GDT: TankTown Express to Pittsburgh

[AjaxManifesto]

I think this team lacks a core group of proud players who hold things together.

Backes could do that. Steen could do that. Perron could probably do that.

The guys we have are stuck in their own little worlds. I can't see this getting better. I think you have to do a major overhaul. I mean MAJOR. I've never seen a team this listless and fragile. It's embarrasing.

 

[TheDizee]

Binnington is more of a head case than Allen ever was. He's also a substandard goalie. Of all of DA's bad contracts, Binnington is the worst.

Kyrou's will top that. But I think Krug and Lehtera's will also be contenders.

 

[Majorityof1]

Binnington ranks 51st in goals saved above expected. Greiss ranks 55th. They're each middle of the pack in low danger save percentage and medium danger save percentage, but are absolutely awful at high danger chances. Same story for Binnington last year. With a good defensive team in front of him, Binnington is a very good goalie because he stops low and medium danger chances pretty well, but when a team is letting up lots of high danger chances like ours does, he's going to get shelled because high danger chances obviously go in more often AND it's an area of weakness for him. Husso was so successful for much of the year last year because for most of the year he was top 5 in that category and finished at 10th after a slide at the end of the year. He's again 10th among starters this year.

Just for a laugh, Cal Peterson has the worst high danger save percentage at just .313, which is unspeakably bad. Binnington, who struggles in this area, has a .630. The Vezina frontrunner, Hellebuyck, has a .786. It's almost impossible for Peterson to have that bad of a high danger percentage. Peterson has a .922 on medium danger chances, second in the entire league. He just cannot make a big stop. It's impossible for him this year.

I am fairly neutral on Binnington. I hate his antics with throwing water bottles, bench drive buys after getting pulled, etc. I think he is a good but inconsistent goalie. I say all that to say I don't really have a bias toward him. But I still give him a pass for the poor stats. All of those stats listed are based solely on where the shot came from with no weight given to quality of the shot or how they were set up. Binnington has seen way, way too many cross ice pass tap ins that no goalie is stopping. No goalie is seeing that many because no other D allows that many. Binnington is seeing a ton of shots that deflect off his own defenders. He is being straight interfered with by his own defenders.

Look at tonight's goals:

#1 - Wide open guy gets a cross crease pass right on the doorstep.
#2 - Rosen pulls Binnington's stick out of his hands while the shot is being made.
#3 - This was a 2-for-1 special. Cross crease pass to a guy wide open in the low slot AND Faulk falls down and bumps Binnington slightly.
#4 - Wide open guy in the slot and a screen by Krug

#4 was the only one he can be blamed, really at all for and that is a tough shot to stop with a screen. #1-3 no goalie is stopping consistently. I'd love if he was stepping up and making more big saves for how much he is paid. But he is far down on the list of problems with this team.

And even though it was on Griess, #5 was a cross crease pass to a wide open guy on the door step as well.

 

[GoldenSeal]

I am fairly neutral on Binnington. I hate his antics with throwing water bottles, bench drive buys after getting pulled, etc. I think he is a good but inconsistent goalie. I say all that to say I don't really have a bias toward him. But I still give him a pass for the poor stats. All of those stats listed are based solely on where the shot came from with no weight given to quality of the shot or how they were set up. Binnington has seen way, way too many cross ice pass tap ins that no goalie is stopping. No goalie is seeing that many because no other D allows that many. Binnington is seeing a ton of shots that deflect off his own defenders. He is being straight interfered with by his own defenders.

Look at tonight's goals:

#1 - Wide open guy gets a cross crease pass right on the doorstep.
#2 - Rosen pulls Binnington's stick out of his hands while the shot is being made.
#3 - This was a 2-for-1 special. Cross crease pass to a guy wide open in the low slot AND Faulk falls down and bumps Binnington slightly.
#4 - Wide open guy in the slot and a screen by Krug

#4 was the only one he can be blamed, really at all for and that is a tough shot to stop with a screen. #1-3 no goalie is stopping consistently. I'd love if he was stepping up and making more big saves for how much he is paid. But he is far down on the list of problems with this team.

And even though it was on Griess, #5 was a cross crease pass to a wide open guy on the door step as well.

This all day, everyday. How do you blame your goalie when he's dealing with your opponent AND his own team setting him up to fail?

 

[TheDizee]

did not watch a minute tonight but saw binner had another meltdown. looks like hes ready to collapse now as well. also saw ROR -3 and Krug -2. If you want to scratch 2 names for a wake up call, those are who I start with.

Anyways I would not fire Berube. He is not the problem. It is a roster issue mainly due to Armstrong being a clown and a leadership issue with the core.

 

[DoubleK81]

^^^^^^ What Golden and Majority said. Binnington has been getting hosed by his own team all year. I don't even particularly care that he acts a fool, I would be too if the guys in front of me were shitting all over me game in and out.

 

[TruBlu]

Lol at people giving binnington a pass when he's been pulled mid game several times this year. Defend him all you want. He's a HUGE part of the problem.

 

[TruBlu]

Binnington is a complete head case. He's got a shit team in front of him, but he can't even stop 9 out of 10 shots from going in. This is what happens when you give a guy a contract because he was in goal when you won a cup. His numbers have dropped every single year.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Next GDT is going to have 5 times as many trains because someone got upset that I put a train picture in this. Lol

 

[Majorityof1]

Lol at people giving binnington a pass when he's been pulled mid game several times this year. Defend him all you want. He's a HUGE part of the problem.

Being pulled isn't always an indictment of the goalie's play. Sometimes it is to motivate the team playing like crap in front of him, and sometimes its to protect the goalie's stats/confidence from a shelling because of the team's play in front of him.

Which goal tonight, a game he was pulled, was a bad goal for a goalie to give up?

 

[TruBlu]

Being pulled isn't always an indictment of the goalie's play. Sometimes it is to motivate the team playing like crap in front of him, and sometimes its to protect the goalie's stats/confidence from a shelling because of the team's play in front of him.

Which goal tonight, a game he was pulled, was a bad goal for a goalie to give up?

Any/all of them. Binnington is not some super goalie. He's not the worst in the league, but it's December and he's carrying less than a .900 save percentage. Even worse teams defensively (Montreal) have goalies with better stats. Add to it that his antics hurt the team with penalties and it's even worse. Defend him if you wish, but he's declined every year here. I'm done with him.

 

[DoubleK81]

Lol at people giving binnington a pass when he's been pulled mid game several times this year. Defend him all you want. He's a HUGE part of the problem.

Binnington is a complete head case. He's got a shit team in front of him, but he can't even stop 9 out of 10 shots from going in. This is what happens when you give a guy a contract because he was in goal when you won a cup. His numbers have dropped every single year.

Any/all of them. Binnington is not some super goalie. He's not the worst in the league, but it's December and he's carrying less than a .900 save percentage. Even worse teams defensively (Montreal) have goalies with better stats. Add to it that his antics hurt the team with penalties and it's even worse. Defend him if you wish, but he's declined every year here. I'm done with him.

Do you even watch the games to see the goals that get scored against us?

 

[TruBlu]

Do you even watch the games to see the goals that get scored against us?

I do. Do you?

 

[Majorityof1]

Any/all of them. Binnington is not some super goalie. He's not the worst in the league, but it's December and he's carrying less than a .900 save percentage. Even worse teams defensively (Montreal) have goalies with better stats. Add to it that his antics hurt the team with penalties and it's even worse. Defend him if you wish, but he's declined every year here. I'm done with him.

I don't think he is some super goalie either. I specifically said he is a good but inconsistent goalie. I also hate his antics and those need to stop. I wasn't talking about that. I was talking about his play in net. If you really think he should have stopped a shot going to his glove hand while his stick was being ripped out of his other hand in the opposite direction, than you have 0 objectivity on the question. Your dislike of Binnington is fueling your argument.

By what metric are you judging our d vs Montreal? We are dead even with Montreal in xGA/60, tied for 8th worst in the league with 3rd-8th all really close. We give up more ever so slightly more HDCA/60 than Montreal and are 6th worst in the league. So by what standard do we play better team D than Montreal?

Also, as I stated, those stats don't account for the nature of the high danger chances. The ones we give up are ridiculously high danger. Maybe Montreal does as well. I haven't watched a second of them this year. But I'd be fairly comfortable betting Binnington has had tougher work than Allen if there was an objective measure that accounted for all the factors to determine the winner.

 

[BadgersandBlues]

Binnington ranks 51st in goals saved above expected. Greiss ranks 55th. They're each middle of the pack in low danger save percentage and medium danger save percentage, but are absolutely awful at high danger chances. Same story for Binnington last year. With a good defensive team in front of him, Binnington is a very good goalie because he stops low and medium danger chances pretty well, but when a team is letting up lots of high danger chances like ours does, he's going to get shelled because high danger chances obviously go in more often AND it's an area of weakness for him. Husso was so successful for much of the year last year because for most of the year he was top 5 in that category and finished at 10th after a slide at the end of the year. He's again 10th among starters this year.

Just for a laugh, Cal Peterson has the worst high danger save percentage at just .313, which is unspeakably bad. Binnington, who struggles in this area, has a .630. The Vezina frontrunner, Hellebuyck, has a .786. It's almost impossible for Peterson to have that bad of a high danger percentage. Peterson has a .922 on medium danger chances, second in the entire league. He just cannot make a big stop. It's impossible for him this year.

I've written the same type of thing many times over the last few years on these boards. Binny is a solid, but not spectacular, goalie. He makes the saves he's supposed to make and maybe a couple he probably shouldn't. But he's not Felix Potvin or CuJo, pulling crazy saves out of his ass all the time thanks to exceptional athleticism. That's never been his game. With a good defense in front of him, he's a Stanley Cup caliber goalie. With a D like ours, he's completely exposed. He comes out and challenges the shooter well, he stays on his angles well. He stays "quiet." But none of that matters if every time he goes out to challenge a shooter, there's some backdoor or cross ice pass that ends up in the back of the net b/c our team just doesn't seem to understand how to defend passing lanes.

 

[Robb_K]

Based on the score and the posts I've read, I'm not sorry I missed this game because of a family get-together. I'm not much interested in watching the replay. I'll just move on to the next game, as will The Blues. Let's hope they start playing better. How did Bitten look?

 

[GoldenSeal]

Lol at people giving binnington a pass when he's been pulled mid game several times this year. Defend him all you want. He's a HUGE part of the problem.

Chief loves pulling the goalie. >_>

 

[HaNotsri]

Dude. I'm just trying to have fun during a pretty awful year and trying to get other people to laugh a bit at the same time.

My post wasn't serious but my expectation for you guys is still to sip on an ol' fashioned and chill. Soaring on the high notes of past success.

 

[Reality Czech]

Binnington is a complete head case. He's got a shit team in front of him, but he can't even stop 9 out of 10 shots from going in. This is what happens when you give a guy a contract because he was in goal when you won a cup. His numbers have dropped every single year.

Relying solely on numbers to judge a goalie is foolish, according to Wayne Gretzky and many others. How many soft goals has he let in this year? I can't think of that many. His numbers are so low because the team has given up so many high danger chances, and anyone who has watched the games can see that. We've given up a ton of PP goals and garbage time goals when the game was already over, but he has been pretty good in games where the Blues were actually competitive.

I'm not the biggest fan of Binnington's antics between the whistles, but at least he's showing some heart and getting pissed off when the team is sucking. He's one of the few guys who's actually shown that he has a pulse this season, and I don't think he's in my top ten concerns about the team this year. Acting like Binnington is the problem is pretty silly if you ask me, but I guess you are committed at this point. Marty Brodeur in his prime couldn't save this team with the way they are playing.

Binnington would be perfectly fine if he was playing behind a competent NHL team, but I would get pissed off too if my team hung me out to dry like that night after night. I'd say he's been one of our two best players this year (with Buchnevich), despite his numbers. Not that they have had much competition.

 

[TruBlu]

These aren't the days when when we had an opposing team putting 40-50 sog and our goalie was getting rung for 5 goals. He gave up 4 goals on 17 shots. It's a trend. Not only that, but his antics put his backup and team at a further disadvantage. Throw all the advanced stats out there you want. Binny is a huge part of the problem.

 

[Reality Czech]

These aren't the days when when we had an opposing team putting 40-50 sog and our goalie was getting rung for 5 goals. He gave up 4 goals on 17 shots. It's a trend. Not only that, but his antics put his backup and team at a further disadvantage. Throw all the advanced stats out there you want. Binny is a huge part of the problem.

The only goal he had any chance on was the fourth one and Krug was standing directly in front of him. Not sure if he could even see the shooter. Pretty absurd to complain about goaltending when the team is failing at pretty much every aspect of the game, but you do you.

 

[TruBlu]

I've flat out admitted that the team in general is flawed. My issue is that every GDT reads the same. "Binny had no chance, he was hung out to dry, etc." It's simply not true. Binny needs to take accountability for the fact that his numbers have dropped every single year. Throwing temper tantrums is not the way to do it.

 

[Reality Czech]

I've flat out admitted that the team in general is flawed. My issue is that every GDT reads the same. "Binny had no chance, he was hung out to dry, etc." It's simply not true. Binny needs to take accountability for the fact that his numbers have dropped every single year. Throwing temper tantrums is not the way to do it.

I agree he needs to keep his cool. He's just embarrassing the team and himself with these little outbursts. But if Binnington deserved to be called out, then I would do it. If he was letting in soft goals left and right then it would be hard to defend him, but that's not the case this year.

All stats require context. Expecting him to match his numbers from his rookie year is unrealistic. Since then there have been times where he looked good and other times when he looked horrible, but I can't think of any losses this season that I would put solely on Binnington. But whatever, agree to disagree I guess.

 

[TK 421]

My post wasn't serious but my expectation for you guys is still to sip on an ol' fashioned and chill. Soaring on the high notes of past success.

But....we want to ride the train to tank town. Choo choo.....

Besides last time I sipped on ol' fashioned's I ended up passed out on my saunas' front porch with a imprint of wood grain on my cheek. Never let family members from Wisconsin mix your drinks, they are like 30% alcohol by volume. And the drinks they make are strong too.

 

[PJJJP]

At least Tarasenko is doing his job in raising his trade value