Transfer: Summer Transfer Rumors and Discussion Part VII

[Savant]

Things change. New players pop up on the market. Injuries happen. A lot can change. Klopp's thinking could change like it famously did in 2018.

Klopp in 2016 after United bought Pogba
"Other clubs can go out and spend more money and collect top players, yes.....Do I have to do it differently to that? Actually, I want to do it differently. I would even do it differently if I could spend that money."

Klopp in 2018 after spending close to 200m in one transfer window; including a world record fee for a goalkeeper (Alisson)
"Thats the problem these days, you say something and whatever bullshit you say, nobody will forget it!"

Klopp responds to comments about big transfer fees

Boss had criticised United when they signed Pogba.

www.thisisanfield.com

Sure but can only base things today on the knowledge that we currently have. This is the knowledge that we currently have.

Klopp also hates the heavy metal football quote. But that is one that he is famous for.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

You really need to read what is being discussed. We're talking about a contract that was given while Bartomeu was the president. How is that Laporta's fault? Laporta wasn't at the club when De Jong was given that contract. The only thing you can say about Laporta here is that he is potentially lying and I already posted "I would have to see something that actually explains why the current board thinks that Frenkie's renewal and those of others were "criminal"." in this very thread. And no, I wasn't saying the same things about Bartomeu that I was about Laporta. I never wanted Bartomeu as club president in the first place.

Well yeah, he hasn't got them out of the mess. As I posted I believe yesterday, feel free to post what you think the club could/should do differently that would clear the club's debts. As for Laporta, it's very clear the work he's doing is largely good work in the short run and probably in the long run, but feel free to post otherwise supporting your claims if you think that's not the case. He's clearly not just talking a big game because they've secured financial deals and signed a lot of good players. That's not talk.

I know what's being discussed.

Laporta says it was criminal. Bartomeu claims its not. How do we know this is not concocted by Laporta to get de Jong to lower his wages? Barcelona is desperate to find ways to reduce salary. Lying to one of your players about the validity of their contract, threatening that it'll be overturned in court, and then obtaining some settlement before it gets to that point, which ends up with Barcelona is paying less for the player, is a good way to do that.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

I know what's being discussed.

Laporta says it was criminal. Bartomeu claims its not. How do we know this is not concocted by Laporta to get de Jong to lower his wages? Barcelona is desperate to find ways to reduce salary. Lying to one of your players about the validity of their contract, threatening that it'll be overturned in court, and then obtaining some settlement before it gets to that point, which ends up with Barcelona is paying less for the player, is a good way to do that.

It gets better lol

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Oh you were serious? Well the contracts in discussion were signed before Laporta came? Maybe that’s it? And les habs definteily did not defend bart lol.

One last note he certainly has fixed their issues well some. You’re just not paying attention

I am paying attention. I don't think creating a situation where you struggle to register your players year after year is fixing the issues. I also don't think mortgaging your interests in assets for the future for some minor short term benefit is good financial business.

These are the types of things Bartomeu would be criticized for. I suspect Laporta might be criticized in a few years, if he doesn't fix the problems. It'll have been obvious at the time, but some of you didn't want to admit it.

Another that got away. Move to LB has worked out great for him.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

I am paying attention. I don't think creating a situation where you struggle to register your players year after year is fixing the issues. I also don't think mortgaging your interests in assets for the future for some minor short term benefit is good financial business.

These are the types of things Bartomeu would be criticized for. I suspect Laporta might be criticized in a few years, if he doesn't fix the problems. It'll have been obvious at the time, but some of you didn't want to admit it.

He reduced the debt and this is a move that others have made without having anyone lose their shit over. Bart was handing out contracts like candy in addition to crazy transfer fees. Laporta has done neither. You're paying as much attention as Neville is.

Year after year? He's been in charge for 1 year ... like I said lack of attention.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Good deal for Sesko and Leipzig. Leipzig needed a long term solution at that position because it isn't Silva or Werner.

Is Leipzig getting him for free because they and Salzburg is Red Bull?

It probably works out to something like that because FIFA doesn't enforce FFP and Red Bull will find some way to manipulate the finances to make it a free transfer, but they'll agree on a fee. Not all good Salzburg players go to Leipzig either, so I can't criticize a transfer between the clubs too much.

 

[les Habs]

I think City bought Cancelo as a RB to eventually replace Walker, who is a good defensive RB but doesnt really fit Pep's style of play offensively (also getting up there in age). Mendy was supposed to be the left back for the next decade until he tore his ACL and decided to get rapey (allegedly) during his rehab. This precipitated a change of plan and Cancelo was moved to LB where he has done great offensively but is very average defensively.

If City had bough Cucurella, I am fairly certain it would have meant more of Cancelo on the right and maybe even a switch to 5 at the back and Walker moving to RCB (Pep has tried this in the past and it didnt really work well with the personnel at the time).

Not sure how Gomez would be deployed if/when he is signed.

I know the history, I was just referring to when Cucurella fell through. Despite a rough go of it after leaving Barça and prior to getting to Anderlecht, I think Gomez looks a good shout for that little a fee. He's versatile and I would think Guardiola could get the best out of him if he gets a chance at City.

I know what's being discussed.

Laporta says it was criminal. Bartomeu claims its not. How do we know this is not concocted by Laporta to get de Jong to lower his wages? Barcelona is desperate to find ways to reduce salary. Lying to one of your players about the validity of their contract, threatening that it'll be overturned in court, and then obtaining some settlement before it gets to that point, which ends up with Barcelona is paying less for the player, is a good way to do that.

We don't. Again, did you just read what I wrote? That said, there's plenty of reason to think it's not a concoction if you look at the reported numbers and factor in what I posted yesterday.

I am paying attention. I don't think creating a situation where you struggle to register your players year after year is fixing the issues. I also don't think mortgaging your interests in assets for the future for some minor short term benefit is good financial business.

These are the types of things Bartomeu would be criticized for. I suspect Laporta might be criticized in a few years, if he doesn't fix the problems. It'll have been obvious at the time, but some of you didn't want to admit it.


Another that got away. Move to LB has worked out great for him.

Again, and this isn't just for you but for all the other armchair club presidents out there, what would you do differently? I'm genuinely curious. I don't agree with everything management has done, but I largely understand it and agree with a good portion of it.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

He reduced the debt and this is a move that others have made without having anyone lose their shit over. Bart was handing out contracts like candy in addition to crazy transfer fees. Laporta has done neither. You're paying as much attention as Neville is.

Year after year? He's been in charge for 1 year ... like I said lack of attention.

Because he mortgaged future financial stake in the assets. It's not necessarily a good thing. Could end up looking bad. We don't know yet. What other clubs did this?

And Laporta is also handing out contracts like candy. How does he afford to sign Bernardo Silva after he probably spent more money on transfers than any club in Europe this summer? They can't even register their players two years in a row, not one, yet he's trying to add another player that all but 4-5 clubs in football can't afford.

 

[mmk786]

Sure but can only base things today on the knowledge that we currently have. This is the knowledge that we currently have.

Klopp also hates the heavy metal football quote. But that is one that he is famous for.

So it appears that based "on the knowledge we currently have" we shouldn't take everything Klopp says seriously as he is prone to changing his mind

 

[les Habs]

Because he mortgaged future financial stake in the assets. It's not necessarily a good thing. Could end up looking bad. We don't know yet. What other clubs did this?

And Laporta is also handing out contracts like candy. How does he afford to sign Bernardo Silva after he probably spent more money on transfers than any club in Europe this summer? They can't even register their players two years in a row, not one, yet he's trying to add another player that all but 4-5 clubs in football can't afford.

What other clubs were in the same situation? Most aren't run the same and are in a lot of debt and yet don't have to pay it back because they have bazillionaire owners and don't have the same financial constraints because the respective leagues they're in aren't as stringent as La Liga when it comes to FFP.

If building the squad by adding new players means handing out contracts like candy, then fine. However, it's very widely reported that there is now a wage structure in place, and a very sensible one for a big club. They've also reduced the wage bill greatly overall from the peak during Bartomeu's tenure.

Who didn't they register last season? Who do you think won't be registered this season?

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Again, and this isn't just for you but for all the other armchair club presidents out there, what would you do differently? I'm genuinely curious. I don't agree with everything management has done, but I largely understand it and agree with a good portion of it.

I would make some small signings. Maybe spend 10-15M total on transfers at most. Nothing expensive, whether its free transfers with big wages or transfer fees. Try to reduce the wage bill as much as possible, but you also have to treat players with respect. Your club handed out those contracts. You can't force them to leave, if they don't want. You can make them play with the reserves or try to embarrass them, but if they don't want to leave, nothing you can do about that.

I would not have signed Lewandowski, Kessie, Kounde, Dembele, Raphinha, or Christinsen. Worse case scenario, you are Arsenal level for 3-4 years, while you regain some financial stability, and you build back your squad like Arsenal has. La Liga is not competitive enough after the top 3 that Barcelona would fall too far. It's possible they could've missed the Champions League once or twice with that strategy, but in the end they'd probably make it, and build through a sustainable strategy.

You realize now that Barcelona is on the hook in the future for what they've done this summer. Even if the club becomes one of the best in the best teams in the world again the next few years, we can't be sure that financially it won't be a disaster in five years.

 

[Savant]

So it appears that based "on the knowledge we currently have" we shouldn't take everything Klopp says seriously as he is prone to changing his mind

I mean Define prone to changing his mind. The example that you used had two years between the quotes. Is it prone to changing mind if its 2016 to 2018?

my point is every team has trusted sources, and at this point there isn’t a reason not to believe them. A guy like Paul Joyce is different from a guy on the rumor mill.

but it’s not a static market. Things could change, but as of now there is no evidence that it will. The noise coming out of the reliable LFC sources is still that there won’t be stopgaps

 

[mmk786]

I know the history, I was just referring to when Cucurella fell through. Despite a rough go of it after leaving Barça and prior to getting to Anderlecht, I think Gomez looks a good shout for that little a fee. He's versatile and I would think Guardiola could get the best out of him if he gets a chance at City.

Yes the fee is small enough that City can take a chance on him. Would have preferred someone more established but hopefully he will be a pleasant surprise.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

Because he mortgaged future financial stake in the assets. It's not necessarily a good thing. Could end up looking bad. We don't know yet. What other clubs did this?

And Laporta is also handing out contracts like candy. How does he afford to sign Bernardo Silva after he probably spent more money on transfers than any club in Europe this summer? They can't even register their players two years in a row, not one, yet he's trying to add another player that all but 4-5 clubs in football can't afford.

Madrid

The wages are way down and the players coming in are not on high fees. The transfer fees are also not crazy stupid.

Lewa, Kounde, Christensen,Raphina and Kessi were all brought here for less than what bart bought Coutinho for. Im pretty spent talking about the same bs. The answers are there for anyone to see so enjoy. Ill bow out.

 

[Eye of Ra]

[MikeVerweij] Ajax close to signing Ahmetcan Kaplan(19) from Trabzonspor

 

[Savant]

Yes the fee is small enough that City can take a chance on him. Would have preferred someone more established but hopefully he will be a pleasant surprise.

Very low risk signing for them. Worst cast scenario they just Angelino him

 

[mmk786]

Very low risk signing for them. Worst cast scenario they just Angelino him

Somewhat different scenario with Angelino. He came through the City academy and the club made a net profit on him.
If Gomez is signed and then flops at City then I doubt the club would be able to make a profit on him.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

And you shit on Jussi for using the best writers reporting. Don’t know why the same energy isn’t being applied here.

Jussi's annoying because he keeps spamming the same information.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

Madrid

The wages are way down and the players coming in are not on high fees. The transfer fees are also not crazy stupid.

Lewa, Kounde, Christensen,Raphina and Kessi were all brought here for less than what bart bought Coutinho for. Im pretty spent talking about the same bs. The answers are there for anyone to see so enjoy. Ill bow out.

Yup, we sure did in the mid-00s and it ended up paying off.

 

[Savant]

Somewhat different scenario with Angelino. He came through the City academy and the club made a net profit on him.
If Gomez is signed and then flops at City then I doubt the club would be able to make a profit on him.

I don’t think it’s farfetched they could make a profit. Especially with the players CV. Once you are bought by a team like than level, you are king of a made man.

also it doesnt matter if city loses money on him because they are city.

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

Werner gone. WBS grumpy.

 

[mmk786]

also it doesnt matter if city loses money on him because they are city.

Perception is not always reality. Cucurella would have been the signing if money didnt matter to City.

 

[Savant]

Perception is not always reality. Cucurella would have been the signing if money didnt matter to City.

10m is nothing to City. They didn’t sign Cucurella because they didn’t think he was worth Brighton’s valuation. This is fine but let’s not pretend City are negatively impacted if Gomez busts

 

[mmk786]

10m is nothing to City. They didn’t sign Cucurella because they didn’t think he was worth Brighton’s valuation.

I feel these two sentences are contradicting each other. Maybe I am misreading them.
Valuation difference is essentially money, yes? But money doesnt matter to City, yes? Confused, no?

 

[cgf]

Is Leipzig getting him for free because they and Salzburg is Red Bull?

No. Leipzig and Salzburg are more like siblings or cousins, related to one another through a common relative but separate entities; rather than two arms of the same entity. They have separate finances that they are separately responsible for. That's why Leipzig can't just take whomever they want from Salzburg and why they have to pay up when they do get a player from Salzburg.