Blue Jays Discussion: Thank you, Gibby!

[canucksfan]

 

[deletethis]

Is there really a risk of Alford qualifying as a "Super Two"?

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Was the return for Donaldson the lowest ever for a player who recently won the MVP ?

Quite the bad timing.

 

[deletethis]

Was the return for Donaldson the lowest ever for a player who recently won the MVP ?

Quite the bad timing.

Blue Jays' only other MVP (George Bell) left Toronto through free agency 3 years later. The Blue Jays got a sandwich compensation pick that became Jeff Ware (59 career innings, 7.47 ERA).

 

[Mach85]

Blue Jays' only other MVP (George Bell) left Toronto through free agency 3 years later. The Blue Jays got a sandwich compensation pick that became Jeff Ware (59 career innings, 7.47 ERA).

Interestingly, both the Jays and Leafs had a player named Jeff Ware who busted around the same time.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Blue Jays' only other MVP (George Bell) left Toronto through free agency 3 years later. The Blue Jays got a sandwich compensation pick that became Jeff Ware (59 career innings, 7.47 ERA).

i mean in the whole league ever.

Ken Giles has 6 walks in his last 45 innings.

 

[phillipmike]

Was the return for Donaldson the lowest ever for a player who recently won the MVP ?

Quite the bad timing.

McCutchen was the MVP in 2013 and didnt go for much. He was traded twice in the last calendar year.

Stanton was the MVP last year and was treated as a salary dump.

Josh Hamilton was an MVP in 2010 and walked for free after the 2012 season (comp pick turned into Travis Demeritte).

Barry Bonds came off his 2nd MVP in 1992 and walked as a free agent too the following season. Comp pick was Charles Rice.

-------

Stanton has to be the worst one. Just came off the MVP salary had to be retained to get very little back. At least the Jays got 2 playoff runs out of Donaldson. Miami got nothing out of Stanton when he was there, got little for him in trade and got huge media backlash from their moves and entire off-season.

 

[Nineteen67]

Was the return for Donaldson the lowest ever for a player who recently won the MVP ?

Quite the bad timing.

Bad timing? More of a case of poor management.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Bad timing? More of a case of poor management.

especially when viewed with the clearest telescope in the world: the retrospectoscope.

 

[BlueForever75]

I don't care what we got for the primadonna Donaldson, he screwed Toronto and I am glad hes out of town. I hope Karma comes back and bites him in the butt come this off season.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Was the return for Donaldson the lowest ever for a player who recently won the MVP ?

Quite the bad timing.

The way the MLB FA Comp pick works has changed recently, so it’s difficult to measure such a thing without context.

Albert Pujols won the NL MVP in 2009, finished second in voting in 2010, and walked in FA after 2011. STL qualified him, got the 18th OA pick and drafted Wacha (flocka flame).

The comp pick the Jays would have hypothetically received would have been in the ~60s or 70s.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

he screwed Toronto and I am glad hes out of town

How did he screw Toronto ?

 

[BlueForever75]

How did he screw Toronto ?

He definitely has an issue with management. I'm sorry but a strained calf doesn't keep you out 3/4 of the season. He stuck it to organization and as he said it will be discussed when the time is right!!! That time being when he has enough of a BS story that puts blame on organization so it increases his FA value.

The guy is a farce, fooled us all. I was the biggest fan of his, but I have seen his true colors. As should everyone else.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

He definitely has an issue with management. I'm sorry but a strained calf doesn't keep you out 3/4 of the season. He stuck it to organization and as he said it will be discussed when the time is right!!! That time being when he has enough of a BS story that puts blame on organization so it increases his FA value.

The guy is a farce, fooled us all. I was the biggest fan of his, but I have seen his true colors. As should everyone else.

Seems like a few players didn't rush back from injury.

i wonder if he healthy for the postseason this year.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

He definitely has an issue with management. I'm sorry but a strained calf doesn't keep you out 3/4 of the season. He stuck it to organization and as he said it will be discussed when the time is right!!! That time being when he has enough of a BS story that puts blame on organization so it increases his FA value.

The guy is a farce, fooled us all. I was the biggest fan of his, but I have seen his true colors. As should everyone else.

This seems like the most unhealthy way to view the situation. So kudos to you, good sir.

 

[Discoverer]

He definitely has an issue with management. I'm sorry but a strained calf doesn't keep you out 3/4 of the season. He stuck it to organization and as he said it will be discussed when the time is right!!! That time being when he has enough of a BS story that puts blame on organization so it increases his FA value.

The guy is a farce, fooled us all. I was the biggest fan of his, but I have seen his true colors. As should everyone else.

 

[Epictetus]

Why would Donaldson choose to cost himself millions of dollars in his free agency year?

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Kyle and Eric have appeared to have doubled-down on there stance on Kevin Smith (i.e. we're late, so let's hope for the worst rather than adjust now).

The Final Pro-Side Update to THE BOARD | FanGraphs Baseball

Kevin Smith, SS, TOR – At Maryland, Smith was a swing-and-miss power hitter who could play a solid shortstop. In pro ball, some swing and approach adjustments have unlocked more contact ability. He now looks like he may be a regular of some kind, which would be quite a find in the fourth round.

Though he has "moved up" their list in terms of Blue Jays prospects and among SS, he remains outside the top-15 SS prospects in baseball, behind Logan Warmoth. Those numbers, in pitchers leagues, with that defense....45FV baby.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

The Blue Jays have six BBA classification all stars. They are:
- Jansen (C- AAA)
- Vlad Jr. (3B - AA), POY
- Bergen (RP - AA)
- Murphy (SP - A+)
- Spanberger (1B, A)
- Pardinho (SP, Rk), POY

Biggio missed mostly because of Jeff McNeil, who was nuts. Smith lost out because of Gavin Lux. Had he spent more time in the Midwest league, he likely beats out Lewis. Chavez Young probably has a legit gripe as well; had a better overall season than Waters and Gomez.

Eloy Jimenez managed to be on both the Triple-A and Double-A teams lol.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

Jays fire 4 scouts and 2 others retire.

 

[deletethis]

Kevin Smith is reminding me of this former Jay:

Alex Gonzalez

Gonzalez was a plus defender who was obsessed with clearing the fence. Sort of a shortstop J.P. Arencibia who could actually play defense.

 

[Nineteen67]

especially when viewed with the clearest telescope in the world: the retrospectoscope.

Or through the eyes of those of us that would have traded him after the 2016 season when it was clear they couldn’t add the pieces to win a WS.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Kevin Smith is reminding me of this former Jay:

Alex Gonzalez

Gonzalez was a plus defender who was obsessed with clearing the fence. Sort of a shortstop J.P. Arencibia who could actually play defense.

Very interesting. The profile you describe also sounds like the other Alex Gonzalez (also a former Jay).

Background: Gonzalez is the latest in a long line of Venezuelan shortstops. Less flashy than Omar Vizquel but with more pop than Ozzie Guillen, Gonzalez will get his first shot at the big leagues this season. He was named top prospect in the International League last year despite ranking as the IL's youngest position player. Strengths: Professional maturity. Gonzalez has played winter ball in his home country since he was 17. His defense is Gold Glove-caliber. He has plus feet, hands, range, instincts and release, though he lacks a cannon arm. He has good gap power and knows how to make adjustments between at-bats. Weaknesses: Like his namesake with the Blue Jays, Gonzalez can become enamored of his power and get himself out by overswinging. His speed is average and contributes to a conservative baserunning style.

Hilariously, though they were both very home run centric in terms of approach, neither hit 20 in a given season (minors or majors) until 27 and 30 years old, respectively. Neither was ever able to exclipse 60 XBH.

Smith accomplished both feats, while hitting .292 and slugging .508, with 2/3rds of his AB's coming in the FSL, where the average slugging % is .364.

JPA walked 96 times in 1745 PA's as a prospect, 38 of which came in his second stint in the PCL. Smith walked 40 times this season in 575 PA's.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Or through the eyes of those of us that would have traded him after the 2016 season when it was clear they couldn’t add the pieces to win a WS.

I thought this narrative was "after the 2015 season when it was clear the roster configuration would never result in the world series"....or was that someone else who kept repeating that?

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Jays fire 4 scouts and 2 others retire.

As long as its not Matt Bishoff, then I'm good.