So how about trading Seth .....

[triggrman]

I don't know if he'll ever be the franchise player he's projected to be or not. I will say that I wasn't sold on the pick until I saw him play. He's one of the smoothest skaters I've seen, period, and he has a very active stick. I do think he'll always tend to be soft but (despite what some here expect) there's been a lot of big guys that didn't have that physical streak that did quite well on the back end because of the right positioning.

I don't think Ekholm was any more physical than Jones and he's just as big but he was still very effective.

Suter isn't remotely physical and can't even skate like Jones but uses his IQ to be effective in the defensive end.

Again, I'm not projecting Jones or even Ekholm to be high end defensive defensemen, just saying that all defensemen have a weakness, even the guys labeled franchise players.

 

[ILikeItILoveIt]

This thread was started under the assumption that many NHL teams will trade for Jones based on his future, and we'd get a Top 6 forward now or a young forward projected to be Top 6 just like Jones is projected to be a Top 1 or 2 D-man.

We're betting on Jones to develop. I get that. I just have this feeling he's been hyped his whole young career because hockey definitely needs more African-American stars, and his size and skating ability certainly indicate he could be great someday. That said, we're deep at the D position so if we can get the right deal (i.e. Top 6 forward or about to be), then his value is better spent to get that forward.

We may be able to get a slightly better player now for Josi, but we'd be giving up much more of a finished product and lose much more of today's productivity in Josi.

The Jones hype and is marketability are attractive to many NHL teams, which could cause them to overpay in an area of need for us.

 

[Drake744]

This thread was started under the assumption that many NHL teams will trade for Jones based on his future, and we'd get a Top 6 forward now or a young forward projected to be Top 6 just like Jones is projected to be a Top 1 or 2 D-man.

We're betting on Jones to develop. I get that. I just have this feeling he's been hyped his whole young career because hockey definitely needs more African-American stars, and his size and skating ability certainly indicate he could be great someday. That said, we're deep at the D position so if we can get the right deal (i.e. Top 6 forward or about to be), then his value is better spent to get that forward.

We may be able to get a slightly better player now for Josi, but we'd be giving up much more of a finished product and lose much more of today's productivity in Josi.

The Jones hype and is marketability are attractive to many NHL teams, which could cause them to overpay in an area of need for us.

I think Jones is going to be a really good defenseman and I think because we have Josi, he looks like an expendable commodity. Is he? Sure, I suppose, but I think trading him would be a huge mistake.

First, he doesn't even turn 20 until next season starts. Defensemen take a long time to develop traditionally. Not that people don't know that, but it's very hard to see just how good he can be in a couple short years, and very easy to forget that while we say "yeah, he's a good player but we could trade him for (player X)" he's still only 19. One could make the comparison that a defenseman this well-rounded and adept at 19 is the equivalent to a forward at 17. I've seen Mike Fisher say (on TV, in front of a national audience) that he thinks Jones is better than Erik Karlsson was at his age when they were both in Ottawa. I just get a feeling that he's going to be a guy that we'd be kicking ourselves in every possible body part in 5 or 6 years if we let him go.

Second, Josi seems to be the reason why some people feel it's okay to let Jones go, but he's had 4 (or 5, or 53, whatever) concussions so far and he's only going to be 24 when next season starts. His long-term health is far from certain (as already evidenced in the early part of this season) so I'm not sure we need to be getting rid of the top defensive prospect in the league right now.

The whole thing just stinks of potential regret to me, that's all.

 

[Persona5]

It all goes back to last years draft. Most people would say we won the draft but personally I think we would have been better off picking 3rd or 5th. Picking 4th we were pretty much forced into picking Jones over help at forward and while it's not all bad that we got Jones it really wasn't a team need in any way. Moving Klein proves that imo. We would have never moved Klein if we had Druin or Monohan from that draft and we would be better off at forward.

With that said if we could move Jones now for a very good return I would be all for it.

 

[nomorekids]

I don't know if he'll ever be the franchise player he's projected to be or not. I will say that I wasn't sold on the pick until I saw him play. He's one of the smoothest skaters I've seen, period, and he has a very active stick. I do think he'll always tend to be soft but (despite what some here expect) there's been a lot of big guys that didn't have that physical streak that did quite well on the back end because of the right positioning.

I don't think Ekholm was any more physical than Jones and he's just as big but he was still very effective.

Suter isn't remotely physical and can't even skate like Jones but uses his IQ to be effective in the defensive end.

Again, I'm not projecting Jones or even Ekholm to be high end defensive defensemen, just saying that all defensemen have a weakness, even the guys labeled franchise players.

I don't mean to imply that soft = bad defensively, Jones has just had a history of being lacking defensively, even in Portland. Suter was always billed as being airtight defensively, even coming out of college. Jones has been more "Incredible skater and puckmover, will hopefully round out his game in time."

 

[NSH615]

I don't mean to imply that soft = bad defensively, Jones has just had a history of being lacking defensively, even in Portland. Suter was always billed as being airtight defensively, even coming out of college. Jones has been more "Incredible skater and puckmover, will hopefully round out his game in time."

Based on that quote, sounds like he needs to spends some time in Milwaukee developing.

 

[Armourboy]

Based on that quote, sounds like he needs to spends some time in Milwaukee developing.

Problem with that though, how much good would it do? Even with his short comings, he's probably still your 3rd best Dman at this point. Thats not really someone you let develop in the AHL.

Right now, I'm perfectly happy keeping him here. First he now has a full season under his belt, he knows what to expect and he knows what he needs to work on. Second, he's basically your insurance policy, if Josi were to go down for good due to his concussion history.

Did we get hosed last year and basically get stuck drafting Jones? Sure, but if you are gonna get stuck, he's a pretty good kid to get stuck with.

 

[PredsV82]

It all goes back to last years draft. Most people would say we won the draft but personally I think we would have been better off picking 3rd or 5th. Picking 4th we were pretty much forced into picking Jones over help at forward and while it's not all bad that we got Jones it really wasn't a team need in any way. Moving Klein proves that imo. We would have never moved Klein if we had Druin or Monohan from that draft and we would be better off at forward.

With that said if we could move Jones now for a very good return I would be all for it.

it has been rumored that Poile was prepared to trade up to get Jones if necessary, so I think we werent getting forward help no matter what

 

[Armourboy]

it has been rumored that Poile was prepared to trade up to get Jones if necessary, so I think we werent getting forward help no matter what

I think if that was the case he would have, even as the picks were coming in no one expected him to drop to 4. Not picked at #1? Sure, but 4? Not so much.

There was some teams in front of us that needed defense pretty bad, heck most of them still do ( including the Avs), the fact he was even there to end up on a team that didn't really need more defense was pretty crazy.

 

[bdub24]

Problem with that though, how much good would it do? Even with his short comings, he's probably still your 3rd best Dman at this point. Thats not really someone you let develop in the AHL.

Right now, I'm perfectly happy keeping him here. First he now has a full season under his belt, he knows what to expect and he knows what he needs to work on. Second, he's basically your insurance policy, if Josi were to go down for good due to his concussion history.

Did we get hosed last year and basically get stuck drafting Jones? Sure, but if you are gonna get stuck, he's a pretty good kid to get stuck with.

Plus his mom would go bananas

 

[dougie1107]

Problem with that though, how much good would it do? Even with his short comings, he's probably still your 3rd best Dman at this point. Thats not really someone you let develop in the AHL.

Right now, I'm perfectly happy keeping him here. First he now has a full season under his belt, he knows what to expect and he knows what he needs to work on. Second, he's basically your insurance policy, if Josi were to go down for good due to his concussion history.

Did we get hosed last year and basically get stuck drafting Jones? Sure, but if you are gonna get stuck, he's a pretty good kid to get stuck with.

Ellis is better than Jones no doubt. Jones is probably the fourth or fifth best defenseman the Predators have, and I don't think he's ready for top 4 minutes.

 

[NSH615]

Ellis is better than Jones no doubt. Jones is probably the fourth or fifth best defenseman the Predators have, and I don't think he's ready for top 4 minutes.

IMO he was thrown to the wolves and put on a show at first but then started to get eaten more and more as the season went on. It was a shame he couldn't have gone to Milwaukee if even for just a week or two for conditioning during the season. Definitely needs 2-3 years of development.

 

[triggrman]

The game was not over his head, the conditioning was though. His body just wasn't used to that sort of grind.

 

[dougie1107]

I would say the game was over his head a bit. He was just flat out unreliable in the defensive zone this season. He's simply just not ready yet.

 

[Armourboy]

Ellis is better than Jones no doubt. Jones is probably the fourth or fifth best defenseman the Predators have, and I don't think he's ready for top 4 minutes.

He should be better, he's been a pro for how long? I don't think he's that much better if at all. Better conditioned? Sure, but lets not act Ellis is a defensive juggernaut who gets pushed around at best. Ellis was playing 3rd pair and the PP for a reason.

One thing that Trotz knows is defense, if Ellis was that much better he would of been playing where Jones was and he wasn't. Did Ellis improve this season? Sure, but is anyone in the league just salivating at the future of Ellis? Not even most of us are anymore.

 

[dougie1107]

Um did you decide to take the year off from watching hockey? Ellis went on quite a long streak towards the end of the season of playing 20:00 a game and even before that not long after the MDZ trade did Ellis replace Jones on the second pairing. Because he's better and under Housley he's beginning to flourish. Ellis is going to be an outstanding defenseman in Nashville. He was very reliable in both ends; Jones wasn't. I don't know why people are claiming Jones wasn't well conditioned... without his conditioning his season would've been nightmarish. I think it's absolutely ridiculous everyone gave up on Ellis after we drafted Jones, then when he has his breakout season and does noticeably better than Jones people refuse to admit it. Ellis is better than Jones, plain and simple. His upside is right up there with Jones and at this moment he's better. If this is a team that wants to make the playoffs ASAP then Ellis is a much better answer than Jones.

 

[PFL615]

Lol Jones is 19 freaking years old and played in his first NHL season. Ellis is 23 and has been in the NHL or AHL for 3 years. So of coarse he plays better. Jones will be skating circles around Ellis in the same amount of time and has the potential to be a franchise player. I know he is the new shiny let's trade him for scoring but come on...

 

[NSH615]

Lol Jones is 19 freaking years old and played in his first NHL season. Ellis is 23 and has been in the NHL or AHL for 3 years. So of coarse he plays better. Jones will be skating circles around Ellis in the same amount of time and has the potential to be a franchise player. I know he is the new shiny let's trade him for scoring but come on...

I am not doubting his talent and skill for his age, but I do not feel Jones is/was ready for prime time yet and the last half of the season proved that.

The problem with the Jones story was 2 things.

1) He was too good to keep playing where he was at (against kids in Juniors), but not eligible to go to the next level (Milwaukee), thus he had to make the jump to the NHL if he wanted to progress.

2) He was overused by Trotz. Up until he was injured at Chicago on March 23rd, he was the only player to play in every game of the season for Nashville. Trotz should have rested him some throughout the season, if only for a game here and there. This would have helped keep him from wearing down as much.

 

[triggrman]

I would say the game was over his head a bit. He was just flat out unreliable in the defensive zone this season. He's simply just not ready yet.

You'd be hard pressed to find many that agreed with that prior to Christmas.

He came in for Josi and looked like a star defenseman early in the season.

I also wouldn't say Ellis played better, all season. Ellis just finished stronger.

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

You'd be hard pressed to find many that agreed with that prior to Christmas.

He came in for Josi and looked like a star defenseman early in the season.

I also wouldn't say Ellis played better, all season. Ellis just finished stronger.

Agreed on Jones. He was playing at least 20 mins a game for a couple months. During the later part of the season, I just think he ran out of gas. In my opinion, he should of sat every third game during the second half of the season.

 

[dougie1107]

You'd be hard pressed to find many that agreed with that prior to Christmas.

He came in for Josi and looked like a star defenseman early in the season.

I also wouldn't say Ellis played better, all season. Ellis just finished stronger.

It's not hard to look like a star defenseman next to Weber.

As soon as Josi came back Jones' game took a very noticeable drop.

For the most part Jones and Ellis played alongside the same guys other than Jones' stint with Weber and Ellis looked better. If Ellis was put next to Weber in replacement of Josi he also would've looked like a star defenseman.

 

[Drake744]

It's not hard to look like a star defenseman next to Weber.

It's hard to look like a star defenseman at barely 19 years old, regardless of who you are.

As soon as Josi came back Jones' game took a very noticeable drop.

For the most part Jones and Ellis played alongside the same guys other than Jones' stint with Weber and Ellis looked better. If Ellis was put next to Weber in replacement of Josi he also would've looked like a star defenseman.

If you take into account the physical grind that Jones had never experienced, Ellis's breakout season, and Ellis's experience......yeah, I would assume that Ellis would look every bit as good as Jones if not better. Do I think Ellis will be better than Jones in 2, 3, or 4 years? Absolutely not.

 

[triggrman]

It's not hard to look like a star defenseman next to Weber.

As soon as Josi came back Jones' game took a very noticeable drop.

For the most part Jones and Ellis played alongside the same guys other than Jones' stint with Weber and Ellis looked better. If Ellis was put next to Weber in replacement of Josi he also would've looked like a star defenseman.

Disagree. Jones started the season with Ekholm and both looked really good together right out of the gate.

 

[Persona5]

At the start of the season when Jones was forced into top line minutes with Weber, he played pretty well but I would put more into being with Weber more than him honestly. Weber was not nearly productive with Jones at his side and that had a lot to do with how Weber had to play. He was for more likely to help Jones out and play back more. Once Josi came back and things got settled Weber started on his bid for the Norris and made such a strong push he ended up a finalist.

I personally think Jones played ok to start and then fell off the face of the earth toward the end. I'm not saying he won't be an elite d-man but for now he is best suited for the 3rd pairing on our team. If we could get players people are offering like Couture or Galchenyuk and Eller than I would do that deal in a second. It's not that I think we would win that trade all out forever and ever. It's that we would win the trade for the next year or two and it would be at a position of need.

 

[BigFatCat999]

Disagree. Jones started the season with Ekholm and both looked really good together right out of the gate.

Both are similar sized players. Height 76", Weight Jones 205, Ekholm 204, Ekholm is 3.5 years younger. Ekholm is a little bit more of a PK type Dman and Jones a little but more of a PP type Dman.

MDZ just doesn't look right with Ellis hat's why I would like Dialby to push for a spot out of the gate. I could see Garrett Noonan push for a spot, LHD, 71" 205lbs, DOB 91' 4 yr NCAA player. .59 pts a game. Compared to Ellis he's a giant bruiser. If anyone 3 would do it. It will be Bitetto, Noonan, and Dialby.