The future of our defense core?

[HamiltonNHL]

If the Leafs don't improve the Blueline, they'll finish lower than 12th in the East.
They need to make some acquisition for a solid D man.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

I think Phaneuf is not the elite defender to anchor the group unfortunately. He is not a Weber/Chara/Doughty/Keith caliber defender. Having said that, his contract term and salary make him hard to trade.

So, in all likelihood, the Leafs will have Phaneuf on their blue line in the top pairing and need to find another dman that can be a steady #2 guy to bolster the top pair. In time, this will likely be Reilly, but its probably a stretch to think he will fulfill this role next season.

Unfortunately, such defenders are in high demand and limited supply in the NHL. I see our blue line as being a weakness for a couple of more years unfortunately unless Nonis can pull a rabbit out of his hat or something.

Further down the road, the Leafs have some prospects in their system that should be able to make the jump to the big league. Maybe one player (Granberg) makes the jump next year, maybe not. I think we are couple of years away before we see any kind of larger impact from the infusion of these prospect defenders.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Having said that, Phaneuf's contract term and salary make him hard to trade.

Closer to impossible than hard.

 

[Chungo]

Pairing #1
Short-Term
Phanuef - Gunnarson

Rationale:
This combo isn't going anywhere, anytime soon. Gunnar is the most consistent defender that we have, but is more suited for a 2nd line role and can be used anywhere we really need. Won't be outstanding, but will get the job done. Phanuef is the closest thing to a #1 we got and I feel the system causes him to look worse than he is. He also tries to do to much as a leader.

Later-on
Phanuef - Reilly

Phanuef is a strong defender and has a great shot, but can get out of position pretty. Reilly has great vision and has great positioning. I feel that they can complement each other well on offense, but might have defensive issues.

Pairing #2
Short-term
Reilly - Gleason

Gleason is a great defensive defender and allows Reilly to explore the ice and make a mistake. I'm ok with how this pairing looks and Reilly has veteran presence to help him out.

Long-term
Gardiner - Finn/Percy

Gardiner is going to be a great #3-4 guy that can outlet the puck or jump in the rush. He is going to need someone that requires a stability as he can have consistency issues that are bound to get screwed over. He will definitely need someone that knows how to play defense first.

Pairing #3
Short-term
Gardiner - Granberg/Ranger/Holzer

I feel that this is going to be the pairing next season. Granberg looks great, but the organization will probably make him work for it and the Leafs should have a stable of defenseman go through the cycle.

Long-term
Percy/Finn - Granberg/Holzer

We have a stable of youth and depending on who is able to take the reigns will determine who will get these spots.

 

[Pyrophorus]

Many people are saying run the kids on the 3rd/4th lines

I think the kids should graduate on the blue line
What I envision

Phaneuf-Rielly
Percy-MacWilliam/Granberg
Gardiner-Gleason
Franson

 

[Mess]

Many people are saying run the kids on the 3rd/4th lines

I think the kids should graduate on the blue line
What I envision

Phaneuf-Rielly
Percy-MacWilliam/Granberg
Gardiner-Gleason
Franson

Remember when Colaiacovo, White, Harrison, Bell and Kronwall were our future on D.

Or when Stralman, Schenn, Aulie, Vorobiev, Oreskovic and Holzer were the shinny new prospects in the system that were the Leafs future.

Now it appears the new current batch is the answer.

Unfortunately all prospects are suspects so you don't really know what you have until they prove themselves where it counts at the NHL level. The Leafs are not at a stage where they have taken a course towards providing them that opportunity.

 

[Ricky Bobby]

Many people are saying run the kids on the 3rd/4th lines

I think the kids should graduate on the blue line
What I envision

Phaneuf-Rielly
Percy-MacWilliam/Granberg
Gardiner-Gleason
Franson

We are already trying to work in enough kids already with Rielly + Gardiner next season on the blueline.

Leafs blueline was actually exceptionally healthy this year which limited call up opportunities but that is far from a normal year.

Players like Percy, Granberg should be slatted to be our first call ups to let them get their feet wet at the NHL level. Counting on them to be higher in the depth then a call up is setting the organization and the player up for failure.

Everyone wants to just toss these youngsters into the NHL when they aren't overripe at the AHL level.

Granberg: 75 AHL games
Percy: 77 AHL games

One AHL season is far from a player being over ripe and giving players call ups opportunities is the best way to groom them into eventually taking over a full time NHL role like Chicago, Detroit, Pittsburgh did with the following:

Hjalmarsson: 111 AHL games
Keith: 168 AHL games

Kronwall: 102 AHL games
Ericsson: 183 AHL games

Orpik: 182 AHL games
Scuderi: 191 AHL games

Better to have a player a day late then a day early.

 

[Ricky Bobby]

Remember when Colaiacovo, White, Harrison, Bell and Kronwall were our future on D.

Or when Stralman, Schenn, Aulie, Vorobiev, Oreskovic and Holzer were the shinny new prospects in the system that were the Leafs future.

Now it appears the new current batch is the answer.

Unfortunately all prospects are suspects so you don't really know what you have until they prove themselves where it counts at the NHL level. The Leafs are not at a stage where they have taken a course towards providing them that opportunity.

I'd argue Coli and Schenn were rushed long before they were ready.

The rest were never regarded as bluechippers but some like White or Stralman have managed to carve out very useful NHL careers. If guys like Percy, Granberg develop into White or Stralman level of impact players on cheap deals I'd be very happy with that.

But they could stand to use some more AHL seasoning to help them get there.

 

[Mess]

I'd argue Coli and Schenn were rushed long before they were ready.

The rest were never regarded as bluechippers but some like White or Stralman have managed to carve out very useful NHL careers. If guys like Percy, Granberg develop into White or Stralman level of impact players on cheap deals I'd be very happy with that.

But they could stand to use some more AHL seasoning to help them get there.

That's a fair assessment.

Keep in mind White and Stralman level dmen etc. were considered expendable in Toronto and not considered to be part of a winning solution. They were traded and used as currency for team intended upgrades.

So what is going to change this time around in Toronto with Percy and Granberg if they are similar to past comparables like Stralman?.

 

[diceman934]

I think Phaneuf is not the elite defender to anchor the group unfortunately. He is not a Weber/Chara/Doughty/Keith caliber defender. Having said that, his contract term and salary make him hard to trade.

So, in all likelihood, the Leafs will have Phaneuf on their blue line in the top pairing and need to find another dman that can be a steady #2 guy to bolster the top pair. In time, this will likely be Reilly, but its probably a stretch to think he will fulfill this role next season.

Unfortunately, such defenders are in high demand and limited supply in the NHL. I see our blue line as being a weakness for a couple of more years unfortunately unless Nonis can pull a rabbit out of his hat or something.

Further down the road, the Leafs have some prospects in their system that should be able to make the jump to the big league. Maybe one player (Granberg) makes the jump next year, maybe not. I think we are couple of years away before we see any kind of larger impact from the infusion of these prospect defenders.

Why would we trade/sign for a D man and play him with Dion when Gunnar is our best Defensive D man.....you pair your best defensive D man together and have them as your shut down pair.

Dion simply needs to go if we are to improve our D man, he needs to go before he has no value at all.

 

[Ricky Bobby]

That's a fair assessment.

Keep in mind White and Stralman level dmen etc. were considered expendable in Toronto and not considered to be part of a winning solution. They were traded and used as currency for team intended upgrades.

So what is going to change this time around in Toronto with Percy and Granberg if they are similar to past comparables like Stralman?.

Toronto is much further along in the rebuild then when Stralman and White were moved out which is a big distinction.

We still have holes but not nearly as many roughly 5 years ago.

I don't get sentimental over whether we drafted a player or not like some do.

If guys like Percy, Granberg help bring in the next Kessel, Phaneuf, Bernier, JVR long term piece like White, Stralman, Schenn, Scrivens, Frattin helped bring in then I'm perfectly okay with trading them out because we'd adding a player with many years left to perform who can make a bigger impact.

However, I'm dead set against trading them out for 1 or 2 years of guys like Bolland who we traded valuable picks for or Stempniak who we dealt Coli and Steen for.