Post-Game Talk: Sens @ Leafs/ Leafs @ Sens

[PoutineSp00nZ]

Because there are better players ready to play to make the team better. Pageau brings energy and compete to the lineup while doing all the other things that Condra does. Eventually its just time to cut ties and bring in talent.

Im not sure how effective PAgeau would be in a 4th line checking role. The guy is an offensive player, he's meant for the top 6 or 9.

I do agree that COndra is looking like the odd man out right now, but injuries happen! The million dollars condra is getting paid isn't going to be the difference in signing Ryan or trading for some oher impact player. Depth doesn't hurt, but if they can get a fair return for him it's probably the time to move him.

 

[Knave]

It's good we didn't lose... I mean they're just the Leafs.

 

[bert]

Im not sure how effective PAgeau would be in a 4th line checking role. The guy is an offensive player, he's meant for the top 6 or 9.

I do agree that COndra is looking like the odd man out right now, but injuries happen! The million dollars condra is getting paid isn't going to be the difference in signing Ryan or trading for some oher impact player. Depth doesn't hurt, but if they can get a fair return for him it's probably the time to move him.

Why do you believe he is only an offensive player? He kills penalties has good hockey sense and is tenacious on the puck, finishes all his checks and puts tons of pressure on the puck carrier. Did you not see the defensive play he made that led to the first goal and the come back yesterday?

 

[Micklebot]

Condra and Greening suck.

Prince, Puempel, Robinson, Hoffman, Lazar, Stone, Grant, Pageau are ALL better than those two.

I think Greening may have one foot out the door, but Condra is a little more secure because he's a RW.

Prince, Puempel, Hoffman, are all LW, Pageau Lazar and Grant are C.

That leaves Stone and Robinson, as well as the posibility of one of the others playing out of position. Stone is set imo, Robinson is probably a year or two away (maybe ready as a call up). Condra has to compete with Ryan Chiasson Stone and Neil currently. I'd rather Condra over Neil, but can understand people saying we'd lack toughness without Neil. Ideally, Robinson learns how to fight and develops an edge, but I don't see that happening.

I think Grant has the best shot at replacing Condra (role wise) but Condra's offensive contribution is underrated around here. He won't the one finishing off chances, but he gets the puck down ice and does a good job keeping it there for his line-mates.

Condra's should never have been considered a long term solution, but I'm not convinced we have the depth at RW to part ways. Maybe if Lazar plays RW, or Grant shows he can be as effective as a winger.

 

[guyzeur]

I think Greening may have one foot out the door, but Condra is a little more secure because he's a RW.

Prince, Puempel, Hoffman, are all LW, Pageau Lazar and Grant are C.

That leaves Stone and Robinson, as well as the posibility of one of the others playing out of position. Stone is set imo, Robinson is probably a year or two away (maybe ready as a call up). Condra has to compete with Ryan Chiasson Stone and Neil currently. I'd rather Condra over Neil, but can understand people saying we'd lack toughness without Neil. Ideally, Robinson learns how to fight and develops an edge, but I don't see that happening.

I think Grant has the best shot at replacing Condra (role wise) but Condra's offensive contribution is underrated around here. He won't the one finishing off chances, but he gets the puck down ice and does a good job keeping it there for his line-mates.

Condra's should never have been considered a long term solution, but I'm not convinced we have the depth at RW to part ways. Maybe if Lazar plays RW, or Grant shows he can be as effective as a winger.

2nd time this morning someone wants Robinson to become a fighter. Stop that.

But you also said to develop an edge which I would like as well.

 

[We Want the Cup 2010]

Im not sure how effective PAgeau would be in a 4th line checking role. The guy is an offensive player, he's meant for the top 6 or 9.

I do agree that COndra is looking like the odd man out right now, but injuries happen! The million dollars condra is getting paid isn't going to be the difference in signing Ryan or trading for some oher impact player. Depth doesn't hurt, but if they can get a fair return for him it's probably the time to move him.

I would have Legwand, Smith, and whoever as the shutdown line and have Pageau's line be classified as the energy line. Pageau going up against bigger slower players seems to be working out alright for him so far. He's been small his entire life and has made it this far, I'm sure he's used to everyone being bigger than him... I see him as a 3rd or 4th liner rather than in top 6. Just keep him out of the corners, haha

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

Im not sure how effective PAgeau would be in a 4th line checking role. The guy is an offensive player, he's meant for the top 6 or 9.

I do agree that COndra is looking like the odd man out right now, but injuries happen! The million dollars condra is getting paid isn't going to be the difference in signing Ryan or trading for some oher impact player. Depth doesn't hurt, but if they can get a fair return for him it's probably the time to move him.

It would be nice to have one guy on the 4th line who has a decent set of mitts. Kind of like the same concept as putting out a strong offensive player in the last 15-20 seconds of a PK...to take advantage of the opposing line when they're tired. Can have the big bodies on the 4th line bang and crash, and little Pageau run around like a little water bug collecting pucks and booting down the ice to generate a scoring chance. Even if it doesn't result in a goal, it at least gets the puck out of the zone and hopefully sets up the next shift with an offensive zone start.

Pretty sweet work for a fourth line, if the guys can make it work.

 

[bert]

I think Greening may have one foot out the door, but Condra is a little more secure because he's a RW.

Prince, Puempel, Hoffman, are all LW, Pageau Lazar and Grant are C.

That leaves Stone and Robinson, as well as the posibility of one of the others playing out of position. Stone is set imo, Robinson is probably a year or two away (maybe ready as a call up). Condra has to compete with Ryan Chiasson Stone and Neil currently. I'd rather Condra over Neil, but can understand people saying we'd lack toughness without Neil. Ideally, Robinson learns how to fight and develops an edge, but I don't see that happening.

I think Grant has the best shot at replacing Condra (role wise) but Condra's offensive contribution is underrated around here. He won't the one finishing off chances, but he gets the puck down ice and does a good job keeping it there for his line-mates.

Condra's should never have been considered a long term solution, but I'm not convinced we have the depth at RW to part ways. Maybe if Lazar plays RW, or Grant shows he can be as effective as a winger.

I dont see how playing RW is a good thing right now. Ryan, Stone, Chiasson and Neal area all locks. Plenty of players can play Condra's role. One dimensional defensive players are not NHL players anymore you have to be versatile. Grant on this team same type of player as Condra except less offense (somehow)? He should be about 18th or 19th on the depth chart. Prince, Puemple, Pageau Hoffman and Lazar are all set to make more of an impace and from what I saw in Buddy Robinson he too will surely pass them too.

Chiasson had a great read on the pk last night that led to his short handed goal. Pageau is very strong on the puck, they should by trying him on right wing. Pageau and Smith with Neil on the 4th line is also an option they can switch sides for faceoffs. When I hear people say that this team needs an identity, its hard working never give up on the play players like Pageau that will bring back the pesky attitude.

Condra, Greening are too comfortable I am glad they have guys pushing them.

 

[BankStreetParade]

I would love to see Michalek, Pageau and Greening on a line together. But to be honest, I don't know how we're going to make room. There's 5 guys right now who could make the team and 2 spots.

 

[Holdurbreathe]

Lazar and Puempel have yet to play a real NHL game

It's a bit early to claim that they should make the team and it wouldn't even be rushing them

I'm all in favour of making Neil the extra forward but I think there is still a role for Condra and Greening on this team and that it's far more likely that Curtis and Matt could benefit from an extra year in Junior and the AHL. It sucks that Lazar can't go to the AHL but it is what it is: he's going to be an NHL player eventually, no need to rush into it.

While it is still early, watching both games last night I came away believing Neil nor Greening belong on the team going forward.

The reason I feel strongly about this is simply they were playing last night like they did last year, only against AHL competition for the most part.

Lazar, Robinson, Puempel, Hoffman, and Stone all have more to offer the Sens.

IMO BM has to make space for at least a few of these players or the team will suffer both in the short and long term.

 

[Holdurbreathe]

I dont see how playing RW is a good thing right now. Ryan, Stone, Chiasson and Neal area all locks. Plenty of players can play Condra's role. One dimensional defensive players are not NHL players anymore you have to be versatile. Grant on this team same type of player as Condra except less offense (somehow)? He should be about 18th or 19th on the depth chart. Prince, Puemple, Pageau Hoffman and Lazar are all set to make more of an impace and from what I saw in Buddy Robinson he too will surely pass them too.

Chiasson had a great read on the pk last night that led to his short handed goal. Pageau is very strong on the puck, they should by trying him on right wing. Pageau and Smith with Neil on the 4th line is also an option they can switch sides for faceoffs. When I hear people say that this team needs an identity, its hard working never give up on the play players like Pageau that will bring back the pesky attitude.

Condra, Greening are too comfortable I am glad they have guys pushing them.

If Neil is a lock then the team will enter the season with less than its best lineup.

Ryan and Chaisson should be the only locks on the right side at this point in time.

 

[bert]

While it is still early, watching both games last night I came away believing Neil nor Greening belong on the team going forward.

The reason I feel strongly about this is simply they were playing last night like they did last year, only against AHL competition for the most part.

Lazar, Robinson, Puempel, Hoffman, and Stone all have more to offer the Sens.

IMO BM has to make space for at least a few of these players or the team will suffer both in the short and long term.

I wish the team had the problem on D!

 

[bert]

If Neil is a lock then the team will enter the season with less than its best lineup.

Ryan should be the only lock on the right side at this point in time.

I don't agree with Neal being a lock but he is. Stone and Chiasson are locks because they are obviously better. Do you think Condra brings more to the table? Honestly?

 

[Xspyrit]

Let's note that I somewhat dislike Colin Greening and want him gone (with Condra and Gryba)

He got a knee jerk reaction contract due to playing with Spezza.

Management was too blind to see what he truly is away from a player of Spezza's calibre.

No, no and no

Greening maintained his pace for 2.5 years with or without Spezza before getting his extension... This was not a knee jerk reaction

I'm always baffled by those comments coming from fans who are supposed to follow this team closely. Fun fact is I probably hate Greening more than them, but won't let bias come in in my way.

I cant handle another season of Greening, Neil, Michalek and Phillips. Ugh. They couldn't even combine all their brains to make 1 averagely smart brain.

Those type of comments are exactly the problem on this board...

Will just talk about 1 guy but Greening had a 3.99 grade point average on his way to an Applied Economics and Management degree college while preparing himself for a hockey career and now plays in the NHL. If we take your statement somewhat seriously, my Gawd what does that make us?

Anyone see how Cowen looked? Saw someone say on Twitter that he looked worse than we was last year

I put about 0.001 stock on what people say on forums... unless you're someone like MoO or FQL and built your credibility with me before.

Other teams score goals too, it was simply a great shot from Reily coming in unmolested on the opposite side of where Greening was & made a great shot to beat Anderson. If it was Karlsson who scored that goal people on here would be boasting at how great a shot it was & that the goalie didn't have a chance on it. I guess you see what you see but the GSN line gets way more abuse than they deserve on here while other players get all the love. I think the coach loves these three & IMO will continue to play them full time for Ottawa.

I noticed Karlsson give the puck away a few times, pinch & get caught twice & make some bad plays. I also notice how he skates circles around guys & while taking a lot of risks he is so good & so fast he can get away with it & correct it or the mistake doesn't always end up in the back of our net but he still makes a lot of defensive mistakes. Wasn't he on the ice for that 2nd Toronto goal? Of course, no one here dares to criticize Eric the great.

Yep, the ultimate bias is evident around here but your bias with size is as noticeable though

Like I often say, it's Alfie/Karlsson or bust for many Sens fans.

 

[Holdurbreathe]

I wish the team had the problem on D!

D isn't as bad as some are making it out to be.

IMO it is really difficult to evaluate the D given the different lineups they faced and the forwards they had to work with.

I thought overall the D played petty well limiting the shots in both games.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Grant not getting enough love. That guy is superb.

Smith should be winger full time now. Pageau and Grant utilize the center of the ice better. Smith will provide the much needed winger grit in our bottom 6.

Mac-Turris-Ryan
Michalek-Zibanejad-Chiasson
Smith-Legwand-Lazar
Greening/Hoffman-Pageau-Stone

I think those are 4 excellent lines with a bunch of everything.

Grant next call-up as center. Peumpel and Prince on the wing.

18 mins
15 mins
13 mins
13 mins

Pk: Pageau and Ryan, Mac and Turris, Legwand and Milo

Defense:

Methot-Karlsson
Cowen-Ceci
Phillips-Wiercioch/Gryba

Claesson first call up

 

[bert]

D isn't as bad as some are making it out to be.

IMO it is really difficult to evaluate the D given the different lineups they faced and the forwards they had to work with.

I thought overall the D played petty well limiting the shots in both games.

Sure it is they were horrible last year and they haven't looked very good this year. Specifically the puck movement. Once again the only d men moving it well are Karlsson and Ceci and sometimes Wiercioch. You cant dress 3 d men that cant get the puck out controlled and expect to win. The point is the sens look great in nets and have about 5 guys pushing for spots upfront so really right now the only issue is the D.

I love that the forwards are all going to have to bring a great work ethic to get ice time. Competition breeds success.

 

[bert]

I put about 0.001 stock on what people say on forums... unless you're someone like MoO or FQL and built your credibility with me before.

As someone that really doesn't care for Cowen he did look to be skating and moving better than last season. Decision making and pass accuracy.... (better than last year but that's against half nhl players)

 

[Holdurbreathe]

I don't agree with Neal being a lock but he is. Stone and Chiasson are locks because they are obviously better. Do you think Condra brings more to the table? Honestly?

IMO more than Neil at this point in time, but I don't think he should be a regular.

I don't consider Stone a lock simply because there are other decision to be made that might impact him making the team out of camp.

If Pageau makes the cut, then Smith and Lazar will have to switch to the wing which could result in lots of movement in the lineup.

Admittedly I am basing it only on last night's games, but Stone wasn't one of the top four RWers.

 

[WhiteLight*]

Grant not getting enough love. That guy is superb.

Smith should be winger full time now. Pageau and Grant utilize the center of the ice better. Smith will provide the much needed winger grit in our bottom 6.

Mac-Turris-Ryan
Michalek-Zibanejad-Chiasson
Smith-Legwand-Lazar
Greening/Hoffman-Pageau-Stone

I think those are 4 excellent lines with a bunch of everything.

Grant next call-up as center. Peumpel and Prince on the wing.

18 mins
15 mins
13 mins
13 mins

Pk: Pageau and Ryan, Mac and Turris, Legwand and Milo

Defense:

Methot-Karlsson
Cowen-Ceci
Phillips-Wiercioch/Gryba

Claesson first call up

I don't like Grant at all as puck distributor. He looks really good sometimes with his puck control, reach, skating, but
1-He's not a goal scorer, doesn't go to the dirty areas and isn't a sniper
2-Not a good puck distributor/playmaker. Lacks hockey sense in his decision making with the puck.

Could he be a 4th liner maybe right now or at some point in his career? Yeah but there are better players than him

I guess he's fine positionally defensively and has an intriguing package but overall doesn't seem to get things done

 

[Benjamin]

Those type of comments are exactly the problem on this board...

Will just talk about 1 guy but Greening had a 3.99 grade point average on his way to an Applied Economics and Management degree college while preparing himself for a hockey career and now plays in the NHL. If we take your statement somewhat seriously, my Gawd what does that make us?

Obviously im talking about hockey sense.

 

[Holdurbreathe]

Sure it is they were horrible last year and they haven't looked very good this year. Specifically the puck movement. Once again the only d men moving it well are Karlsson and Ceci and sometimes Wiercioch. You cant dress 3 d men that cant get the puck out controlled and expect to win. The point is the sens look great in nets and have about 5 guys pushing for spots upfront so really right now the only issue is the D.

I love that the forwards are all going to have to bring a great work ethic to get ice time. Competition breeds success.

Of the D that will likely start the season in Ottawa, they were OK though Phillips is still too slow making decisions with the puck IMO.

Playing D with so many different forward combinations isn't as easy as you might like to think.

However you are entitled to your opinion and I respect it.

 

[umma gumma]

Im not sure how effective PAgeau would be in a 4th line checking role. The guy is an offensive player, he's meant for the top 6 or 9.

Vermette was pretty effective there for the Sens...scored 20 one year in that role, and Pageau is far more physical. I think Pageau can be effective almost anywhere.

 

[bert]

IMO more than Neil at this point in time, but I don't think he should be a regular.

I don't consider Stone a lock simply because there are other decision to be made that might impact him making the team out of camp.

If Pageau makes the cut, then Smith and Lazar will have to switch to the wing which could result in lots of movement in the lineup.

Admittedly I am basing it only on last night's games, but Stone wasn't one of the top four RWers.

Well that's where we disagree I think Stone was fantastic, he slowed the play down multiple times and got control. He created space, time and chances for his linemates. Where the puck was he was more than any forward on the team.

Stone will be playing in the top 9 and at times the top 6. I don't think moving Pageau moving to RW isn't out of the question either.

 

[coladin]

I thought the entire group looked energetic and eager to play. I just felt optimistic watching both games. Even in the ACC game, down 3-1 I still felt good about what I was watching.

Players that stood out at CTC:

1. Turris line was excellent against average players, but dogged players trying to win jobs.
2. Ryan skated very well
3. Erik Karlsson is pretty good
4. Legwand looked like a vet with nothing to prove. Thought he could have shown more but he is a vet probably trying not to pull anything?
5. Lazar won a lot of pucks, shot the puck well while playing with AHLers. I just smile when I watch him play because...he is always smiling. They say it is contagious!
6. Peumpel looked good, wasn't amazing but getting that goal out of the way may do wonders as he sticks around
7. Solid AHL acquisition in Cullen. Claesson skates weird but looked reasonably composed.
8. Boro was solid with some hits.
9. Buddy is getting better and could be a diamond in the rough
10. Derek Grant played really well, nice skater
11. Andy looked good.

ACC:

1. Michalek skated really well.
2. Chiasson looked really athletic and skilled
3. Zbad was just okay
4. Pageau was in Briere mode (Buffalo Briere that is)
5. Cowen looks set to play much better this year
6. Ceci is looking confident
7. I like Dzingel and his skill set, may push Hoffman out of Ottawa
8. Still not sure where Hoffman ends up

Happy to see hockey!

I think the writing is on the wall for Condra, Hoffman, Dzyurzinski and either Wiercoch or Gryba will not be a Senator...just too many players coming up