GDT: Stickpuck Duel: "Meet the New Boss, (Please be better than) the Old Boss"

[Roboturner913]

I thought Slavin needed a break back weeks ago. He was looking like he had some mental fatigue going on.

 

[Unsustainable]

I thought Slavin needed a break back weeks ago. He was looking like he had some mental fatigue going on.

I blame it on his recent marriage.

 

[RodTheBawd]

I wouldn't say there is an anti-Faulk crusade but then again not everyone has a Faulk-icorn avatar so there's that. Seriously though, it's like any player who has been with this team for several years. First he's overrated - I personally have stated that many times in the past about Faulk here and on the trade board - and then after a large enough sample size, warts are more evident. AKA shiny toy syndrome or STS.

Faulk has not been good, and that goes beyond his paltry scoring. I don't agree with those that are quick to say he should be traded, but his play has warranted criticism this year.

Ahh yes, my (ironic) avatar indicates I'm a huge Justin Faulk fan here to defend his internet honor. "I personally have stated that..." hahaha holy shit. We are so lucky to have such a great hockey mind in our midst. Hot taek: Faulk playing worse than he has in the past does not validate him being "overrated", oh wise one; it simply means he's been playing like shit.

 

[Lempo]

Just read through the Penguins post-game thread....from the sound of it, I'd say mass suicide isn't out of the question....that fan base is just....well I don't know what they are.

Compared to our "no post-season PTSD", that sense of entitlement is astonishing.

I went to look for the classic Magic the Gathering card "Juggernaut" to make a geeky attempt at humor, but turns out the joke's at me:

 

[Navin R Slavin]

Ahh yes, my (ironic) avatar indicates I'm a huge Justin Faulk fan here to defend his internet honor. "I personally have stated that..." hahaha holy ****. We are so lucky to have such a great hockey mind in our midst. Hot taek: Faulk playing worse than he has in the past does not validate him being "overrated", oh wise one; it simply means he's been playing like ****.

Yes, yesssssssss.

Feeeeeel your anger, Rod of Ruin.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Ahh yes, my (ironic) avatar indicates I'm a huge Justin Faulk fan here to defend his internet honor. "I personally have stated that..." hahaha holy ****. We are so lucky to have such a great hockey mind in our midst. Hot taek: Faulk playing worse than he has in the past does not validate him being "overrated", oh wise one; it simply means he's been playing like ****.

I'm with Rod here. There's lots to be complaining about with Faulk this season (and past seasons), but the "looks slow vs. Hagelin" and "needs a calming influence partner so he's not a leader" are pretty weak complaints.

 

[StormCast]

Ahh yes, my (ironic) avatar indicates I'm a huge Justin Faulk fan here to defend his internet honor. "I personally have stated that..." hahaha holy ****. We are so lucky to have such a great hockey mind in our midst. Hot taek: Faulk playing worse than he has in the past does not validate him being "overrated", oh wise one; it simply means he's been playing like ****.

Still can't take good-natured ribbing about unimportant things as an avatar I see. Maybe in the new year.

In more serious terms, you missed my entire point which was that I feel he has been overrated for some time by many in the fan base and have stated that in several places. It wasn't intended to a humble-brag but rather to offer a long-standing perspective. But oh well.

Your original point was about an anti-Faulk crusade of late. My point was that I've felt he was overrated for some time and has been bad lately in all facets, thus not part of the "crusade."

 

[StormCast]

I'm with Rod here. There's lots to be complaining about with Faulk this season (and past seasons), but the "looks slow vs. Hagelin" and "needs a calming influence partner so he's not a leader" are pretty weak complaints.

But that wasn't really his complaint. Agreed about the slow v. Hagelin point but on the flip side, if a veteran Dman who also wears the C seemingly can't help mentor and groom younger guys on the blue line, how exactly does that show leadership?

On another related matter how in the world was Rask an A last year?

 

[geehaad]

if a veteran Dman who also wears the C seemingly can't help mentor and groom younger guys on the blue line, how exactly does that show leadership?

What is your evidence that he cannot and/or does not? We know that Hanifin referred to Faulk's advice about fighting after his fight with Mackenzie, as an example to the contrary.

 

[StormCast]

What is your evidence that he cannot and/or does not? We know that Hanifin referred to Faulk's advice about fighting after his fight with Mackenzie, as an example to the contrary.

This, really? Is this the main board with this "what's the evidence" business and then the example you used? Wow. Just wow. Maybe Tim Conboy should have worn the C too.

I used the word "seemingly" to signify that it is not a proven fact but rather my opinion. Feel free to disagree in all CAPS, I'll stand by my opinion regardless.

 

[RodTheBawd]

Still can't take good-natured ribbing about unimportant things as an avatar I see. Maybe in the new year.

In more serious terms, you missed my entire point which was that I feel he has been overrated for some time by many in the fan base and have stated that in several places. It wasn't intended to a humble-brag but rather to offer a long-standing perspective. But oh well.

Your original point was about an anti-Faulk crusade of late. My point was that I've felt he was overrated for some time and has been bad lately in all facets, thus not part of the "crusade."

I don't disagree that he's been overrated by many. Most of that was probably brought about by the underrated shift we saw last season where the HFBoard echochamber went with "good offensively, terrible defensively", which wasn't the case. Unfortunately, that's come to fruition so you get these jackasses (present company maybe excluded) "humble-bragging" that they were right all along. He was never as bad defensively as HFBoards would have you believe, but he is now. The truth was always somewhere in between.

But that wasn't really his complaint. Agreed about the slow v. Hagelin point but on the flip side, if a veteran Dman who also wears the C seemingly can't help mentor and groom younger guys on the blue line, how exactly does that show leadership?

On another related matter how in the world was Rask an A last year?

Ahh, I see. You've been banging the C-card for a while now and are still really hung up on that. Not that I disagree he was a terrible choice, I just don't think it matters much.

 

[StormCast]

I don't disagree that he's been overrated by many. Most of that was probably brought about by the underrated shift we saw last season where the HFBoard echochamber went with "good offensively, terrible defensively", which wasn't the case. Unfortunately, that's come to fruition so you get these jackasses (present company maybe excluded) "humble-bragging" that they were right all along. He was never as bad defensively as HFBoards would have you believe, but he is now. The truth was always somewhere in between.



Ahh, I see. You've been banging the C-card for a while now and are still really hung up on that. Not that I disagree he was a terrible choice, I just don't think it matters much.

True about the echo chamber last year but I'm referring to a time even before that when the mantra was "RHD, incredible contract, 1D, etc." You and I do agree on his D play of late being really bad, whereas many others think he's the same as he ever was. Definite decline.

No, only mentioned the C thing over the last couple days and over several posts. Not hung up on it but he was a poor choice and, of course, it was two poor choices by BP over the last two years. No decision last year, and dumb decision this year.

 

[Lempo]

"groom younger guys on the blue line"

 

[StormCast]

"groom younger guys on the blue line"

Indeed. You did notice that Faulk used his powers of persuasion, mind control and leadership to get Hanifin to shave, no?

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

But that wasn't really his complaint. Agreed about the slow v. Hagelin point but on the flip side, if a veteran Dman who also wears the C seemingly can't help mentor and groom younger guys on the blue line, how exactly does that show leadership?

How do you know that he's not mentoring and grooming them? I've heard them talk about Faulk being a leader in the past. I've been at a few practices where I've seen him giving advice/instruction to the younger guys. You are making a leap that because Faulk isn't paired with a Hanifin or the like that he therefore isn't mentoring nor grooming them, nor showing leadership. That's extremely flawed logic. Does Erik Karlsson not show leadership because he was best paired with a veteran, stay at home guy like Methot?

Point being, unless you are in the locker room and on the ice, you (nor I) have no idea how much mentoring and grooming Faulk is giving these guys.

 

[RodTheBawd]

Point being, unless you are in the locker room and on the ice, you (nor I) have no idea how much mentoring and grooming Faulk is giving these guys.

Hopefully not much... lazy, overrated dumbshit.

 

[geehaad]

This, really? Is this the main board with this "what's the evidence" business and then the example you used? Wow. Just wow. Maybe Tim Conboy should have worn the C too.

I used the word "seemingly" to signify that it is not a proven fact but rather my opinion. Feel free to disagree in all CAPS, I'll stand by my opinion regardless.

Yes, and without ANY EVIDENCE, I am pointing out that your opinion is baseless. Stand by your baseless opinion at your own risk, slick.

Wow, just wow, indeed. Kerplunk.

 

[bleedgreen]

I don't disagree that he's been overrated by many. Most of that was probably brought about by the underrated shift we saw last season where the HFBoard echochamber went with "good offensively, terrible defensively", which wasn't the case. Unfortunately, that's come to fruition so you get these jackasses (present company maybe excluded) "humble-bragging" that they were right all along. He was never as bad defensively as HFBoards would have you believe, but he is now. The truth was always somewhere in between.



Ahh, I see. You've been banging the C-card for a while now and are still really hung up on that. Not that I disagree he was a terrible choice, I just don't think it matters much.

I hope I’m not part of the humble bragging Jackass group!

I’m defending him.

 

[StormCast]

How do you know that he's not mentoring and grooming them? I've heard them talk about Faulk being a leader in the past. I've been at a few practices where I've seen him giving advice/instruction to the younger guys. You are making a leap that because Faulk isn't paired with a Hanifin or the like that he therefore isn't mentoring nor grooming them, nor showing leadership. That's extremely flawed logic. Does Erik Karlsson not show leadership because he was best paired with a veteran, stay at home guy like Methot?

Point being, unless you are in the locker room and on the ice, you (nor I) have no idea how much mentoring and grooming Faulk is giving these guys.

Always interesting how posters read into comments they don't like here.

My quote was "seemingly can't help mentor and groom younger guys..." I didn't say he wasn't trying, but that he is not succeeding in my opinion. As for practices, I don't see him doing much advice-giving and he rarely does it on the bench. It's not a leap of of logic, it's a number of things I've observed. The Sens' parings have no relevance as BP doesn't coach them. But why was Hainsey constantly over-slotted to play with the young guys, including Faulk under BP? Ponder that, but again it goes beyond pairings.

 

[StormCast]

Yes, and without ANY EVIDENCE, I am pointing out that your opinion is baseless. Stand by your baseless opinion at your own risk, slick.

Wow, just wow, indeed. Kerplunk.

At my own risk? No evidence? Glad my opinion is so baseless that it's allowed you to simply ignore it? Oh...wait.

Funny how serious some people take themselves but good to know Faulk gave Hanifin "tips" on how to fight. That should equate to him being the full-time C, no?

 

[RodTheBawd]

But why was Hainsey constantly over-slotted to play with the young guys, including Faulk under BP? Ponder that, but again it goes beyond pairings.

On this point, could it be that maybe... JUUUUST maybe... Hainsey wasn't being overslotted and can be an ok complementary piece when needed? Why does that have to have anything to do with "mentoring young guys"?

 

[StormCast]

On this point, could it be that maybe... JUUUUST maybe... Hainsey wasn't being overslotted and can be an ok complementary piece when needed? Why does that have to have anything to do with "mentoring young guys"?

If you don't think Hainsey was being over-slotted, there is no point in continuing this conversation. Yes, Hainsey was a nice piece but somewhere as a 4-5 while contributing good PK minutes. He was over-slotted in the first pairing when he played with Faulk. Understandable because he was a steady, heady vet. Same was true of Sekera playing with Faulk.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Always interesting how posters read into comments they don't like here.

My quote was "seemingly can't help mentor and groom younger guys..." I didn't say he wasn't trying, but that he is not succeeding in my opinion. As for practices, I don't see him doing much advice-giving and he rarely does it on the bench. It's not a leap of of logic, it's a number of things I've observed.

Huh? I didn't read anything into your comment, I took them at face value and my point is still the same. Your view is that he's not mentoring/grooming the young defensemen and my point is that you (and I) see maybe 5% or less, of all of the time Faulk interacts with these guys. None of us are on the plane, in the bus, in the lockerroom, on the ice, etc... I'm not saying Faulk is a good leader or mentor, just that none of us know for sure as we aren't seeing 95%+ of it. We all have the right to form an opinion, but an opinion without enough data is suspect at best and none of us really have enough data.

The Sens' parings have no relevance as BP doesn't coach them.

Sure it does. The initial statement that started this whole line of talk was that Faulk has always done better with a more stabilizing partner (paraphrasing). Nothing to do with Peters as even Gleason was mentioned. You then, in my view, took a leap in saying that he shouldn't be a C because he is more in need of a veteran mentor than having the capacity to be one. My point being that because a guy that does better with a more stabilizing partner has no bearing on his leadership / mentoring ability, thus why the EK example is indeed relevant. BP is irrelevant in this context.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

If you don't think Hainsey was being over-slotted, there is no point in continuing this conversation. Yes, Hainsey was a nice piece but somewhere as a 4-5 while contributing good PK minutes. He was over-slotted in the first pairing when he played with Faulk. Understandable because he was a steady, heady vet. Same was true of Sekera playing with Faulk.

He was over-slotted for what you'd ideally want, but not for what the Canes had at the time. He was properly slotted based on the personnel they had.

Year 1: He was 2nd pairing (Faulk/Sekera 1st) and the rest of the D was Gleason, Liles, Komesarek, Bellemore, Harrison and Murphy. Clearly 2nd paring was the right slotting based on who Carolina had.
Year 2: Same group only replace Komi with Michal Jordan. Clearly, 2nd pairing was right based on who Carolina had.
Year 3: Faulk, Hainsey, Liles, Hanifin, Wiz (1 game), Jordan and Murphy were the 7 to start the season. Hainsey clearly was the 2nd best D of that group. Pesce and Slavin came up about 10 games into the season but were unproven and Faulk got injured about 2/3rds through the season. Again, not over-slotted for what the Canes had.
Year 4: Slavin-Pesce became the top pairing. Faulk-Hainsey the 2nd pairing. Hanifin-Dhalbeck/Murphy/Tennyson 3rd pairing. Was pretty clear they were bring Hanifin along slowly so seems like Hainsey was properly slotted again.

If you don't think Hainsey was properly slotted based on the personnel the Canes had, where should they have slotted him? He's playing similar minutes in Toronto now also.

 

[Joe McGrath]

Hainsey is currently slotted in the top 4 for the Leafs and he was slotted in the top 4 for the Stanley Cup Champions last year.

It’s hard to argue he was overslotted with this shit pile of a teamover the length of his contract.