Sportsnet: Talking Calder last night.

[Mess]

Zach Werenski would get my vote if the vote were today. Laine won't win it.

People keep forgetting Pens goalie Matt Murray who is also a rookie and might finish in the final 3 for the Calder voting.

I had him in my preseason list as a contender, but Matthews was my favourite.

I thought this was going to be between Matthews, Vesey and Murray as final 3 with Laine & others as honourable mention. Werenski is the biggest current surprise at his success as I thought Provorov would be the rookie points among dmen not counting Zaitsev who is 25.

 

[doorman]

I was around already when Davey Keon was winning the Calder in 1961.

So I'm very excited by the fact Leafs have 3 contenders for the Calder this year.

I suddenly feel younger, lol

 

[Jozay]

I actually think Werenski deserves it.

 

[613Leafer]

Werenski actually is the standout performer at the moment.

Matthews has been far far better than Laine, dsspite the similar point totals.

Werenski and its not even close ATM. Like not even close.

I agree, but there seems to be a general bias in favour of forwards when it comes to the Calder and Hart trophies. I think most people are just more excited by forwards and the guys that get THE most points. Defensemen have only won the Calder 11 times in ~83 years whereas forwards have won it ~55 times.

But IMO you should look at how a player does relative to other rookies of his position. A rookie dman putting up ~50+ points is more rare than a rookie forward putting up ~65+ points, and thus IMO more impressive.

 

[613Leafer]

People keep forgetting Pens goalie Matt Murray who is also a rookie and might finish in the final 3 for the Calder voting.

Murray is a very legitimate contender, IF he plays enough games. You shouldn't win it as the back-up goalie, he needs to steal the starting role and finish with ~45+ games IMO to really be considered.

As it stands right now, I'd rank them:

Werenski
Marner
Laine

With Murray as a guy who would be in there based on his stats, if he was currently at like ~12 games instead of 7.

Marner I just think really drives his line, and is very defensively polished relative to what was expected. He's constantly back checking hard, picking peoples pockets, etc. Which is why I have him ahead of Laine and Matthews.

 

[Mess]

I thought the panel was right that Leafs rookies might split the ballet and votes with Matthews, Marner and maybe even Nylander getting some individual votes.

If Matthews and Marner split votes it could make Laine the winner if he continues on his pace or Werenski continues to impress.

 

[SnazzyNazzy]

Come on now... Be real neither Marner nor Matthews would win the Calder today. Although at the end of the day I think it'll be Matthews/Marner, Murray, Werenski in no order. That would be a neat vote.

 

[doorman]

Murray is a very legitimate contender, IF he plays enough games. You shouldn't win it as the back-up goalie, he needs to steal the starting role and finish with ~45+ games IMO to really be considered.

As it stands right now, I'd rank them:

Werenski
Marner
Laine

With Murray as a guy who would be in there based on his stats, if he was currently at like ~12 games instead of 7.

Marner I just think really drives his line, and is very defensively polished relative to what was expected. He's constantly back checking hard, picking peoples pockets, etc. Which is why I have him ahead of Laine and Matthews.

Murray's totals are only low because he was injured (broken hand) at the World Cup otherwise he is the Pens starter.

 

[IBeL34f]

I thought the panel was right that Leafs rookies might split the ballet and votes with Matthews, Marner and maybe even Nylander getting some individual votes.

If Matthews and Marner split votes it could make Laine the winner if he continues on his pace or Werenski continues to impress.

They tier their votes, don't they? Meaning they place multiple players in a ranked position (1st, 2nd, 3rd) rather than just choosing who they think deserves to win the trophy?

If that's the case, I wouldn't worry too much about split votes between Leafs players being an issue.

 

[pgk]

Marner has been the better complete player. Analysts know this. But if they say laine and werenski they drive page clicks from angry leaf fans

 

[HespelerGreenFlash]

At the end of the day, I don't care who wins the Calder. Laine is definitely ahead right now based on his two hattricks but I have no doubt Matthews will be the better pro when all is said and done. Even if he does win the Calder, and wins the Richard next year, I still take Matthews everyday of the week.

My recommendation is to be happy we have great young talent to build our team around, and don't pay much attention to Leafs bias/anti-bias.

Sooooo, if Laine wins the Calder and then has 55 goals and wins the Richard you would still take Matthews even if he has 25 to Laine 's 55? Hmmmm

Nice thinking there skippy

 

[zeke]

Laine is on pace for a 45gl/67pt season.

Matthews is on pace for a 33gl/66pt season.

Laine's shooting percentage and on ice shooting percentage are unsustainably high, Matthews' shooting percentage and on ice shooting percentage are unsustainably low.

 

[BayStreetBully]

Sooooo, if Laine wins the Calder and then has 55 goals and wins the Richard you would still take Matthews even if he has 25 to Laine 's 55? Hmmmm

Nice thinking there skippy

Yes.

 

[al secord]

Sooooo, if Laine wins the Calder and then has 55 goals and wins the Richard you would still take Matthews even if he has 25 to Laine 's 55? Hmmmm

Nice thinking there skippy

All day everyday....Jif.

 

[613Leafer]

Sooooo, if Laine wins the Calder and then has 55 goals and wins the Richard you would still take Matthews even if he has 25 to Laine 's 55? Hmmmm

Nice thinking there skippy

How many Cups do the last 10 Rocket Richard winners have vs the last 10 Selke winners?

I'll take the two-way centre with ~Kopitar/Toews potential over a potential elite goal scoring winger.

 

[nuck]

NHL Goal Leaders

1) Crosby .... 14
2) Laine ..... 12
2) OV ......... 12

NHL Rookie scoring leaders

1) Laine ....... 18
2) Matthews .. 16
2) Marner ...... 16

The panel simply picked the leader at the moment and Laine has 2 X hattricks already.

My money is on Matthews before this done.

True. A hatrick by Matthews next game and it all changes. I think it was "if they were voting today" so Laine looks like he makes sense. I might pick Werenski as the 20 game Calder winner myself but using a crystal ball, he is at risk of being part of a CBJ decline before year end because they are likely playing way over their heads. If CBJ actually are a playoff club then Werenski has a good shot. He already looks better than Jones.

 

[Radomon]

It's not all about point totals. Matthews has to worry about things Laine doesn't, like winning faceoffs and being a good defensive centre. Playing at the wing with players like Scheifele and Wheeler is much easier than playing with two rookies and carrying the whole line. It's not even comparable. With that said, I couldn't care less if Sportsnet favors Laine ahead of Matthews, Marner or Nylander.

 

[Dustin]

I agree with others in the fact that I don't really care about the Calder. If one of our players wins it that would nice but it's really an icing on the cake kind of thing.

As for who my pick is, while I have not seen enough/any of certain players, the very fact that Werenski is close in points is pretty special. They were talking about how he QB's the PP which is both a positive and negative when only taking points into account. Does anyone know about his usage beyond the PP?

Besides if a Leaf player does win I can see HF talking about how the Leafs stacked the deck to win the Calder. Anti Leafers would be intolerable.

 

[BayStreetBully]

It's not all about point totals. Matthews has to worry about things Laine doesn't, like winning faceoffs and being a good defensive centre. Playing at the wing with players like Scheifele and Wheeler is much easier than playing with two rookies and carrying the whole line. It's not even comparable. With that said, I couldn't care less if Sportsnet favors Laine ahead of Matthews, Marner or Nylander.

I thought Matthews was great defensively last night.

And I loved how he fought for space to score his goals from in close. That's how he'll have to score when the games get tight. Hopefully he's internalizing what he has to do to be successful in this league.

Now that he has the monkey off his back, he can just continue to develop at his own pace without everyone breathing down his neck. The negative attention was stupid to begin with, but maybe they can give him a break now.

 

[666]

Laine won't be able to maintain his pace.
If Murray or Werenski maintain their pace it will be one of them, probably Murray.
Mathews has an outside chance if his slump is over and he doesn't have another one.
Put Marner on Matthews wing and one of the two of them win it for sure, probably Marner.

 

[Mess]

They tier their votes, don't they? Meaning they place multiple players in a ranked position (1st, 2nd, 3rd) rather than just choosing who they think deserves to win the trophy?

If that's the case, I wouldn't worry too much about split votes between Leafs players being an issue.

They tier their votes ranking players from 1 to 5 or even 10 with first votes added up at the end and 2nd and 3rds.

However if Darren Dreger votes Matthews and Pierre Lebrun votes Marner 1st for the Calder, so instead of 1 Leaf rookie get both votes they each get 1 1st place vote where Laine might 2 X 1st himself etc thus when they add up the points at the end the one with the most 1st place ones has the edge.

ie 1st place = 10 points, 2nd = 9 points, 3rd = 8 points etc

Ballot #1 (Matthews (10), Laine (9), Marner (8)
Ballot #2 (Marner (10), Laine (9), Matthews (8)
Ballot #3 (Laine (10), Matthews or Marner (9), Matthews or Marner (8)

Laine = 28 points, Matthews (27 or 26), Marner (27 or 26) .. Laine wins the Calder as Leafs rookies split the ballots.

It would be better if 1 Leaf rookie was much better then all the others to increase Leaf Calder odds.

 

[Xscout*]

Uhh.. reporters and media have votes for this award. .. sooo it's not something to be concerned with.
It's opinions, bias and them points tho.

Unless it's peer voted it's a joke.

@post 69 - the negativity really does get old doesn't it?

 

[666]

During his first season in Toronto in 1985-86, he scored 34 goals and 45 points while spending 227 minutes in the penalty box however he finished second in the rookie of the year voting for the Calder Trophy to Calgary defenseman Gary Suter.

Do you steal all of your posts?

from http://www.legendsofhockey.net/LegendsOfHockey/jsp/SearchPlayer.jsp?player=10273

"During his first season in Toronto in 1985-86, the coaching staff decided to move Clark to the left wing on a full-time basis. The change seemed to agree with him, as he scored 34 goals and 45 points while spending 227 minutes in the penalty box. He finished second in the rookie of the year voting for the Calder Trophy to Calgary defenseman Gary Suter."

 

[LaPlante94]

If Werenski keeps this up all season he'll easily deserve it.

 

[Liminality]

If Werenski keeps this up all season he'll easily deserve it.

That's a very big if and if he does he probably wins the Norris too.