Management Sweeney/Neely-Grade offseason moves

[LouJersey]

So I’m guessing Rask and Thomas weren’t as good as we thought they were because of the defense they played behind? Or do we just discount goalies on other teams?

 

[BruinDust]

So I’m guessing Rask and Thomas weren’t as good as we thought they were because of the defense they played behind? Or do we just discount goalies on other teams?

The Bruins style and ability to defend absolutely had an impact on Rask's and Thomas's numbers. No question about it. Same as any goaltender that seems to play for Barry Trotz lately. You can count on their numbers being inflated.

Doesn't make them bad goaltenders or products of the system. No chance Vladar does here what he's been doing in Calgary. Him and Markstrom have basically identical numbers, which says more about the team defense in front of them than it does them.

But Dan Vladar is a solid goaltender. So are the two guys currently in Boston. It's too bad he didn't really show it last year or else they may of made a different decision.

 

[arider1990]

The issue with all this goalie talk is the fact that there is zero guarantee that Rask will be back to his old self. Also there is a chance he could have a setback that could keep him out to March or April. That is like playing Poker and going all in on a hand that consists of a pair of 2s.

 

[EverettMike]

Yeah, just hold the fort until Jan or Feb. No problem at all.

Can you? You like our GM making trades from a position of weakness? Both rookies flame out now Sweeney got his fellow GMs tossing him anchors. The bolded sounds like something Pete Chiarelli would say.

If we can't do the smart thing because we think our GM can't handle adversity then what the f*** does it matter? We're f***ed anyway.

 

[TCB]

I agree with those who say the goaltending is the least of this clubs worries. There's a lot bigger issues and if those were addressed in the off-season, then maybe the goalie situation might be the number one issue but 15 games into a season, Im not ready to throw darts in that direction but if it does become a debacle, that's would be just another failure among the many made by Sweeney.

The offensive woes and the defensive core that's been here for two years and counting are all on Sweeney and the management team, its in black and white and for some reason Sweeney can't manage to fix it. Simply put he should be gone out the door, he's failed miserable and for some reason they keep giving him the shovel.

 

[BruinDust]

If we can't do the smart thing because we think our GM can't handle adversity then what the f*** does it matter? We're f***ed anyway.

Well Sweeney (and Neely) were here the year they went to camp with Blaine Lacher, Evgeni Ryabchikov and Vincent Riendeau. That wasn't smart then. Repeating it with Swayman, Vladar and a low-AAV/low-term veteran goaltender wouldn't of been terribly smart either.

But they may f***ed anyway as you said. Considering we have a GM who has never in his 6+ year career made a mid-season trade.

 

[LouJersey]

The Bruins style and ability to defend absolutely had an impact on Rask's and Thomas's numbers. No question about it. Same as any goaltender that seems to play for Barry Trotz lately. You can count on their numbers being inflated.

Doesn't make them bad goaltenders or products of the system. No chance Vladar does here what he's been doing in Calgary. Him and Markstrom have basically identical numbers, which says more about the team defense in front of them than it does them.

But Dan Vladar is a solid goaltender. So are the two guys currently in Boston. It's too bad he didn't really show it last year or else they may of made a different decision.

my point is when did the Flames defense become the 78-79 Canadiens? Their goalies are playing great as is their defense but let’s take it easy with the “well look at the defense Vladar is playing behind.” Really? Would you guys swap defenses straight up? Saying goodbye to Mac and Carlo and hello Noah and Rasmus. Can anyone honestly name the other four? I mean I can because I just looked it up. It’s ok to say there are other good players in the NHL, even ex Bruins. (Not meant for you, you get what I’m saying)

 

[Aussie Bruin]

my point is when did the Flames defense become the 78-79 Canadiens? Their goalies are playing great as is their defense but let’s take it easy with the “well look at the defense Vladar is playing behind.” Really? Would you guys swap defenses straight up? Saying goodbye to Mac and Carlo and hello Noah and Rasmus. Can anyone honestly name the other four? I mean I can because I just looked it up. It’s ok to say there are other good players in the NHL, even ex Bruins. (Not meant for you, you get what I’m saying)

If I could keep McAvoy instead of Andersson or Tanev, then otherwise yeah I take the Flames' D over ours every day of the week. Main reason is simple - all their guys are over 6 ft and can take care of business in their own end, and clearly their transition game is still fine even if they're not as mobile as some because Calgary are scoring plenty of goals. They're tough to play against and ours too often is not.

Still think you've got to give their goalies a lot of credit though - Markstrom is elite and Vladar has been doing a really good job especially in his last 3-4 games. Good defense helps but those guys are getting it done regardless.

 

[BruinDust]

my point is when did the Flames defense become the 78-79 Canadiens? Their goalies are playing great as is their defense but let’s take it easy with the “well look at the defense Vladar is playing behind.” Really? Would you guys swap defenses straight up? Saying goodbye to Mac and Carlo and hello Noah and Rasmus. Can anyone honestly name the other four? I mean I can because I just looked it up. It’s ok to say there are other good players in the NHL, even ex Bruins. (Not meant for you, you get what I’m saying)

I see it more as a total team defense, not just the two guys on the back-end. This is a team that just lost their captain and supposed best D-man.

Both Markstrom and Vladar had to play well to post those numbers. But look who is coaching them. Sutter came in late last season but really too late to salvage their year. But he got a sense of what he had. Their roster turnover was minimal, Giordano out and Coleman in the only significant changes. He had a full camp to implement his structure.

Sutter is among the best coaches in terms of team defense. He's right there with Trotz and Julien in that respect. He took a 29th ranked goal-scoring LA Kings in 2012 to a cup. And just to prove it was no fluke, he did it again two years later with the 25th ranked goal-scoring Kings in 2014.

Sutter wears thin with players eventually and his message goes by the wayside, as it did in 2015. But the man knows how to coach defensive structure, demands hard work and has proven he can get total buy-in during the earlier part of his coaching tenure with a new team. I think that is what we are seeing here with Calgary and I'm not trying to discredit either Flames goaltender. He's basically repeating what he did during the beginning of his time in LA in early 2012.

I think both guys are solid Tenders. Markstrom has been Top 10 for me since his final Vancouver season. And Vladar despite not great NHL numbers in Boston, I felt he was a legitimate NHL goaltender, a legit back-up at the very least. While the historic numbers are eye-popping, I'm not surprised he's having success. Big athletic goaltender, now in his 6th professional season. I always thought it was impressive he broke in as a North American professional at 19-years old.

 

[BruinsFanSince94]

So I’m guessing Rask and Thomas weren’t as good as we thought they were because of the defense they played behind? Or do we just discount goalies on other teams?

I mean, team defense is pretty important for a goalie. You need a mix of both. Bruins haven’t been nearly as good as the Flames. It’s not discounting goalies on other teams. Vladar has shown at both the AHL/NHL levels he has talent and can produce in net.

The Flames are a good team and if Vladar was here behind Boston, it’s not difficult to see why you’d expect his numbers to not be nearly as good.

It’s more of a dig at the Bruins than anything.

 

[PlayMakers]

I mean, team defense is pretty important for a goalie. You need a mix of both. Bruins haven’t been nearly as good as the Flames. It’s not discounting goalies on other teams. Vladar has shown at both the AHL/NHL levels he has talent and can produce in net.

The Flames are a good team and if Vladar was here behind Boston, it’s not difficult to see why you’d expect his numbers to not be nearly as good.

It’s more of a dig at the Bruins than anything.

The Bruins team defense has been pretty darn good.

#2 in Corsi Against.
#1 in Expected Goals Against.
#3 in Scoring Chances Against.
#1 in High Danger Chances Against.

29th in save percentage.

There is a huge gap between the amount and quality of the shots we allow and the saves we're getting. No team can overcome bad goaltending. Fluto did an article recently that talked about how, if we had been getting quality goaltending, our team defense would be dominant.

IMO, this is another example of the Bruins not firing on all cylinders yet. Our goalies haven't got going, but I think that's a fixable problem. If Swayman and Ullmark aren't the answer, Rask will be.

 

[22Brad Park]

The Bruins team defense has been pretty darn good.

#2 in Corsi Against.
#1 in Expected Goals Against.
#3 in Scoring Chances Against.
#1 in High Danger Chances Against.

29th in save percentage.

There is a huge gap between the amount and quality of the shots we allow and the saves we're getting. No team can overcome bad goaltending. Fluto did an article recently that talked about how, if we had been getting quality goaltending, our team defense would be dominant.

IMO, this is another example of the Bruins not firing on all cylinders yet. Our goalies haven't got going, but I think that's a fixable problem. If Swayman and Ullmark aren't the answer, Rask will be.

One big mirage.The eye test says not even close to dominant.Cannot count the times Bruins d had puck and turned it over and it landed in the net

 

[EverettMike]

It's genuinely stunning how much a lot of us nailed this team before the season.

They struggle to score past the first line. They're tough to play against for bad teams, but they struggle with good teams. Their defense is incredibly shallow and have too many bottom pairing guys that get exposed by playing too high up.

They'll still likely get a wild card spot and not be a serious threat in the post-season unless a goalie gets crazy hot. They're not really better than last year. They're just a different form of sameness. Most of their free agent signings proved to be, at best, lateral moves.

Exactly what a lot of us thought.

 

[Gee Wally]

Yep.

So poll ran over 4 months. Long enough for folks to stand and be counted.
Now lets return to the original FO thread to continue the discussion.
Thanks.

Management - Sweeney, Neely