Prospect Info: Shakir Mukhamadullin (#20 pick - 2020 draft)

Status
Not open for further replies.

Team Concept

Registered User
Jul 11, 2002
1,735
325
Wingdale, New York
Why are we comparing a 19 year old Philip Broberg to an 18 year old Shakir Mukhamadullin?

Shouldn't we be comparing the 18 year old Shakir to the 18 year old Broberg?

If so this is what it looks like:

After 4 games
4-0-0-0
6 shots on goal
21:18 of ice time (most on the Team Russia)

146 shifts (most on the team; Chistyakov is 2nd with 138 shifts)

Phillip Broberg as an 18 year old

7-1-0-1 -3 12 shots on goal 14:13 M/G #4 D-man in shifts and ice time on Sweden
 
  • Like
Reactions: My3Sons

ninetyeight

Registered User
Jun 3, 2007
2,009
2,987
Finland
It's just a weird mindset to say you're only excited for a prospect when they're breaking records but then you "don't expect much" and say he "doesn't look like anything special" when it's literally been 12 weeks since he was drafted.

Being this reactionary to every single thing this kid does when we know he's a long term project is just really toxic IMO. I don't really care what he's doing game to game, there's a lot of moving parts here and the only way he's going to get better is years of training and learning from his mistakes.

Are you responding to my posts or Shak critics in general. Cause first of all I'm not this reactionary to every single thing he does, this is my first post about him since the draft. Second it's not a mindset, as someone whose able to watch KHL games I've probably seen him more than most here. The fact is he looked a lot better earlier and I expected him to keep that up, which he didn't so naturally I'm less hyped.

uh, if you think Muk is simply an "offensive DMan", thats probably your first mistake right there...

Have you watched him play? His two biggest strengths are his shot and passing, he's a good skater for his size and likes to carry the puck and sometimes even drive the net with it. He's definitely not a stay at home Daneyko-like defender.
 

Blender

Registered User
Dec 2, 2009
51,440
45,319
It's just a weird mindset to say you're only excited for a prospect when they're breaking records but then you "don't expect much" and say he "doesn't look like anything special" when it's literally been 12 weeks since he was drafted.

Being this reactionary to every single thing this kid does when we know he's a long term project is just really toxic IMO. I don't really care what he's doing game to game, there's a lot of moving parts here and the only way he's going to get better is years of training and learning from his mistakes.
"What have you done for me lately" and instant gratification culture that HF is completely polluted with when it comes to prospect development. No one wants to wait until 3-5 years after someone is drafted to pass judgement, so they do it based on short term performance.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Darkauron

ninetyeight

Registered User
Jun 3, 2007
2,009
2,987
Finland
its almost like there are more than 2 types of DMen....?

Ok an offensive minded two-way puck moving defenceman. That's not what you meant and you know it, you're just trying to save face. A lot of media had him scouted as a defensive dman (even stay at home dman) predraft, which could be a reason most had him ranked so low, but thats not how he likes to play.

"What have you done for me lately" and instant gratification culture that HF is completely polluted with when it comes to prospect development. No one wants to wait until 3-5 years after someone is drafted to pass judgement, so they do it based on short term performance.

Stop being so high and mighty, we dont have to go further than the previous page to see you trash some other teams' prospects.

Ofcourse its what have you done lately, how else are we suppose to judge these players since nobody can know for sure how they turn out. If a player has an off year don't you think his stock drops?

I'd rather hear some constructive counter arguments instead of just dismissing every post you dont agree with, it's alright to have different opinions.
 

Blender

Registered User
Dec 2, 2009
51,440
45,319
Stop being so high and mighty, we dont have to go further than the previous page to see you trash some other teams' prospects.

Ofcourse its what have you done lately, how else are we suppose to judge these players since nobody can know for sure how they turn out. If a player has an off year don't you think his stock drops?

I'd rather hear some constructive counter arguments instead of just dismissing every post you dont agree with, it's alright to have different opinions.
I was commenting on single game or tournament performances, I didn't make any statements about what they will/might be in the NHL. That is the difference here.

I don't care about a player having "their stock drop" unless we're discussing trade value. Otherwise, what is important is long term projections and development, not what they did lately.
 

ninetyeight

Registered User
Jun 3, 2007
2,009
2,987
Finland
I'm with you, long term projections and development is what I'm interested as well. With Mukhamadullin it wasn't just his last few games but this whole span of few months, his better games included. I was probably over excited about him early this season, thus having to re-evaluate my expectations of him. If you guys think he has been good that's fine, I'm just telling what I'm seeing and I don't expect my opinion to matter more than as just a conversation starter (which it has).
 

Guttersniped

I like goalies who stop the puck
Sponsor
Dec 20, 2018
21,836
47,189
Not Mukhamadullin's best moment, for certain.

But you have to admit, at least he's an interesting specimen. Russian KHL teams are not particularly known for giving kids his age big minutes, but that's the case with Mukhamadullin. Team Russia is not known for relying on less-than-stellar players to lead their team in ice time during the WJC, and yet here we are.

I've found myself defending Mukhamadullin all tourney long just because many of the people attacking him are the same people who overhype lesser defensemen in the tourney like Broberg and Ryan Johnson.

We can say a couple of very encouraging things about Mukhamadullin. His coaches seem to depend on him, he is capable of making high-end plays and passes, and -- although I'm not an analytics guy -- the metrics seem to be very much in his favor. Of course, you take this with the type of play you mentioned vs. Czech, where you can pull your hair out from its roots watching him.

I'm going to give Mukhamadullin the benefit of the doubt because of a few factors.

1)How much he has improved in one year.
At the outset of analyzing players for the 2020 draft, I had Mukhamadullin very, very high. At one point he was just outside my top 10 overall. I loved his combination of size & skill set. But I had to drop him like a bullet after an inconsistent 2019-20 campaign -- exactly what you're saying. In my preliminary draft rankings, I dropped Mukhamadullin to #42. In my final rankings, I had him as a 2nd/3rd round "tweener". All along I said he was an impossible guy to rank. But ranking is what I do, so I suppose I'm a jackass for bitching about it, ha.

2)Isn't inconsistency exactly the thing which improves with age and experience?
Mukhamadullin is certainly the type of player who makes a terrible play followed by a spectacular one, and vise versa. So he's frustrating to watch. He has a game like he did vs. Canada, where he was perhaps the best player on the ice. But then we have his game vs. Czech Republic, where he was very bad. Not Broberg Vs. Russia bad, but bad nevertheless. Hopefully experience teaches the kid to bring it every night, and to not get flustered by adversity. We shall see.

Last night, an old reader of mine in my Todays Slapshot days emailed me a very interesting question. He asked -- if the draft was held again today -- would I take Mukhamadullin at #20 overall. It's interesting to me because I've been his biggest defender all week long. But I must say, the answer is no. I'm going to stick by what I originally thought -- which was to draft one of my two highest ranked players, Perreault or Khusnutdinov. If I was pressured to take a defenseman, I would take my highest ranked D at that spot who was Brock Faber (though I would trade down first for Faber and try to get him in the late 20s).

This is not to say the Mukhamadullin pick bothers me. I've seen enough which encourages me to give the pick a few years. Although -- like you -- I also get frustrated. But, then I watch any shift by Dawson Mercer in the entire WJC tourney and I'm happy again, haha.
Fitz did try to trade down, so I guess is it’s a question of taking the player you want or not with the pick you have. It was the same with Yzerman picking Seider 6th after failing to to trade down.
 

Jason MacIsaac

Registered User
Jan 13, 2004
22,256
6,003
Halifax, NS
Are you responding to my posts or Shak critics in general. Cause first of all I'm not this reactionary to every single thing he does, this is my first post about him since the draft. Second it's not a mindset, as someone whose able to watch KHL games I've probably seen him more than most here. The fact is he looked a lot better earlier and I expected him to keep that up, which he didn't so naturally I'm less hyped.



Have you watched him play? His two biggest strengths are his shot and passing, he's a good skater for his size and likes to carry the puck and sometimes even drive the net with it. He's definitely not a stay at home Daneyko-like defender.
Reach reach reach..frame...reach
 
  • Like
Reactions: Darkauron

Guttersniped

I like goalies who stop the puck
Sponsor
Dec 20, 2018
21,836
47,189
Not Mukhamadullin's best moment, for certain.

But you have to admit, at least he's an interesting specimen. Russian KHL teams are not particularly known for giving kids his age big minutes, but that's the case with Mukhamadullin. Team Russia is not known for relying on less-than-stellar players to lead their team in ice time during the WJC, and yet here we are.

I've found myself defending Mukhamadullin all tourney long just because many of the people attacking him are the same people who overhype lesser defensemen in the tourney like Broberg and Ryan Johnson.

We can say a couple of very encouraging things about Mukhamadullin. His coaches seem to depend on him, he is capable of making high-end plays and passes, and -- although I'm not an analytics guy -- the metrics seem to be very much in his favor. Of course, you take this with the type of play you mentioned vs. Czech, where you can pull your hair out from its roots watching him.

I'm going to give Mukhamadullin the benefit of the doubt because of a few factors.

1)How much he has improved in one year.
At the outset of analyzing players for the 2020 draft, I had Mukhamadullin very, very high. At one point he was just outside my top 10 overall. I loved his combination of size & skill set. But I had to drop him like a bullet after an inconsistent 2019-20 campaign -- exactly what you're saying. In my preliminary draft rankings, I dropped Mukhamadullin to #42. In my final rankings, I had him as a 2nd/3rd round "tweener". All along I said he was an impossible guy to rank. But ranking is what I do, so I suppose I'm a jackass for bitching about it, ha.

2)Isn't inconsistency exactly the thing which improves with age and experience?
Mukhamadullin is certainly the type of player who makes a terrible play followed by a spectacular one, and vise versa. So he's frustrating to watch. He has a game like he did vs. Canada, where he was perhaps the best player on the ice. But then we have his game vs. Czech Republic, where he was very bad. Not Broberg Vs. Russia bad, but bad nevertheless. Hopefully experience teaches the kid to bring it every night, and to not get flustered by adversity. We shall see.

Last night, an old reader of mine in my Todays Slapshot days emailed me a very interesting question. He asked -- if the draft was held again today -- would I take Mukhamadullin at #20 overall. It's interesting to me because I've been his biggest defender all week long. But I must say, the answer is no. I'm going to stick by what I originally thought -- which was to draft one of my two highest ranked players, Perreault or Khusnutdinov. If I was pressured to take a defenseman, I would take my highest ranked D at that spot who was Brock Faber (though I would trade down first for Faber and try to get him in the late 20s).

This is not to say the Mukhamadullin pick bothers me. I've seen enough which encourages me to give the pick a few years. Although -- like you -- I also get frustrated. But, then I watch any shift by Dawson Mercer in the entire WJC tourney and I'm happy again, haha.
I accidentally posted while still writing. (a short post? Moi?) Perrault seemed unlikely since the Devils seemed to lean towards character guys. The Devils don’t seem take talented guys with work ethic questions, the last one that comes to mind is Popugaev, our 5th pick in 2017. We had numerous Captains. I was surprised we didn’t drafts Rossi if only for his famous motor and dedication but then again Holtz reportedly pretty dedicated himself.

I don’t get hung up on particular picks but I did share your impulse for picking more elite offense with the 3rd 1st. Bad teams get to draft elite offense talent but we keep trading our lot high picks away, ironically Khusnutdinov was picked with our 2nd (#37) that the Wild got in Kunin trade. I move on with the player have though and we needed higher end defensive prospects too.

After the draft, I read how Mukhamadullin’s coach talk about how coachable he is and how he’s not “a typical Russian” (his words) because of how hard on himself he is because he’s so driven to get better. Then a scout talked about how he said he “sucked” at tournament after a rocky game then I realized 1) in many ways he’s a typical Devils character pick 2) maybe he could use therapist/life coach like Bratt’s because his game seems to suffer a bit after while (later in the KHL last season according to reports and I guess this this season according ninetyeight) as perhaps he gets down on himself and starts over thinking things. I’m obviously looking at it from the human side rather than the hockey development side because I don’t pretend to have a lot to add on the kid’s needs in latter side.

It might be better to have him under a 3 year ELC though which means signing him before 22 but we’ll see how it goes and future status with the KHL is.
 

My3Sons

Nobody told me there'd be days like these...
Sponsor
I accidentally posted while still writing. (a short post? Moi?) Perrault seemed unlikely since the Devils seemed to lean towards character guys. The Devils don’t seem take talented guys with work ethic questions, the last one that comes to mind is Popugaev, our 5th pick in 2017. We had numerous Captains. I was surprised we didn’t drafts Rossi if only for his famous motor and dedication but then again Holtz reportedly pretty dedicated himself.

I don’t get hung up on particular picks but I did share your impulse for picking more elite offense with the 3rd 1st. Bad teams get to draft elite offense talent but we keep trading our lot high picks away, ironically Khusnutdinov was picked with our 2nd (#37) that the Wild got in Kunin trade. I move on with the player have though and we needed higher end defensive prospects too.

After the draft, I read how Mukhamadullin’s coach talk about how coachable he is and how he’s not “a typical Russian” (his words) because of how hard on himself he is because he’s so driven to get better. Then a scout talked about how he said he “sucked” at tournament after a rocky game then I realized 1) in many ways he’s a typical Devils character pick 2) maybe he could use therapist/life coach like Bratt’s because his game seems to suffer a bit after while (later in the KHL last season according to reports and I guess this this season according ninetyeight) as perhaps he gets down on himself and starts over thinking things. I’m obviously looking at it from the human side rather than the hockey development side because I don’t pretend to have a lot to add on the kid’s needs in latter side.

It might be better to have him under a 3 year ELC though which means signing him before 22 but we’ll see how it goes and future status with the KHL is.

He’s already a KHL player at 18. Hopefully he will want to take his shot at the NHL before 22.
 

Goptor

Registered User
Jun 30, 2016
2,294
2,672
Type 1: Scott Niedermayer

Type 2: Scott Stevens

Type 3: Ben Lovejoy

Any others? That’s pretty much all that comes to mind.

Peter Harrold type defensemen.
Have the same name as the coach so you're always gifted a spot, even if its mostly as a forward.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bleedred

Call Me Al

Registered User
Aug 28, 2017
5,584
6,963
oh man. i just remember seeing a montage of the top 10 hits the season he played a ton and he was on the receiving end of 2 or 3 of them
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Bleedred

Bleedred

Travis Green BLOWS! Bring back Nasreddine!
Sponsor
May 1, 2011
130,385
57,853
Good old Petey Jr.

I don’t think I’ve typed that name here in many years.

The Kremlin Kone makes an appearance at #8.
 

devilsblood

Registered User
Mar 10, 2010
29,583
11,849
Ok an offensive minded two-way puck moving defenceman. That's not what you meant and you know it, you're just trying to save face. A lot of media had him scouted as a defensive dman (even stay at home dman) predraft, which could be a reason most had him ranked so low, but thats not how he likes to play.

.
Let's be honest, the NA media had no clue who Shak was.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Comparison Ford

Nubmer6

Sleep is a poor substitute for caffeine
Sponsor
Jul 14, 2013
13,744
17,846
The Village
Keep watching, you will get there.
I think any large D, mobile D with a shot will always set off Gelinas comparisons. Many people here have quite a bit of PTSD from him, and I'll admit I do too. I have that irrational, niggling fear that Muk will turn into him that I can't quite quell.
 
  • Like
Reactions: My3Sons

My3Sons

Nobody told me there'd be days like these...
Sponsor
I think any large D, mobile D with a shot will always set off Gelinas comparisons. Many people here have quite a bit of PTSD from him, and I'll admit I do too. I have that irrational, niggling fear that Muk will turn into him that I can't quite quell.

The latest research suggests that microdosing can help with that.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad