Speculation: Taylor Hall Benched, New Jersey last in the East - do they need a shake-up?

[NYRKing]

They've underachieved but not by much. Goaltending and D are poor. Blackwood must be a revelation because Schnieder and Kinkaid are awful. You can't be competitive with that tandem, unless Cory somehow regains his form. Aside from Severson and Vatanen, maybe Greene?, the D is totally sub-par. Even Butcher seems to be having a big sophmore slump.

Hall ain't the problem, and for the record I'd be shocked if he doesn't sign an extension. Focal point of the team, and just won the Hart trophy. You would think as long as the devs pay him he understands they're a young team with some growing pains.

 

[zharkenby]

No I don't realize that. Maybe you can enlighten me.

5 1st round picks in 2 seasons plus the young prospects with some potential in trade returns like Hajek, Lindgren and Rykov. Chytil and Howden are NHL main stays already at 20, Andersson is getting his cup of coffee at 20. Kravtsov is leading his KHL team in scoring at 18/19(or was before leaving for WJC), Miller is having a tremendous season as a Freshman and Lundkvist is playing well in the SHL as an 18 year old. Nico Gross looks solid in the WJC as a defensive D and Joey Keane looks very promising for future potential. Rangers will have a top 10 pick this season and if TBL win the cup get their 1st round pick as well. Trade deadline will see if there are any more 1st round picks for 2019.

Currently the only forwards on the team over 27 are Zuccarello and McLeod. All expensive contracts, from Staal and Shattenkirk down to Lundqvist will be off the books after two more seasons.

NYR management put out a letter to the fans to inform them of the full rebuilding intentions about 1 calendar year ago. I think it's going pretty good. Personally, I think NYR have done more effective rebuilding in 1 year than the NJD have done in 6 or 7 years. Even with a fresh rebuilding team, NY is still higher in the standings than NJ this season. If you want to see a terrible rebuild... look no further than NJ. Outside of those lottery winning picks, it's been pretty dismal.

See the difference between NJ and NYR is our young players actually produce( see Nico, Bratt, Butcher, and hell even Blackwood)

Andersson has been a wreck in the nhl. Chytil had a hot streak and has otherwise done nothing. Bowden is alright I guess, but I can recap how wel some of our guys are playing outside of the nhl also... it doesn’t mean anything. I don’t think you realize the Rangers rebuild starts AFTER guys like henrik and zucc and staal are gone. Sure, they have some nice pieces. None of them are elite, and none of them are proven. Atleast 5 years away from competing.

The devils made the playoffs 2 years after fully committing to a rebuild. Good effort though

 

[NYR713]

See the difference between NJ and NYR is our young players actually produce( see Nico, Bratt, Butcher, and hell even Blackwood)

Andersson has been a wreck in the nhl. Chytil had a hot streak and has otherwise done nothing. Bowden is alright I guess, but I can recap how wel some of our guys are playing outside of the nhl also... it doesn’t mean anything. I don’t think you realize the Rangers rebuild starts AFTER guys like henrik and zucc and staal are gone. Sure, they have some nice pieces. None of them are elite, and none of them are proven. Atleast 5 years away from competing.

The devils made the playoffs 2 years after fully committing to a rebuild. Good effort though

I won't quote all of the responses on my post, so I'll just pick this last one and respond in general. I'll give you one of your specific responses... NYR don't have any elites in the pipeline. I agree. Neither do the Devils, though. Nico is nice, but not elite either. Past him, it's pretty shitty. Actually, past the 1st line in general... the team is pretty shitty.

When NJ didn't make the playoffs for 5 seasons in a row (and 6 out of 7) and I might gloat a bit about them missing the playoffs again (and again) I was told by Devils fans, every one of those seasons, it's because they were rebuilding.

When I said LL was ruining the team by not selling veterans and buying to try and make the 8th spot, I "knew nothing about the Devils and should worry about my own team." Now it's all Lou's fault... like I said.

Shero's first big picks were Zacha and McLeod... to the one that mentioned how tremendous Shero's drafting has been. Same guy thinks ROW is better than points and standings. But at the same time, NJ is supposed to be "rising" while NYR were always supposed to be bad this season. When does that whole "rising" thing start?

Other guy says Bratt, Wood, Butcher and Zacha are the building blocks of the future and "at least they produce." lol Good luck with that. I'll take NYR prospects and young players over that group any day. I'm open to a bet that Chytil will produce more next season, at age 20, than any of those mentioned. I'm feeling pretty good that Kravtsov will also be better than any of those great NJ building blocks.

Again... Nico is nice but the rest? Butcher is no better than Pionk... and that's not very good and not even someone I'd bring into the discussion. Bratt is Hagelin 2.0... gonna be a decent NHL player. Zacha is trash... I think any sensible NJD fan would agree there. Wood is a nice bottom 6 type... I'll give you that. I wouldn't kick him off my team with his speed and grit but wouldn't be depending on him to be a big cup competitive piece of the puzzle. It's pretty hard to get excited about the potential of anyone else in the system after Ty Smith and maybe Joey Anderson.

I doubt we will all agree on any of it, but I'm pretty confident that the NYR will be the better team in the next 3-5 years. You NJ fans better start praying Hall resigns, because if he leaves it's going to be a complete shit show in a couple seasons.

 

[Pens x]

Let’s see Shero build a legitimate team without most of the pieces already in place like he had in Pittsburgh.

 

[zharkenby]

I won't quote all of the responses on my post, so I'll just pick this last one and respond in general. I'll give you one of your specific responses... NYR don't have any elites in the pipeline. I agree. Neither do the Devils, though. Nico is nice, but not elite either. Past him, it's pretty ****ty. Actually, past the 1st line in general... the team is pretty ****ty.

When NJ didn't make the playoffs for 5 seasons in a row (and 6 out of 7) and I might gloat a bit about them missing the playoffs again (and again) I was told by Devils fans, every one of those seasons, it's because they were rebuilding.

When I said LL was ruining the team by not selling veterans and buying to try and make the 8th spot, I "knew nothing about the Devils and should worry about my own team." Now it's all Lou's fault... like I said.

Shero's first big picks were Zacha and McLeod... to the one that mentioned how tremendous Shero's drafting has been. Same guy thinks ROW is better than points and standings. But at the same time, NJ is supposed to be "rising" while NYR were always supposed to be bad this season. When does that whole "rising" thing start?

Other guy says Bratt, Wood, Butcher and Zacha are the building blocks of the future and "at least they produce." lol Good luck with that. I'll take NYR prospects and young players over that group any day. I'm open to a bet that Chytil will produce more next season, at age 20, than any of those mentioned. I'm feeling pretty good that Kravtsov will also be better than any of those great NJ building blocks.

Again... Nico is nice but the rest? Butcher is no better than Pionk... and that's not very good and not even someone I'd bring into the discussion. Bratt is Hagelin 2.0... gonna be a decent NHL player. Zacha is trash... I think any sensible NJD fan would agree there. Wood is a nice bottom 6 type... I'll give you that. I wouldn't kick him off my team with his speed and grit but wouldn't be depending on him to be a big cup competitive piece of the puzzle. It's pretty hard to get excited about the potential of anyone else in the system after Ty Smith and maybe Joey Anderson.

I doubt we will all agree on any of it, but I'm pretty confident that the NYR will be the better team in the next 3-5 years. You NJ fans better start praying Hall resigns, because if he leaves it's going to be a complete **** show in a couple seasons.

Shero isn’t the reason we took zacha... he let conte handle the draft. I don’t know how many times that needs to be said. Also, Nico will be elite, he’s showing signs of it already. Right now I’d take bratt over Anderson ainec, and probably would have a tough time choosing between him and chytil. I can go on, but this is a Taylor Hall trade thread.

I know it’s been forever since the rags had a player of that quality (or kovalchuks, parises, Elias etc) because every major free agent signing they’ve made recently busted (shattenkirk, Nash, Richards, gaborik etc)

But don’t derail the thread.

 

[McFlash97]

Jerseys biggest issue is goaltending. Fix that and its a different story.

 

[NJDevils17]

Still multiple pieces away. 2 top four dmen and a top 6 center are the most striking.

 

[HellOnIce]

You get assets, you try to pick the BPA in the draft, you do your homework, try to get lucky, be patient and take the opps when they come your way.

I can't complain too much about what Ray has done. This team had nothing, zero, nada when he took over. Not too mention was pretty much near bankruptcy when he took over. They've had to clean up a lot on the ice, as much as off the ice. And if you don't think one affects the other, you're mistaken.

I see Butcher being mentioned above as being "meh" or "just ok"----he's 23, pretty much played every game - had 44 points last year and is slowed a tad this year (but so has the team) - but he's 23 - 120 GP already and is almost at .5 PPG. Kid is on the way to be a solid top-4 D, which is great. I don't see the point in comparing to Pionk, Butcher serves the Devils very well in what they need right now.

Severson, Butcher, Vatanen, Ty Smith (almost made the team this year, now killing it in WHL this year - probably play NHL before season is over) leading the way into 2019-2020 --- still have really good D prospects in Reilly Walsh, Jeremy Davies, etc. Andy Greene still has a year left on his contract, and despite what some may say, the guy is generally smart/solid. If anything with Smith coming on, hopefully he can be the 'Dad' back there and have his TOI come down a tad to preserve him.

Nico is just fantastic. He just turned 20 last night, already so solid defensively, strong on the puck for this size, has fit in so well with what this team is and wants to be. He is that Datsyuk type of guy, and his offense will only get better.

Aside from Nico, the 2017 draft is shaping up to be interesting as well. Jesper Boqvist, Fabian Zetterlund, Aaron Talvitie, Walsh all look to possibly push for spots in '19-20/20-21. Boqvist/Talvitie next year, the others maybe the following. Joey Anderson is already on the team, but it's guys like Boqvist that have bigger O upsides.

Every year it's a progression, and it's not linear. This year maybe non-playoff but if you're telling me at the end of it, we got a good pick coming up, we found a potential future #1 in Blackwood, Severson came into his own, Joey Anderson became a player, and the rest of the kids got experience - you take it and move forward.

 

[KovalSNIPE]

We need a true top 4 shutdown LHD and high skilled top 6 C or RW. Hopefully, Boqvist can be that forward we need.

 

[glucker]

Jerseys biggest issue is goaltending. Fix that and its a different story.

Given the history of the Devils, this is so strange.

Especially when you consider they have two of the 3 guys Nucks fans called top-2 goalies in the NHL.

 

[rt]

We need a true top 4 shutdown LHD and high skilled top 6 C or RW. Hopefully, Boqvist can be that forward we need.

Stepan and Hjalmarsson for Wood, Butcher and a pick.

 

[Strait2thecup]

I won't quote all of the responses on my post, so I'll just pick this last one and respond in general. I'll give you one of your specific responses... NYR don't have any elites in the pipeline. I agree. Neither do the Devils, though. Nico is nice, but not elite either. Past him, it's pretty ****ty. Actually, past the 1st line in general... the team is pretty ****ty.

When NJ didn't make the playoffs for 5 seasons in a row (and 6 out of 7) and I might gloat a bit about them missing the playoffs again (and again) I was told by Devils fans, every one of those seasons, it's because they were rebuilding.

When I said LL was ruining the team by not selling veterans and buying to try and make the 8th spot, I "knew nothing about the Devils and should worry about my own team." Now it's all Lou's fault... like I said.

Shero's first big picks were Zacha and McLeod... to the one that mentioned how tremendous Shero's drafting has been. Same guy thinks ROW is better than points and standings. But at the same time, NJ is supposed to be "rising" while NYR were always supposed to be bad this season. When does that whole "rising" thing start?

Other guy says Bratt, Wood, Butcher and Zacha are the building blocks of the future and "at least they produce." lol Good luck with that. I'll take NYR prospects and young players over that group any day. I'm open to a bet that Chytil will produce more next season, at age 20, than any of those mentioned. I'm feeling pretty good that Kravtsov will also be better than any of those great NJ building blocks.

Again... Nico is nice but the rest? Butcher is no better than Pionk... and that's not very good and not even someone I'd bring into the discussion. Bratt is Hagelin 2.0... gonna be a decent NHL player. Zacha is trash... I think any sensible NJD fan would agree there. Wood is a nice bottom 6 type... I'll give you that. I wouldn't kick him off my team with his speed and grit but wouldn't be depending on him to be a big cup competitive piece of the puzzle. It's pretty hard to get excited about the potential of anyone else in the system after Ty Smith and maybe Joey Anderson.

I doubt we will all agree on any of it, but I'm pretty confident that the NYR will be the better team in the next 3-5 years. You NJ fans better start praying Hall resigns, because if he leaves it's going to be a complete **** show in a couple seasons.

If nico doesn’t have elite potential to you than chytil an Andersen must have the upside of dog shit

 

[NYR713]

Shero isn’t the reason we took zacha... he let conte handle the draft. I don’t know how many times that needs to be said. Also, Nico will be elite, he’s showing signs of it already. Right now I’d take bratt over Anderson ainec, and probably would have a tough time choosing between him and chytil. I can go on, but this is a Taylor Hall trade thread.

I know it’s been forever since the rags had a player of that quality (or kovalchuks, parises, Elias etc) because every major free agent signing they’ve made recently busted (shattenkirk, Nash, Richards, gaborik etc)

But don’t derail the thread.

You guys have excuses for everything haha

I never derailed the thread. My original post in the thread was Hall should go nowhere and I'm rooting for NJD to be better than they've been because I don't want to see them near the draft lottery. Your NJD fan brethren took it off the rails from there.

 

[Newsworthy]

I'm a NYR fan rooting for Devils to be better. I don't want those lucky bastards anywhere near the higher percentages of the lottery.

Hall needs to stay and Shero needs to buy. Start that whole "Rise" thing they've been talking about for a calendar year now.

So basically do what the Rangers have done for the past 25 years.
I don't remember if the N YR have ever drafted first overall.
Even now I don't see it. They will just continue to flounder but won't be bad enough to get there. NYC fickle fans won't tolerate the Rangers being one of the worst teams in the league.

 

[My3Sons]

The Hall benching is in the rear view mirror. The team has moved out of the basement and even extended the head coach. It is likely a seller at the deadline but the circumstances that created this thread no longer exist. It seems to be degenerating into a rant about things other than trades to change the team’s fortunes. The thread should be closed since it has outlived its purpose.

 

[BudBundy]

This thread was overblown from the second it was created. It was purely to give irrational Hall haters a place to vent their spleen, or for other teams fans to fantasize about picking Hall up “on the cheap.” He is a top flight player by any measure, and the Devils are lucky to have him. The Devils are too thin to do anything significant any time soon, but that is another story.

 

[Smitty426]

The Hall benching is in the rear view mirror. The team has moved out of the basement and even extended the head coach. It is likely a seller at the deadline but the circumstances that created this thread no longer exist. It seems to be degenerating into a rant about things other than trades to change the team’s fortunes. The thread should be closed since it has outlived its purpose.

Well said!

 

[Pens x]

Lol at John Hynes getting an extension.

 

[Liferleafer]

Lol at John Hynes getting an extension.

Hit him with the HYYY-EEEN!

 

[My3Sons]

Lol at John Hynes getting an extension.

Thanks for making my point for me. Time to close this thread.

 

[Pens x]

One of the main reasons Shero was fired is because he kept Bylsma around too long; maybe we are seeing this in New Jersey too?

 

[JT Kreider]

So basically do what the Rangers have done for the past 25 years.
I don't remember if the N YR have ever drafted first overall.
Even now I don't see it. They will just continue to flounder but won't be bad enough to get there. NYC fickle fans won't tolerate the Rangers being one of the worst teams in the league.

All Rangers fans I know are fully on board for what is going to happen the next few years.

And Rangers games will still be a hot ticket either way for business executives taking potential clients out for a night on the town or people who barely follow hockey and are trying to impress their friends with sick seats and the entirety of their hockey knowledge is "Yeah! The goalie #30, I've heard of him before!"

The Rangers are barely a year into the rebuild and just compare the state of the franchise to say when we got blasted by the Penguins in the first round in 2016. We had an aging core with bad contracts, no cap space and no prospect pool.

We are about to have our first top 5 pick in over 20 years and already have a top 10 young core. I for one am excited for about what is going to come.

 

[Neutrinos]

Could San Jose put together a tempting offer?

 

[belair]

Could San Jose put together a tempting offer?

You're already paying Evander Kane $7m a year for a long time.

 

[Fourier]

Jersey has the cap space to resign Hall even at $10M. He did say that his primary consideration would be winning. But even so player tend to stay put if the money is on the table and he seem tp like the NY area.

(Note: Of course Hall has one more year left so my comment about why it has not been done was removed. )