The Penguins once Crosby/Malkin leave

Discussion in 'National Hockey League Talk' started by NA Scouting, Oct 12, 2018.

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  1. NA Scouting

    NA Scouting Registered User

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    I know they arn't that old yet but with all the young stars coming into the league like Matthews/MacKinnon/McDavid and Ovechkin winning the cup last year it got me thinking that it's possible we are witnessing the final years of the Crosby/Malkin legacy.

    I was curious as to what Pittsburgh would do without them in the future since I don't believe they are a good drafting team and currently don't have a lot of young prospects coming up.

    I discovered that Malkin, Kessel and Letang are all UFA in 2022-23 and that Crosby's salary drops to $3M by then. What would the Penguins look like by then if they all left?

    FORWARDS
    Guentzel and Sprong seem to be the only top-6 players remaining, with a possibility for Hallander. Hornqvist will be 34 by then and Rust 30, both should be 3rd liners. They don't really have anyone else worthy of mentionning. Maybe Bellerive, also for the 3rd line. That is an awful, awful forward corps.

    DEFENSE
    The D without Letang will be pretty average, led by aging Schutlz/Dumoulin as well as Maatta. Johnson will be pretty old and should be relegated to 3rd pairing duties. Calen Addison should be part of the mix.

    GOALIES
    Fortunately the Pens should still have Matt Murray and he could be a top-5 NHL goalie, which should help.


    In conclusion it seems apparent to me that the Pittsburgh Penguins might be in a position to trade away at least two of Malkin, Crosby, Letang and Kessel prior to the 2022-23 season in order to acquire picks, prospects and young players to quicken the rebuild. As it stands the Penguins are an awful drafting team that havn't drafted in the 1st round in recent years. Furthermore, it is likely that they will compete for the Stanley Cup in the coming years, so they will trade away other picks/prospects to reinforce their roster and will not draft very high.

    It will be extremely interesting to see how Pittsburgh will manoeuvrer. I know it's a long way but if they don't start drafting decent players soon, it sure seems like the cupboards will be extremely bare when Crosby and Malkin reach retirement age.
     
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  2. Mean Gene

    Mean Gene Haters gonna hate

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    They won’t retire until another generational talent comes along :naughty:
     
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  3. kladorf2005

    kladorf2005 Registered User

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    Can we not do this for any team, looking 5+ years into the future?

    "Hey, let's assume all the 30 something's leave, all the 25 somethings drop to 3rd line status, and no new kids come up"
     
  4. K Fleur

    K Fleur If You Know You Know

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    Pens got that Betman hookup. We good.
     
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  5. Penguin Suited Up

    Penguin Suited Up Registered User

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    Malkin/Crosby/Letang aren’t going to be traded, period. Not even worth a thought in OP. Kessel probably won’t be traded either, unless trading him somehow makes he team better right now. Bottom line is that the Pens will have to get better through the draft, and once Sid/Geno retire, they’ll probably be in a good spot in the draft to do so.

    Also, even if you want to say the Pens haven’t drafted well(can’t say I agree) they’ve certainly been able to acquire new talent outside of the draft to help the team.
     
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  6. Pens x

    Pens x Registered User

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    The Penguins are in store for some dark years in the not so distant future, unfortunately. Our prospect pool is embarassing and our core is only getting older.

    I don’t see them ever trading Sid or Geno unless either requested a trade, though.
     
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  7. izzy

    izzy go

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    almeida is the new crosby
     
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  8. NA Scouting

    NA Scouting Registered User

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    You are right that a lot may change in 5 years. But I singled out the Penguins because most teams at least have a collection of kids that, if you project 5 years in the future, they could actually ice a decent line-up even without the 30+ years olds. The Penguins literally cannot.

    They also have been bad at the draft table and so it doesn't bode well for the future. And as I also mentionned, they are prone to trading away 1st round picks, which won't help for 2022.

    They will also lose a player to Seattle.
     
  9. GodEmperor

    GodEmperor Registered User

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    Pens tend to draft two generational talents every 20 years.

    Lemieux/Jagr

    Crosby/Malkin

    Who's coming up in 8-10 years?
     
  10. W5HD

    W5HD Registered User

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    The problem though is that they haven't drafted top-end talent. That's not a knock on them, it's just really hard to do that when you're consistently picking in the bottom 5 of the 1st round, or not at all.
     
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  11. izzy

    izzy go

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    holy jumping anyone ever really look at the pens first round picks since staal??

    wtf they doing

    well guess thats why they decided they might as well trade their last 4 first round picks. they arent gonna use em
     
  12. FunkySeeFunkyDo

    FunkySeeFunkyDo Registered User

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    duh, not gonna trade Sid or Geno. When the time comes and they start a rebuild all you have to do is bink a Mario/Jagr or Sid/Geno combo. Easy game!

    But seriously, when you have a core like the Pens, you shouldnt worry about the future--you maximze the present at the expense of the future.
     
  13. kladorf2005

    kladorf2005 Registered User

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    They don't win their latest two cups without the kids that came up from AHL those seasons (Murray, Guentzel, Rust, etc.). Not sure why you think they don't have the ability to keep developing through their farm system.

    And again, everyone is going to lose a player to Seattle.
     
  14. NA Scouting

    NA Scouting Registered User

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    There has been 13 drafts since Crosby. Your best players drafted are Matt Murray, Jordan Staal, Jake Guentzel and Jake Muzzin, with Kapanen/Sprong/Hallander as good young guys.

    If you can only muster this in the next 13 years after Crosby/Malkin departure, you are in for some long, long years my friend.
     
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  15. Blitzkrug

    Blitzkrug Bae over Bay

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    Maybe they suck, maybe they don't. Tis the circle of life in hockey.

    People thought the Hawks would continue to outrun the specter of the salary cup and lack of high end picks to keep replenishing their system, but even they were caught up to eventually.

    It happened to Detroit. It happened to Los Angeles. It happened to Chicago. It'll probably happen to Pittsburgh eventually but that's just the way she goes.
     
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  16. NA Scouting

    NA Scouting Registered User

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    A player or two comes up and helps generational talent like Crosby/Malkin win a cup. That's all fine. But what happens if you don't have Crosby/Malkin anymore. As I've posted, the Pens have barely developped 1 decent player every 2 years since Staal. That's not nearly enough. That is why I posted that I can't see the Pens as anything more than a basement team for YEARS after 2022.
     
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  17. rfournier103

    rfournier103 Registered User

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    When they retire, the Penguins will do what has worked quite well. Finish in last place for a couple of seasons, win the draft lottery, get a couple of all-planet talents, and win the Stanley Cup.

    It’s really not that hard to follow the model.*







    *past results do not guarantee future returns.
     
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  18. Catch22

    Catch22 ArrowHead

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    Right...it's like when Mario and Wayne retired they got a pocket full of First Overall vouchers.
     
  19. rfournier103

    rfournier103 Registered User

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    The Penguins didn’t?
     
  20. K Fleur

    K Fleur If You Know You Know

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    I mean this thread is basically:

    “Once the Pens lose two of the top 3 players of the last 20 years they’re gonna suck.”

    No **** Sherlock :laugh:
     
  21. Penguin Suited Up

    Penguin Suited Up Registered User

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    Look at where they’ve drafted and the amount of picks they’ve had. You can’t judge a team based on an absolute value. You need to look at a conversion rate on the opportunities they’ve had. Not sure where you can find that info.
     
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  22. Penguin Suited Up

    Penguin Suited Up Registered User

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    You’re missing a few players on your list, but quantity isn’t a good representation here. See my above post. I don’t think the Pens have been a great drafting team, but you can’t dismiss them when they’ve been trading picks or prospects away for a more immediate impact.
     
  23. Jacob

    Jacob Registered User

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    I mean they're going to suck when they lose those guys plus Letang and Kessel who are the same age. Just no way around it.

    Their best bet is to tank for 3-5 years and grab some generational talent again. Or trade Malkin & Sid for futures at the very end of their careers. Or both.
     
  24. W5HD

    W5HD Registered User

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    No arguments here. It's like Detroit. They would have been in the basement much sooner than this had they not gotten unbelievably lucky with Zetterberg and Datsyuk. That's the level of skill you need to be able to find later in the draft in order to keep sustained top-end success for any more than 10-15 years. Not impossible to do, just very unlikely.
     
  25. Catch22

    Catch22 ArrowHead

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    It's a slight exaggeration
    But Crosby and Fluery- were 1OV
    Staal- and Malkin went 2OV

    In like 4 years imagine having those picks for the last 4 Drafts and what that team would look like.

    Pretty significant combo imagine Mathews and Mcdavid with a couple of the 2OV picks in the other 2 seasons ?
     
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