Equipment: SKATES - Buying Guide and Advice IV

[Solmors]

i got a pair of bauer vapor 2xpro's off of sidelineswap a couple weeks ago and have had a really good experience with them so far. i play beer league friday-saturday and have had a couple weekends of 9-14 games reffing and had no pain at all, but thats just me. don't cheap out on footbeds either, i have used speedplates and superfeet, i find the superfeet more comfortable while the speedplates are way better at feeling your edges on the ice, thats my experience at least.

you can find some pretty good deals on on sidelineswap you just have to shop around quite a bit, thats the route i would go personally.

I forgot about sidelineswap! I'll check it out and keep an eye out for good deals in my size. In the meantime, good idea about the footbeds/insoles. I'll see if my local shop carries them so I can try them out first.

Keep in mind that part of the pain is most likely just your foot muscles getting used to being in skates for an hour at a time. I notice during times where I'd have significant gaps between playing (6 months or more) that foot pain would develop for the first handful of ice sessions. No different than someone who sat all day for work taking a job where they need to stand all day. It will seem like misery for the first couple weeks while your foot muscles adjust. Speaking from experience.

Personally I'd keep skating on the ones you have for another 5-6 ice sessions. If there is no improvement and you still feel pain, then try Superfeet insoles as the previous poster suggested. Make sure you get the right size insole, I made that mistake once. I highly recommend Super-feet insoles.

If none of that works, then go with new skates. I'd also point out that as you go up in price, your also going up in stiffness and rigidity. For someone just learning how to skate in ice hockey I don't think stiffer skates help but may actually hinder your skating development as you'll have a harder time developing the muscles used for balance, pivots, turning, etc while wearing a stiff higher end skate. The skate is essentially doing some of that work for you with the stiffer boot. Think of it like cheating on a test.

In the long run I think your better off staying with a more flexible boot and working your way up. I've been playing 30 years and am certainly no pro but I would say a experienced skater and I still find my skating isn't really strong enough to move to a full-composite boot and I wear essentially the price point just below the top (Bauer Nexus 7000 - 2014-15 model) which is a tech-mesh with more flex than the Curve Composite boot of the next model up (Nexus 8000). If you do buy new skates you might want to consider the stuff in the $300-ish range to get that added flex while still learning.

This is great information, thank you! I think I will play the season out with my current skates then, but if I'm still having pain after 2-3 more weeks I'll look into getting some insoles. I'm just using the stock/normal insoles that came with the skates at the moment.

 

[Sky04]

Short:
I have a pair of old Bauer Vapor X:50 skates from ~2010 that don't have that many games/use but are causing foot pain after ~60 minutes or so of wearing them. I'm willing to spend ~$600 on a new pair that fit me well and are nicer. Would you all recommend I go to the local shop, get fitted, and newest generation mid-tier, or get fitted and wait for a sale on an older generation high-tier?

Long:
Around 2010 I was looking to get into playing hockey for the first time after being a life long fan but not being able to afford to play. I got lower-mid tier gear including my Bauer Vapor X:50 skates on sale/clearance deals, so while the skates are the right size (probably) they were not fitted and have never felt that comfortable to me. Unfortunately I ran into tight financial times and never was able to start playing, only using the skates a couple times a year at open skate times.

Two years ago I joined an adult learn to play class, did well enough that I got invited to a lower level team and played 2 games. And then covid hit. But now restrictions are lifted and I have played my 4th ice hockey game ever!

As you can imagine my skates don't really have that much wear on them for being 11+ years old. But like I said, they are uncomfortable and after ~45 minutes (usually towards the end of the 2nd, start of the 3rd period) my feet start hurting and I lose some feeling in the little toes of my left foot. I am willing to spend up to around $600 on a new pair of skates, which gives me a few options (After going to the local shop and getting fitted):

1. Newest generation mid-tier (Bauer 3S, CCM Jetspeed FT485, etc)
2. Older generation high-tier (Bauer 3x, CCM Jetspeed FT2, etc) that I can find on sale/clearance somewhere. May have to wait for a deal.
3. True TF9
4. Deal with what I have until I absolutely can't stand it and want to quit.

Thoughts?

I definitely wouldn't suggest staying on those 10 year old skates, you'd be surprised how much the technology has improved in the newer models in terms of comfort and fit.

I personally wouldn't go with the "newest gen," feels like the best bang for your buck is getting the previous top models on sale but comfort and fit are first and foremost so if one of the newer skates just fit your feet the best then go for it although if you're relatively new skater I'm not sure you'll get the most out of a top-end skate. I think the sweet spot is the $300-500~ tier and you can probably find last years model on sale for <$300 as well.

Wouldn't suggest the TF9's if you have narrow feet, they have a medium-high volume boot and they're pretty wide. If you're coming from a vapor line and want to stick with it the previous years X2.9 and 2X are very, very comfortable skates and are on clearance right now, if you're looking for a CCM, the Jetspeed line is similar to the Vapor.

 

[miscs75]

Recently went on an adventure to find new skates to replace my 709 (Canadian made, mesh lining) from 2013. I currently wear those in a size 7W. Tried on the Vapor 3X, Supreme 3S, CCM Jetspeed FT4 and Ribcor 90k, all in a 6.5EE/fit3. Not one of them felt right on the outside of the left skate. All of them either felt just slightly too narrow or pressure on the pinky toe in the case of the FT4. I did get scanned with the Bauer scanner which measured me out to a 6.25 fit 3 (if I want my toes touching the front). Not one store I went to has the True TF7/9 in stock in wide width.
Anyone familiar with the True stock skates that would be able to know if they’d work as opposed to the other ones.

 

[Evergreen]

Recently went on an adventure to find new skates to replace my 709 (Canadian made, mesh lining) from 2013. I currently wear those in a size 7W. Tried on the Vapor 3X, Supreme 3S, CCM Jetspeed FT4 and Ribcor 90k, all in a 6.5EE/fit3. Not one of them felt right on the outside of the left skate. All of them either felt just slightly too narrow or pressure on the pinky toe in the case of the FT4. I did get scanned with the Bauer scanner which measured me out to a 6.25 fit 3 (if I want my toes touching the front). Not one store I went to has the True TF7/9 in stock in wide width.
Anyone familiar with the True stock skates that would be able to know if they’d work as opposed to the other ones.

Why don't you just buy another pair of 709s? Graf still makes them.

Hockey Plus - Best Pricing on Graf G709 Pro Senior Hockey Skates

 

[miscs75]

Why don't you just buy another pair of 709s? Graf still makes them.

Hockey Plus - Best Pricing on Graf G709 Pro Senior Hockey Skates

Looking for a stiffer boot. Ideally if they made the 709 fit with the modern materials over leather/synthetic leather that would be amazing.

 

[Evergreen]

Looking for a stiffer boot. Ideally if they made the 709 fit with the modern materials over leather/synthetic leather that would be amazing.

You can custom order 709s from Graf with basically whatever materials you want, including their modern carbon material. I also think you'd be surprised how stiff a new pair of 709s would be compared to the ones you've been wearing and breaking down for so long.

 

[miscs75]

You can custom order 709s from Graf with basically whatever materials you want, including their modern carbon material. I also think you'd be surprised how stiff a new pair of 709s would be compared to the ones you've been wearing and breaking down for so long.

Custom was the one thing I’m steering away from due to the price of the actual skate. I have no problem going slightly oversized if it means I can save myself $400 in the end. The actual difference between a 6.5EE and 7EE (or comparable width) is minuscule in terms of actual length of the skate so it wouldn’t really be like skating in improperly fitting skates if the heel lock is there.
I did call Graf and speak to someone who asked for photos of my skates to see if he can find something comparable in Europe that isn’t a leather boot. The current model 709 is not something I’d be interested in honestly even though a new skate in the same model will be stiffer due to no breakdown.

 

[Evergreen]

Custom was the one thing I’m steering away from due to the price of the actual skate. I have no problem going slightly oversized if it means I can save myself $400 in the end. The actual difference between a 6.5EE and 7EE (or comparable width) is minuscule in terms of actual length of the skate so it wouldn’t really be like skating in improperly fitting skates if the heel lock is there.
I did call Graf and speak to someone who asked for photos of my skates to see if he can find something comparable in Europe that isn’t a leather boot. The current model 709 is not something I’d be interested in honestly even though a new skate in the same model will be stiffer due to no breakdown.

Something to keep in mind going from size $ to 6.5 is that generally the 6.5 uses a shorter holder. Not sure if that is the case with EE but make sure to check. I made the change from 7 to 6.5 and I wish I had known because the change in holder size was a problem for me.

 

[miscs75]

Something to keep in mind going from size $ to 6.5 is that generally the 6.5 uses a shorter holder. Not sure if that is the case with EE but make sure to check. I made the change from 7 to 6.5 and I wish I had known because the change in holder size was a problem for me.

6.5EE-7EE both use a 263mm holder. The D width is where it changes when you go up/down a size. Using a standard size chart measures 10” for a 6.5 and 10.2” for a 7 in terms of overall skate length. I’m not sure if that is across the board for all skates but I’m sure most are on par with that.

 

[althoma1]

Recently went on an adventure to find new skates to replace my 709 (Canadian made, mesh lining) from 2013. I currently wear those in a size 7W. Tried on the Vapor 3X, Supreme 3S, CCM Jetspeed FT4 and Ribcor 90k, all in a 6.5EE/fit3. Not one of them felt right on the outside of the left skate. All of them either felt just slightly too narrow or pressure on the pinky toe in the case of the FT4. I did get scanned with the Bauer scanner which measured me out to a 6.25 fit 3 (if I want my toes touching the front). Not one store I went to has the True TF7/9 in stock in wide width.
Anyone familiar with the True stock skates that would be able to know if they’d work as opposed to the other ones.

I have 7W TF9 boots converted for inline. I scan as a 7.5 Fit 3 Bauer and wear 8EE Mako II ice skates. The TF9 in wide is wider in the forefoot than an EE Supertack (I tried on 8EE in those and they pinched the widest part of my feet near the baby toe).

After baking, the True retail skates fit about a half size longer than Bauer. I think a 6W may work for you. It will feel too small before baking, but they really open up after baking.

 

[miscs75]

I have 7W TF9 boots converted for inline. I scan as a 7.5 Fit 3 Bauer and wear 8EE Mako II ice skates. The TF9 in wide is wider in the forefoot than an EE Supertack (I tried on 8EE in those and they pinched the widest part of my feet near the baby toe).

After baking, the True retail skates fit about a half size longer than Bauer. I think a 6W may work for you. It will feel too small before baking, but they really open up after baking.

I wound up ordering a TF9 in 7W. I’ll bake them when they come in and adjust from there. The 30 day warranty is a godsend.

 

[althoma1]

I wound up ordering a TF9 in 7W. I’ll bake them when they come in and adjust from there. The 30 day warranty is a godsend.

I am 99% sure that a 7W will be too long if you're a 6.5 in Bauer and CCM, but yes the 30 day guarantee is great.

When I tried on an 8W, it was clearly too big even before baking. The 7.5W felt perfect lengthwise before baking, but I went with the 7W based on sizing posts in a modsquadhockey.com, Reddit and a YouTube video. The 7W felt too small before baking, my toes were hard against the cap. Even after baking they felt a touch small, but after a second bake and 20 hours of skating they feel like the same length as my 8EE Makos.
Here is the Reddit thread with a link to the video:

 

[miscs75]

I am 99% sure that a 7W will be too long in you're a 6.5 in Bauer and CCM, but yes the 30 day guarantee is great.

When I tried on an 8W, it was clearly too big even before baking. The 7.5W felt perfect lengthwise before baking, but I went with the 7W based on sizing posts in a modsquadhockey.com, Reddit and a YouTube video. The 7W felt too small before baking, my toes were hard against the cap. Even after baking they felt a touch small, but after a second bake and 20 hours of skating they feel like the same length as my 8EE Makos.
Here is the Reddit thread with a link to the video:

I did watch that video and do a bit of research but found a bunch of scattered stuff. For Long Island being a small hockey hotbed, no one knows how to size properly or do anything outside of push custom skates. If these are too big, I’ll just contact the site and exchange them for a smaller size. I’m not desperate for skates thankfully.

 

[beedee]

So I’ve been skating on Bauer Vapor x500’s for the last few years. They are starting to get a bit worn out, cut up, etc. I got these before Bauer introduced their foot scanner. Fast forward to a few months back and I had my foot scanned at Pure Hockey. Ironically it recommended a 7EE Vapor (which is the size and width I have) or Fit 2.

On Tuesday I was in PH again with my family, wife wanted to get her foot scanned and possibly new skates. This is when I saw the CCM JetSpeed FT485, I wanted to try it on even though I thought I was dead-set on a newer pair of Vapors. After putting on a 7.5 “Regular” FT485 I immediately noticed my foot sat deeper into the boot compared to the Vapor. I did the pencil test, and this reinforced that it was deeper, and it cleared my foot all the way up and down the boot. When doing the test on the Vapor it slightly rubbed the top of my foot around the 4th or 5th eyelet area. This explains why I always had trouble getting my Vapors laced up just right without too much pressure in that area. I’ve learned to cope, but once in awhile I’ll get them too tight and my foot will tingle. :/ Not sure why I never did the pencil test back when I bought my Vapors?!?

Anyhow, I purchased the FT485’s, (7.5 Regular) and a pair of SuperFeet (I have a low arch and it was a definite hot-spot, the SF alleviated the hot-spot). Had them baked and was on my way. Went to a public skate yesterday and couldn’t get over how bad my pinky toes were hurting. I skates for about 1.5 hours on them. I pulled the laces out and was able to determine the problematic area was where the toe cap meets the boot. It protrudes inwards a bit and gives that bunched up sock feeling, which is pretty annoying and hard to ignore. I’m thinking I need to get a 7.5 “Wide”. Unfortunately Pure Hockey didn’t have them in stock at the shop or online. I’ll have to order online from Ice Warehouse or Hockey Monkey. My fear with the "Wide" is that it will be too loose after breaking it in. Will the FT485 “Wide” provide more room in the toe cap area than the “Regular”? Is it like an EE? I sent an email to CCM to see what they have to say.

On Friday, I actually ordered the Vapor x2.9 in a 7, FIT 2, that is being cleared out by PH, free returns so I figured I might as well give it a test fit. The Vapor I tried on in PH was a 3x, so not quite an apples to apples situation in regards to the x2.9. It’s just too bad that they didn’t have the 485 in an EE so I could know for sure if it would work or not. Always a bit of a hassle to order, wait for it to be delivered and then have to send back if needed.

 

[althoma1]

So I’ve been skating on Bauer Vapor x500’s for the last few years. They are starting to get a bit worn out, cut up, etc. I got these before Bauer introduced their foot scanner. Fast forward to a few months back and I had my foot scanned at Pure Hockey. Ironically it recommended a 7EE Vapor (which is the size and width I have) or Fit 2.

On Tuesday I was in PH again with my family, wife wanted to get her foot scanned and possibly new skates. This is when I saw the CCM JetSpeed FT485, I wanted to try it on even though I thought I was dead-set on a newer pair of Vapors. After putting on a 7.5 “Regular” FT485 I immediately noticed my foot sat deeper into the boot compared to the Vapor. I did the pencil test, and this reinforced that it was deeper, and it cleared my foot all the way up and down the boot. When doing the test on the Vapor it slightly rubbed the top of my foot around the 4th or 5th eyelet area. This explains why I always had trouble getting my Vapors laced up just right without too much pressure in that area. I’ve learned to cope, but once in awhile I’ll get them too tight and my foot will tingle. :/ Not sure why I never did the pencil test back when I bought my Vapors?!?

Anyhow, I purchased the FT485’s, (7.5 Regular) and a pair of SuperFeet (I have a low arch and it was a definite hot-spot, the SF alleviated the hot-spot). Had them baked and was on my way. Went to a public skate yesterday and couldn’t get over how bad my pinky toes were hurting. I skates for about 1.5 hours on them. I pulled the laces out and was able to determine the problematic area was where the toe cap meets the boot. It protrudes inwards a bit and gives that bunched up sock feeling, which is pretty annoying and hard to ignore. I’m thinking I need to get a 7.5 “Wide”. Unfortunately Pure Hockey didn’t have them in stock at the shop or online. I’ll have to order online from Ice Warehouse or Hockey Monkey. My fear with the "Wide" is that it will be too loose after breaking it in. Will the FT485 “Wide” provide more room in the toe cap area than the “Regular”? Is it like an EE? I sent an email to CCM to see what they have to say.

On Friday, I actually ordered the Vapor x2.9 in a 7, FIT 2, that is being cleared out by PH, free returns so I figured I might as well give it a test fit. The Vapor I tried on in PH was a 3x, so not quite an apples to apples situation in regards to the x2.9. It’s just too bad that they didn’t have the 485 in an EE so I could know for sure if it would work or not. Always a bit of a hassle to order, wait for it to be delivered and then have to send back if needed.

The thing about the 7.5W Jetspeeds is, they'd be wider all over than the 7.5R. So, that might solve the width issue where the toe cap meets the boot, but then it might be too wide in the heel and midfoot.

A shop with the right equipment (a boot punch made by Custom SkateWorks) could potentially stretch the toe cap/boot area on the 7.5R:

Another option you could try would be a True TF7 or TF9 retail boot in 7R. The True retail boots are wider in the toe cap area than most CCM and Bauer boots and are really thermoformable for the rest of your foot. They're also a bit deeper than Vapors. After baking, they're definitely at least a half size longer than Bauer or CCM in the same size. Before baking, the right size will feel too small and won't be that comfortable - they open up quite a bit after a proper bake.

If the Vapors work for you or you can get the 7.5R punched or stretched where needed, great. If neither of those options work out, I'd seriously consider the True retail skates.

 

[beedee]

Last night I finally played a game in my JetSpeed FT485's. (only time I've skated in them was once at a public session) And the skates felt pretty good last night, no pain, or pressure points at all. However, I did lace these all the way up, so it took some adjusting because with my other skates, I wouldn't go up to the top eyelet. So I wasn't used to not having as much forward flex in my foot/strides. After a few minutes of skating the pinky toe issue was virtually a non-factor, I didn't even notice it. I'm not sure if it was because of all the different movements that I was making while playing, perhaps the liner inside was starting to break-in a bit and not protrude out as far as it was when new? But I feel like these might actually work out for me. Today the top part of my foot is a little sore from the extra pressure of lacing all the way up (and not having the forward flex that I'm used to when leaving it un-laced), but no lace bite issues, no extracurricular pain anywhere at all. The Vapor x2.9's I ordered are due to arrive on Saturday, so I'll try them on and maybe get them baked depending on how good or bad they feel. But so far, I'm glad that the CCM's are showing signs of promise for working for me. Also, I removed the SuperFeet as I felt like they were creating a bit of discomfort in the heel area due to the hard plastic portion that creates the lift. OEM footbeds felt fine last night.

 

[Cursed Lemon]

This is more of a rant than anything but I have never had LESS fun playing hockey than I have the last two skates trying to make my CCM Ribcor 88K's work.

I bought the regular version because I have a wide foot and thought "oh CCM traditionally have wide boots, I can get away with it), skated in them, was in serious pain the entire skate and have never felt more uncoordinated as a skater.

Bought the wide version. Less pain but the same lack of coordination, got off the ice after 30 minutes because I was completely miserable and couldn't do shit out there.

No idea if this has anything to do with it but one of the blades is slightly curved on the side which causes a visible twisting profile to appear from front to back when sharpening the blade.

Honestly have no idea what to do at this point. I've always worn CCM skates and my last pair were U+.

EDIT: And I baked both pairs by the manufacturer's recommendations.

 

[gswift]

This is more of a rant than anything but I have never had LESS fun playing hockey than I have the last two skates trying to make my CCM Ribcor 88K's work.

I bought the regular version because I have a wide foot and thought "oh CCM traditionally have wide boots, I can get away with it), skated in them, was in serious pain the entire skate and have never felt more uncoordinated as a skater.

Bought the wide version. Less pain but the same lack of coordination, got off the ice after 30 minutes because I was completely miserable and couldn't do shit out there.

No idea if this has anything to do with it but one of the blades is slightly curved on the side which causes a visible twisting profile to appear from front to back when sharpening the blade.

Honestly have no idea what to do at this point. I've always worn CCM skates and my last pair were U+.

EDIT: And I baked both pairs by the manufacturer's recommendations.

Therein lies your issue, with each generation of skates there have been changes to the boot itself, get properly fitted by someone that knows what they're doing & ignore loyalties to a specific brand. That way you get the skate that best fits your foot.

 

[Cursed Lemon]

Therein lies your issue, with each generation of skates there have been changes to the boot itself, get properly fitted by someone that knows what they're doing & ignore loyalties to a specific brand. That way you get the skate that best fits your foot.

The problem is that the skates felt fine when test fitting them. There's also no way to predict how they're going to feel on the ice until you get out there, but I've never felt as weird on the ice as I do with these skates.

 

[BruinDust]

This is more of a rant than anything but I have never had LESS fun playing hockey than I have the last two skates trying to make my CCM Ribcor 88K's work.

I bought the regular version because I have a wide foot and thought "oh CCM traditionally have wide boots, I can get away with it), skated in them, was in serious pain the entire skate and have never felt more uncoordinated as a skater.

Bought the wide version. Less pain but the same lack of coordination, got off the ice after 30 minutes because I was completely miserable and couldn't do shit out there.

No idea if this has anything to do with it but one of the blades is slightly curved on the side which causes a visible twisting profile to appear from front to back when sharpening the blade.

Honestly have no idea what to do at this point. I've always worn CCM skates and my last pair were U+.

EDIT: And I baked both pairs by the manufacturer's recommendations.

Is the bolded normal? Could it be a defective pair?

 

[Cursed Lemon]

Is the bolded normal? Could it be a defective pair?

Someone who's more well-versed in skate manufacturing will have to answer that one but I can lay a straight edge on the blade and get a pretty thick feeler gauge underneath.

This isn't the only element to why they feel wonky though. Just not the skate for me, problem is I don't know what the "skate for me" is anymore because the only other time I've ever felt this way about a pair of skates was when I was 16 and I went for a pair of Bauers that crushed my feet.

 

[BruinDust]

Someone who's more well-versed in skate manufacturing will have to answer that one but I can lay a straight edge on the blade and get a pretty thick feeler gauge underneath.

This isn't the only element to why they feel wonky though. Just not the skate for me, problem is I don't know what the "skate for me" is anymore because the only other time I've ever felt this way about a pair of skates was when I was 16 and I went for a pair of Bauers that crushed my feet.

Could it be the blade's profile? The 88k's are supposed to come with a stock 10" profile but I had a pair of LS-3 Tuuk steel profiled this time last year and my profiling shop told me the stock profile on the two blades (which was also supposed to be 10") was off by not a little but a lot. Other than the profile or a misaligned holder seems really strange what your experiencing.

 

[Cursed Lemon]

Could it be the blade's profile? The 88k's are supposed to come with a stock 10" profile but I had a pair of LS-3 Tuuk steel profiled this time last year and my profiling shop told me the stock profile on the two blades (which was also supposed to be 10") was off by not a little but a lot. Other than the profile or a misaligned holder seems really strange what your experiencing.

Well, that was actually something I was looking forward to, I actually had to buy new skates because they apparently haven't made the steel for U+ skates since biblical times and I was basically skating on a half moon. I NEED that toe and heel support when I skate, so the flattened profile should make things better not worse.

 

[BruinDust]

Well, that was actually something I was looking forward to, I actually had to buy new skates because they apparently haven't made the steel for U+ skates since biblical times and I was basically skating on a half moon. I NEED that toe and heel support when I skate, so the flattened profile should make things better not worse.

True, but my concern would be are the blades actually the profile they say they are. In my case, one blade pre-profiling was around 10.5", the other blaade my shop said was closer to an 8.5" even thought profile out-of-the-box was suppose to be a 10".

 

[Cursed Lemon]

True, but my concern would be are the blades actually the profile they say they are. In my case, one blade pre-profiling was around 10.5", the other blaade my shop said was closer to an 8.5" even thought profile out-of-the-box was suppose to be a 10".

Maybe, but I don't think that's my problem here.