Online Series: Stranger Things (A love letter to the supernatural classics of the 80's)

[harvestglen]

Okay, I haven't read the thread yet (I'll get to it when I'm home from work), but I just finished season 2 and...I can't be the only one that thinks this show is massively overrated, can I?

Well, I would argue the biggest strength of season 1, and the one that best explains the phenomenon it became, is hitting certain emotional resonance for viewers that isn't easy to explain. While there are qualities of mystery and tension, good aesthetics, and some compelling narrative turns, I don't view those as the core elements that they are for many big shows. Doesn't surprise me at all then that the show's beloved reputation might be bewildering for some viewers.

Season 2 seems to offer massive appeal as well, though I would argue the roots of that appeal are not entirely the same as the first (as someone like myself who had more of a mixed response to season 2 can attest).

 

[The Waffler]

The scene when Hopper puts on "You Don't Mess Around With Jim" was awesome. I love Jim Croce.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Okay, I haven't read the thread yet (I'll get to it when I'm home from work), but I just finished season 2 and...I can't be the only one that thinks this show is massively overrated, can I?

Yup, you are pretty much alone.

 

[Smash88]

Okay, I haven't read the thread yet (I'll get to it when I'm home from work), but I just finished season 2 and...I can't be the only one that thinks this show is massively overrated, can I?

Some people go overboard with the hype, but it is a good show. One of the better ones currently out there.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

Am I the only one who's a little distracted by Nancy's head. Is she anorexic? Her head seems too big for her body. My wife and I always mention it.

 

[Osprey]

Am I the only one who's a little distracted by Nancy's head. Is she anorexic? Her head seems too big for her body. My wife and I always mention it.

Some other people mentioned it during Season 1. I don't think that she's anorexic, just very thin. She has a very wide face, though, which makes the rest of her seem unhealthily thin. I just think that she's naturally blessed with a good metabolism and cursed with a wide head that doesn't go so well with the thin body that the former promotes.

 

[Rhaegar Targaryen]

Some other people mentioned it during Season 1. I don't think that she's anorexic, just very thin. She has a very wide face, though, which makes the rest of her seem unhealthily thin. I just think that she's naturally blessed with a good metabolism and cursed with a wide head that doesn't go so well with the thin body that the former promotes.

I think she’s a pretty good looking girl and all my friends agree.

 

[CactusEverywhere]

The scene when Hopper puts on "You Don't Mess Around With Jim" was awesome. I love Jim Croce.

That little dance to start things off.

 

[Fantomas]

After really liking season one, I was disappointed by season 2. Although I still had a good time with it.

The writing felt rushed throughout, with too many new characters filling up time without justification. Characters often do things to satisfy the story ark, but in ways that are not plausible. For example why do the kids even decide to go under ground in the final episode when they torch the creature? Are they insane? It did not seem necessary, but is just thrown in there so that every character has something to do during the climax.

I hated the way the season left some key characters hanging without purpose. For example, Mike is given nothing to do. All he does is observe, and this is after being perhaps the heart of the first story. I am baffled by the show's inability to make better use of him. Furthermore most of the female characters are poorly written - Winona Ryder's mother has almost the exact same role as in season one, freaking out and making sense of patterns (this time drawings and the morse code thing - groan). The red-headed girl - Max - served absolutely no purpose. Why was she even written into the show? She contributes nothing. I was waiting for a big reveal of some kind, to learn she is related to Eleven or something. Nope. She just hangs around, sort of like Mike.

I was annoyed by the fact the writers broke up the kids, which was a tight Stand-by-Me-meets-It unit in season 1. Here they are spread out doing different things, which changes the show in a bad way - the charm of their friendship was key to the appeal of the first season. What sucked me into the first season was the character development, the investment in relationships and worldbuilding that felt real and engaging. Horror and sci-fi elements added suspense, but were secondary to all of that stuff. This season got things backwards, dropping the ball on character development and overloading us on thrills without establishing emotional investment. Watching this action I was beginning to forget why I was supposed to care in the first place.

Side characters were also poorly written. Sean Astin's rotund boyfriend has no discernible personality except to drive a plot point - he is good with puzzles - and then to die somewhat gruesomely in annoying slo-mo - just freaking run, fatso. And why couldn't they do more with Paul Reiser? I kept expecting some kind of nod to his backstabbing character in Aliens, in which he screws over the crew. But there is no surprise here either. (also can someone explain to me why the demo-dogs injure him but not kill him???)

More complaints. Are we really supposed to buy into the Nancy-Jonathan relationship? I don't think they have any chemistry. I much preferred her scenes with Steve from the first season. But maybe this is just me.

Oh and let me be among those who hated season 2, episode 7 - Eleven joining the gang of never-do-well superhero punks. It was like something out of network TV. Please fire everyone responsible for that thing and erase it forever from our memory. Dreadful.

Loved Billy Hargrove. May have been the only aspect of this season to really resonate with me. Completely captured the essence of the 80s movie villain.

 

[Upgrayedd]

My only criticism for season 2 was the Mad Max and Brother angle, I didn't see there point in really any story arc and can't envision where there headed with it, perhaps it is setting up for the third season?

 

[Bubba Thudd]

I think she’s a pretty good looking girl and all my friends agree.

Me too. All my friends, too...

...index, bird, ring, pinkie, thumb...

 

[Evincar]

I really didnt like season 2. Everything I loved about season 1: the nostalgia, pop culture references, humor, story, acting, none of that it was really there. The 2 new characters really added nothing to the show. It seems Max was just there to give Lucas his own storyline and something to do. Mike went from being maybe the most important character to being a side character.

I feel like I can go back and watch season 1 and be entertained. I dont feel the same for season 2.

 

[Osprey]

I agree with 90% of what you wrote, Fantomas, especially about the season doing things backward from Season 1 (ex. breaking all of the kids up). A few comments, though...

The red-headed girl - Max - served absolutely no purpose. Why was she even written into the show? She contributes nothing. I was waiting for a big reveal of some kind, to learn she is related to Eleven or something. Nope. She just hangs around, sort of like Mike.

Max was written into the show to be a substitute for Eleven as the female in the group while Eleven was off doing their own thing, to create the love triangle story line with Dustin and Lucas and to establish how much of a jerk and a villain Billy is (because it's his treatment of a young girl who's almost family that makes him seem particularly vile). I think that she had a lot of purpose, personally.

It seems like I'm in the minority, but I actually liked Max and her inclusion. She kept the coed feeling of the group going, particularly the "girl trying to fit into a group of boys" theme. I suspect that people's dissatisfaction with her may stem partly from her getting screen time when Mike didn't and, essentially, replacing Mike as the go-between Dustin and Lucas. I think that they should've written a natural friendship between Max and Mike, rather than going in the opposite direction. They could've had them spending a lot of time together, since everyone else was off doing their own things, with Max confiding in Mike about how Dustin and Lucas are both acting so weird around her and Mike talking to her more about Eleven. That would've also given more basis to Eleven's jealousy. Anyways, by giving Max and Mike more screen time together, the writers could've addressed the issues with both characters, IMO.

Side characters were also poorly written. Sean Astin's rotund boyfriend has no discernible personality except to drive a plot point - he is good with puzzles - and then to die somewhat gruesomely in annoying slo-mo - just freaking run, fatso. And why couldn't they do more with Paul Reiser? I kept expecting some kind of nod to his backstabbing character in Aliens, in which he screws over the crew. But there is no surprise here either. (also can someone explain to me why the demo-dogs injure him but not kill him???)

It was mentioned in the after show (BTW, there about 8 15-minute after shows that play after the final episode, if anyone didn't know) that Bob was originally written to be a much smaller character, but, once they signed Astin and realized how likable he was, they gave his character much more to do (bonding with Will and being the chief puzzle solver). It maybe doesn't excuse it, but it does explain it. As for Reiser, I actually was surprised since I totally expected him to turn into his Aliens character and, instead, he turned out to be an OK guy.

 

[Fantomas]

One of the reasons I did not like Max as a character is because she is initially established as a sassy independent gal, but is gradually changed into a needy tag-along. I hated that.

 

[Osprey]

One of the reasons I did not like Max as a character is because she is initially established as a sassy independent gal, but is gradually changed into a needy tag-along. I hated that.

I don't disagree that they handled the transformation a little roughly. They made it seem like none of the boys wanted her around, which did raise the question of why she was tagging along. If they had at least done what I just suggested--established a friendship between Max and Mike--then Dustin and Lucas pretending to be disinterested in her wouldn't have deterred her from hanging out with them.

That said, you need character development. You can't just have the sassy independent girl stay just as sassy and just as independent through to the end of the series. People who act so sassy and independent are often just putting up a front, anyways. They want to be accepted, but, when they aren't or are afraid that they won't be, they put up walls and make it look like they don't care what other people think. It makes sense to me for Max to put up those walls when she's new at school and has no friends and then to let those walls down once she's made friends. As I suggested, though, they might've written that character development in a little more smoothly.

 

[harvestglen]

I was annoyed by the fact the writers broke up the kids, which was a tight Stand-by-Me-meets-It unit in season 1. Here they are spread out doing different things, which changes the show in a bad way - the charm of their friendship was key to the appeal of the first season. What sucked me into the first season was the character development, the investment in relationships and worldbuilding that felt real and engaging. Horror and sci-fi elements added suspense, but were secondary to all of that stuff. This season got things backwards, dropping the ball on character development and overloading us on thrills without establishing emotional investment. Watching this action I was beginning to forget why I was supposed to care in the first place.

I agree with this. I actually thought the character development was going quite well the first few episodes, but as the characters became more split up and the stakes rose, the action seemed to take center stage over any of that promise. I also don't think we spent enough time with the characters after the climax. That's something season 1 did well by contrast. The snowball itself was fun, but we could have used more time to see how their relationships have changed as a result of their experiences. For instance, the boys spend barely a few moments together at the dance and have other things on their mind. They also completely bypassed the unresolved tension in the whole Max/Mike/El thing. I loved the El/Hopper bond, but that dropped after the first half and we only got a few moments between them after that while all the chaos was going on. Sorely missing some kind of bookend seeing her settling back into the cabin. I will say the whole Dustin/Steve team-up played out well, forming an unlikely bond that makes a lot of sense giving their respective situations.

The worst offender for what they did to the characters for me was Mike. I could get behind him being more checked out as a result of what happened the year prior and not knowing whether El is alive. I also get him being simultaneously worried about his friend. However, we seem to completely lose focus of what's going on with him and he becomes no more than a bystander to Will's predicament.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

My only criticism for season 2 was the Mad Max and Brother angle, I didn't see there point in really any story arc and can't envision where there headed with it, perhaps it is setting up for the third season?

Bingo.

Cast was a bit limited the first season (not a bad thing), but eventually you need to add a couple more characters, esp if you plan on have the series last for awhile. They were introduced with a limited role this season and I expect their role will increase for season 3.

 

[Winger98]

Liked the second season, didn't really love it.

Spoiler: various thoughts

Not interested in Nancy/Jonathan at all, or Hopper/Joyce. I enjoyed Astin's character and think he should have been kept and his role expanded the following season, if Astin wanted to stick around.

No real interest in additional Super Kids, either.

I did like that Reiser's character never did the heel turn, but I'm expecting it in future seasons.

Wasn't buying Dustin taking in Baby Demogorgon until the scene where he basically admitted to how lonely he still was and how he thought it was his friend. It seems this scene is just missed by people, but I wonder how/if it comes back in future seasons with Dustin's loneliness becoming some sort of issue, maybe taking in a baby mindflayor next season.

Snow Ball has some implications that really make the last scene weird/funny in inappropriate ways.

Bingo.

Cast was a bit limited the first season (not a bad thing), but eventually you need to add a couple more characters, esp if you plan on have the series last for awhile. They were introduced with a limited role this season and I expect their role will increase for season 3.

yeah, I thought a few of these things were clearly done with future seasons in mind. And I thought they did a fair job of closing the sister/brother dynamic by showing us their homelife a bit, that Max sees more to her brother's abusiveness than him just being an abusive jerk, and the grudging respect (?) the brother shows her at the end.

The same with how Mike wasn't the center of this series. This isn't a series about Mike and they needed to start fleshing these other characters out . Mike had about the same to do this season as Will in last season, and that's fine. I thought the kid who plays Lucus really stepped up, Steve solidified his character, Dustin was Dustin, and Will showed he could do something more than cower.

Does everyone really want every season to be Mike and El versus The Big Bad?

 

[CactusEverywhere]

Liked the second season, didn't really love it.

Spoiler: various thoughts

Not interested in Nancy/Jonathan at all, or Hopper/Joyce. I enjoyed Astin's character and think he should have been kept and his role expanded the following season, if Astin wanted to stick around.

No real interest in additional Super Kids, either.

I did like that Reiser's character never did the heel turn, but I'm expecting it in future seasons.

Wasn't buying Dustin taking in Baby Demogorgon until the scene where he basically admitted to how lonely he still was and how he thought it was his friend. It seems this scene is just missed by people, but I wonder how/if it comes back in future seasons with Dustin's loneliness becoming some sort of issue, maybe taking in a baby mindflayor next season.

Snow Ball has some implications that really make the last scene weird/funny in inappropriate ways.

I also don't much care for the

Spoiler

Nancy/Jon pairing. It's kinda boring.

I wouldn't mind a little more peek into other

Spoiler

lab subjects, but just briefly in flashbacks. Keep and explore more with Kali (like does she feel betrayed by El taking off), but don't overdo it. More Matthew Modine, please!

Owens:

Spoiler

Perhaps he may have been a spy trying to get close to them from the beginning. Assuming he's not and is truly a good guy, though, I can still see him dropping a dime on Hopper/El, but not willingly. Like, his bosses find out that he saw her/about the birth certificate and force it out of him.

I don't know, but speculating on the plethora of directions this show can go is pretty fun.

This was the first time Steve

Spoiler

saw Eleven in person, right? For sure he heard about her, but now *everybody* in the clan knows each other, yeah?

The excitement in

Spoiler

El's voice when she went to tell Becky that she found Kali was cute. She speaks so low and quiet all the time, I was surprised to hear her all giddy like that.

 

[harvestglen]

Does everyone really want every season to be Mike and El versus The Big Bad?

Well, it's a no to the idea of a big bad every season. At the same time, it would be nice for those two characters to do something together for once.

 

[RobBrown4PM]

It was OK, not nearly as good as the first season. 008, Johno & Nancy and the Mike & Eleven shit was beyond atrocious.

I liked. Billy, hooper & eleven, Sinclair and Max and the many homages to Aliens.

I really really hope they do another reason, But!

I hope there's new characters in a new setting with a new story. They really should make this an anthology series from here on out, kinda like AHS, Fargo, Outer Limits, et cetra.

 

[aufheben]

I love how they found an actor that looks exactly like Rob Lowe lol

 

[NyQuil]

The scene when Hopper puts on "You Don't Mess Around With Jim" was awesome. I love Jim Croce.

Thanks to the magic of the Internet, Hopper can dance to everything.

Hopper Dancing To (@hopperdancingto) | Twitter

 

[dogbazinho]

Honestly it was a bit dissappointing, i enjoyed the early character development and expected more depth to the conclusion. The ending felt rushed and all the exposition felt a bit wasted

 

[M.C.G. 31]

On ep 3 right now of season 2 after starting the series last weekend. Loooooved season one so much. Liking season two to start off.

Bob is such a geek.