Pre-Game Talk: Seattle Expansion Draft (It matters)

[AppleHoneySauce]

It's a game of high stakes chicken, but I see Francis as the winner because he's got all the cap space and the choices. You know some GM out there is going to fall in love with one of his players and do anything to keep them on the team. I expect at least 3 or 4 teams to blink before the draft.

Yeah to me this seems more like a game of chicken the kraken are teying to play to hopefully gain some assets to not pick him. Its quite interesting and if they are actually this ruthless makes me wonder of they would be willing to throw down some offersheets.

 

[Hit the post]

He's a player they've heard of because he was once selected 6th overall. MAH CEILINGZ!!

I'm sure DimJim has looked into the availability of Cam Barker. Dude is 6 ft 3 inches & 215 pounds besides being a former 3rd overall pick!

 

[4Twenty]

Obviously if I was working in Player Val for Seattle I'd be giving the red light on Price.

But...I can see it. He will be all over their marketing material, and if he even has 1 good year it would be absolutely huge for them in terms of marketing a new team. They will have the cap space and, probably he can be LTIRed in the near future.

Like, again, I would have to vote no if I had a vote, but I don't think it's completely ridiculous given their specific situation. Who are you going to market the team around? Zack MacEwan? Calle Jarnkrok? The sales of Price jerseys alone could almost make it worthwhile. Maybe, I assume those are the numbers they are running.

He's having hip surgery, so it's not like he'll be waltzing in there day one and putting them on his back. Imagine they take him and by the time he's healthy they're already a lotto team. It just seems ridiculous.

I can kind of understand the marketing aspect, but how does that work if he's not playing when the teams starts playing? Vegas had Fleury, but they also marketed who they took into stars. Nobody though Reilly Smith, William Karlsson, and Johnathan Marchessault were marketable.

If it was me, just going by what you could draft on it's own, I'd be marketing 24 year old Stanley Cup Champion puck mover - Vince Dunn, former USA Hockey olympian James Van Riemsdyk, and whatever bounty you get from the current Stanley Cup champs. JVR and Giordano are the only big salaries I'd draft free of sweetener.

We must also remember, guys like Derek Engylland were marketed stars in Vegas' first year. People will just be stoked to have a team.

 

[Bubbles]

I would disagree. Think the flat cap would force teams to accept losing a bigger cap hit player.

really don’t see guys who are listed as available for the ED that teams would bend over backwards to try to keep when factoring the players contract and term, in addition to the teams cap situation.

I can see teams trying to entice Sea to take a bad contract. But teams like Ana, Det, NJ. Buf have the cap room to do that too if they can’t work out a deal with Sea.

who knows what other factors impact the kraken decision making process. Things like the Vegas success, potential for an nba expansion team or relocation in the near future, competing with the other pro teams plus UW football for sports entertainment dollars.

If Francis can't extract assets or a draft pick, he simply picks the player he likes. He wins either way. Arguably there are better players available in this draft than the Vegas one.

If he takes just the max amount of defenseman, he's laughin'. Dunn, Fleury, Bean...that's a core than can stay together for years.

Competition for sports entertainment isn't a big issue IMO. NBA coming back is a forgone conclusion and football is so big that they're not worried about hockey at all. Besides football is a 5 month sport while hockey is 9 months long.

 

[m9]

Obviously if I was working in Player Val for Seattle I'd be giving the red light on Price.

But...I can see it. He will be all over their marketing material, and if he even has 1 good year it would be absolutely huge for them in terms of marketing a new team. They will have the cap space and, probably he can be LTIRed in the near future.

Like, again, I would have to vote no if I had a vote, but I don't think it's completely ridiculous given their specific situation. Who are you going to market the team around? Zack MacEwan? Calle Jarnkrok? The sales of Price jerseys alone could almost make it worthwhile. Maybe, I assume those are the numbers they are running.

I've seen the "Price jerseys" argument around a bit. For fans who are planning on buying a jersey, do you think they wouldn't buy a jersey if they don't have Price? Or would they then buy two jerseys?

I just don't really get it. I think 90% of people who are buying a Kraken jersey are just going to buy one. If not Price, someone else.

 

[Hit the post]

If Francis can't extract assets or a draft pick, he simply picks the player he likes. He wins either way. Arguably there are better players available in this draft than the Vegas one.

If he takes just the max amount of defenseman, he's laughin'. Dunn, Fleury, Bean...that's a core than can stay together for years.

Competition for sports entertainment isn't a big issue IMO. NBA coming back is a forgone conclusion and football is so big that they're not worried about hockey at all. Besides football is a 5 month sport while hockey is 9 months long.

I tend to agree. Kraken owner funded their new arena *with privately funded money* & I think it's not that difficult to modify to have a NBA team as a tenant.

 

[Hit the post]

I've seen the "Price jerseys" argument around a bit. For fans who are planning on buying a jersey, do you think they wouldn't buy a jersey if they don't have Price? Or would they then buy two jerseys?

I just don't really get it. I think 90% of people who are buying a Kraken jersey are just going to buy one. If not Price, someone else.

If Price can play a part in getting the Kraken into the post-season & win a round or two, that pays for a good chunk of his salary. Playoff revenue is where the owners really rake in the money.

 

[m9]

If Price can play a part in getting the Kraken into the post-season & win a round or two, that pays for a good chunk of his salary. Playoff revenue is where the owners really rake in the money.

Sure.. but you can just say that about any player so what meaning does it have?

 

[Egghead1999]

If Seattle had not essentially committed to Dreigder already, I think they 100% take Price even with the injuries.

Now they are trying to figure out what to do.

I say 50/50 given the lack of deals so far from Seattle to only taken certain players off teams or to stay away from some.

You are right on. Both 2 big-name players that MTL unprotected are injuries. I call them are 'FAKE' injuries news. In fact, $ on Price contract is only ~8M AAV after this year. The only downside of having Price is that it is hard to tank.

 

[Hit the post]

Sure.. but you can just say that about any player so what meaning does it have?

If we didn't have Demko in net, we'd be a lock for a lottery pick even if the rest of the lineup was 100% healthy for the whole year. I'm assuming (my guess) Seattle will assemble a better or comparable blueline than the Canucks current one as it stands.

 

[Melvin]

I've seen the "Price jerseys" argument around a bit. For fans who are planning on buying a jersey, do you think they wouldn't buy a jersey if they don't have Price? Or would they then buy two jerseys?

I just don't really get it. I think 90% of people who are buying a Kraken jersey are just going to buy one. If not Price, someone else.

I think you're wrong, frankly, but I think this is what they need to look into. Like this is the discussion we should be having. If not for this angle, taking Price would be absolutely out of the question, obviously. Obviously.

I don't buy the "star power," "jersey sales" argument generally, but we're talking about an expansion team. Getting Price could help create a buzz about the team in a very significant way. I know several Seattle residents who are barely aware they are getting an NHL team, but the Carey Price news puts it on their radar.

 

[Egghead1999]

Sure.. but you can just say that about any player so what meaning does it have?

If that player is available, you should take it, especially it costs you no pick and no player(s).

 

[Melvin]

He's having hip surgery, so it's not like he'll be waltzing in there day one and putting them on his back. Imagine they take him and by the time he's healthy they're already a lotto team. It just seems ridiculous.

I can kind of understand the marketing aspect, but how does that work if he's not playing when the teams starts playing? Vegas had Fleury, but they also marketed who they took into stars. Nobody though Reilly Smith, William Karlsson, and Johnathan Marchessault were marketable.

If it was me, just going by what you could draft on it's own, I'd be marketing 24 year old Stanley Cup Champion puck mover - Vince Dunn, former USA Hockey olympian James Van Riemsdyk, and whatever bounty you get from the current Stanley Cup champs. JVR and Giordano are the only big salaries I'd draft free of sweetener.

We must also remember, guys like Derek Engylland were marketed stars in Vegas' first year. People will just be stoked to have a team.

Engylland was virtually the only player who was from Vegas. Price is from, uh....the west!

Again, I am not really arguing for this, I am saying that this is what the argument is. Presumably Seattle has better data on the local interest and their marketing than I do. But I don't buy that like, the same people who would buy a Price jersey would be buying a Jarnkrok jersey. I really don't think that's true. I think we as diehard fans lose touch sometimes with how more casual fans operate.

 

[MS]

Obviously if I was working in Player Val for Seattle I'd be giving the red light on Price.

But...I can see it. He will be all over their marketing material, and if he even has 1 good year it would be absolutely huge for them in terms of marketing a new team. They will have the cap space and, probably he can be LTIRed in the near future.

Like, again, I would have to vote no if I had a vote, but I don't think it's completely ridiculous given their specific situation. Who are you going to market the team around? Zack MacEwan? Calle Jarnkrok? The sales of Price jerseys alone could almost make it worthwhile. Maybe, I assume those are the numbers they are running.

I ... still don't see it.

Carey Price isn't Wayne Gretzky or Sidney Crosby or Alex Ovechkin where even total non-hockey fans have heard of him and know he's a big deal and he'll sell tickets as a result. He might get a bit of hype but I'd still guess that most 'new fans' in Seattle have barely heard of him.

There's no way I could see his name having enough clout to generate huge revenue over and above his terrible contract and likely poor on-ice play. Especially since interest in Seattle already seems very high - season tickets sold out months and months ago and they're probably selling out every game this year. If you're lagging behind projections a big splash might be needed but when there are no more tickets to sell, you have to sell a hell of a lot of jerseys to make up for it.

Plus Price won't even be healthy next year. Hard to hype a guy up to the fans and then not have him available until after Christmas or whatever.

 

[tyhee]

Yup
2nd round pick from 2018
One can argue his value is a late 1st due to his decent season in SHL

The SHL must have suddenly gotten a lot tougher if a D+3 player being the 8th leading scorer on an SHL team makes a prospect equivalent in value to a late 1st round NHL draft pick.

 

[StreetHawk]

The SHL must have suddenly gotten a lot tougher if a D+3 player being the 8th leading scorer on an SHL team makes a prospect equivalent in value to a late 1st round NHL draft pick.

It probably got tougher than it was in 19-20 with guys who would be in the AHL in 20-21 going over there to begin the season with the AHL season on pause til 2021.
But, who really cares where a player was drafted 3 years ago. late round picks can be better than guys drafted in the top 50 after 3 years of development.

 

[m9]

I think you're wrong, frankly, but I think this is what they need to look into. Like this is the discussion we should be having. If not for this angle, taking Price would be absolutely out of the question, obviously. Obviously.

I don't buy the "star power," "jersey sales" argument generally, but we're talking about an expansion team. Getting Price could help create a buzz about the team in a very significant way. I know several Seattle residents who are barely aware they are getting an NHL team, but the Carey Price news puts it on their radar.

Engylland was virtually the only player who was from Vegas. Price is from, uh....the west!

Again, I am not really arguing for this, I am saying that this is what the argument is. Presumably Seattle has better data on the local interest and their marketing than I do. But I don't buy that like, the same people who would buy a Price jersey would be buying a Jarnkrok jersey. I really don't think that's true. I think we as diehard fans lose touch sometimes with how more casual fans operate.

Eh, I guess I just disagree. Jersey sales aren't going to be an issue for an expansion team. I can't imagine the amount of people in Seattle who barely even know they are getting a team is that high, and then from that number a Carey Price is going to push them to buy a jersey. Seems like a stretch.

 

[supercanuck]

From a marketing perspective, I think Subban would make more sense. He has that marketable personality and he is genuinely willing to do community work. Make him captain and face of the franchise in terms of marketing. Plus, he only has one year left on his deal so you can just let him go if it doesn't work out.

 

[Angry Little Elf]

 

[Melvin]

Eh, I guess I just disagree. Jersey sales aren't going to be an issue for an expansion team. I can't imagine the amount of people in Seattle who barely even know they are getting a team is that high, and then from that number a Carey Price is going to push them to buy a jersey. Seems like a stretch.

Well, I don't have the data. You don't have the data. This is assume what they're looking into. Otherwise there is literally no reason to even consider taking Price.

 

[m9]

I actually think all this Carey Price talk is 100% BS. I think it's a way to give some respect to Price & also to get some clicks during an otherwise dead few days until the actual expansion draft.

 

[racerjoe]

I really think the whole price thing is just a ploy on Seattle’s part. I think it comes down to a few different things one can they convince Montreal that they really will take price? And does Montreal really want to keep price? But then on top of that can they tell Jim Benning that he we’re going to take price and not take holtby unless you give us blank? Maybe they think they can get assets from both?

there just has to be more here.

 

[Bubbles]

I really think the whole price thing is just a ploy on Seattle’s part. I think it comes down to a few different things one can they convince Montreal that they really will take price? And does Montreal really want to keep price? But then on top of that can they tell Jim Benning that he we’re going to take price and not take holtby unless you give us blank? Maybe they think they can get assets from both?

there just has to be more here.

Well, it started with Price waiving his NMC for the draft. Was he asked by Bergevin so the Habs could protect Allen? Does Price care about the Habs and Allen to waive it (and, just for the draft)?

Also, if the Kraken take Price, Bergevin is relieved of the cap hit without getting blamed for trading Price away.

Also, some cryptic words from Price's wife.

I guess we'll know after Wednesday.

 

[Melvin]

I actually think all this Carey Price talk is 100% BS. I think it's a way to give some respect to Price & also to get some clicks during an otherwise dead few days until the actual expansion draft.

On that note, why do we need 5 dead days between the freeze and the draft? They should have held the draft yesterday.

 

[racerjoe]

Well, it started with Price waiving his NMC for the draft. Was he asked by Bergevin so the Habs could protect Allen? Does Price care about the Habs and Allen to waive it (and, just for the draft)?

Also, if the Kraken take Price, Bergevin is relieved of the cap hit without getting blamed for trading Price away.

Also, some cryptic words from Price's wife.

I guess we'll know after Wednesday.

I mean I think the habs should be happy rose price, I am just not sure they actually would be because reasons. I think this was the habs trying to protect an asset and assuming he wouldn’t get selected. Then Seattle “looking” into it and suddenly then his health is an issue. Seems like games to me.