Post-Game Talk: Tampa Bay @ Toronto | Part II

[RootinTootinPookin*]

Marner will not make it to game 10.

Babcock will have lost a lot of fan support at end of season.

Andersen will be run out of town.

Rielly will have lost a lot of fan support at end of season.

Gardiner will be looked on as a joke and trade bait.

JvR will be viewed as lazy with no compete.

Leafs will be drafting top 3.

 

[Doug Gilmour]

This was hard to watch tonight. Their defensive zone play was atrocious. I have always tried to defend Gardiner but I can't anymore, it's cringeworthy when he gets the puck. Hunwick had some good moments and some bad moments that outweighed the good. #FreeFrankie

Again, Matthews/Nylander/Hyman was the best line out there. Great job guys, keep it up.

 

[LeafingTheWay]

I've been doing some thinking:
Kadri seems to be fast while skating on the forecheck but as a defensive C, he slows down greatly to make sure he doesn't get caught out of position. What would he look like as a future W? We all want a high-skilled, aggressive, puck-retrieving winger for Matthews, so what if we put Kadri there?

Next year:
Kadri - Matthews - Marner (All the tools and perfect combo for success).
JVR - Nylander - Kapanen (Nylander becomes a natural C and commands his own line)
Johnson - Bozak - Soshnikov/Brown (Johnson and Soshnikov/Brown make up the high-skilled scoring 3rd line).
Martin - Komarov - Hymen (An actual forechecking 4th line like the Clutterbuck-Czikas-Martin line in NYI)

Leivo and one of Soshnikov/Brown traded in a package with others for another player.

 

[LeafingTheWay]

This was hard to watch tonight. Their defensive zone play was atrocious. I have always tried to defend Gardiner but I can't anymore, it's cringeworthy when he gets the puck. Hunwick had some good moments and some bad moments that outweighed the good. #FreeFrankie

Again, Matthews/Nylander/Hyman was the best line out there. Great job guys, keep it up.

I counted twice he messed up (twice to the point for an easy shot to the net).
But other than that he's had great plays but looked weird as always with his scary skating. He was on for 1 goal against though.

I have a feeling though that the fanbase on here will be a lot more supportive of Gardiner, Rielly, Marincin once we win games and Andersen plays at least decent.

 

[orbiter11]

We where supposed to do a normal rebuild and everyone was on board with that but where management ****ed up was trying to rush the rebuild and signing andersen long term. Now they mind ****ed everyone and no one knows what the teams goals are now. I blame management for getting antsy and not keeping true to the rebuild

I kind of agree with this. Shanny sold me on the rebuild and although im not going to agree with every decision they make, I just want them to be practical and non rushed. So we trade a 1st a 2nd and a goalie with the same numbers (on the worse team in the league) who had one bad 10 game stretch in a tank year ? Then we give the new goalie a 5 yr contract. Also why waive Michalek when our team on the ice was playing the best hockey in years just to tinker.... Our Ds not complete dont mess with the offense if its working.

 

[Magic Man]

I've been doing some thinking:
Kadri seems to be fast while skating on the forecheck but as a defensive C, he slows down greatly to make sure he doesn't get caught out of position. What would he look like as a future W? We all want a high-skilled, aggressive, puck-retrieving winger for Matthews, so what if we put Kadri there?

Next year:
Kadri - Matthews - Marner (All the tools and perfect combo for success).
JVR - Nylander - Kapanen (Nylander becomes a natural C and commands his own line)
Johnson - Bozak - Soshnikov/Brown (Johnson and Soshnikov/Brown make up the high-skilled scoring 3rd line).
Martin - Komarov - Hymen (An actual forechecking 4th line like the Clutterbuck-Czikas-Martin line in NYI)

Leivo and one of Soshnikov/Brown traded in a package with others for another player.

I like the Kadri idea. I'd keep Nylander with Matthews though.

Kadri - Matthews - Nylander
JVR - Marner - Kapanen
Soshnikov - Komarov - Brown
Leipsic - Hyman - Martin

 

[rrc1967]

makes you wonder where this team will be when the dog days of the season hit the rookies and they stop playing with jacked up adrenaline and excitement, and teams start to focus in on the leafs a little bit more seriously and game tapes get out there and dissected more.

For rookies these are the gimmie games - it doesn't get any easier, and they are the only ones right now that are carrying the team along.

We could be in for a world of hurt if the systems don't stabilize and the goaltending takes it up a notch.

 

[rrc1967]

I kind of agree with this. Shanny sold me on the rebuild and although im not going to agree with every decision they make, I just want them to be practical and non rushed. So we trade a 1st a 2nd and a goalie with the same numbers (on the worse team in the league) who had one bad 10 game stretch in a tank year ?

Bernier was done. babcock simply didn't like him and wasn't going to play him.. and a bad 10 game stretch? yeah. okay.

 

[orbiter11]

Why touch the offense at all? Brown with Holland and Martin balanced out that line. Michalek was a bit slow but did fine on the Kadri CHECKING line. The d is the d (unless we make a move for a D man) our only hope on d this season was just steady goaltending.

 

[Bill Waters*]

I've been doing some thinking:
Kadri seems to be fast while skating on the forecheck but as a defensive C, he slows down greatly to make sure he doesn't get caught out of position. What would he look like as a future W? We all want a high-skilled, aggressive, puck-retrieving winger for Matthews, so what if we put Kadri there?

Next year:
Kadri - Matthews - Marner (All the tools and perfect combo for success).
JVR - Nylander - Kapanen (Nylander becomes a natural C and commands his own line)
Johnson - Bozak - Soshnikov/Brown (Johnson and Soshnikov/Brown make up the high-skilled scoring 3rd line).
Martin - Komarov - Hymen (An actual forechecking 4th line like the Clutterbuck-Czikas-Martin line in NYI)

Leivo and one of Soshnikov/Brown traded in a package with others for another player.

We are not breaking up Nylander and Matthews just because you want to give kadri the best chance to succeed.

 

[Liminality]

So I just got home, anyone care to do a quick recap of the game for me?

I see we outshot them quite a bit, did we outplay them? Was Andersen as bad as the stats show? Did Hunwick deserve the -3? I glad to see Matthews and Nylander continuing to dominate offensively but did they play well all game?

 

[orbiter11]

Bernier was done. babcock simply didn't like him and wasn't going to play him.. and a bad 10 game stretch? yeah. okay.

Maybe ill give you 15 games for Bernier, and yes he was atrocious but he bounced back to his old self at the end of the season. Its just startling how I had to live through 4 yrs of Reimer playing 15 atrocious games every season and people still wanted him to sign an extension ?? Must be a personality thing....

 

[RootinTootinPookin*]

Hyman-Matthews-Nylander
JvR-Bozak-Marner
Brown-Kadri-Komarov
Martin-Holland-Soshnikov

Hyman is replaceable provided you find a similar player with better offensive instincts. I would like a veteran on that line, but a legit vet.. not a Hunwick type.

Maybe try Joshua Leivo with Matthews and Nylander and bump Hyman down to Sosh's spot.

Holland is replaceable with a better competing, better defensive center.

Komarov has made himself expendable with his early play so far.


Rielly-Zaitzev
Gardiner-*
*Marinicin-Carrick/Valiev/Loov/Corrado

If the defense is going to suck, get rid of the veteran pylons (Polak, Hunwick). Rotate partners for Gardiner until one sticks, rotate bottom guys until a pair sticks.

The defense isn't working. It's time to make changes now. You have a goalie getting absolutely torn apart on the ice and off.

 

[The Examiner]

So I just got home, anyone care to do a quick recap of the game for me?

 

[LeafingTheWay]

I like the Kadri idea. I'd keep Nylander with Matthews though.

Kadri - Matthews - Nylander
JVR - Marner - Kapanen
Soshnikov - Komarov - Brown
Leipsic - Hyman - Martin

Agreed, I was thinking that too. I like the idea of Marner at C too but I was wondering how his face-off #s would look like, because apparently he wasn't that amazing at it in junior I think.
Also, how is Hyman on the draw? I know he does it on the PK but haven't looked at his numbers too much.

 

[LeafingTheWay]

We are not breaking up Nylander and Matthews just because you want to give kadri the best chance to succeed.

... Did you not see my reasoning though? Nylander doesn't have to be at C, he can be on the wing instead of Marner as well. I was putting it out there as a suggestion because the majority of fans on here agree that we need a much more skilled Hyman (I was thinking Soshnikov before would be a good option) and Kadri is just that (good defensively, good on the forecheck/puck-retrievals + skill). Kadri's not doing well at the draw either so it does make sense that him at W could be a possibility.

Next year:
Kadri - Matthews - Nylander
JVR - Marner - Kapanen
Johnson - Komarov/Bozak - Brown
Martin - Hyman - Soshnikov

^ That or:

Soshnikov - Matthews - Nylander
JVR - Kadri - Marner
Kapanen - Komarov/Bozak - Brown
Martin - Hyman - Brown

 

[The Examiner]

Hyman-Matthews-Nylander
JvR-Bozak-Marner
Brown-Kadri-Komarov
Martin-Holland-Soshnikov

Hyman is replaceable provided you find a similar player with better offensive instincts. I would like a veteran on that line, but a legit vet.. not a Hunwick type.

Maybe try Joshua Leivo with Matthews and Nylander and bump Hyman down to Sosh's spot.

Holland is replaceable with a better competing, better defensive center.

Komarov has made himself expendable with his early play so far.


Rielly-Zaitzev
Gardiner-*
*Marinicin-Carrick/Valiev/Loov/Corrado

If the defense is going to suck, get rid of the veteran pylons (Polak, Hunwick). Rotate partners for Gardiner until one sticks, rotate bottom guys until a pair sticks.

The defense isn't working. It's time to make changes now. You have a goalie getting absolutely torn apart on the ice and off.

This guy is probably not on anybody's radar but I think Justin Holl would be a perfect partner for Jake. He was great with Brennan last year and Jake isn't even close to being as bad defensively as TJ was. He's RHD with size, he can skate and, although not the most physical, he gets the job done. He's also 24, so, even though it would be his first year, he is a little more mature. He's also waiver exempt.

Of course, this means that one of the current defenceman would need waivers. Hunwick should be that guy but we all know Babcock ain't sending him nowhere.

 

[The Examiner]

... Did you not see my reasoning though? Nylander doesn't have to be at C, he can be on the wing instead of Marner as well. I was putting it out there as a suggestion because the majority of fans on here agree that we need a much more skilled Hyman (I was thinking Soshnikov before would be a good option) and Kadri is just that (good defensively, good on the forecheck/puck-retrievals + skill). Kadri's not doing well at the draw either so it does make sense that him at W could be a possibility.

Next year:
Kadri - Matthews - Nylander
JVR - Marner - Kapanen
Johnson - Komarov/Bozak - Brown
Martin - Hyman - Soshnikov

^ That or:

Soshnikov - Matthews - Nylander
JVR - Kadri - Marner
Kapanen - Komarov/Bozak - Brown
Martin - Hyman - Brown

IMO, if they're moving Hyman off of that line then Leivo should be his replacement.

Also, as much as I love Brown, I think it would be over kill having him on the 3rd AND 4th line.

 

[Daisy Jane]

So I just got home, anyone care to do a quick recap of the game for me?

I see we outshot them quite a bit, did we outplay them? Was Andersen as bad as the stats show? Did Hunwick deserve the -3? I glad to see Matthews and Nylander continuing to dominate offensively but did they play well all game?

we simply weren't ready in the first period - as yo'd expect playing a cup contending team. Stamkos scored early (after boarding a player - no call), then Matthews turned it over (really bad) and then it was a weird goal that was let in.

then there was a MUFFIN of a 2nd goal. just brutal

Stamkos clapper for the third, bar, down, no chance.

Second period JVR had a great chance on a break away gets hauled down, but we only get the PP, no dice.

Hedman shoots on Andy - great save, Hedman tries again, and scores, 4-0.

Nylander gets a Powerplay goal, near the end of the period.

sidenote: bishop gets hit with the puck and can now go as Bobby Clarke for Halloween.

Third period.
Kucherov goal

Matthews Goal, JVR goal, within minutes and you think we've got a chance

Mitch high stick, games over, 2 PP goals, we lost 7-3. so we poured it on in the end - some of the goals Freddy should have had, but again LOTS of defensive break downs (FROM EVERYONE). Rielly does not look good. Naz had a decent game. PP was good, PK was okay until the 4minute powerplay, and now we play Florida.

 

[Dustin]

IMO, if they're moving Hyman off of that line then Leivo should be his replacement.

Also, as much as I love Brown, I think it would be over kill having him on the 3rd AND 4th line.

Watched the whole game and the game in six. Daisy sums it up pretty well. Honestly just felt like a playoff team vs a lottery team and what made it worse is that the playoff team really showed up to play.

 

[KingJoffrey]

Shots on goal are bad indigator. Despite Leafs outshot tampa, but they did give up more legit scoring chances than them.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Mathews and Nylander still killing it.

 

[Leaftors]

babcock "theres going to be pain"
every leafs fan " its fine, your the best coach ever, cant wait to win one day, we'll be patient"

-pain arrives-
babcock "i literally told you this would happen"

every leafs fan " team is trash, babcock sucks, anderson sucks, trade everyone, fire babcock!!"

classic

 

[LeafingTheWay]

IMO, if they're moving Hyman off of that line then Leivo should be his replacement.

Also, as much as I love Brown, I think it would be over kill having him on the 3rd AND 4th line.

I was thinking more along the lines of a Marchand/Simmonds type of player (great defensively + high energy + aggressive/pain-in-the-*** + high skill) and I thought Soshnikov/Kadri would fit that role really well. I do want to see Leivo in the lineup but I don't know if he'll be able to beat out Kapanen/Soshnikov/Johnson/Brown/Hyman for a spot.

And my bad lol. There's no way I put Brown on the 4th line.

I totally forgot, Griffith needs to be in there too! Griffith/Soshnikov/Brown/Leivo are 4 guys this year that I hope will get a chance to rise to the occasion, surprise us and land a full-time spot.

 

[Vandalay Industries]

Can you seriously blame Andersen for ALL 7 goals?!
Goal #1 - partial breakaway that Stamkos actually los tthe puck but Hunwick knocked it in over a sprawled Andersen. (Not Freddie's fault)
Goal #2 - shot from the point with a screen in front, should have been able to squeeze and hold it but it squeaked through and Killorn tapped it in (bad goal by freddie but also a bad box out by Polak)
Goal #3 - a rocket one-timer that went Bar Down from one of the best shooters in the game (a nice shot not a bad goal)
Goal #4 - Immediately after a spectacular save, a cross crease pass is deflected by Rielly's skate on goal and Andersen made a good save but could not control the rebound as Hedman tapped it in. (Hard to blame Andersen for that)
Goal #5 - Hunwick played kucherov softly, chased Stamkos behind the net and then an unfortunate bounce when Stamkos tried to throw a pass in front that went directly to Kucherov where Andersen and most other thought the past was going to the slot. That gave Kucherov the extra second or two to fire it before Andersen could get over. (Not Andersen's fault)
Goal #6 - penalty kill and Polak AND Hunwick let Namestnikov stand in front untouched to screen Andersen and tap in the rebound. (While Andersen could have possibly stopped the initial shot, Namestnikov screening did not help and being alone Freddie had no chance on the rebound)
Goal #7 - there were too many possibilities on that 3-on-1 to solely blame Andersen Drouin could have passed it, shot low for a rebound, or just try to beat Andersen by a deke or shot. Obviously, Drouin chose the last option and fired a slap shot short side top corner. Would it have been nice to get a save there? Absolutely, but that does not mean I blame Andersen for letting it in.

This is where it all goes wrong. I don't agree with all these judgements, but it doesn't even matter.

It's not about breaking down how many of the goals was his fault, it's about how much he is letting in in general.

Bishop had even more big chances against him in the other end of the ice and managed to make the key saves.

It might be a good shot by Stamkos, Drouin and the others, but no matter how good the shots are, we still expect a goalie to perform better. Make some of the same saves as Bishop and lesser goalies. It's not like he is getting breakaways and 2-on-1's against him numerous times each game, he just doesn't make nearly enough real saves so far.

I'm still giving him much more patience, but I just don't agree at all with this way of breaking it down.