Prospect Info: The Big Mac Thread - Part 2 - Extra Bacon Edition

[jaffy27]

You guys are delusional. Next year, it's AHL time for guys like Scherbak and McCarron. They might make the team in 2016.

Ya...cause it's so "Delusional" to think that 2 prospects who will soon be hitting 20 and dominating their respective leagues and who are physically imposing and have NHL size and that had a great showing with the big club in the pre-season and are both 1st round draft picks would have ZERO chance at making the team...how dare we even fathom that possibility....

Delusional is people thinking we can trade Desharnais for McKinnon.

 

[jaffy27]

In Montreal especially we have to take our time with these kids.

That is the one thing that Detroit does we should really try to emulate. They have the same style of play in the minors, and kids spend a year or two down there mandatory.

We did that with Subban and Subban was the most NHL ready player we had. But it was the right thing to do. AHL is the best environment to develop these guys, closest thing to the NHL there is. If the choice is between juniors and NHL, and the kid is supremely talented like Galchenyuk, then sure.. but otherwise, a year or two in the AHL is not a bad thing. I hope they don't call up Hudon at all and let him work on his game down there.

I hear what your saying, but if you're ready, you're ready. Nothing wrong with time in AHL I agree, serves many players good, especially young D, goalies and Centers. In my opinion, and it's only an opinion, McCarron is gonna be ready, as for Sherbak, it's 50/50 I believe. Guess we'll know next October!

 

[Devourers]

In Montreal especially we have to take our time with these kids.

That is the one thing that Detroit does we should really try to emulate. They have the same style of play in the minors, and kids spend a year or two down there mandatory.

We did that with Subban and Subban was the most NHL ready player we had. But it was the right thing to do. AHL is the best environment to develop these guys, closest thing to the NHL there is. If the choice is between juniors and NHL, and the kid is supremely talented like Galchenyuk, then sure.. but otherwise, a year or two in the AHL is not a bad thing. I hope they don't call up Hudon at all and let him work on his game down there.

Frankly I don't see the harm in giving a kid 2-3 games just to see what the NHL is like and where they need to improve, especially if they've earned it by playing well in their respective leagues.

As for the person calling people delusional, 90% of the people here are saying they'll get a call up, only about 10% are the ones saying they'll make the team on a permanent basis. In either case it isn't delusional to think a physically mature talented 1st rounder could make the NHL in his second year.

The people who call that delusion are probably the same kinds of people who never believed in Gallagher when everyone knew he'd be a Hab sooner rather than later. It isn't delusion to state something that is possible could happen. It's more-so wishful thinking. Just because you're pessimistic doesn't mean we're delusional for having faith.

Also if you're going to disagree fine disagree, but calling people delusional because of a very possible (however unlikely) opinion is trolling. You might as well go around calling half the people in this thread ****tards who are missing a chromosome. It's a backhanded comment and imo it's as insulting as just coming out and saying we're all ****ing idiots and you're the grand master of intellect.

 

[jaffy27]

Frankly I don't see the harm in giving a kid 2-3 games just to see what the NHL is like and where they need to improve, especially if they've earned it by playing well in their respective leagues.

As for the person calling people delusional, 90% of the people here are saying they'll get a call up, only about 10% are the ones saying they'll make the team on a permanent basis. In either case it isn't delusional to think a physically mature talented 1st rounder could make the NHL in his second year.

The people who call that delusion are probably the same kinds of people who never believed in Gallagher when everyone knew he'd be a Hab sooner rather than later. It isn't delusion to state something that is possible could happen. It's more-so wishful thinking. Just because you're pessimistic doesn't mean we're delusional for having faith.

Also if you're going to disagree fine disagree, but calling people delusional because of a very possible (however unlikely) opinion is trolling. You might as well go around calling half the people in this thread ****tards who are missing a chromosome. It's a backhanded comment and imo it's as insulting as just coming out and saying we're all ****ing idiots and you're the grand master of intellect.

Well said Devourers...well said!! (Unsynched slow clapping)

This comment sponsored by "Weisers"

 

[Habs76]

I read Bobby Orr's book not too long ago and he was talking about how he was ready at a skill standpoint but not at a mental standpoint or physical one. I would say they are both strong enough for the NHL but may possibly nor be mentally ready. HOWEVER, he was talking about himself as an 18 year old, not a 21 year old. Just thought I should throw it out there.

 

[Marc the Habs Fan]

No points in 7 of his last 10 games now...2 points in his last 6 games...

Not a good sign.

I must admit I bought into the notion his early season production was legit and not just because he was playing with Domi and he was on their 1st PP unit...but it certainly seems like it now. In Oshawa, it's like he's back on last year's Knights, it's a very deep team, he's not playing 1st line minutes with MDC...

And the offensive results are nearly identical to last year. Granted, it is still a small sample size, but it's concerning to me. Stats aren't everything, but the drop off from his London numbers to his Oshawa numbers is significant.

I'd love to read from Grant about what he has seen from McCarron as a General or is hearing from his 'source' inside the organization about McCarron in Oshawa so far.

Not sure why there's even a debate about his NHL readiness in the fall. He's not dominating the OHL at all. He'll get at least a year in Hamilton.

 

[jaffy27]

No points in 7 of his last 10 games now...2 points in his last 6 games...

Not a good sign.

I must admit I bought into the notion his early season production was legit and not just because he was playing with Domi and he was on their 1st PP unit...but it certainly seems like it now. In Oshawa, it's like he's back on last year's Knights, it's a very deep team, he's not playing 1st line minutes with MDC...

And the offensive results are nearly identical to last year. Granted, it is still a small sample size, but it's concerning to me. Stats aren't everything, but the drop off from his London numbers to his Oshawa numbers is significant.

I'd love to read from Grant about what he has seen from McCarron as a General or is hearing from his 'source' inside the organization about McCarron in Oshawa so far.

Not sure why there's even a debate about his NHL readiness in the fall. He's not dominating the OHL at all. He'll get at least a year in Hamilton.

In all fairness, he was dominating before the trade, even without Domi. Now it's new team, new coach, new line mates, new system, new role, chemistry has to be re-hatched. I fly airplanes for a living and whenever you go into a new airport or in new continents, your comfort level is not the same, you're not as automatic as you'd normally be, or if you switch to a new aircraft, there's always an adaptation period, just give it some time and he'll find his way.

 

[calder candidate]

McCarron shouldn't play in the NHL next year regarless. Even if McCarron (or Schebak) could make the team next year I rather see him in the AHL, getting more ice time, have resposibilities, keep devellopping is offensive game.
He would be physcally ready, but in the NHL I feel he would have too much presure to not make mistake or fight and eventually the would lead him to become a fringe player, he is a 1rd pick we need him to make a impact we need him to become a good top 9 player.
I think that one of the issue with guy JDRL been playing with adults since he a was like 16yo mostly getting bottom 6 minute because he was physically able to, it help him in some aspect but I think he would of been better serve playing and dominating is age group instead of learning to play safe and not making mistake.

 

[montreal]

McCarron shouldn't play in the NHL next year regarless. Even if McCarron (or Schebak) could make the team next year I rather see him in the AHL, getting more ice time, have resposibilities, keep devellopping is offensive game.
He would be physcally ready, but in the NHL I feel he would have too much presure to not make mistake or fight and eventually the would lead him to become a fringe player, he is a 1rd pick we need him to make a impact we need him to become a good top 9 player.
I think that one of the issue with guy JDRL been playing with adults since he a was like 16yo mostly getting bottom 6 minute because he was physically able to, it help him in some aspect but I think he would of been better serve playing and dominating is age group instead of learning to play safe and not making mistake.

I'm not saying he will or won't but if the Habs feel he can help the team win then I don't see any reason why he shouldn't be in the NHL. Same for Scherbak, especially if they don't make any coaching changes in Hamilton. I really do think Scherbak could help the Habs, if his defensive game is up to par. But we'll have to see where they are at physically and their overall game when next season rolls around. I'm all for not rushing prospects, since we saw what happened to Leblanc and I still feel they shouldn't have rushed Bournival either but each prospect is his own and they have to find their own way. Since hopefully the Habs are a team that should be looking to win now it makes it that much harder to make the team next fall but if they show enough to impress management then so be it.

Not worried about McCarron at all since he brings something we sorely need, he's raw though so if it takes him however long in the AHL then that's fine too.

 

[Mr. Hab]

In Montreal especially we have to take our time with these kids.

That is the one thing that Detroit does we should really try to emulate. They have the same style of play in the minors, and kids spend a year or two down there mandatory.

We did that with Subban and Subban was the most NHL ready player we had. But it was the right thing to do. AHL is the best environment to develop these guys, closest thing to the NHL there is. If the choice is between juniors and NHL, and the kid is supremely talented like Galchenyuk, then sure.. but otherwise, a year or two in the AHL is not a bad thing. I hope they don't call up Hudon at all and let him work on his game down there.

You guys are delusional. Next year, it's AHL time for guys like Scherbak and McCarron. They might make the team in 2016.

I agree with the above (except with the usage of the word ''delusional''), but...

I also agree with those who may think that Scherbak and McCarron may be ready sooner than later (especially Scherbak). IF this is the case (IF)...I'm all for it, but I'd be careful.

PK Subban (development):
Imo, he was ready before they brought him up from AHL...imo. Maybe they waited too long? It took an injury to Markov for us to finally see Subban in a Hab jersey.
I still don't get it...why wasn't he playing before that?
1st game he plays (playoffs)...I already instantly saw a superstar (not a star...a superstar... hence why I was wondering why they waited so long to bring him in?). Anyways...everything worked out in the end.

Tinordi, Hudon, Scherbak, McCarron:
<Tinordi...may get some games before 2015 playoffs...may be our #6-7dman for 2015 playoffs...or for sure our #6-7dman for 2015-2016...for sure (YOU DO NOT TRADE TINORDI...NO WAY!! imo!).
<Hudon...playoffs 2015? 2015-2016 season for sure?
<Scherbak...50/50 AHL/NHL...2016 playoffs?
<McCarron...a few NHL games next season (a few)...maybe a few 2016 playoff games? (or more than a few). 2016-2017 season.

I'm not saying he (McCarron) will or won't but if the Habs feel he can help the team win then I don't see any reason why he shouldn't be in the NHL. Same for Scherbak, especially if they don't make any coaching changes in Hamilton. I really do think Scherbak could help the Habs, if his defensive game is up to par. But we'll have to see where they are at physically and their overall game when next season rolls around. I'm all for not rushing prospects, since we saw what happened to Leblanc and I still feel they shouldn't have rushed Bournival either but each prospect is his own and they have to find their own way. Since hopefully the Habs are a team that should be looking to win now it makes it that much harder to make the team next fall but if they show enough to impress management then so be it.

Not worried about McCarron at all since he brings something we sorely need, he's raw though so if it takes him however long in the AHL then that's fine too.

+1.

But/and...I'm all for whatever it takes (more patience...*sigh!*) to make sure Scherbak and McCarron are fully ready/developed. We all wish they were all ready...NOW!! (I do too!), but rushing our gems can be counterproductive. I also don't want them coming in too raw.

 

[calder candidate]

I'm not saying he will or won't but if the Habs feel he can help the team win then I don't see any reason why he shouldn't be in the NHL. Same for Scherbak, especially if they don't make any coaching changes in Hamilton. I really do think Scherbak could help the Habs, if his defensive game is up to par. But we'll have to see where they are at physically and their overall game when next season rolls around. I'm all for not rushing prospects, since we saw what happened to Leblanc and I still feel they shouldn't have rushed Bournival either but each prospect is his own and they have to find their own way. Since hopefully the Habs are a team that should be looking to win now it makes it that much harder to make the team next fall but if they show enough to impress management then so be it.

Not worried about McCarron at all since he brings something we sorely need, he's raw though so if it takes him however long in the AHL then that's fine too.

We both agree, my point was that keeping up isn't good enough they need to be able to impact the game. We need there skills and size and I think that they would be able to keep but I don't want to see that cloud are judgement (long term vs. short term). I rather see them getting 1st line minute in the AHL (hopefully there will be coaching change) then getting bounced around or molded in to player we need right now vs. the player he could be in the NHL. If they are good enough to win a spot in the top 9, it hard to take it away from them, but they need to make impossible to deny them the spot not just match the competition.

 

[calder candidate]

Also I think we need to consider how playing will impact there FA status. I think game played can impact their RFA status (able to receive offer sheets or arbitration). Having them hit RFA or UFA a years ealier might not be worth what they will bring next year. This can't be the biggest factor since you can't hold them back for financial reason alone, but if it a 50/50 call in the cap world I think we need to consider it. I might have this issue come up with Galchenyuk who will hit UFA a year early with the taxes in Quebec and with everyone getting over pay badly if you have/had to overpay on a couple of RFA that need to resign it could be the difference that close our cup window a year early.

 

[montreal]

We both agree, my point was that keeping up isn't good enough they need to be able to impact the game. We need there skills and size and I think that they would be able to keep but I don't want to see that cloud are judgement (long term vs. short term). I rather see them getting 1st line minute in the AHL (hopefully there will be coaching change) then getting bounced around or molded in to player we need right now vs. the player he could be in the NHL. If they are good enough to win a spot in the top 9, it hard to take it away from them, but they need to make impossible to deny them the spot not just match the competition.

Yea if Scherbak isn't in the top 6 I don't want him in the NHL. I just hope they at least try him on a line with Galchenyuk to see how it goes.

 

[Habs76]

Yea if Scherbak isn't in the top 6 I don't want him in the NHL. I just hope they at least try him on a line with Galchenyuk to see how it goes.

Luckily enough for us, we have an open spot in the top 6

Pacioretty - Galchenyuk - Scherbak
Desharnais - Plekanec - Gallagher
Sekac - Eller - Parenteau
Prust - Bournival - Wiese


Beaulieu - Subban
Markov - Nygren
Tinordi - Gilbert
Pateryn

Notes:

Big Mac takes PaP's spot when PaP's contract expires

We trade Emelin(assuming he waives da NTC)

Sekac later takes DD'S spot soon

 

[montreal]

Luckily enough for us, we have an open spot in the top 6

Pacioretty - Galchenyuk - Scherbak
Desharnais - Plekanec - Gallagher
Sekac - Eller - Parenteau
Prust - Bournival - Wiese


Beaulieu - Subban
Markov - Nygren
Tinordi - Gilbert
Pateryn

Notes:

Big Mac takes PaP's spot when PaP's contract expires

We trade Emelin(assuming he waives da NTC)

Sekac later takes DD'S spot soon

I would consider buying out PAP if they think they can upgrade via UFA. Like the top 9 otherwise. Hate the D, way too inexperienced and soft for a team that hopefully is among the best in the NHL next year.

 

[Habs76]

I would consider buying out PAP if they think they can upgrade via UFA. Like the top 9 otherwise. Hate the D, way too inexperienced and soft for a team that hopefully is among the best in the NHL next year.

Ya, I doubt Nygren plays top 4. More realistically, we sign a UFA.

Beaulieu - Subban
Markov - XXXX
Tinordi - Gilbert
Nygren/Pateryn

 

[mustardnight*]

Its depressing to see everyone on hfboards completely leave out Emelin. He ain't going anywhere and I for one am glad you guys can't touch the roster.

 

[Carey Chant]

Guys this is the Big Mac thread......

McCarron scores the game winner tonight in a 5-4 OT victory against Ottawa.

 

[S Bah]

Guys this is the Big Mac thread......

McCarron scores the game winner tonight in a 5-4 OT victory against Ottawa.

Gotta love that pick, Go McCarron Go!!!...

 

[Habs76]

Big Mac is a stud muffin

 

[Jakomyte]

I must admit I bought into the notion his early season production was legit and not just because he was playing with Domi and he was on their 1st PP unit...but it certainly seems like it now. In Oshawa, it's like he's back on last year's Knights, it's a very deep team, he's not playing 1st line minutes with MDC...

I don't get this line of thinking. So McCarron is now playing less, on a lower line, and receiving less PP time, and the fact that his stats take a hit is a surprise? I think at this point its much more important to actually watch how he's playing as opposed to expecting his point production to remain the same under completely different circumstances.

Sure, the more points he can get the better, but all players will have some ups and downs, and he is playing in a different role on his new team. I wouldn't get too bent out of shape.

 

[RandR]

McCarron scores the game winner tonight in a 5-4 OT victory against Ottawa.

I went to the game last night, mostly to watch McCarron but also of course to check out a few other top drafted and prospect players.

Regarding McCarron,
- he played Centre the entire game. No RW at all.
- his lack of scoring on the Generals since his trade there is not because he is on the 3rd or 4th line with scrubs. His left-winger all game long was Tobias Lindberg, Oshawa's 2nd leading scorer (4th-round pick from Sweden by Ottawa Senators in 2013), and his right winger was Brent Pedersen (5th round pick by Carolina in 2013). He also got a lot of 4on4 or 4on3 time with Dal Colle late in the game.
- he got a lot of ice time, especially in the 3rd and overtime. In the 3rd period when Oshawa was down 2-0, the 67s had a run of penalties and I'm pretty sure Dal Colle and McCarron both played the entire first 2 minutes of the first penalty before McCarron (first) went off for about a minute before coming back on again when the next powerplay turned into another 5 on 3.
- I was impressed by his hustle all game long. He had "jump" in his game, especially on the forecheck. Guy moves really well for a big guy. I recall reading that he dropped a few pounds for this season, and it looks like that has helped.
- his winning goal in overtime was a nice shot. He was set up all alone on a 2 on 1 by Dal Colle, and he took his time to snap a shot low glove side from about 15 feet out.

Overall I was pretty impressed by McCarron. I saw him play live once last year with the Knights against Kingston and there just wasn't much to take notice of back then other than his size. Last night was watching someone being far more involved and consistently contributing to the play, especially in the offensive zone on the forecheck, moving the puck along the boards, and going to the front of the net.

 

[montreal]

I went to the game last night, mostly to watch McCarron but also of course to check out a few other top drafted and prospect players.

Regarding McCarron,
- he played Centre the entire game. No RW at all.
- his lack of scoring on the Generals since his trade there is not because he is on the 3rd or 4th line with scrubs. His left-winger all game long was Tobias Lindberg, Oshawa's 2nd leading scorer (4th-round pick from Sweden by Ottawa Senators in 2013), and his right winger was Brent Pedersen (5th round pick by Carolina in 2013). He also got a lot of 4on4 or 4on3 time with Dal Colle late in the game.
- he got a lot of ice time, especially in the 3rd and overtime. In the 3rd period when Oshawa was down 2-0, the 67s had a run of penalties and I'm pretty sure Dal Colle and McCarron both played the entire first 2 minutes of the first penalty before McCarron (first) went off for about a minute before coming back on again when the next powerplay turned into another 5 on 3.
- I was impressed by his hustle all game long. He had "jump" in his game, especially on the forecheck. Guy moves really well for a big guy. I recall reading that he dropped a few pounds for this season, and it looks like that has helped.
- his winning goal in overtime was a nice shot. He was set up all alone on a 2 on 1 by Dal Colle, and he took his time to snap a shot low glove side from about 15 feet out.

Overall I was pretty impressed by McCarron. I saw him play live once last year with the Knights against Kingston and there just wasn't much to take notice of back then other than his size. Last night was watching someone being far more involved and consistently contributing to the play, especially in the offensive zone on the forecheck, moving the puck along the boards, and going to the front of the net.

good stuff, thanks for posting.

 

[Carey Chant]

Overall I was pretty impressed by McCarron. I saw him play live once last year with the Knights against Kingston and there just wasn't much to take notice of back then other than his size. Last night was watching someone being far more involved and consistently contributing to the play, especially in the offensive zone on the forecheck, moving the puck along the boards, and going to the front of the net.

Really happy to hear that. I just hope the stat hounds are satisfied with hard work and good all around play sometimes instead of looking for those 5 points in 1 game to be happy.

 

[Hoople]

I went to the game last night, mostly to watch McCarron but also of course to check out a few other top drafted and prospect players.

Regarding McCarron,
- he played Centre the entire game. No RW at all.
- his lack of scoring on the Generals since his trade there is not because he is on the 3rd or 4th line with scrubs. His left-winger all game long was Tobias Lindberg, Oshawa's 2nd leading scorer (4th-round pick from Sweden by Ottawa Senators in 2013), and his right winger was Brent Pedersen (5th round pick by Carolina in 2013). He also got a lot of 4on4 or 4on3 time with Dal Colle late in the game.
- he got a lot of ice time, especially in the 3rd and overtime. In the 3rd period when Oshawa was down 2-0, the 67s had a run of penalties and I'm pretty sure Dal Colle and McCarron both played the entire first 2 minutes of the first penalty before McCarron (first) went off for about a minute before coming back on again when the next powerplay turned into another 5 on 3.
- I was impressed by his hustle all game long. He had "jump" in his game, especially on the forecheck. Guy moves really well for a big guy. I recall reading that he dropped a few pounds for this season, and it looks like that has helped.
- his winning goal in overtime was a nice shot. He was set up all alone on a 2 on 1 by Dal Colle, and he took his time to snap a shot low glove side from about 15 feet out.

Overall I was pretty impressed by McCarron. I saw him play live once last year with the Knights against Kingston and there just wasn't much to take notice of back then other than his size. Last night was watching someone being far more involved and consistently contributing to the play, especially in the offensive zone on the forecheck, moving the puck along the boards, and going to the front of the net.

Thanks for the informative post.