News: Seattle Kraken Expansion Draft Thread [Part III]

[Ice Mammoth]

Did Ron Francis do it? Arizona did it for him.

Arizona Coyotes
Shayne Gostisbehere
2022 second-round pick
2022 seventh-round pick

Philadelphia Flyers
No return

Arizona Coyotes
Andrew Ladd
Second-round pick (2021)
Conditional second-round pick (2022)
Conditional third-round pick (2023)

New York Islanders
No return

Many more deals were lost. Good job Ron!

 

[powerstuck]

Apparently "several" means one, nowadays

Well, they scored 100% on expansion draft rumors...they had to be wrong somewhere.

 

[SirKillalot]

Francis had 62 opportunities to make a trade in regards to expansion draft and he made 1...Tyler Pitlick for a 4th...

During the same time frame this is what Vegas did:


1. Calvin Pickard G Colorado Avalanche - goalie prospect
2. Luca Sbisa D Vancouver Canucks - bottom four defenseman
3. Teemu Pulkkinen LW Arizona Coyotes - forward prospect
4. Jon Merrill D New Jersey Devils - bottom four defenseman
5. William Carrier LW Buffalo Sabres - bottom six forward
6. Cody Eakin C Dallas Stars - middle six forward/bottom six forward
7. Tomas Nosek LW Detroit Red Wings - forward prospect
8. Jonathan Marchessault C Florida Panthers - middle six forward
9. Brayden McNabb D Los Angeles Kings - bottom four defenseman
10. Connor Brickley C Carolina Hurricanes - forward prospect
11. Chris Thorburn RW Winnipeg Jets - bottom six forward
12. Pierre-Edouard Bellemare RW Philadelphia Flyers - bottom six forward
13. Jason Garrison D Tampa Bay Lightning - bottom four defenseman
14. Jean-Francois Berube G New York Islanders - goalie "prospect"
15. James Neal LW Nashville Predators - top six forward
16. Deryk Engelland D Calgary Flames - bottom four defenseman
17. Brendan Leipsic LW Toronto Maple Leafs - bottom six forward
18. Colin Miller D Boston Bruins - bottom four defenseman
19. Marc Methot D Ottawa Senators - bottom four defenseman
20. David Schlemko D San Jose Sharks - bottom four defenseman
21. David Perron LW St. Louis Blues - top six forward
22. Oscar Lindberg C New York Rangers - bottom six forward
23. Griffin Reinhart D Edmonton Oilers - d-man prospect
24. Alexei Emelin D Montreal Canadiens - top four defenseman
25. Clayton Stoner D Anaheim Ducks - bottom four defenseman
26. Erik Haula C Minnesota Wild - middle six forward
27. William Karlsson C Columbus Blue Jackets - middle six forward
28. Trevor van Riemsdyk D Chicago Blackhawks - d-man prospect
29. Marc-Andre Fleury G Pittsburgh Penguins - starting goalie
30. Nate Schmidt D Washington Capitals - top four defenseman

2 top six forwards
4 middle six forwards
2 top four defenseman
1 starting goalie

Trades

The Buffalo Sabres traded their 2017 NHL Entry Draft sixth-round pick in exchange for Vegas selecting William Carrier.
The Florida Panthers traded Reilly Smith in exchange for Vegas selecting Jonathan Marchessault and a 2018 Entry Draft fourth-round pick .
The Carolina Hurricanes traded Boston's 2017 Entry Draft fifth-round pick (previously acquired) in exchange for Vegas selecting Connor Brickley.
The Winnipeg Jets traded their 2017 Entry Draft first-round pick (13th overall) and a 2019 Entry Draft third-round pick in exchange for Vegas selecting Chris Thorburn and Columbus' 2017 Entry Draft first-round pick (24th overall; previously acquired by Vegas).
The Tampa Bay Lightning traded their 2017 Entry Draft second-round pick, Pittsburgh's 2018 Entry Draft fourth-round pick (previously acquired) and Nikita Gusev in exchange for Vegas selecting Jason Garrison.
The New York Islanders traded their 2017 Entry Draft first-round pick, a 2019 Entry Draft second-round pick, Mikhail Grabovski and Jake Bischoff in exchange for Vegas selecting Jean-Francois Berube.
The Anaheim Ducks traded Shea Theodore in exchange for Vegas selecting Clayton Stoner.
The Minnesota Wild traded Alex Tuch in exchange for Vegas selecting Erik Haula and a conditional 2017 or 2018 Entry Draft third-round pick .
The Columbus Blue Jackets traded their 2017 Entry Draft first-round pick, a 2019 Entry Draft second-round pick and David Clarkson in exchange for Vegas selecting William Karlsson.
The Pittsburgh Penguins traded their 2020 Entry Draft second-round pick in exchange for Vegas selecting Marc-Andre Fleury.

3 - middle six forward (R. Smitch, N. Gusev (more seen as talent), A. Tuch (seen as talent at the time)
1 - top four defenseman (S. Theodore)
3 - 1st round picks
5 - 2nd round picks
2 - 3rd round picks


In the end Vegas had this before they started to operate after the expansion draft ordeal and trade players for more assets:

2 top six forwards (Neal, Perron)
7 middle six forwards (Marchessault, R. Smith, W. Karlsson, A. Tuch, Eakin, Haula, Gusev)
4 top four defenseman (Theodore, Emelin, N. Schmidt, McNabb - 5 if you count Garrison)
1 starting goalie (Fleury)

+
acquired picks
3 - 1st round picks
5 - 2nd round picks
2 - 3rd round picks


Seattle Kraken:

1	Jeremy Lauzon	D	Boston Bruins
2	Will Borgen	D	Buffalo Sabres
3	Dennis Cholowski	D	Detroit Red Wings
4	Chris Driedger	G	Florida Panthers
5	Cale Fleury	D	Montreal Canadiens
6	Joey Daccord	G	Ottawa Senators
7	Yanni Gourde	C/LW	Tampa Bay Lightning
8	Jared McCann	LW/C	Toronto Maple Leafs
9	Morgan Geekie	RW/C	Carolina Hurricanes
10	Gavin Bayreuther	D	Columbus Blue Jackets
11	Nathan Bastian	RW	New Jersey Devils
12	Jordan Eberle	RW	New York Islanders
13	Colin Blackwell	C	New York Rangers
14	Carsen Twarynski	LW	Philadelphia Flyers
15	Brandon Tanev	LW	Pittsburgh Penguins
16	Vitek Vanecek	G	Washington Capitals
17	Tyler Pitlick	C	Arizona Coyotes
18	John Quenneville	C	Chicago Blackhawks
19	Joonas Donskoi	RW	Colorado Avalanche
20	Jamie Oleksiak	D	Dallas Stars
21	Carson Soucy	D	Minnesota Wild
22	Calle Jarnkrok	RW	Nashville Predators
23	Vince Dunn	D	St. Louis Blues
24	Mason Appleton	C	Winnipeg Jets
25	Haydn Fleury	D	Anaheim Ducks
26	Mark Giordano	D	Calgary Flames
27	Adam Larsson	D	Edmonton Oilers
28	Kurtis MacDermid	D	Los Angeles Kings
29	Alexander True	C	San Jose Sharks
30	Kole Lind	RW	Vancouver Canucks

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

1 top six forward (Eberle)
5 middle six forwards (Gourde, Donskoi, McCann, Jarnkrok, Appleton)
4 - top four defensemen (Giordano, Larsson, Oleksiak, Dunn, 6 if Lauzon and Soucy counts, which there are reasonable arguments for them being quality-wise good enough to be called that, and if SEA makes trades among the others those are in such position, so I would say initially better job on defense by SEA)
2 - Backup goalies (Dreidger, Vanicek - pr. today, but both possible starters potential)

Middle six forwards are debatable, some will argue some can play top six, some argue they wouldn't be any good there, some would argue one of the other forwards could be seen as such instead of one of these.

Rest - prospects or bottom six forwards/defensemen
+
acquiring pick
4th round pick

 

[Mike Jones]

Did Ron Francis do it? Arizona did it for him.

Arizona Coyotes
Shayne Gostisbehere
2022 second-round pick
2022 seventh-round pick

Philadelphia Flyers
No return

Arizona Coyotes
Andrew Ladd
Second-round pick (2021)
Conditional second-round pick (2022)
Conditional third-round pick (2023)

New York Islanders
No return

Many more deals were lost. Good job Ron!

I agree - I think these two deals should have gone Seattle's way. I was skeptical about the number of picks at first but I did some math and the return is pretty good. The contracts aren't completely hideous and are done in a couple of years. While it would have been good to see some firsts go Seattle's way 5 confirmed and conditional picks are a good consolation prize for Seattle fans.

And if Seattle's scouting is up for the challenge each of these picks could have turned into some contributing NHL players.

 

[Kcoyote3]

Here's what I don't get.

JVR has 2 years left at 7 million dollars. He was left exposed by Philly. He's a consistent 50-60 point player who generally scores 20+ goals a season.

Now why in the absolute hell did Seattle not take him, retain 50% of his salary, and flip him for a 1st and a prospect. Any competing team in the league would take two years of JVR at 3.5 million, with two runs at the cup while he's still scoring.

Same goes for Max Domi. He's got one year left at 5.3 million. Retain half his salary and immediately flip him. You can recoup at least a second from that.

These are short term contracts. If you're going for the tanking approach anyways, and you're not likely to spend to the cap, get some draft capital going.

 

[Mike Jones]

Here's what I don't get.

JVR has 2 years left at 7 million dollars. He was left exposed by Philly. He's a consistent 50-60 point player who generally scores 20+ goals a season.

Now why in the absolute hell did Seattle not take him, retain 50% of his salary, and flip him for a 1st and a prospect. Any competing team in the league would take two years of JVR at 3.5 million, with two runs at the cup while he's still scoring.

Same goes for Max Domi. He's got one year left at 5.3 million. Retain half his salary and immediately flip him. You can recoup at least a second from that.

These are short term contracts. If you're going for the tanking approach anyways, and you're not likely to spend to the cap, get some draft capital going.

Maybe nobody wanted to spend picks and/or prospects on either player (even at half price). These seem like the kinds of deals Francis would have discussed with GMs leading up to the ED.

 

[powerstuck]

Maybe nobody wanted to spend picks and/or prospects on either player (even at half price). These seem like the kinds of deals Francis would have discussed with GMs leading up to the ED.

What the rumors and other GM's comments tells us is that discussions most like were had.

But instead of hoping for a 2nd for Domi...Ron was asking for two firsts + 3 other picks.

For JVR it most likely was asking for picks 1 thru 5 in 2021 and same in 2022.

I am exagerating but not even much. I mean the guy was asking for a 1st and a 3rd to not chose Allen.

 

[Mike Jones]

What the rumors and other GM's comments tells us is that discussions most like were had.

But instead of hoping for a 2nd for Domi...Ron was asking for two firsts + 3 other picks.

For JVR it most likely was asking for picks 1 thru 5 in 2021 and same in 2022.

I am exagerating but not even much. I mean the guy was asking for a 1st and a 3rd to not chose Allen.

Asking is a part of negotiating. I'm just surprised we haven't seen more flexibility from Francis.

 

[abo9]

Here's what I don't get.

JVR has 2 years left at 7 million dollars. He was left exposed by Philly. He's a consistent 50-60 point player who generally scores 20+ goals a season.

Now why in the absolute hell did Seattle not take him, retain 50% of his salary, and flip him for a 1st and a prospect. Any competing team in the league would take two years of JVR at 3.5 million, with two runs at the cup while he's still scoring.

Same goes for Max Domi. He's got one year left at 5.3 million. Retain half his salary and immediately flip him. You can recoup at least a second from that.

These are short term contracts. If you're going for the tanking approach anyways, and you're not likely to spend to the cap, get some draft capital going.

Yeah I get selecting Vince Dunn over flipping Tarasenko

But the Flyers pick makes no sense. You're sitting there with $30M cap space and a decent D corp, and you're telling me either of Voracek or Van Riemsdyke was too expensive lol?

Just a real'y, real'y weird strategy

 

[Ice Mammoth]

I posted my comment # 1522 on this topic (Jul 22, 2021 at 2:13 PM Seattle Kraken Expansion Draft Thread (Part 2)).

“Calgary Mark Giordano LD $6,750,000 (UFA 2022) (ED - Mark Giordano) = (@50% ret) = $3,375,000 = 1st
Replacement is not 100% - Alex Goligoski Arizona +.

Columbus Max Domi C LW $5,300,000 UFA 2022 (ED - Gavin Bayreuther!!!) = (LTIR?) = (@50% ret) = $2,650,000 = 1st

Philadelphia James van Riemsdyk LW $7,000,000 UFA 2023 (ED - Carson Twarynski!!!) = (@50% ret) = $3,500,000 = 1st+

@0% ret:
- Chicago Nikita Zadorov LD/RD RFA (ED - John Quenneville)
- Winnipeg Dylan DeMelo RD $3,000,000 UFA 2024 (ED - Mason Appleton)”.

It was surprising to read that Mark Giordano (@ 50% ret) and Max Domi (@ 50% ret) are not 1st. I see a lot of teams wanting to get these players. You need to remember about the deals made in the past deadline. Think of the small cost of additional payroll retention.
Imagine:
Mark Giordano = (@50% ret) = $3,375,000 = 1st; (@50% ret) = $1,687,500 = 4th.
Max Domi = (@50% ret) = $2,650,000 = 1st; (@50% ret) = $1,325,000 = 4th.

Look at the CapFriendly homepage for how many teams have free payroll space.

CapFriendly - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Do I have to believe that NHL teams are not interested? In these Iroks and for this price?

 

[LokiDog]

People keep talking about Appleton over DeMelo as a miss. Seattle drafted 12 defenseman. DeMelo is a good RHD, but he's a #4 on a truly deep team, and Seattle has 4 better or equal Dmen already. Yes, he's a RHD and that does matter, but Appleton is going to end up being the Kraken's Willy Karlsson. That was a no brainer to go with Appleton, IMO. DeMelo is 100% exactly what he is at this point. Appleton is on a clear upward trajectory and about to get a lot more opportunity. Appleton (or Geekie, even though I wanted Bean) is probably the best pick of the draft for Seattle when we look back (which won't be saying too much based on the roster from the initial ED).

 

[AveryStar4Eva]

I’m curious to see when Seattle will start trading away defensemen for picks. They have 11 guys who needs waives next season, they likely carry 8.

 

[Piffle]

I know a lot of people are very surprised at how this expansion draft ended up, but the more I think about, it seems to have worked out in a pretty obvious way.

• Teams exposed their best bottom 6 forwards, so we ended up with a really great bottom 6.
• Teams exposed their best #4 defenseman, so we ended up with not much on the top end of the defense but basically a really good mix of middle pairing defenseman and will defend by committee.
• Teams exposed their worst, overpaid top 6 forwards hoping Francis would bite and take them. Nobody else wanted them, and Francis doesn't want overpaid guys either, so none of those got picked.
• Cap space is solid gold right now, so Francis was very deliberate about choosing the lower priced player where the quality of player was anywhere close.

I know a lot of GMs are under a lot of pressure to perform, so are willing to take on risky (bad) contracts to try to give their team a boost, but building a team with (so far) zero bad contracts and zero dead cap seems a pretty smart way to get started to me. It is still very early in the offseason. We'll see how desperate other GMs get.

 

[SwedishFire]

People keep talking about Appleton over DeMelo as a miss. Seattle drafted 12 defenseman. DeMelo is a good RHD, but he's a #4 on a truly deep team, and Seattle has 4 better or equal Dmen already. Yes, he's a RHD and that does matter, but Appleton is going to end up being the Kraken's Willy Karlsson. That was a no brainer to go with Appleton, IMO. DeMelo is 100% exactly what he is at this point. Appleton is on a clear upward trajectory and about to get a lot more opportunity. Appleton (or Geekie, even though I wanted Bean) is probably the best pick of the draft for Seattle when we look back (which won't be saying too much based on the roster from the initial ED).

The good players whre also exposed often on the same team, and afrancis could only pick one. Though the Bean pick was obvious bad. I think that he was a RFA has a lot to do with it. He probably wanted to stay. Or Francis really is an idiot. Who really knows. Because Bean clearly has more trade value than Geekie. Real miss there!

 

[JustAHabFan]

The good players whre also exposed often on the same team, and afrancis could only pick one. Though the Bean pick was obvious bad. I think that he was a RFA has a lot to do with it. He probably wanted to stay. Or Francis really is an idiot. Who really knows. Because Bean clearly has more trade value than Geekie. Real miss there!

Francis is just a bad GM. Seattle fully deserved him.

 

[Piffle]

Francis is just a bad GM. Seattle fully deserved him.

Why does Seattle fully deserve a bad GM?

 

[SwedishFire]

Francis is just a bad GM. Seattle fully deserved him.

And why take a completly unkkown plauer in columbus instead of Stenlund who at least has trade value? Is the picked player a darkhorse to boom?

But otherwise pretty good deals. Except Oleksiaks monstercontract. Cant belive he will be better than Larsson??

Im having a hard time beliving Seattle will ice a good team in october. But there will be trades with all desperate GMs that has used all cap, 1 and 2 rounders.

Seattle missed on Landeskog, they should now target Eichel.

 

[Piffle]

Seattle missed on Landeskog, they should now target Eichel.

I missed it. Where did Landeskog sign?

 

[SwedishFire]

I missed it. Where did Landeskog sign?

He did not want to sogn with Seattle. But ofC it aint over. But Francis dont want to spend high cap, so I dont see a siging with them

 

[Piffle]

He did not want to sogn with Seattle. But ofC it aint over. But Francis dont want to spend high cap, so I dont see a siging with them

Him waiting to see all offers doesn't mean Seattle missed on him. Francis wants to get good value with his cap dollars, which he may see Landy as good value. I think that is way too early to call.

 

[Olcoach]

Lol. Minnesota wild style hockey coming up.
Watch the fans just race to watch Eberle score a goal every 4 games the kraken to lose 3-1 each night.

So the K's are playoff bound you say? Lol

 

[Taswell]

And why take a completly unkkown plauer in columbus instead of Stenlund who at least has trade value? Is the picked player a darkhorse to boom?

But otherwise pretty good deals. Except Oleksiaks monstercontract. Cant belive he will be better than Larsson??

Im having a hard time beliving Seattle will ice a good team in october. But there will be trades with all desperate GMs that has used all cap, 1 and 2 rounders.

Seattle missed on Landeskog, they should now target Eichel.

I hope not for Jack's sake. Congrats, you've been traded from the worst team in the league to a team that looks to challenge for that title!

 

[KrakenSabresMike]

I hope not for Jack's sake. Congrats, you've been traded from the worst team in the league to a team that looks to challenge for that title!

I guarantee you Seattle will not be the worst team in the league - just look at their division

 

[uncleben]

Here's an interesting tidbit I just stumbled across in the CBA:

13.7 Expansion Draft, Team Relocation. Any Player forced to move as a result of being claimed in an expansion draft, or as a result of a team relocation, shall be paid $6,000. (This payment shall not affect or be credited against "moving expenses" to which the Player might otherwise be entitled).

A cool 6Gs in the pockets of those players

 

[Frank Drebin]

Here's an interesting tidbit I just stumbled across in the CBA:



A cool 6Gs in the pockets of those players

What do nhl players do with 6 grand? Jeans and sneakers?