The Kent Johnson thread

[CBJWerenski8]

Or maybe he see's their high end potential and knows they are still young players who still have an opportunity to reach said potential. It's not like they are 30 years old and are heading to the khl to finish out their careers.

However this will be a big year for both as they are both expected to take on more responsibility.

Sure, but that wasn't what Jarmo said.

How many times, in reference to Texier and Bemstrom, did he say they were "ready to not only make the team, but make a big impact on the team" or something around those lines? And yeah, I get that he's just trying to build their confidence and hype up the kids (what's he going to say, they're going to make the team and toll on the 4th line for a few years?) but you still have to take his comments seriously. To this point, Jarmo has set those two up with pretty decent expectations only for them not to meet them.

I'm far from calling them busts or finished products. They're not, they're like 23 years old or something, but Jarmo has certainly set the bar higher than what they've produced to this point. Hopefully this is the year they clear it.

In regards to this now Johnson vs Sillinger (because of course it has to be VS) debate. I do think Johnson has way higher upside and the Sillinger is NHL ready stuff is kind of ridiculous to me. I think Johnson possesses more "game breaking" offensive upside while Sillinger possesses more NHL qualities that will likely develop into an NHLer. I believe both need time, they both have weaknesses in their skating among other things, but Johnson is the better prospect while Sillinger is the "safer" one. They're both immensely valuable and should be big time players for us in the nearish future.

 

[CBJx614]

Sure, but that wasn't what Jarmo said.

How many times, in reference to Texier and Bemstrom, did he say they were "ready to not only make the team, but make a big impact on the team" or something around those lines? And yeah, I get that he's just trying to build their confidence and hype up the kids (what's he going to say, they're going to make the team and toll on the 4th line for a few years?) but you still have to take his comments seriously. To this point, Jarmo has set those two up with pretty decent expectations only for them not to meet them.

I'm far from calling them busts or finished products. They're not, they're like 23 years old or something, but Jarmo has certainly set the bar higher than what they've produced to this point. Hopefully this is the year they clear it.

In regards to this now Johnson vs Sillinger (because of course it has to be VS) debate. I do think Johnson has way higher upside and the Sillinger is NHL ready stuff is kind of ridiculous to me. I think Johnson possesses more "game breaking" offensive upside while Sillinger possesses more NHL qualities that will likely develop into an NHLer. I believe both need time, they both have weaknesses in their skating among other things, but Johnson is the better prospect while Sillinger is the "safer" one. They're both immensely valuable and should be big time players for us in the nearish future.

You also have to remember who the coach was when he was saying that. Torts wasn't known for giving young kids a lot of leash, all of sudden you can't play your game because you know if you f*** up once you might not be dressing for a few games.

 

[EDM]

Texier was given an entire year last year playing almost every game. What were his stats?

 

[Halberdier]

Texier was given an entire year last year playing almost every game. What were his stats?

Zero offensively gifted, skill based skaters succeeded for CBJ in last season apart from Roslovic who had moderate success. There simply was no system to back them up. But Texier was one of the very few that could occasionally make a great pass for a great scoring opportunity.

Disappointing? Yes, but so were most of them anyway.

 

[thebus88]

Each year (in every pro sports league in the world) you have individual players or even entire teams who either overachieve or underachieve.

The concept of “development” or “potential” in sports is nowhere near as linear as some would like to believe or pass off to others.

 

[CBJx614]

Texier was given an entire year last year playing almost every game. What were his stats?

The whole team sucked.. Morale was at an all time low and we were still playing in the middle of a pandemic with a coach who didn't want to be there.

People need to stop using last year as a marker for sports across the board.

 

[MoeBartoli]

Interesting today was the UM Coach on NHL Sirius XM saying the Jackets had asked if (suggested) Johnson play center this year, but the Coach told them Johnson would be playing wing this year.

 

[majormajor]

Interesting today was the UM Coach on NHL Sirius XM saying the Jackets had asked if (suggested) Johnson play center this year, but the Coach told them Johnson would be playing wing this year.

Easy to understand the perspective from both sides there. The coach has Bordeleau and Beniers, two of the top centers in college hockey. What else is he going to do? Put Johnson at 3C maybe?

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Interesting today was the UM Coach on NHL Sirius XM saying the Jackets had asked if (suggested) Johnson play center this year, but the Coach told them Johnson would be playing wing this year.

As MM said, there’s simply just better centers on the roster right now.

If we’re going to try to make it work at C, another year after this at Michigan could help him. Hed almost certainly be the 1C, and might even develop quick enough to skip the AHL all together.

If we’re just trying to fast track him to the NHL, then a year at wing this year and he’s probably good to go next year (at least to turn pro.) we’ll see. Injuries happen and maybe hed be asked to do some center if that happens. But if the end goal is for him to be a C, playing at Michigan isn’t the best for that.

 

[Jovavic]

Maybe they asked that before it was announced that Beniers was coming back?

 

[EspenK]

I get that Beniers is thought to be better than Johnson. I get that Michigan's coach wants to do what he thinks is best for his team. I worry that he really thinks KJ isn't best suited to play C. Many kids who play C in college or juniors start in the NHL at W and move to C after a year or two. Jackets are facing a situation where there supposed top 6 C will not have played the position in competition for the last 2 years.

Sounds like another Jackets conundrum.

 

[majormajor]

Maybe they asked that before it was announced that Beniers was coming back?

There was never much doubt that Beniers was staying.

 

[majormajor]

I get that Beniers is thought to be better than Johnson. I get that Michigan's coach wants to do what he thinks is best for his team. I worry that he really thinks KJ isn't best suited to play C.

I don't know if we can infer that. You might think you could gradually train a guy to be great at center ice, and still not be willing to put him there if your other centers are already great in that role. What's the point for Michigan?

As for whether it is much of a conundrum for the Jackets, it might not be. This won't be reassuring for everyone, but KJ might need to stay another year at Michigan beyond this one, he's not close to physical maturity. That'll give him a much better chance of getting the center job.

I personally think if he pans out as an elite playmaker, it isn't going to matter whether he lines up at center or wing. He would be the transition maestro that sets everything up. So I'm more focused on following that part of KJ's development.

 

[pled]

As for whether it is much of a conundrum for the Jackets, it might not be. This won't be reassuring for everyone, but KJ might need to stay another year at Michigan beyond this one, he's not close to physical maturity. That'll give him a much better chance of getting the center job.

I really don't think anyone should expect him to be on the team tomorrow. he will definitely take time.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

As for whether it is much of a conundrum for the Jackets, it might not be. This won't be reassuring for everyone, but KJ might need to stay another year at Michigan beyond this one, he's not close to physical maturity. That'll give him a much better chance of getting the center job.

And if so, we (fans) should be fine with that, top 5 pick or no, stinky team or no.

I personally think if he pans out as an elite playmaker, it isn't going to matter whether he lines up at center or wing. He would be the transition maestro that sets everything up. So I'm more focused on following that part of KJ's development.

Exactly.

 

[Byrral]

This player needs to put on some muscle before he's going to be ready to play at the NHL level. As much as I'd like to see him at center I'm not worried about it. He's playing on a good team, in a good development system/coaching and he's still going to play top minutes. He will continue to develop no matter where he plays....as long as he plays a lot which he should. Also he may end up being a wing anyway. Give him time. There's some young players going to be coming to the team over the next few of years. He will be another one. Let him stay there and develop. There's no rush.

 

[Jan]

You also have to remember who the coach was when he was saying that. Torts wasn't known for giving young kids a lot of leash, all of sudden you can't play your game because you know if you f*** up once you might not be dressing for a few games.

This is simply not a valid argument.
Yes Tort was expecting and in fact demanding that everybody was defensive responsibly, but he did give both PLD and Zack a lot of leave way. To make some errors and to learn.
So he has done for both Texier and others as well. Texier has had some set back, with a back injury, that could easily had ended his hockey carrier and that has nothing to do with Tort.

Now it is not important any longer what Tort did or would do.

It is however important to understand, that the new coaching staff will demand that everybody will contribute in the defensive part of the game.
There is no space on any or almost any teams for players that are really bad defensively and all must do their part, to make the defensive part work.
If not, then it would not matter if Bjorkstrand, Laine or some one else scored 100 goals in this coming season, since most of our players would still be minus player, which mean that the team will lose more than they would win.

Sonny Milano example was not a flop because of Tort, but because he was bad defensibly and bad without the puck.
Believe me, the CBJ staff has worked hard with him, to try to improve his defensive play. He was given every chance to succeed and that before players like Bjorkstrand.

Likewise the new prospect has part of their game that they will have to develop, before they will be able to do well in the NHL.
That who ever is the head coach on the NHL team.
I agree that Sillinger seams wo be the safer of the two, but also the one with a lower celling.
Still, there is a great different in playing junior hockey and NHL.
That was why Sonny Milano was a star in junior and AHL, but failed in the NHL.
Not the head coach.

I just hope, with all the high junior talent this team has drafted over the years, that they for once has hit jackpot, and has selected some that will pan out.
Still it is far to early to make any judgement on.

 

[CBJx614]

This is simply not a valid argument.
Yes Tort was expecting and in fact demanding that everybody was defensive responsibly, but he did give both PLD and Zack a lot of leave way. To make some errors and to learn.
So he has done for both Texier and others as well. Texier has had some set back, with a back injury, that could easily had ended his hockey carrier and that has nothing to do with Tort.

Now it is not important any longer what Tort did or would do.

It is however important to understand, that the new coaching staff will demand that everybody will contribute in the defensive part of the game.
There is no space on any or almost any teams for players that are really bad defensively and all must do their part, to make the defensive part work.
If not, then it would not matter if Bjorkstrand, Laine or some one else scored 100 goals in this coming season, since most of our players would still be minus player, which mean that the team will lose more than they would win.

Sonny Milano example was not a flop because of Tort, but because he was bad defensibly and bad without the puck.
Believe me, the CBJ staff has worked hard with him, to try to improve his defensive play. He was given every chance to succeed and that before players like Bjorkstrand.

Likewise the new prospect has part of their game that they will have to develop, before they will be able to do well in the NHL.
That who ever is the head coach on the NHL team.
I agree that Sillinger seams wo be the safer of the two, but also the one with a lower celling.
Still, there is a great different in playing junior hockey and NHL.
That was why Sonny Milano was a star in junior and AHL, but failed in the NHL.
Not the head coach.

I just hope, with all the high junior talent this team has drafted over the years, that they for once has hit jackpot, and has selected some that will pan out.
Still it is far to early to make any judgement on.

It most definitely is a valid argument.. It may not apply to the Werenskis and PLDs, but to kids who barely make the roster and don't have a guaranteed spot, it most definitely does. If Bemstrom has a bad game, theres a good chance they are gonna have whoever is next up take his spot in the next game. Players, especially young players entering the league need to be able to make mistakes without fear of losing their spot.

Yes you want to breed competition in the lineup, but you don't want kids playing afraid and without confidence. The only way they get over that is playing and playing through their mistakes. Kids can't get better on the bench or in the stands.

 

[Jan]

It most definitely is a valid argument.. It may not apply to the Werenskis and PLDs, but to kids who barely make the roster and don't have a guaranteed spot, it most definitely does. If Bemstrom has a bad game, theres a good chance they are gonna have whoever is next up take his spot in the next game. Players, especially young players entering the league need to be able to make mistakes without fear of losing their spot.

Yes you want to breed competition in the lineup, but you don't want kids playing afraid and without confidence. The only way they get over that is playing and playing through their mistakes. Kids can't get better on the bench or in the stands.

No Bennstrom, Milano, Kirby, Texier, Foudy and many more than a few other was given more than a fair chance to succeed. Also while clearly not NHL ready. That their skills did not transfer well to NHL, not here and not other places where they was send, is another story.
I know that even with given 100 of second chance, that many here feel that Milano was not given a chance.

No matter what team you are going to play on, you will be expected to be able to play with defensive responsibility.
It is not just under Torts.

 

[CBJx614]

No Bennstrom, Milano, Kirby, Texier, Foudy and many more than a few other was given more than a fair chance to succeed. Also while clearly not NHL ready. That their skills did not transfer well to NHL, not here and not other places where they was send, is another story.
I know that even with given 100 of second chance, that many here feel that Milano was not given a chance.

No matter what team you are going to play on, you will be expected to be able to play with defensive responsibility.
It is not just under Torts.

I'm not disagreeing that players need to be defensively responsible. My argument is that a young player should be allowed to make defensive mistakes as that is the only way he's going to grow. And under Torts, for the most part if a player made one or two mistakes he was taken out of the game and in the case of the younger players, it could be a couple of games before they got another chance to even play.

Part of that was the roster makeup, but this season I don't expect there to be growing pains. But the kids need to be able to play through them.

 

[Jan]

I'm not disagreeing that players need to be defensively responsible. My argument is that a young player should be allowed to make defensive mistakes as that is the only way he's going to grow. And under Torts, for the most part if a player made one or two mistakes he was taken out of the game and in the case of the younger players, it could be a couple of games before they got another chance to even play.

Part of that was the roster makeup, but this season I don't expect there to be growing pains. But the kids need to be able to play through them.

Well they was allowed to make some defensive mistake under Tort!
He just had his limits, like any other coach would have.
I am sure those limits would depend on both the coach and which other players available.

Where I will agree that Torts was not fair, was that I think that some of the veterans was given to much leverage, when they failed their obligations.
How was Bjorkstrand put down on fourth line, far basically playing more than OK and others (Like Foligno and other veterans) was gaining more playing time for failing?
But then He gave Laine almost unlimited chances, to fail.
So how you can say they was not allowed to make mistakes, I can not under stand.
Laine did not end up being send down the line up, before it was far to late to improve the team.

So maybe he was to given to many chance to fail, but I think there was not enough consequence for all the mistakes he was making.
Sitting out one of two games for bad behavior, is not to much punishment, for that. He was never really punished for all the failings he was making on the ice.

About the punishment for bad comments, you can discuss on a cultural point of view. English is not exact Laine's mother languages, so his feeling of bad words would surely be different to natives.
But to make a standard of how you get along with the entire team, is needed.

But Torts was giving the young player some leverage, and the most shining example is in fact Partik Laine and Sonny Milano.
They has kept failing their responsibilities and it took some time before they was degraded, even those error cost a lot of games.
That they keep doing it and did not learn, does not mean that it is all on the coaching staff.
Much on those players and sometime is partly being rushed up in the NHL, without really being ready.

So now there are a question of attitude as well. So far Laine's attitude is really questionable. Both here and in Winnipeg.

Not that this is a subject of this Kent Johnson.
At least I do not hope so. (Or think so).

 

[Cowumbus]

Johnson training video

 

[CBJWerenski8]

KJ watch officially on

 

[Cowumbus]

Honestly I was surprised at how little the Michigan top line played. Maybe it was more than I think, but it seemed like the coaching staff felt that their style of play did not match up well versus the physicality of Denver.

Kind of ridiculous that UM couldn’t get a PP the entire game; there was a clear slew-foot / trip on KJ that went uncalled.

KJ was okay. He made some nice passes but the one play that stood out to me was when he did the “Crosby self-pass”. KJ picked up the puck behind the goal with a defender draped on his back, passed the puck off of the back of the net, spun away from the defender picking up his own pass, then sauced a pass to Blankenburg (I think) cutting in from the blue line. Didn’t result in a goal but he has subtle skill if you watch him.

 

[LJ7]

I'm excited to see how he does in this late season stretch. He exceeded my expectations in Beijing. This handful of games should give him a good idea of what he has to work on the most this summer