The Rebuild/Tank Related GDT Thread #17, currently 6th. worst team.

[King Leaf]

Clarkaon was just a guy that was paid way too much for his talent level who had a rough couple of seasons. I still want players who can embrace the frenzy in this city, look at the mess our team is in right now thanks to the media and fans. It's not a requirement, but it would be nice. It's also a nice narrative, like if Arizona get Matthews next year. But I'm actually from Toronto I could see why Leafs fans from other parts of the world couldn't care less.

 

[Daisy Jane]

who cares really.

Hm. this is a good question.

I guess it matters because in a sense, it's a good story. (i mean never mind we generally here this story every single year very skilled high drafted player wants to be in Toronto because big Leafs fan, but will never play for home town team because life and Toronto is not good (or lucky, or whatever to get him).

I put skilled because we never really had that
We've had broken down Leafs fans (Lindros)
we've had okay Leafs fans (Franson)
we've had Clarkson.

but we've never really had the high end-skilled elite/super talented player who was born here, grew up here, loves being here, grew up a Leaf, etc. I'm a girl. I love the romantic nature of it. it doesn't "really" matter, but it's nice. I'd also be happy with the best hockey player from Timbuktu who never heard of the Leafs until the day we called his name at the podium just as long as he was good.

 

[Teeder9]

Clarkaon was just a guy that was paid way too much for his talent level who had a rough couple of seasons. I still want players who can embrace the frenzy in this city, look at the mess our team is in right now thanks to the media and fans. It's not a requirement, but it would be nice. It's also a nice narrative, like if Arizona get Matthews next year. But I'm actually from Toronto I could see why Leafs fans from other parts of the world couldn't care less.

I could probably care more if Leaf fans didn't come into Toronto and kick the **** out of the Leafs on a regular basis, but then I also believe it doesn't matter where you were born, you play for the team you're on

 

[King Leaf]

Hm. this is a good question.

I guess it matters because in a sense, it's a good story. (i mean never mind we generally here this story every single year very skilled high drafted player wants to be in Toronto because big Leafs fan, but will never play for home town team because life and Toronto is not good (or lucky, or whatever to get him).

I put skilled because we never really had that
We've had broken down Leafs fans (Lindros)
we've had okay Leafs fans (Franson)
we've had Clarkson.

but we've never really had the high end-skilled elite/super talented player who was born here, grew up here, loves being here, grew up a Leaf, etc. I'm a girl. I love the romantic nature of it. it doesn't "really" matter, but it's nice. I'd also be happy with the best hockey player from Timbuktu who never heard of the Leafs until the day we called his name at the podium just as long as he was good.

This is a much better explanation than mine, just ignore the drivel I wrote! I'm a dude and I'm still about that romantic nature of it, that's why I want Max Domi here man. And cause Tie Domi, dat nostalgia :')

 

[Kurisu]

Hm. this is a good question.

I guess it matters because in a sense, it's a good story. (i mean never mind we generally here this story every single year very skilled high drafted player wants to be in Toronto because big Leafs fan, but will never play for home town team because life and Toronto is not good (or lucky, or whatever to get him).

I put skilled because we never really had that
We've had broken down Leafs fans (Lindros)
we've had okay Leafs fans (Franson)
we've had Clarkson.

but we've never really had the high end-skilled elite/super talented player who was born here, grew up here, loves being here, grew up a Leaf, etc. I'm a girl. I love the romantic nature of it. it doesn't "really" matter, but it's nice. I'd also be happy with the best hockey player from Timbuktu who never heard of the Leafs until the day we called his name at the podium just as long as he was good.

in the same token, I can see alot of unrealistic pressure on the Toronto kid to save this losing franchise.

 

[Kurisu]

This is a much better explanation than mine, just ignore the drivel I wrote! I'm a dude and I'm still about that romantic nature of it, that's why I want Max Domi here man. And cause Tie Domi, dat nostalgia :')

I wouldn't get too hyped about the WJC performances.

 

[Giuseppe Sallo]

Stamkos is coming home.

Actually I think Wiggins coming home is more likely to happen. Haha

 

[Daisy Jane]

in the same token, I can see alot of unrealistic pressure on the Toronto kid to save this losing franchise.

oh it's totally true. like it's a double edge sword for sure. but you didn't ask me that , you simply asked, who cares? so i do (partially).

 

[KingBrian]

Toronto's future

With the trade deadline over, and Phil Kessel still on the leafs...Predict the top line-up of the Maple Leafs if they were to draft Mcdavid or Eichel, how many points do you think their top line can get, and what position in the standings would the leafs finish at (if they had Eichel or Mcdavid)? Also, if you were Toronto's gm and you had the thrid overall draft pick....who would you select?

 

[LV*]

If we had #3 I'm taking Noah Hanifin

 

[Giuseppe Sallo]

I hope Kessel isn't on the team. It's time to move on.

#3? Marner for me. Stock up on Ontario boys.

 

[KingBrian]

An all american line with jvr-eichel-kessel would be pretty sick

 

[HEAVY DUTY]

hanifin if we want D, or strome if we want C.

i want hanifin at #3 though. the guy is going to be a stud. seriously.

 

[Divine]

I wish this year's draft had the top three picks selected via lottery. I want McDavid or Eichel pretty bad. I saw Craig Button talk about Eichel today.. and the best comparable he could give was a faster Getzlaf, and a player who knows how to use his size and speed to go around players, like Lemieux...

Yeah, I like those comparables...

 

[colchar]

With the trade deadline over, and Phil Kessel still on the leafs...Predict the top line-up of the Maple Leafs if they were to draft Mcdavid or Eichel, how many points do you think their top line can get, and what position in the standings would the leafs finish at (if they had Eichel or Mcdavid)?

What is the point of a ridiculous exercise like that when it is all fantasy and speculation?

 

[Giuseppe Sallo]

This is a deep draft so I'm optimistic we'll get a stud player. Barzal is my steal of the draft. Book it.

 

[highslot]

mcdavid will break 100 with kessel.

#3 pick is marner. then strome, then hanafin, then barzal, then zacha, then ratanen.

 

[Tyler Biggs*]

This rebuilding process will weed out the fairweather fans who do nothing but troll in this forum. Only true fans will have the patience to be around for the long haul.

 

[ShooterMikgaven]

This rebuilding process will weed out the fairweather fans who do nothing but troll in this forum. Only true fans will have the patience to be around for the long haul.

Well its been a long haul already, since 2004 nothing but futility and spinning our wheels, up until 2013 where we saw a glimmer of hope that was dashed quickly since.

Basically any Leaf fan that can call themselves that for any length of time, has seen more than their share of mediocrity or worse, and will be witness to more of the same, but at least it will be by design and with direction(we hope) so that will make it more bearable to watch.

 

[pucci2001]

Agreed, people seem to think that trading these players now for anything is the best move, when thats not even close to true. Our rebuild really depends on the return for guys like Kessel/Dion.

As for your returns, Kessel should get an A prospect, B prospect and a midfirst OR a top 10 pick and a B~ prospect. If the players we get in return don't have at least a chance of becoming a player like Kessel then I say we keep him. This means top 10 picks or A prospects, otherwise it's worth more just to have him stay.

I agree with everything except Dion. I think he needs to go, he can't be captain, TSN burned his last bridge here too maybe? I think if we can get a first and second or even first and third we move him out even if we have to take a bad contract in return. I would want him out west though, as much as I dont like Dion I know he can be a good 2nd pairing guy and if one of his rare neutral zone hits landed on Nylander, Kessel, Rielly one day I would cringe so hard seeing it. Just get him somewhere where we barely will see him for years not somewhere that will haunt us.

 

[FlareKnight]

This rebuilding process will weed out the fairweather fans who do nothing but troll in this forum. Only true fans will have the patience to be around for the long haul.

Will it really ? Anyone who is still here after the start of the Burke era until now has already been through plenty. I really don't think an actual rebuild is going to break them. You have to have a heck of a lot more patience to endure what we just went through.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Posted in the Shanahan thread, but worth repeating in this low expectation thread

The more I think about this the more I think Shanahan is setting himself up to look good.

It's very smart actually.

Set expectations so low, any success this team has perhaps next year, or the year after. He looks like a genius.

It's about managing expectations. I will cite 3 recent examples.

Montreal finished 3rd last in 2012. Where are they now? A more radical improvement was Colorado finished dead last to draft Mackinnon, the following year they had 100+ points. Nashville finished 4th last to draft Jones in 2012, they are 2nd overall this year after being 1st overall until they hit a 4 game losing streak.

The Leafs are 6th last currently, it is not impossible for them to improve, in the next couple of years.

For me, I am not fooled by this long patient, low expectations, rebuild message from Shanahan. He has cleverly changed the message around this team. It's about lowering expectations.

To buy himself more leeway. Fans should not be so quick to throw in the towel on next season. Nashville, Montreal, and Colorado are hard factual examples of quick turnarounds. Don't buy what Shanahan is trying to sell.

Shanahan is quite a clever politician. He has already got this fanbase buying into more years of losing. And he did it so easily. I call myself a Hockey Mentalist, Why I can see throught this mind trick. Shanahan has not fooled me. And I will relay my thoughts to my fellow Leafs fans to not be so gullable.

Leafs ticket holders pay the highest prices for tickets around. They (we) deserve better.

 

[achtungbaby]

This rebuilding process will weed out the fairweather fans who do nothing but troll in this forum. Only true fans will have the patience to be around for the long haul.

Someone is showing their youth. The elder Leaf fans have been through plenty already, this won't stop them.

 

[ACC1224]

This rebuilding process will weed out the fairweather fans who do nothing but troll in this forum. Only true fans will have the patience to be around for the long haul.

Not at all, you're making the assumption that they are fans in the 1st place.

 

[Nithoniniel]

The more I think about this the more I think Shanahan is setting himself up to look good.

It's very smart actually.

Set expectations so low, any success this team has perhaps next year, or the year after. He looks like a genius.

It's about managing expectations. I will cite 3 recent examples.

Montreal finished 3rd last in 2012. Where are they now? A more radical improvement was Colorado finished dead last to draft Mackinnon, the following year they had 100+ points. Nashville finished 4th last to draft Jones in 2012, they are 2nd overall this year after being 1st overall until they hit a 4 game losing streak.

The Leafs are 6th last currently, it is not impossible for them to improve, in the next couple of years.

For me, I am not fooled by this long patient, low expectations, rebuild message from Shanahan. He has cleverly changed the message around this team. It's about lowering expectations.

To buy himself more leeway. Fans should not be so quick to throw in the towel on next season. Nashville, Montreal, and Colorado are hard factual examples of quick turnarounds. Don't buy what Shanahan is trying to sell.

Shanahan is quite a clever politician. He has already got this fanbase buying into more years of losing. And he did it so easily. I call myself a Hockey Mentalist, Why I can see throught this mind trick. Shanahan has not fooled me. And I will relay my thoughts to my fellow Leafs fans to not be so gullable.

Leafs ticket holders pay the highest prices for tickets around. They (we) deserve better.

He might very well be lowering expectations. I can't say anything for his reasons to such, I'm sure a Hockey Mentalist such as yourself is more qualified for that.

What I do know is that we have every reason to lower expectations. This team as it is will never be anything but a bubble team at best. A quick fix rebuild could make this team a playoff team with significant flaws. For anything else, a longer rebuild is needed.