Speculation: Stammergeddon: Episode II - The not so phantom menace

[Volodya Krutov]

What about last season? Top two/three in goal scoring AGAIN. And not just last year - EVERY YEAR except the injury season.

The only better goal scorer than him has Backstrom passing him the puck every game.

Goals are important but it's also just a number, there are plenty of things besides pure point production. By eye test you can be sure Palat's value to the team last year is worth a lot than jus the raw 47 assists and 16 goals. Many times he took control of a game without registering a single point and you can also be sure that when Palat enters beastmode we're winning more often than not.

So yeah Stammer scored 43 goals last year but what do you see in the other 41 games when he's not scoring ? An utterly one dimensional player that turns constantly the puck over, Stammer's average defensively, he's an average puck possession player, he's an average playmaker, he doesn't make his linemates better, he can't control the pace of the game, he doesn't have the individual skills to make superstar game/momentum changing plays.

In short Stamkos is an elite goal scorer but he's not an elite hockey player. So he shouldn't be paid like one, it's as simple as that.

 

[Flat Ronnie]

Goals are important but it's also just a number, there are plenty of things besides pure point production. By eye test you can be sure Palat's value to the team last year is worth a lot than jus the raw 47 assists and 16 goals. Many times he took control of a game without registering a single point and you can also be sure that when Palat enters beastmode we're winning more often than not.

So yeah Stammer scored 43 goals last year but what do you see in the other 41 games when he's not scoring ? An utterly one dimensional player that turns constantly the puck over, Stammer's average defensively, he's an average puck possession player, he's an average playmaker, he doesn't make his linemates better, he can't control the pace of the game, he doesn't have the individual skills to make superstar game/momentum changing plays.

In short Stamkos is an elite goal scorer but he's not an elite hockey player. So he shouldn't be paid like one, it's as simple as that.

I agree that he is one dimentional, but concidering we have a hard time scoring goals, that is the most important dimention.

If he is not worthy of being payed as an all around elite hockey player, than what do you pay an annual top goal scorer like him? Kinda hard to say because his accomplishments almost put him into his own category.

Lets just say for the sake of argument he has a good second half and gets himself up into the top 3-5 in goals and leads the team in points (which isn't too unrealist). Does he deserve any raise or no?

 

[These Are The Days]

I agree that he is one dimentional, but concidering we have a hard time scoring goals, that is the most important dimention.

If he is not worthy of being payed as an all around elite hockey player, than what do you pay an annual top goal scorer like him? Kinda hard to say because his accomplishments almost put him into his own category.

Does he deserve no raise?

Stamkos deserves a raise if he can pot 50 and win a Richard like we know he can. If we're gonna get this crap night after night then we can forget about anything beyond an annual $9-10 million range. I've long maintained that he and the KFC line were not compatible with each other and the point stands now that everyone is playing better because of it.

Once everyone is healthy

Drouin-Stamkos-Kucherov
Palat-Johnson-Callahan

Ride it til we die

 

[JS91]

That's not what you guys want to pay both of them though. That's the damn point.

You guys want to give Kuch 6-7 mil while saying Stamkos isn't even worth that. Yet, the worst version of Stamkos is still out producing the guy you say is worth more.

I doubt anyone here would be against signing Stamkos to a 6-7 million a year deal. What we've said is that Stamkos' recent performances barely justify his current contract which is true. No matter how bad he is in every other aspect of the game his goalscoring abilities are still worth around what he is currently making. Giving him a raise would be stupid simply because he hasn't earned it in the last 2 years.

Paying Kucherov 6-7 million, while a bit extreme, is still more reasonable than paying Stamkos 9+ because he is continuously improving, still only 22 years old and a lot more dynamic forward than Stamkos. If we give him a short term deal like Stamkos and he keeps improving we're looking at Kucherovgeddon when he has to be resigned again. Even if he stays at the level he's at right now he'll be worth 6-7 million easily especially if the cap goes up and even if it doesn't.

 

[Volodya Krutov]

I agree that he is one dimentional, but concidering we have a hard time scoring goals, that is the most important dimention.

If he is not worthy of being payed as an all around elite hockey player, than what do you pay an annual top goal scorer like him? Kinda hard to say because his accomplishments almost put him into his own category.

Lets just say for the sake of argument he has a good second half and gets himself up into the top 3-5 in goals and leads the team in points (which isn't too unrealist). Does he deserve any raise or no?

The main point is that even if Stamkos has a great second half his fundamental style doesn't fit the evolution of the game. Today we need speed, skills, puck possession, versatility, 2 way game and hockey smartness to be a dominant team in such a competitive league... And paying franchise money to a one dimensional sniper is a thing of the past, we really, really need to resist to the temptation and adapt or we'll regret it for a long time. IMO.

I don't know whether Stamkos deserves a raise but I know for sure I don't want his next contract to be at the expense of Johnson, Palat, Kucherov and Hedman.

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

The main point is that even if Stamkos has a great second half his fundamental style doesn't fit the evolution of the game. Today we need speed, skills, puck possession, versatility, 2 way game and hockey smartness to be a dominant team in such a competitive league... And paying franchise money to a one dimensional sniper is a thing of the past, we really, really need to resist to the temptation and adapt or we'll regret it for a long time. IMO.

I don't know whether Stamkos deserves a raise but I know for sure I don't want his next contract to be at the expense of Johnson, Palat, Kucherov and Hedman.

I think the bolded is what's really important here (and I was thinking this exact thing in my own wording today). This guy managed to develop himself into a really potent weapon in a paradigm that really isn't seen as being a good recipe for success anymore and he's struggling to adapt (IMO).

 

[wxkid23]

Nice game tonight

 

[dechire]

Nice game tonight

He's had some really good games since his last terrible one which was Toronto. I'm not saying that the media spotlight was affecting him but....

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

He's had some really good games since his last terrible one which was Toronto. I'm not saying that the media spotlight was affecting him but....

The narrative I want to believe: Stamkos saw the "Sign Stamkos" things being handed out and decided finally, "There's no way I can really, actually sign with that team and have that kind of media spotlight."

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

He's been shooting more. That's #1. Can't score if you don't shoot.

Last 4 games:

12/26 - 3 shots on goal / 2 PP goals
12/22 - 5 shots on goal / 0 goals
12/20 - 7 shots on goal / 2 goals (1 PP & 1 empty netter)
12/18 - 5 shots on goal / 1 goal


Previous 10 game goalless streak:

12/15 - 1 shot on goal
12/14 - 1 shot on goal
12/12 - 2 shots on goal
12/10 - 2 shots on goal
12/6 - 0 shots on goal
12/5 - 1 shot on goal
12/2 - 1 shot on goal
11/28 - 5 shots on goal
11/27 - 3 shots on goal
11/25 - 1 shot on goal

Since that goal he scored vs the Caps that finally put his 10 game goal slump to rest, the monkey's off his back and pucks are now going in for him. A scoring Stamkos is a happy Stamkos.

 

[Hoek]

Yeah I almost feel like we should be grading him on his SOGs more than just the Gs.

 

[LightningStrikes]

He's been shooting more. That's #1. Can't score if you don't shoot.

Last 4 games:

12/26 - 3 shots on goal / 2 PP goals
12/22 - 5 shots on goal / 0 goals
12/20 - 7 shots on goal / 2 goals (1 PP & 1 empty netter)
12/18 - 5 shots on goal / 1 goal


Previous 10 game goalless streak:

12/15 - 1 shot on goal
12/14 - 1 shot on goal
12/12 - 2 shots on goal
12/10 - 2 shots on goal
12/6 - 0 shots on goal
12/5 - 1 shot on goal
12/2 - 1 shot on goal
11/28 - 5 shots on goal
11/27 - 3 shots on goal
11/25 - 1 shot on goal

Since that goal he scored vs the Caps that finally put his 10 game goal slump to rest, the monkey's off his back and pucks are now going in for him. A scoring Stamkos is a happy Stamkos.

Who'da thought the solution is so easy. Just shoot the puck.

 

[The Gongshow]

He's got some swagger now. Looks like he shaved his beard, maybe it was holding him back

 

[Volodya Krutov]

Played a solid game, very few mistakes. The more he keeps things simple the better Stamkos plays.

 

[Todd1a]

He's got some swagger now. Looks like he shaved his beard, maybe it was holding him back

cooper is that you ?

 

[These Are The Days]

Any rumor as to when this first and final offer is supposed to happen? Christ it's going on 6+ months and the only update was almost 2 months ago saying it was, "virtually nowhere." This is ridiculous

 

[Todd1a]

Any rumor as to when this first and final offer is supposed to happen? Christ it's going on 6+ months and the only update was almost 2 months ago saying it was, "virtually nowhere." This is ridiculous

it would not surprise me if stamkos resigned like 3 days before the nhl trade deadline. I expect nothing to happen till we get close to the deadline.

 

[These Are The Days]

I tell ya, Todd this is just mind numbing right now. I don't know the degree of politics involved in these negotiations but I pray to God we never have to go through the hassle of ever signing Stamkos to a contract again.

I can't even comprehend how stressful, aggravating and exhausting dealing with this crap day after day is.

And we still have: Kucherov, Killorn, Drouin, Hedman, Bishop, Palat and Johnson to sign after the following season.

I'm not gonna handle 6+ months of these guys dicking around on us sending more mixed signals than a 16 year old girl about who she wants as her prom date

 

[CupsOverCash]

I tell ya, Todd this is just mind numbing right now. I don't know the degree of politics involved in these negotiations but I pray to God we never have to go through the hassle of ever signing Stamkos to a contract again.

I can't even comprehend how stressful, aggravating and exhausting dealing with this crap day after day is.

And we still have: Kucherov, Killorn, Drouin, Hedman, Bishop, Palat and Johnson to sign after the following season.

I'm not gonna handle 6+ months of these guys dicking around on us sending more mixed signals than a 16 year old girl about who she wants as her prom date

Well at least we are signing good players. We could be on the opposite side of the spectrum where we don't have a core and have to build one from scratch.

 

[These Are The Days]

Well at least we are signing good players. We could be on the opposite side of the spectrum where we don't have a core and have to build one from scratch.

Well lord knows we've spent long enough drafting and building one: Kucherov, Palat, Johnson, Stamkos, Drouin, Hedman, Killorn, Brown. I'd hate for Stamkos to walk when we got so close like Marty did.

If we still had St. Louis last year I guarantee you we that would've won the Stanley Cup. We would've lured Stralman here from New York no matter what and at worst we would've kept Nate Thompson as our bottom 6 stud. He's not as good as Boyle but it would've sufficed. And right now we'd be down a top 6 forward but we would've had Drouin annointed the heir apparent to St. Louis' throne. It's nothing against Callahan but I'd rather be looking for him right now and to have been a champion than to have him right now and have fallen short.

But who knows? Maybe without him Stralman and Boyle don't sign with us period and God knows we don't make it to the SCF without Stralman.

 

[CupsOverCash]

Well lord knows we've spent long enough drafting and building one: Kucherov, Palat, Johnson, Stamkos, Drouin, Hedman, Killorn, Brown. I'd hate for Stamkos to walk when we got so close like Marty did.

If we still had St. Louis last year I guarantee you we that would've won the Stanley Cup. We would've lured Stralman here from New York no matter what and at worst we would've kept Nate Thompson as our bottom 6 stud. He's not as good as Boyle but it would've sufficed. And right now we'd be down a top 6 forward but we would've had Drouin annointed the heir apparent to St. Louis' throne. It's nothing against Callahan but I'd rather be looking for him right now and to have been a champion than to have him right now and have fallen short.

But who knows? Maybe without him Stralman and Boyle don't sign with us period and God knows we don't make it to the SCF without Stralman.

Who knows. I'm happy we were able to get those guys because your right no way we get that far without Stralman and I thought Cally was one of our best players in the playoffs last year.

MSL looked like he was on his last legs last year. At the moment I just want to see our team get healthy and get on a roll. That would be best case scenario.

I don't think there would be anything cooler than to see this team get over some big adversity and get back to where they were last year.

It's within reach and teams in front of us seem to be losing and getting their own adversity lately. If we can get healthy and get on a run I like our chances vs anybody. Just gotta get our PP going.

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

Well lord knows we've spent long enough drafting and building one: Kucherov, Palat, Johnson, Stamkos, Drouin, Hedman, Killorn, Brown. I'd hate for Stamkos to walk when we got so close like Marty did.

If we still had St. Louis last year I guarantee you we that would've won the Stanley Cup. We would've lured Stralman here from New York no matter what and at worst we would've kept Nate Thompson as our bottom 6 stud. He's not as good as Boyle but it would've sufficed. And right now we'd be down a top 6 forward but we would've had Drouin annointed the heir apparent to St. Louis' throne. It's nothing against Callahan but I'd rather be looking for him right now and to have been a champion than to have him right now and have fallen short.

But who knows? Maybe without him Stralman and Boyle don't sign with us period and God knows we don't make it to the SCF without Stralman.

It could be worse. We could have paid Niskanen 5+

 

[These Are The Days]

It could be worse. We could have paid Niskanen 5+

But we're paying Carle that!!!

 

[LightningStrikes]

He's good again! Sign him SFY!

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

But we're paying Carle that!!!

Not for long