Rumor: Seth Jones

[golffuul]

I thought Columbus went in on this precisely because of what is happening now and to buy time with their fan-base. They had a top 5 player, a 2 time Vezina winner and Team USA's Olympic (hopefully Gold Medal Winning in 2022 or at least 2026) top pairing. They had a guy that was just used in a leverage checking role in PLD and went and got Duchene which turns out we know is not really good for your team actually winning but yeah. Savard wasn't a terrible 3rd D-man either and has immediately dropped into Tampa's top 4.

Columbus wasn't lacking on talent, they needed more scoring and Jarmo went in hard. That it didn't work is a shame, that they are all leaving hurts. But that fan-base was going to quit on the team before the latest run, now they at least seem with the organization even though these unfortunate outcomes are playing out. That was important and actually is a part of the GM's job especially if it was broken down by management.

JD's connection with the Rangers goes way back and while it was surprising to see Columbus so quickly take him back given that, I think there was an understanding on both sides that was the only job he was leaving for. It was kind of illuminating that he had to have turned down both ESPN and TNT given his standing on the tv side of things too for probably not small money. So I do really hope it works out for them.

They are going to sell Jones and Werenski, probably Laine too. But fans in Columbus can't say, hey we never go for it. They understand those moves better now in my opinion and in that market that was an important message.

Yeah. They were in a no-win position that year. They were not going to win the Cup but they felt like the fan base deserved a "run". I still think you could have sold patience better than failure. Selling off Bob in his prime and Panarin as a bonafide star would have brought back major pieces that would have probably made them better the next year and for years to come. But that's the price you pay for failed runs, I guess.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I get where you are coming from, I just think it’s funny to say it cost him getting a ring, when in my opinion, he cost himself getting a ring by just leaving.

I would hope he learned from that and think he would consider it a mistake. I think he would love to have Owen Power along with Seider for a lot of these reasons.

Well hopefully the damn lottery does right by us for once tonight...

No team is owed more, excited or super bummed to update my message tomorrow with more places lost or hopefully just a -3 value...

 

[better Red than Dead]

Nick Kypreos and MacLean podcast, as recently as yesterday, said that all they hear is that Werenski wants to play for the Red Wings and he’s the next one gone. They also called the Seth Jones situation last year. So there’s that

 

[jkutswings]

I think LA is likely where Buffalo wants to send Eichel for the reasons you're outlining and to keep him out of NYC. The Rangers also probably have a tough time looking at Jones, so if LA sinks their cash and assets into Eichel the Jones sweepstakes becomes a little more open. Colorado is probably the third sneaky team for these two and man alive if they figure out a way to swap out Kadri and some of their young pieces for either of these two...

However that is an interesting part about Jones hitting the market at almost every other time he would be the premium asset on the market, right now he is #2 behind Eichel.

An interesting part about the Mantha move was a few of the national guys talked about who Detroit was talking to at the time. Columbus was a name we heard, now there have been some changes. However, it is worth noting between the Savard money deal and the rumored Mantha discussions I think we have probably had pretty good talks with them at least. Did we talk Bertuzzi or Hronek with them???

Man Panarin and Bob, PLD forcing out, now it you have to wonder Jones is opting to UFA, Werenski is rumored to want out and I know we are crossing our fingers there, and you have no idea what will happen with Laine... I feel for their fans, makes you question the viability of Columbus almost. I know that is harsh, but if no star player is ever going to really see this out and I know Nash spent a long time but yeah where do you go from here... Tough spot for Jarmo and JD who I have a lot of faith in as hockey people.

Yeah, tough to know how many of the rumors are true, but Columbus is almost shaping up to be the Kansas City Royals of the NHL, where they're more a developmental team for the contenders instead of a destination.

 

[better Red than Dead]

Yeah, tough to know how many of the rumors are true, but Columbus is almost shaping up to be the Kansas City Royals of the NHL, where they're more a developmental team for the contenders instead of a destination.

There was an Athletic Article that discussed the reason that Columbus can’t hold on to their players, the majority of ex players said it’s a nice place to play but that it’s not a “hockey city “ and that players are not really revered outside the rink. Also a consideration is how management plays hardball during RFA negotiations, so given all that, not really a place to call a career for them at least

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

There was an Athletic Article that discussed the reason that Columbus can’t hold on to their players, the majority of ex players said it’s a nice place to play but that it’s not a “hockey city “ and that players are not really revered outside the rink. Also a consideration is how management plays hardball during RFA negotiations, so given all that, not really a place to call a career for them at least

On The Hockey News podcast recently they discussed how Tortorella was probably a negative impact on keeping RFAs. Who wants to work for a boss they don't like?

They also discussed that Jarmo can be a total MFer in negotiations and that can also make players want to get away if they're worried they won't get market value.

 

[better Red than Dead]

On The Hockey News podcast recently they discussed how Tortorella was probably a negative impact on keeping RFAs. Who wants to work for a boss they don't like?

They also discussed that Jarmo can be a total MFer in negotiations and that can also make players want to get away if they're worried they won't get market value.

Yep, and the lack of amenities. Say what you will about the city of Detroit, but the players get the best amenities, just ask guys like Ryan and Bernier, among others who passed through here recently. Not to mention the tradition of being an Original Six team

 

[Winger98]

okay, so here's my question. Does 6OA have enough pull behind it to be the center piece of a deal for Jones or Eichel? None of us are thrilled with who is likely there for us at 6th, and Columbus and Buffalo are likely both looking hard at futures at this point in either deal.

 

[HisNoodliness]

okay, so here's my question. Does 6OA have enough pull behind it to be the center piece of a deal for Jones or Eichel? None of us are thrilled with who is likely there for us at 6th, and Columbus and Buffalo are likely both looking hard at futures at this point in either deal.

I don't think they would trade those guys for 6th OA yet. That is, I think it will have as much value (or more) as what they ultimately do get, but they're going to have to try to get more for a long time before they accept that.

 

[Bench]

okay, so here's my question. Does 6OA have enough pull behind it to be the center piece of a deal for Jones or Eichel? None of us are thrilled with who is likely there for us at 6th, and Columbus and Buffalo are likely both looking hard at futures at this point in either deal.

I think it gets your foot in the door with Jones. Columbus would be foolish not to consider it. They won't get a top 5 pick back as the deadline and UFA looms.

Buffalo is probably still trying to work it out with Eichel and until he comes down firm like Jones did you'll have to knock their socks off and such.

 

[jkutswings]

I think it gets your foot in the door with Jones. Columbus would be foolish not to consider it. They won't get a top 5 pick back as the deadline and UFA looms.

Buffalo is probably still trying to work it out with Eichel and until he comes down firm like Jones did you'll have to knock their socks off and such.

I wonder when the stalemate of surgery vs rehab will be decided for Eichel. Any update on long term prognosis and timing will play a key factor in his trade value.

 

[MBH]

Yeah if only his points per 60 would go up... All of Columbus had a bad year and this argument seems to grounded in analytics versus you know the player we watch controlling the proceedings of games far too often when you do watch Columbus.

You know what I remember Seth Jones doing, kind of right after he got robbed out of a Norris not long ago. Eliminating the best team in hockey while being the best player on the ice. Sure Hedman went down, but Jones absolutely vexed the Lightning.

I know people think there are a lot of guys that can do that, but you're looking at what 20 maybe in the league some on the same teams. You're damn right I line up for and hold that kind of star player in very high regard and become super interested if they somehow become available.

You know what Seth Jones and Zach Werenski did this year?
Nothing.
So to get Seth Jones, you have to give up assets. And then you've to sign him to a UFA premium contract.

Seth Jones rose to among the top defensemen and then he's proceeded to fall.
You can damn right this or that all day.

I look a lot more closely before I pull the trigger.
Defensemen often have reputations that live longer than their actual performance.

 

[Ricelund]

You know what Seth Jones and Zach Werenski did this year?
Nothing.
So to get Seth Jones, you have to give up assets. And then you've to sign him to a UFA premium contract.

Seth Jones rose to among the top defensemen and then he's proceeded to fall.
You can damn right this or that all day.

I look a lot more closely before I pull the trigger.
Defensemen often have reputations that live longer than their actual performance.

Weren’t you upset when Yzerman didn’t trade for Subban a couple years back?

 

[Sweetpotato]

As a neutral fan. I love what Yzerman is building and I'd hate to see him rush it. Jones while a great player is a rental and will likely get overpaid.

I'd rather see Detroit keep with their rebuild and pick up guys like Saad, Hyman, Larsson and Goligoski to surround youngsters like Raymond and Seider instead of sacrificing those youngsters to rush things.

Hoping they pick up one of the star dmen in this draft.

 

[MBH]

Weren’t you upset when Yzerman didn’t trade for Subban a couple years back?

Upset? I don't think so.
I did want Holland to deal for Subban.
But Subban is an example of an elite defenseman who slowed down, got paid, and suddenly is more of an anchor than a helper.
Karlsson, too, though with his injuries, those red flags should have been there for all to see.

So yeah, Subban was a guy I was thinking about in relation to Seth Jones.
Winds the Norris at 23.
Finishes 3rd at 26 and 28.
Is viewed my many as a toxic asset at 29 and 30.

Karlsson wins at 25. Finsihes 2nd at 25 and 26.
Is virtually unmoveable at 29 and 30.

 

[lidstromiscool]

okay, so here's my question. Does 6OA have enough pull behind it to be the center piece of a deal for Jones or Eichel? None of us are thrilled with who is likely there for us at 6th, and Columbus and Buffalo are likely both looking hard at futures at this point in either deal.

I'd be fine with a few options at 6, one of the top LHD or Guenther/Eklund will be there which I would be excited about. I wouldn't give #6 up for Jones unless he was signed to a LTC for a decent salary. Eichel on the other hand, I would definitely be interested in giving up #6+, although I would imagine other teams offers would beat Detroit's.

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

There's some massive overrating of Jones in this thread.

And underrating.

 

[TatarTangle]

Nick Kypreos and MacLean podcast, as recently as yesterday, said that all they hear is that Werenski wants to play for the Red Wings and he’s the next one gone. They also called the Seth Jones situation last year. So there’s that

My coworker knows the Werenski’s, this was a year or two ago, truthfully I forget how long it was; Zach and his dad were not at all happy with how Columbus treated his injury and he misses his family and home pretty bad. I guess he’d drive back to Michigan from Columbus quite often. Take that for what it’s worth. I just would not be surprised at all to see him playing for the Red Wings from what I’ve heard, albeit second-hand.

 

[Hoog]

Yea, they are pretty much in tear down mode it sounds like but if it is done smart and we can jump in they may be able to do some nice FA things as well. So, let's say we are out on the Seth Jones side. They could trade with another team and get some nice players/picks. We could then jump in and give them with a huge deal of the #6 pick, Hronek, Fabbri, and one of our later 2nd rounders for Werenski, Patrik Laine, Emil Bemstrom, and pick #22. We would probably have to give up a prospect (like say Alex Cotton or Chase Pearson) or possibly take on some money but I think it works.

This gives Columbus a lot of high picks in the first round (maybe use on Echel trade), a young RHD in Hronek, a scrapper in Fabbri (who is still younger), along with reducing some salary as well. This could allow them to grab Dougie Hamilton or another top FA.

This gives us, two young players we can sign long term to be part of our building blocks. Swapping the RH Hronek for the LH Werenski puts a line of Mo and Werenski together for a long time. Laine, I think would thrive with us on the RW. You could have Vrana/Larkin/Laine on the top line, which should be pretty potent. We also keep a first rounder which Steve will do magic with. Say a Pinelli and either Rosen or Chibrikov. You could put a Berggren/Bemstrom/Zadina 2nd line together as well.

It would be interesting and I think it would help two teams.

 

[lilidk]

It's a very bad idea to trade 6 for Jones. Do we really wanted to get little bit better before 2022- 2023 draft . Let's bring Jones for Vrana and Glendening for example. Let's free up for Bergreen , Raymond and Veleno, Pearson

 

[Frk It]

It's a very bad idea to trade 6 for Jones.

 

[Dotter]

I'd rather Jack Eichel if we are trading for anyone. I also don't want to give up the assets required to get said player.

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

I'd have no issue moving for Jones, I just don't have confidence that he'd sign here long term.

To me Werenski just makes more sense. Much stronger indications that he's interested in signing here long term. Doesn't hurt that he's younger and left-handed.