Player Discussion: The Official Jonathan Drouin Thread: Part 5

[DFC]

You just can't hold that kind of talent down forever. He's a very unique player to watch, which is why it's so hard to come up with stylistic comparables. He does sort of the same things Kane does, but it looks a lot different.

 

[Steazy Doo]

Motion to change Jonathan Drouin's nickname to "Uncontested J"

I like it!

 

[The Gongshow]

You just can't hold that kind of talent down forever. He's a very unique player to watch, which is why it's so hard to come up with stylistic comparables. He does sort of the same things Kane does, but it looks a lot different.

I think Kane is a good player to compare Drouin too. Hopefully with the right players and being in the top 6 he can put up points like Kane!

 

[Sky04]

You just can't hold that kind of talent down forever. He's a very unique player to watch, which is why it's so hard to come up with stylistic comparables. He does sort of the same things Kane does, but it looks a lot different.

Yeah a unique style for sure, can't think of a proper comparison either if you're going by skillset then Kane is similar but stylistically they're very different.

 

[Sky04]

It's a good problem to have, but it'd be better not to have it because we didn't give $8.5M for eight years to a guy who isn't even in our top five players.

Stamkos can clearly be the #1 forward on any given year. Highest upside out of all of our forwards, not close at the moment.

 

[CupsOverCash]

I think Stamkos will be better with the contract behind him and also think he will play with Drouin and Palat.

 

[JAY7791]

this is my first post and this topic has been bothering me for a long time. What did stamkos do to you tjs? Did he mug you or run over your dog? I've seriously never seen so much irrational hate for the star on our team.

lol!

 

[Sky04]

This is my first post and this topic has been bothering me for a long time. What did Stamkos do to you tjs? Did he mug you or run over your dog? I've seriously never seen so much irrational hate for the star on our team.

 

[Pointerspoint]

This is my first post and this topic has been bothering me for a long time. What did Stamkos do to you tjs? Did he mug you or run over your dog? I've seriously never seen so much irrational hate for the star on our team.

Truth.

 

[These Are The Days]

This is my first post and this topic has been bothering me for a long time. What did Stamkos do to you tjs? Did he mug you or run over your dog? I've seriously never seen so much irrational hate for the star on our team.

Ohhh snap!!

 

[tjs*]

This is my first post and this topic has been bothering me for a long time. What did Stamkos do to you tjs? Did he mug you or run over your dog? I've seriously never seen so much irrational hate for the star on our team.

I don't hate him at all. I respect Stamkos as a person; I just don't think he's worth the money we're paying him, value other players on the team more highly (particularly in the postseason), and think that $8.5M over the next eight years could have been spent more wisely.

It's a bit of an unfair comparison given that their attitudes are completely different but the Stamkos we've seen since his injury reminds me a lot of the NBA's Carmelo Anthony: one of the best scorers in the league but that's about all he gives you, to get the most out of him you have to constantly run the offense through him and when he's not on you just find yourself back on defense every time he misses, and he doesn't really gel with his teammates and the offense actually runs better when he's not in the game because there's more movement and better chemistry between the players. He's the kind of guy who will put up big numbers every year as long as you keep feeding him opportunities but you'll never win a championship with him as the primary focus of your offense.

The difference of course is that Stamkos is a far superior leader and I think he truly wants to do whatever it takes to win a championship. But I just don't think Stamkos in his current form is the kind of guy you win with in the postseason - he needs to reinvent himself and make his game fit in better with the way the team as a whole plays. Our best forwards (the Triplets and Drouin) all thrive on movement and creativity and Stammer setting up in the left faceoff circle and waiting for someone to send him the puck just doesn't fit with that.

So basically I have nothing against him - I just think we'd have been better off using that $8.5M to retain and improve the ensemble cast rather than spending it all on one big star who doesn't really fit the way the team has evolved.

 

[Sky04]

Johnson and Palat took a huge step backwards this year in the regular season, at least with Stamkos he still put 64 points on a **** year, Johnson just could not get going all season, I mean Stamkos hasn't been the same since his leg injury but people don't talk about Johnson's injury problems, it's so apparent and greatly hampers his game every time he's injured.

 

[tjs*]

Johnson and Palat took a huge step backwards this year in the regular season, at least with Stamkos he still put 64 points on a **** year, Johnson just could not get going all season, I mean Stamkos hasn't been the same since his leg injury but people don't talk about Johnson's injury problems, it's so apparent and greatly hampers his game every time he's injured.

I've talked about that on numerous occasions and it's definitely a concern. Correct me if I'm wrong though but wasn't most of that the lingering wrist injury from the playoffs the season before? I am worried about his durability but let's see how he does next season before we say for certain that he's injury prone. In any event the difference between Johnson and Stamkos is a) he shows up in the playoffs, b) he has fantastic chemistry with several of his teammates, and c) nobody's talking about giving him $8.5M x 8.

In the end it really all comes down to the contract. There are different types of star players: some make everybody they play with better. Some are capable of taking over a game singlehandedly. A select few excel at both. And then there are the ones like Stamkos, who aren't phenomenal playmakers and facilitators AND are dependent on others in order to generate their offense. Players like that have their place on a team, but it's in a complementary role - I don't care what sport you're talking about, you'll never win a championship with a guy like that as the primary focus of your offense. Basically I just view the Stamkos we've seen recently as an elite complementary player (at least in the regular season - the playoffs are another issue entirely) who is being paid like the sort of player you build your team around, and I just don't see him as that sort of player.

 

[Volodya Krutov]

I didn't want Stamkos to come back at $10M, I'm still not a fan of giving that much money to a sniper and I'll be sad if we lose someone else instead but there's some undeniable positive about Stammer taking a paycut. It's not all black or white. Firstly he sets the tone money wise, nobody is going to surpass his cap hit and they'll all be asked to make a financial effort if they truly want to stay together. Who knows how much Hedman was gonna ask if Stamkos left ? $9M AAV would be an honest price for a dman of his caliber.

Secondly, Stamkos' providing not only valuable depth because he can play Wing and Center but also scoring depth. And that was our most urgent need. Even if it's "just" 0.7 ppg in the playoffs, it's still above average production and way better cost/point ratio than a Filppula/Callahan at almost $5M/$6M... Yeah I know Callahan does other things well but Stamkos was a good PKer last season and he's quite physical in the playoffs too. What could've been worse was to massively overpay for a top 6 forward via free agency, like we just saw a few days back. I mean it was a good idea at the beginning but the guys hitting free agency are just unreasonable. I'm honestly more comfortable with Stamkos under his terms than Ladd at $38.5M over 7 years.

Thirdly, to become a constant positive value all Stamkos needs to do is just to stop forcing plays. It's not a situation where we're asking someone to play above his level of competence, but the other way around. The thing to understand that Stamkos' not a prototypical center and pairing him with someone that loves to have constantly the puck on his stick will do wonders to Stamkos, I reckon. Palat-Stamkos-Drouin could be a filthy line.

Fourthly, it's too early to tell. Let's see how Yzerman executes his plan. If by some jedi mind trick he has a solution to unload Flip and Callahan to keep the core together + Stamkos, in the end re-signing Stamkos would've been a genius move, no less.

 

[tjs*]

I didn't want Stamkos to come back at $10M, I'm still not a fan of giving that much money to a sniper and I'll be sad if we lose someone else instead but there's some undeniable positive about Stammer taking a paycut. It's not all black or white. Firstly he sets the tone money wise, nobody is going to surpass his cap hit and they'll all be asked to make a financial effort if they truly want to stay together. Who knows how much Hedman was gonna ask if Stamkos left ? $9M AAV would be an honest price for a dman of his caliber.

Secondly, Stamkos' providing not only valuable depth because he can play Wing and Center but also scoring depth. And that was our most urgent need. Even if it's "just" 0.7 ppg in the playoffs, it's still above average production and way better cost/point ratio than a Filppula/Callahan at almost $5M/$6M... Yeah I know Callahan does other things well but Stamkos was a good PKer last season and he's quite physical in the playoffs too. What could've been worse was to massively overpay for a top 6 forward via free agency, like we just saw a few days back. I mean it was a good idea at the beginning but the guys hitting free agency are just unreasonable. I'm honestly more comfortable with Stamkos under his terms than Ladd at $38.5M over 7 years.

Thirdly, to become a constant positive value all Stamkos needs to do is just to stop forcing plays. It's not a situation where we're asking someone to play above his level of competence, but the other way around. The thing to understand that Stamkos' not a prototypical center and pairing him with someone that loves to have constantly the puck on his stick will do wonders to Stamkos, I reckon. Palat-Stamkos-Drouin could be a filthy line.

Fourthly, it's too early to tell. Let's see how Yzerman executes his plan. If by some jedi mind trick he has a solution to unload Flip and Callahan to keep the core together + Stamkos, in the end re-signing Stamkos would've been a genius move, no less.

Very good points. This could all work out in the end, but like both of us mentioned it's going to require Stamkos to modify his game for that to happen. He wouldn't be the first player to do so successfully.

 

[Werewolf]

A good reason to be hopeful is that for the better part of the last two seasons Stamkos has played the majority of his minutes with some combination of Filp / Callahan / Killorn and no playmaking wingers. The emergence of Drouin is a very good reason to understand what Yzerman is trying to put together. Stamkos / Drouin were made for each other. Now we have one of the two pieces locked in for the forseeable future. I guarantee this is the duo that Yzerman envisioned and the main reason Stamkos will get going again. At some point in the near future we'll hopefully get to see:

X / Stamkos / Drouin
X / Vladdy / Kucherov
Palat / Johnson / X

For those wanting depth scoring - look no further than the combinations listed above as your top 9 forwards. The "x" could be a combination of Killorn / Erne / Point or the heavy wingers we just drafted in Raddysh / Katchouk in a couple of years. I mean there is the core of 6 right there - we just need to fill in the pieces with some "young cheap talent". I know most of these aren't ready yet but we are setting ourselves up for the long run here. Filp / Callahan will have to go at some point but I believe the core of 6 to be these guys.

I fully trust Vladdy will get there I've been watching him since his early AHL days. Drouin and Kucherov are another level but look at Vladdys most consistent linemates. We've had a glut of center depth and Vladdy is not a winger. He has been playing Winger and 4th line minutes and produced whenver he gets a shot to play with better talent. Vladdy will be a force and the chemistry he has with Kuch should not be underrated.

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

i'm very happy stamkos is back at 8.5

8.5 for 40 goals ppg guy is sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet to me

i get some trepidation I agree in ways but honestly i think stamkos will be close to 70-80 points each year and 40 goals im good for that I am beyond good for that

Drouin kucherov are x factors can they put stamkos into the rarified air that kane hit this season? Yes i think he wins some more scoring titles and he chases a hart myself because of the others will be along for the ride I saw good signs of stamkos return before the blood clots if he was same all season before the push id be a lot more worried

He has it in him to be great again just like tyjo palat drouin and kucherov have. Injuries are injuries people got to go through them hopefully wont take a couple years to get to top of their games.

But after watching weiss to see tyjo's recovery which we witnessed and stamkos coming back from leg I am very excited and happy for this group and for our lineup

 

[Vincek40]

Question for you guys since I dont follow Tampa, and well, you do.

Im thinking about picking up Drouin in a keeper league of mine, but was wondering what kind of role he may have next year. With the skill and depth Tampa has, will he be in a reduced role? Or will he have the opportunity to play in the top 6?

 

[Todd1a]

Question for you guys since I dont follow Tampa, and well, you do.

Im thinking about picking up Drouin in a keeper league of mine, but was wondering what kind of role he may have next year. With the skill and depth Tampa has, will he be in a reduced role? Or will he have the opportunity to play in the top 6?

If he doesn't play in the top six all year I think I'm going to lead a riot to Jon coopers home!

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

Johnson and Palat took a huge step backwards this year in the regular season, at least with Stamkos he still put 64 points on a **** year, Johnson just could not get going all season, I mean Stamkos hasn't been the same since his leg injury but people don't talk about Johnson's injury problems, it's so apparent and greatly hampers his game every time he's injured.

call ********

huge step backwards? thats over reacting he still had 1.93 ppg per / 60 mins stamkos is only at 2.52 so johnson didnt go crazy bad.. I mean look at the stats put all into affect etc.. and his numbers are not as terrible as one might thing

also a year before he was 3rd in league in in plus minus

if you want to sum up tyjo's drop look no further than his drop in shooting percentage as he recovered from his injury

by playoffs he had it together so good sign but he was 6 points below his league average until that time last year.

his stats moving forward will be fine if stays healthy

 

[LightningStrikes]

Man I'm so pumped to see what this kid can do as a legit top-6er now! Can he translate his playoff performance to the regular season? Is he up to 80+ games of tough matchups alongside Stammer?

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

Man I'm so pumped to see what this kid can do as a legit top-6er now! Can he translate his playoff performance to the regular season? Is he up to 80+ games of tough matchups alongside Stammer?

After what we saw in the playoffs, I'm much more confident that he can become the player we thought he could be. Before then, I was very much doubting it.

 

[tjs*]

Question for you guys since I dont follow Tampa, and well, you do.

Im thinking about picking up Drouin in a keeper league of mine, but was wondering what kind of role he may have next year. With the skill and depth Tampa has, will he be in a reduced role? Or will he have the opportunity to play in the top 6?

He's expected by most to spend the year on a line with Stamkos and either Palat or Killorn. That can always change of course depending on chemistry and performance, but the most likely alternative has him swapping with Kucherov to play on a line with Johnson and one of Palat/Killorn/Point (the latter if Point stays hot and Cooper decides to put Killorn on the third line.) In short unless he regresses Drouin should be in the top six playing with talented linemates all season.

 

[dbieon12]

Okay. Who took Coburn in the first penalty of the year pool....

... oh yeah everyone did.

 

[Steazy Doo]

Uncontested J with a beaut snipe