Salary Cap: The Impending Cap Ceiling Issue

[alphafox]

I really don't think there's much to worry about. We've got talented kids in every position in Cleveland. The veterans who aren't performing and are able to be moved won't be here.

Agreed. The situation is bad but not nearly as dire as it appears. Hartnell has real value and I expect will be traded this deadline to a contender which clears up. I expect to see Tyutin moved at the deadline for next to nothing or even if we have to add value to take someone, but that is addition by subtraction. We also have Bourque, Prout, Cotton, Bondrachuk, and Falk all coming off this year to be replaced by rookies. The real question is if we can bite the bullet and give up something like a 1st in 2017 with Clarkson to a cap floor team or if we are permanently stuck with that contract (not that it is any different then the Horton situation really). Finally,
trading Johansen for someone like Seth Jones or even OEL will save us quite a bit in terms of current and future contracts, plus gets rid of an enigma of a player. He is legitimately great when he wants to be, but he has failed to show that he wants to be. He reminds me of Nash, without the excuse that he is forced to carry the team.

Overall, regardless of your thoughts on why the team Jarmo and JD built this season is a mess, their drafting and some of their trades (Wiz for Karlsson+, Saad and Paliotta) have afforded the team the ability to make trades and rework the salary cap structure without penalty to the present (replacing veterans with rookies isn't gonna hurt much if at all in the short term and is an upgrade in the long term, particularly on the blueline.)

 

[Mayor Bee]

Agreed. The situation is bad but not nearly as dire as it appears. Hartnell has real value and I expect will be traded this deadline to a contender which clears up. I expect to see Tyutin moved at the deadline for next to nothing or even if we have to add value to take someone, but that is addition by subtraction. We also have Bourque, Prout, Cotton, Bondrachuk, and Falk all coming off this year to be replaced by rookies. The real question is if we can bite the bullet and give up something like a 1st in 2017 with Clarkson to a cap floor team or if we are permanently stuck with that contract (not that it is any different then the Horton situation really). Finally,
trading Johansen for someone like Seth Jones or even OEL will save us quite a bit in terms of current and future contracts, plus gets rid of an enigma of a player. He is legitimately great when he wants to be, but he has failed to show that he wants to be. He reminds me of Nash, without the excuse that he is forced to carry the team.

Overall, regardless of your thoughts on why the team Jarmo and JD built this season is a mess, their drafting and some of their trades (Wiz for Karlsson+, Saad and Paliotta) have afforded the team the ability to make trades and rework the salary cap structure without penalty to the present (replacing veterans with rookies isn't gonna hurt much if at all in the short term and is an upgrade in the long term, particularly on the blueline.)

That starts getting into "dire" territory pretty quickly. Trading a still-productive Hartnell because of cap room, trading a veteran in Tyutin and leaving nothing but a lot of young kids on the back end because of cap room, and giving up significant assets with Clarkson because of cap room.

And I've got news for you: a single 1st-round pick isn't going to entice anyone to take Clarkson. A cap floor team has plenty of options, and getting saddled with a permanent roster spot being occupied isn't going to be very enticing unless there are major assets along with it to make the deal worthwhile. Think multiple 1sts, think prospects that you don't want to lose, think some combination of the two. Columbus has absolutely zero leverage.

 

[Johansen2Foligno]

If it only a took a 2017 1st, I imagine we would have cut ties with Clarkson already.

 

[major major]

A few notes:

1) Jack Johnson has a great contract. Lots of GM's will give you very good value in a deal for him, even if they see him only as a second pair D at best.

2) Foligno and Bob both have bad value now only because of the start of the season. If you assume bad years for them then of course they are bad value deals, but it all depends how they play from here on out.

3) Clarkson isn't going to be traded, ever, unless he ends up on LTIR for the rest of his career or something unforeseen like that.

4) Connauton is RFA, not UFA. And thank god, he's been excellent under Torts. But even if he has a great year he doesn't have the consistent track record to ask for much of a raise. Bodnarchuk, Falk, etc.. can be resigned for cheap, in the worst case they'll ask for a one-way deal.

5) It's too early to pencil in Werenski for next season. Jacob Trouba came into the league for his draft +2 season and did very well, but even for him a lot of folks are saying he would have been better served developing at Michigan, or in the minors. I hope we give a shot to Palliota but who knows what we'll get from him.

 

[DarkandStormy]

Paliotta goes RFA next season. Looks like a decision with him and Connauton/Prout perhaps on the blue line. Try to keep whoever it is around $1 million cap hit.

Tyutin is probably the player you want to move most on the blue line, but with a modified NTC and $4.5 million cap hit it will be difficult.

Will be interesting to see where the Canadian dollar ends up.

 

[futurcorerock]

re: acquiring a foundational top pairing D

We do realize that they've been trying for, oh, the entire time Columbus has had a franchise? Stating it as an objective really does feel like stating "Win the Stanley Cup" as a realistic objective every year.

The closest we could ever get was Adam "Quitter" Foot and Jack Johnson.

 

[DarkandStormy]

re: acquiring a foundational top pairing D

We do realize that they've been trying for, oh, the entire time Columbus has had a franchise? Stating it as an objective really does feel like stating "Win the Stanley Cup" as a realistic objective every year.

The closest we could ever get was Adam "Quitter" Foot and Jack Johnson.

Methot & Tyutin? Nevermind.

 

[Viqsi]

Methot & Tyutin? Nevermind.

JAN. HEJDA. Still miss him.

We've had them, just not always for very long.

 

[futurcorerock]

Methot & Tyutin? Nevermind.

Not sure what you're getting at here -- Peak Tyutin was never the caliber of player that Columbus needs right now, and Methot certainly wasn't the player he currently is in Ottawa while here.

If we're going to talk about guys who aren't here anymore who are better for it, let's start with Beauchemin and Stralman.

 

[TaketheCannoli]

JAN. HEJDA. Still miss him.

We've had them, just not always for very long.

Ah the Black Hole from the Czech Republic. He was a legitimate #1 for a few years.

 

[CBJx614]

Hell, I'd take Holden back right now.

 

[major major]

Hell, I'd take Holden back right now.

Yeesh.

 

[Mayor Bee]

Hell, I'd take Holden back right now.

I didn't think it was possible to get that deep in the bottle.

 

[Theo Von]

I didn't think it was possible to get that deep in the bottle.

Believe it or not he is on the Avs second pairing with Barrie.. He's a +2 in 28 games which is tied for best +/- (defensemen) on the team.

 

[EspenK]

Salary cap not how to fix the D. Just sayin'

 

[cslebn]

I've been kicking around the cap situation for awhile now and to me I see problems arising as soon as the end of this year with the need to re-sign Jenner, Karlsson & Murray as well as add 2 D men who may or may not be Connauton & Prout. I have put a place holder/guesstimate salary in for the 3 RFA's I'm about 100% sure we'll re-sign. By my calculations and estimations we will have between 3.5 & 5 million to sign the 2 D if my estimates for the 3 F's are in the ballpark. And if we can avoid a cap problem this year think about re-signing Joey next year for 8 mill plus.


What do you guys think?
What are some possible solutions?

Anyone know how to get this link to actual show up here?

Try your math with a summer buy-out of Tyutin. Yes it adds a D, but with the lower cost of players like Connauton, see what you think.

 

[CBJx614]

Yeesh.

I didn't think it was possible to get that deep in the bottle.

That's how much I dislike Prout

Salary cap not how to fix the D. Just sayin'

Well, by replacing someone on D with Holden might save some space

 

[EspenK]

Try your math with a summer buy-out of Tyutin. Yes it adds a D, but with the lower cost of players like Connauton, see what you think.

Quick and dirty it would free up about $3 mill a year in cap space and would cost 1.5 in cash for 4 yrs. I think this is a last gasp move since the Jackets don't seem to like buyouts and I'm not sure Tyutin on the third pair isn't better than what else we might have.

 

[CBJx614]

Quick and dirty it would free up about $3 mill a year in cap space and would cost 1.5 in cash for 4 yrs. I think this is a last gasp move since the Jackets don't seem to like buyouts and I'm not sure Tyutin on the third pair isn't better than what else we might have.

Or what's available

 

[Light the Lamp]

Putting Clarkson on LTIR is easy to say, but that is a lot of money to burn by ownership (Over $20M remaining).

If and when that decision is made, will speak volumes on the financial affairs of the organization.

 

[CBJx614]

Putting Clarkson on LTIR is easy to say, but that is a lot of money to burn by ownership (Over $20M remaining).

If and when that decision is made, will speak volumes on the financial affairs of the organization.

I know my knowledge on the salary cap, contracts and all that jazz isn't exactly top notch, but how would it be any different than Horton, except that it's insured? Which would be better than Hortons contract (given that he's on LTIR for an extended amount of time)

 

[DarkandStormy]

I know my knowledge on the salary cap, contracts and all that jazz isn't exactly top notch, but how would it be any different than Horton, except that it's insured? Which would be better than Hortons contract (given that he's on LTIR for an extended amount of time)

In theory, it would work the same assuming Clarkson is out for the required amount of time to qualify for LTIR. We don't really know if his contract is insured, though. So, in a worst case scenario where Clarkson doesn't play again, it would basically be the same situation as Horton.

LTIR won't kick in for cap relief until CBJ are over the cap with call-ups and such. So we'll have to see what happens.

 

[JacketsDavid]

I thought at some point someone from the CBJ said it was insured? I doubt if the bonuses would have any impact on it being insured because as noted they are iron-clad bonuses (meaning they are guaranteed to be paid) not abonus that can be saved by cutting him. I could be wrong but I thought someone said it was insured (again maybe it was the same source that thought Horton's contract was insured lol).

As others have said if it's not insured it would be exactly like Horton's. The CBJ would file for LTIR and then would receive an exemption to go a certain $ amount over the cap. Big question is if the CBJ would even use it.

If it is insured and if it was a LTIR problem then the CBJ would not only get the exception but they would also get a certain % (likely 80%) back from the insurance company. In that situation the CBJ would likely spend additional dollars.

But still comes back to primary question - how serious is Clarkson's injury?

 

[Viqsi]

In theory, it would work the same assuming Clarkson is out for the required amount of time to qualify for LTIR. We don't really know if his contract is insured, though. So, in a worst case scenario where Clarkson doesn't play again, it would basically be the same situation as Horton.

LTIR won't kick in for cap relief until CBJ are over the cap with call-ups and such. So we'll have to see what happens.

Well, that and IIRC you can't insure signing bonuses, only actual salary. And Clarkson's contract is about 75-76% signing bonuses. So you'd be getting IIRC 80% (the portion insurance pays out) of $1m/year ($2m/year for next season and the season afterward). Big savings.

(Admittedly, I haven't fully confirmed the underlined bits above on my own so I would appreciate it if someone who knows differently could speak up, but that's my understanding at the moment.)

 

[DarkandStormy]

Well, that and IIRC you can't insure signing bonuses, only actual salary. And Clarkson's contract is about 75-76% signing bonuses. So you'd be getting IIRC 80% (the portion insurance pays out) of $1m/year ($2m/year for next season and the season afterward). Big savings.

(Admittedly, I haven't fully confirmed the underlined bits above on my own so I would appreciate it if someone who knows differently could speak up, but that's my understanding at the moment.)

Missing capgeek right now.