LeBrun: "The Leafs are phoning around looking at defensemen on PTOs"

[Leaf Fans]

Sooo… the only guy is the guy you’re defending?

Hint: players aren’t good at 39.

Some are, but admittedly not very many. I think Giordano is the only one right now, but there might be another one. It is rare.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

There's probably been a bunch of Norris winners who were still very good 2nd pair dmen at age 39 tbh.

No there really isn't. Age 39 players are few and far between.

There's probably been a bunch of Norris winners who were still very good 2nd pair dmen at age 39 tbh.



Seems healthier than Landy.

Landy played a cup run. Muzzin hasn't played past round 1 and somehow already has back issues.

The same Barrie the Colorado ran out of town.

The Barrie that got traded for Kadri that won a cup. Yes.

 

[Space umpire]

The defense is good on paper because your top 2 lines drive so much offense.
When teams do get solid time in the Leaf zone that D is not really that good.
It’s especially noticeable with Muzzin’s decline.
Brodie is “acceptable” Rielly is a good puck handler but hardly a solid defender.
You REALLY need your offense to stay deadly, Giordano to stay healthy and Lilly and Sandin to play well.

 

[GOilers88]

There's a much simpler and more obvious reason why hfboards manages to believe that players are better as soon as they wear a different jersey.

You're insinuating I only think Ceci is good because he's an Oiler and not because he played a solid top 4 role last year.

I also never thought him or Barrie, or Hyman, or Campbell were bad players on the Leafs either. In fact most of the people I see claiming Campbell isn't that good are folks from your own contingent because he had a rough go last season outside of a couple months. Prior to that there was Vezina chatter regarding him from some folks in that same contingent.

Barrie has always been a very good offensive defenseman. For years in Colorado. For his time in Edmonton. Him having a rough year in Toronto, which he had turned around after they fired Babcock, doesn't mean he was only a bad player cause he was a Leaf. He had an off year under a shitty coach and found his stride again elsewhere doing exactly what he's done his whole career.

You're so dead set on claiming everyone here only hates players because they're Leafs that you're incapable of any real logic here.

 

[SI90]

No, but the might play defense in some situations like when they are a goal down late in the game.

He’s a great defensive forward but the assignments and even techniques are completely different for a forward and Defensman.

If he’s playing the point like on a PP as an extra attacker or just replacing a defenseman as the 4th forward like you said being down a goal then that makes more sense.

 

[zeke]

No there really isn't. Age 39 players are few and far between.

It's not like we expect Gio to be top-pair quality at 39 like Chara and Lidstrom were.

Landy played a cup run. Muzzin hasn't played past round 1 and somehow already has back issues.

Lots of players taking time off in early pre season to make sure twinges don't develop into something more serious. Pretty typical for preseason.

 

[Leaf Fans]

Back injury just before start of training camp for 33+ year old. That's gonna end well

Who has a back injury are they out for long? Muzzin had a sore back at the beginning of camp, people were worried he might be injured - but he is ok now. I hope your guy isn't serious.

 

[zeke]

You're insinuating I only think Ceci is good because he's an Oiler and not because he played a solid top 4 role last year.

I also never thought him or Barrie, or Hyman, or Campbell were bad players on the Leafs either. In fact most of the people I see claiming Campbell isn't that good are folks from your own contingent because he had a rough go last season outside of a couple months. Prior to that there was Vezina chatter regarding him from some folks in that same contingent.

Barrie has always been a very good offensive defenseman. For years in Colorado. For his time in Edmonton. Him having a rough year in Toronto, which he had turned around after they fired Babcock, doesn't mean he was only a bad player cause he was a Leaf. He had an off year under a shitty coach and found his stride again elsewhere doing exactly what he's done his whole career.

You're so dead set on claiming everyone here only hates players because they're Leafs that you're incapable of any real logic here.

I know what Ceci is. You want to believe he was just worse on the Leafs, because then getting cleanly beat out by Holl for a spot wouldn't look as bad.

I get it.

Oilers fans have done this for years now. They mocked leafs fans for daring to think any leafs dman compared to Larsson, especially Ceci.

 

[Petey But Really Jim]

I thought that forward core was 4 overrated overpaid choking stars and zero depth?

They are. It’s their goaltending that has been carrying the team.

 

[Leaf Fans]

No there really isn't. Age 39 players are few and far between.

Landy played a cup run. Muzzin hasn't played past round 1 and somehow already has back issues.

The Barrie that got traded for Kadri that won a cup. Yes.

Yup Kadri won a cup with the Avalanche in June. So did ZAR.

 

[GOilers88]

I know what Ceci is. You want to believe he was just worse on the Leafs, because then getting cleanly beat out by Holl for a spot wouldn't look as bad.

I get it.

Oilers fans have done this for years now. They mocked leafs fans for daring to think any leafs dman compared to Larsson, especially Ceci.

He did have a worse season his year with the Leafs than he did with Pittsburgh or Edmonton. That's not just because he wore a Leaf jersey. It just statistically is what it is. I don't care that Holl beat him out a couple of years ago, because last year he managed to thrive in a top 4 role, even if he should have ideally been on the third pairing. Again, it just is what it is. It has nothing to do with what sweater he's wearing. It's far more likely that Mike Babcock was the issue, as not only the whole team, but Barrie and Ceci improved after he got fired. Again, that's got nothing to do with the sweater they wear. Also again, I thought Larsson sucked for most of his time in Edmonton so I don't know why you keep bringing him up when you respond to me.

The complex is ridiculous in your posts.

 

[Legion34]

Playing “top pair on a Cup winner” is incredibly irrelevant when that was like a decade ago.
Should have signed Chara then since he was a top pair on a Cup winner as well.

 

[Leaf Fans]

They are. It’s their goaltending that has been carrying the team.

They have only played 40mins each in the preseason.

 

[Space umpire]

Muzzin Rielly
Giordano Brodie
Sandin Liljegren
Holl

1-7 they're quite good. They don't have a superstar (Makar, Hedman type) - but when Justin Holl is your 7th D, you're doing quite good I think.

Muzzin’s decline has been significant yet you count on him to cover for Rielly who isn’t really a good defender.
Brodie - Giordano is a decent pairing but Brodie has never been a shut caliber guy and Giordano is 127 years old and played hard minutes his whole career. Can you count on Giordano to play top 4 minutes against top 6 opponents for close to 80 games?
Both your 3rd pair guys may turn out ok but when Muzzin and Gio are out is either ready for regular top 4 ice time?
(I’m not saying they’re not, but it will be an interesting learning curve)
They may be forced into key roles a bit too soon.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

Lol at thinking a 33 year old with muzzin's recent injury history, declining play and coming into training camp with a bad back is not a red flag. And to expect 20+ mins per night over the long season lol.

 

[zeke]

They are. It’s their goaltending that has been carrying the team.

Goaltending ranks:

.900sv% (#22)
-0.38gsax (#27)

Lol at thinking a 33 year old with muzzin's recent injury history, declining play and coming into training camp with a bad back is not a red flag. And to expect 20+ mins per night over the long season lol.

Yeah 1 injured season where he finished healthy and playing great is clearly game over for him.

 

[leafsfan5]

Lol the only thing missing is Norris quality guy?!?!

I think that’s the whole point. A high top end is worth more than good #4-5-6…

Name me one good offense that doesn’t have a Hart trophy quality guy?!?

The Blues and Hurricanes

 

[GirardSpinorama]

Goaltending ranks:

.900sv% (#22)
-0.38gsax (#27)



Yeah 1 injured season where he finished healthy and playing great is clearly game over for him.

Playing like a 5.7MM dman is certainly over for him. And to have that contract for another year; yuck.

 

[leafsfan5]

I never said they were the worst in the league. But someone suggested they're among the very best in the league which is simply absurd.


I'd say they're maybe slightly above average league wide(Not quite Top 10 so probably in the ~12-15 range), among playoff teams they're pretty bad however which is a contributing factor in why they cant get out of the first round despite having some fantastic offensive talent and reasonably ok forward depth.

The forwards are the reason we can't get out of the first round, not the defense lol

The D has been fine, I'd like it to be more physical but Dubas has done a really good job rebuilding it. The reason we lose is our depth isn't good enough

From games 5-7 of the Tampa series the only players to score were the big 4 + Rielly. Literally one goal from a depth piece in either game 6 or 7 and we win. That's the difference. Not the defense

Combine that with the offensive talent disappearing in other years (e.g. against MTL in 2021) and you have the drought

 

[notbias]

Playing like a 5.7MM dman is certainly over for him. And to have that contract for another year; yuck.

Why are you even in this thread? Shouldn't you be worried about how to spin your goaltending duo as a positive? That is atrocious, 32nd in the league probably, can't think of a worse duo.

 

[Petey But Really Jim]

Why are you even in this thread? Shouldn't you be worried about how to spin your goaltending duo as a positive? That is atrocious, 32nd in the league probably, can't think of a worse duo.

Who cares? They just won it all.

 

[notbias]

Who cares? They just won it all.

I'd assume their fans care. They have the worst goaltending in the league, I like to live in the present and get excited about the season, definitely tough to be optimistic.

 

[SmokeyDuck]

Sounds like they need Stanley Cup champion Jack Johnson.



Also did I really just read a Leafs fan suggest Toronto has one of the best Defense's in the NHL? That group of fans

They certainly have a defense.

 

[Space umpire]

I'd assume their fans care. They have the worst goaltending in the league, I like to live in the present and get excited about the season, definitely tough to be optimistic.

You think their goaltending is worse than yours? That’s funny stuff right there.

 

[Oilslick941611]

I know what Ceci is. You want to believe he was just worse on the Leafs, because then getting cleanly beat out by Holl for a spot wouldn't look as bad.

I get it.

Oilers fans have done this for years now. They mocked leafs fans for daring to think any leafs dman compared to Larsson, especially Ceci.