. They were one of the worse teams in the league the year before. And PAP is a 9th round draft pick that's been on waivers and was traded for Briere.

I know it's popular to blame MT for the results but we just aren't that great a lineup right now.

 

[Sorinth]

Max has never broken 66 points over a full season so I'm going to have to reject your 66 point average. Max had 60 points last year and is on pace for 58 this year.

The AVs have been a bottom feeder the past 5 years, they had a good regular season last year but didn't make it out of the first round. They were one of the worse teams in the league the year before. And PAP is a 9th round draft pick that's been on waivers and was traded for Briere.

I know it's popular to blame MT for the results but we just aren't that great a lineup right now.

You can reject basic math all you want but that's still his average over 82 games.

Colorado was considered an up and coming contender. They didn't think they needed PAP because of their depth at forward. It turns out they were wrong, so them dumping PAP is meaningless.

Therein is getting the least possible out of the lineup.

 

[Saintpatrick*]

We don't have a first line center or a first line right winger

We also don't have a coach that will use the current personnel properly maximizing their strengths.

Till we acquire the above mentioned we'll be a middle of the pack team.

 

[japhi]

The last 3 seasons Pacioretty has averaged 66.8 points over an 82 game season. So to say he isn't a threat to crack 71 points isn't true, especially if we stop playing him with Desharnais. And Galchenyuk could break out at any time, especially if he's moved to center.

30 points in 180 games is about 14 points a season. That seems entirely reasonable for a 4th line center, especially if he brings other things to the table which Malhotra does.

Not that it matters but Colorado wasn't a bottom feeder when they got rid of Parenteau, in fact they were a top team thought to be on the cusp of being a contender. They got worse with that trade and are now a worse team (Obviously not all due to losing Parenteau).

You can reject basic math all you want but that's still his average over 82 games.

Colorado was considered an up and coming contender. They didn't think they needed PAP because of their depth at forward. It turns out they were wrong, so them dumping PAP is meaningless.

Therein is getting the least possible out of the lineup.

LOL, you must have your own basic math system. Here is what my math tells me:

He has a career .66 PPG average (54 over 82 avg). He hit 60 points last year and is on pace for 56. If that's a 70 point threat you need to do more to convince me. If you follow the guy you would know he is a sniper, he's not a guy that's going to put up big points.

And PAP is a plug, if you want to argue that he's a top 6 player I'm all ears. We can use your math or mine. 40 point guy all day long.