Sergachev vs Drouin

[Ainec]

Surprised Drouin is winning

Sergachev for me. Hard to find a young dmen with potential in this league. I'd take a Ristolainen lite dmen over a top line LW unless that LW is elite

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Sergachev. Unlike Drouin who is already 23 (forward's peak is around 24-25 ) and in his 5th season, he is only 20, in his 2nd season and far away from his peak (D-men's peak is around 26-27).

The comparison between forward's and defenseman's production is nonsense.

Hedman has 35 points. Drouin has 46 points. 46 > 35.
According to some posters here it means:
1) Drouin is better than Hedman.
2) Hedman should play in AHL.

To make this deal a win for Montreal Sergachev should seriously fail during the next 6-7 years. Which is highly unlikely, since his offensive talent level is already well known and tested in NHL.

Myers, Phaneuf and other Dmen experienced their best offensive years in their first year and then trailed off.

Sergachev's first NHL season doesn't mean it's an indicator as to what type of Dman he will be and his ability to put up points.

I think this thread is somewhat a shot at those who were all over the trade stating how much Montreal lost this trade/ Sergachev was better. Now, those people aren't around. Surprise, surprise. Tampa won last year, Montreal won this year, let's wait and see how things are 5 years after the trade ?

And yes, while Sergachev is younger, he came to Tampa Bay with, what appeared to be very little pressure and motivation to prove Montreal wrong. Drouin came to Montreal, an offensively starved team looking to him to be a catalyst, while being from the area. Seems like the pressure that would have been on each player isn't being brought up as a factor ?

I'm not sure how, for Montreal to win, Sergachev needs to seriously fail.

A 50ish point winger for a dman who puts up 25-30 points seems like a pretty good deal for both teams and can easily come off as a win for both ? This deal seems to be trending that way, which is odd, as usually there's a clear winner and a clear loser.

 

[ijuka]

Sergachev. Unlike Drouin who is already 23 (forward's peak is around 24-25 ) and in his 5th season, he is only 20, in his 2nd season and far away from his peak (D-men's peak is around 26-27).

You can't use trends like this. You can go ahead and ask Marchand or Wheeler how they feel about forwards peaking around 24-25. Drouin's looking to be having an upwards surge right now.

 

[Karl Eriksson]

Hard to compare them. Serge for me.

 

[the paisanos guy]

"Nobody has ever argued that Drouin is a better player than Hedman"
You literally just did by using the phrase:
"If Sergachev doesn't surpass Drouin in performance"
As well as other posters did before you.

Are you sure you read that first sentence correctly?

 

[amnesiac]

too early, Dmen take time to develop..... Hedman took 4-5 years

 

[LordZapp]

Sergachev got 2 goals, 16 assists and 18 points in 49 games.

Drouin got 17 goals, 29 assists and 46 points in 55 games.

Who you take going forward?

This is just low key bashing sergachev. One is a one-dimensional winger, the other is a defenseman.

 

[CupInSIX]

Any Hab fan that says they wouldn't want a mulligan on the trade is a liar.

 

[Bouboumaster]

Right now, Drouin.
In the future, I don't know.

 

[DanM]

too early, Dmen take time to develop..... Hedman took 4-5 years

This is the correct answer ^^

 

[SympathyForTheDevils]

"Nobody has ever argued that Drouin is a better player than Hedman"
You literally just did by using the phrase:
"If Sergachev doesn't surpass Drouin in performance"
As well as other posters did before you.

You do know that Hedman and Sergachev are different players, right?

Unless you think I meant offensive production when I said performance. Which I clearly didn't.

"Nobody has ever argued that Drouin is a better player than Hedman"

"What matters is which team got the most out of their early, underpaid years"
Have you just invented this? It's a rhetorical question.

Well, now is my turn to invent something.

Your whole message is essentially: "Montreal won this trade, cause I said so. To make it look well supported and important I put some nonsense that have no connection with the discussion, some contradictions to myself and some "facts" I have just invented. I hope no one will read it anyway".

Well, I read it. And it looks exactly like this^

Man, you do love your strawmen. I never even said (or believe) that Montreal won the trade. Just that your assertion that Tampa wins the trade regardless of whether Drouin is a better player for the next few years is wrong. Hell, I like Sergachev. I think he's a better player than what he's shown this year.

I'll make my point simpler so you can understand it. Teams become contenders by assembling a lot of talent under the cap limit. This is greatly helped by acquiring and signing good players before they breakout, or by getting good young players when their salary is limited by their rookie contract or RFA status. In that context, for the team, a player's high performance in his early-mid 20s is more valuable than high performance in his late 20s, at which point he'll be able to bolt to another team or ask for a huge contract that will hamper the team's ability to sign other good players. Regardless of whether he's a forward or a Dman.

Tampa may very well win the trade, but for that Sergachev needs to be better than the sheltered offensive Dman he is now. And that has to happen earlier than in 5-6 years (especially since Tampa are right in the middle of their cup window).

 

[habs03]

Sergachev has played on the right side all year because ... stacked at LD. Last year Sergachev played on the left side with Stralman and had a great season. Now Sergachev is playing on his wrong side and with Coburn as his partner. How did Drouin look playing at his wrong position last year?

Also, Drouin has like 9 points in his last 3 games. If you made this same poll 3 games ago ... Drouin is a huge minus player and like 35 points in 50+ games getting first line winger minutes. That looks pretty bad.

Glad Montreal is happy with Drouin ... Tampa would do trade again for sure.

FYI Sergachev can play both sides, he played RD in juniors. Even in the 9 games he played in Mtl he played RD. His struggles aren't because he is playing a "new" position.

 

[McGuires Corndog]

Recentcy bias pick for me is Drouin, and I was furious with the trade at the time.

Sergachev can absolutely reverse the trend, but his lack of hockey IQ has always concerned me.

 

[HockeyDBspecialist]

Drouin if he keep playing like a superstar since 2 games.

 

[ole ole]

Any Hab fan that says they wouldn't want a mulligan on the trade is a liar.

I wouldn't.

 

[wetcoast]

If Drouin can play like he's been playing recently, then it's 1000% him AINEC.

Before his recent 4-3-6-9 plus 6 run would any Habs fan really put up this poll?

Sergachev is 3 years younger and already given hints that he is the right answer for this poll.

 

[CupInSIX]

I wouldn't.

Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies.

 

[Hint1k]

Unless you think I meant offensive production when I said performance. Which I clearly didn't.

...for the team, a player's high performance in his early-mid 20s is more valuable than high performance in his late 20s...

You do know that you constantly use the word "performance" in exactly this way "I clearly did not" (c)you, do you?

"You do know that Hedman and Sergachev are different players, right?"
Well, to answer this question, you actually need to read my message. That very 1st message you chose to answer.

Well, it looks like I don't really need to argue with you. You are very successfully doing it for me by arguing with yourself in your every message.

 

[Hint1k]

Are you sure you read that first sentence correctly?

Are you sure that you actually read that whole discussion? Rhetorical question. You clearly did not.

Let me help you. Its here Sergachev vs Drouin (Link to the message that you did not read)

 

[Hockey4Life91]

If Sergachev doesn't surpass Drouin in performance before he's 26-27, by which point Sergachev will be a UFA, Montreal will have definitely won that trade. In that context, it doesn't really matter who's the better player at their peak. What matters is which team got the most out of their early, underpaid years.

Plus, that Hedman thing is a strawman. Nobody has ever argued that Drouin is a better player than Hedman, or even close in any way, shape or form. Or that points is the only thing that matters. But it would be hard to make the case that Sergachev has been a better player this year.

Huh? You literally just contradicted yourself.

And putting that aside, regarding your output during cost-controlled years argument, Sergachev already has scored playoff goals, including a game winner. So Tampa is pretty happy with the output thus far, and sees a bright future for a player who plays a harder position to slot on a competitive roster.

 

[Werewolf]

FYI Sergachev can play both sides, he played RD in juniors. Even in the 9 games he played in Mtl he played RD. His struggles aren't because he is playing a "new" position.

He played both in Junior. Drouin played Center in Junior too ... how did that translate? Fact is, Sergachev played primarily LD last year while this year he is playing primarily RD and the results are what they are. Sergachev plays better on the left side, fact. When Coburn leaves as a free agent next year Sergachev will go back back to the left side and we can do comparables again.

 

[DFC]

I think 10 years from now we'll forget about this trade because it'll be viewed as pretty fair.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

Serg ez

 

[VoluntaryDom]

Serg has better results this year than last idk what anyone saying the opposite is thinking. He’s better on the right side.

 

[JoVel]

Serg has better results this year than last idk what anyone saying the opposite is thinking. He’s better on the right side.

Where do you get that from? His offensive production is way down and has been pretty much our worst defenseman at actually playing defense.