Seattle emphasizing diversity in hires

[Fantomas]

Good luck being at the bottom of the league then.

As opposed to all those teams already at the bottom of the league with a buncha white dudes in charge.

 

[MXD]

I'm in favor of diversity hiring. Unfortunately this is often done poorly (e.g., via quotas), rather than intersectionally.

Diversity hiring rarely goes beyond gender and race categories, which will hopefully change in time. What winds up happening is that hiring organizations stock up on upper-middle class blacks and women, which has negligible impact on inequality.

Great point... but how, exactly, do you counter that when your group of applicants would necessarily be from the middle-class at the lowest (or students that will eventually become upper-middle class themselves)?

 

[MXD]

So how does setting artificial hiring quotas counter inherent bias in a practical manner other than like looking like a good PR move?

What wrong with ensuring that a certain portion of a broader applicant base includes diversity but not to be held to that as you get closer to picking a the right person?

This is the point where I have to answer that, if I knew answer to these questions, I wouldn't be doing what I'm currently doing for a living.

 

[Fantomas]

Great point... but how, exactly, do you counter that when your group of applicants would necessarily be from the middle-class at the lowest (or students that will eventually become upper-middle class themselves)?

By creating initiatives that encourage different groups to apply. Creating awareness in whichever way possible.

One thing I'd love to see gone is preferential hiring based on Ivy league degrees, which are never a sign of ability or intelligence, but rather one of privileged upbringing.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

So what did anyone today do to contribute to these past discriminations, and the bigger point is, if discrimination is bad, why are you supporting it?

Giving minorities and woman more opportunity after centuries of being discriminated against is not discrimination.

If its discrimination to you, then it speaks volume about you. Whoo boy.

The OP clearly states they want to reach %'s that reflect the %'s in Seattle. How doesn't that lead to that exact scenario?

Want to reach and having a set goal does not necessarily mean they will hire any unqualified minorities and woman. Stop reaching.

Honestly, if you are mad about job that you will never apply for or qualified for just because they intend to give more opportunities to non white male, it speaks a lot about you.

 

[MXD]

By creating initiatives that encourage different groups to apply. Creating awareness in whichever way possible.

One thing I'd love to see gone is preferential hiring based on Ivy league degrees, which are never a sign of ability or intelligence, but rather one of privileged upbringing.

Yeah, but if a degree is required for whatever reason, we're back to square one. Totally agree on the awareness point.

Also, Ivy League Grads applying for a middle/upper-middle class job?!

 

[Fantomas]

Yeah, but if a degree is required for whatever reason, we're back to square one. Totally agree on the awareness point.

Also, Ivy League Grads applying for a middle/upper-middle class job?!

I was referring to upper-middle-class upbringing. The jobs themselves will attract all kinds of people, including those willing to work for less because they are independently wealthy.

If you're Seattle and want to hire a stats expert, are you more likely to interview someone with a Harvard degree or someone with a state school degree? That's the kind of question I would ask them, if I were writing a story about this.

 

[Kaner9]

Thats why I honestly believe the only people that support these hiring practices are virtue signalling white people, who feel sorry for the minorities, or feel that they need charity, or pity.

Qft and hate it. This shit basically ruined my brother. Will not go work hard or do anything after people who call themselves his friends tell him for years that he's always against discrimination every where he goes. They didnt get him with evidence but those excuses looked nice to him.

 

[daver]

This is the point where I have to answer that, if I knew answer to these questions, I wouldn't be doing what I'm currently doing for a living.

I am going to go out on a limb and say that the team is not trying to honestly do their best to eliminate inherent biases but rather pander to a social justice agenda.

% quotas are merely a token effort.

 

[daver]

Giving minorities and woman more opportunity after centuries of being discriminated against is not discrimination.

If its discrimination to you, then it speaks volume about you. Whoo boy.

Someone being labeled by their identity and treated differently than other identities is textbook discrimination. Social engineering to "equal" things up doesn't work.

And how are they still being denied opportunities today?

And why should anyone (be it a man, a woman, a non-minority, or a minority man) who doesn't contribute to this discrimination feel like they are indiscriminately being discriminated against? You don't think that creates a sense of resentment?

 

[daver]

Want to reach and having a set goal does not necessarily mean they will hire any unqualified minorities and woman. Stop reaching.

You seem to live in a world where you can have people who are equally qualified but women and minorities will get an extra point for being historically oppressed.

The very existence of the goal means they will give a job to women and/or minority to meet their goal who objectively is not as qualified, or give the perception of it.

 

[daver]

Honestly, if you are mad about job that you will never apply for or qualified for just because they intend to give more opportunities to non white male, it speaks a lot about you.

There we go. When all else fails, bring out the ivory tower argument: " I feel empathy therefore I am better than you and can make grossly inappropriate attacks on your character."

and more importantly, " I can hide behind this facade of higher moral values to avoid having an actual objective discussion about the social value of this program".

 

[daver]

I think the reason the whole "discrimination in the past" narrative to minorities having less opportunities than white people = why there is less representation in certain careers is extremely, extremely overstated. The experiences of immigrants like myself, my parents, and the Chinese-Canadian community in the Toronto area kind of destroy this argument. My parents and I immigrated to Canada from China in 1997. I was around 4, my parents in their 30s. China then was very poor so my parents and I had no money at all (these international students from China now are rich as hell though), and we lived in a small, run-down apartment. The English education in China at the time was very poor, so neither of my parents could speak much English when they came, and they had to work in Chinese restaurants. Slowly, both of them attended College/University and restarted their careers, and now do very well for themselves. We moved from a small apartment to a modest townhouse and now my parents live in a very nice house. This isn't an isolated case by any means. Toronto has a very large Chinese/Asian population, and I saw many Chinese immigrant families like mine. Pretty much all of them are doing fairly well for themselves now. This was pre-diversity BS, so they was no preferential treatment for being a minority at that time. Now in Canada (actually, I can't be sure, because the study I saw was in the US, but I think Canada should be much the same) as a racial minority, Asians on average attain the highest levels of education (so many Asians are entering medical school that I am now on the bad end of affirmative action lol), achieve higher average levels of wealth etc. Despite the majority being recent immigrants/2nd generation. A lot of them could not speak English, had to restart their careers in their 30s/40s etc and had no money coming in. You mention Jim Crow laws, but we had "head tax" laws for Chinese people in the 20th century. How does white privilege explain this?

Great post. Too bad it will be ignored.

 

[Pizza!Pizza!]

I just want to interject and applaud the mods for letting this thread stay open for 10 pages. Many threads like this would have been culled after the first 10 posts, especially on the mainboard.

I don't think anyone has changed their opinions based on the debate/discussion but discord is still important and its great that everyone here has been able to post their viewpoints in accordance with our free speech principles.

 

[flyersfan187]

I wish people wouldn’t consider skin color at all for jobs and try to hire who they think is the best person for the job.

 

[CupsOverCash]

I think the biggest reason for all of this is education in this country sucks and its even worse in poor areas. Im not for hiring quotas because I think that is just the same side of the coin and doesnt address the real issue. The country needs equal opportunity, not equal outcome. Then they really need to fix the education accross the country. Not just in poor areas either, everywhere.

 

[webdev]

Good for them, so what black coach will they hire or is this all waitresses and security jobs?

Not hiring the best person for the job is not the way I hire people but whatever. They are a private company who can do what they like.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

There we go. When all else fails, bring out the ivory tower argument: " I feel empathy therefore I am better than you and can make grossly inappropriate attacks on your character."

and more importantly, " I can hide behind this facade of higher moral values to avoid having an actual objective discussion about the social value of this program".

Grossly inappropriate? Bruh you are out here being mad that minorities and women get an opportunity to show their ability and essentially calling them incompetent. Why are you assuming they can’t find people of color or women who are more than capable?

Great post. Too bad it will be ignored.

And it rightfully should be. I am Asian American and I know my experience is nothing like those of other minority groups. Ask black or Hispanics if they think they have same opportunities as white men.

Crazy. How many people of color do you actually know and talk to in real life?

 

[daver]

Grossly inappropriate? Bruh you are out here being mad that minorities and women get an opportunity to show their ability and essentially calling them incompetent. Why are you assuming they can’t find people of color or women who are more than capable?

Yep, that's exactly what I saying. All women should be in the kitchen and minorities should jump back on the boat they came over on.

Back to being serious, I haven't said one whit about who or who wouldn't be capable? Nobody in this thread has even remotely hinted at this. You obviously need to feel some sort of moral superiority here so have it.

 

[CupsOverCash]

Yep, that's exactly what I saying. All women should be in the kitchen and minorities should jump back on the boat they came over on.

Back to being serious, I haven't said one whit about who or who wouldn't be capable? Nobody in this thread has even remotely hinted at this. You obviously need to feel some sort of moral superiority here so have it.

Nice talking with you.

This is the problem with this debate. If somebody has an opposing view on Diversity hires they are automatically racist or sexist. Maybe some are but is it really preposterous that some people would do a thorough analysis on why this may not be the best idea?? No just racist and sexist.

 

[daver]

And it rightfully should be. I am Asian American and I know my experience is nothing like those of other minority groups. Ask black or Hispanics if they think they have same opportunities as white men.

Crazy. How many people of color do you actually know and talk to in real life?

So we can throw in Asians with white men then as being unfairly privileged? How did the white man ever let that happen?

Opportunities for what? Get an education and to work hard in a chosen field to make a half decent living?

 

[BKIslandersFan]

Yep, that's exactly what I saying. All women should be in the kitchen and minorities should jump back on the boat they came over on.

Back to being serious, I haven't said one whit about who or who wouldn't be capable? Nobody in this thread has even remotely hinted at this. You obviously need to feel some sort of moral superiority here so have it.

Once again lying>>>>>>>

I guess trying to speak some sense and speaking facts is trying to feel moral superiority.

If we agree women and people of color are just as capable then what’s the problem? Why do they need to hire only white men?

This is the problem with this debate. If somebody has an opposing view on Diversity hires they are automatically racist or sexist. Maybe some are but is it really preposterous that some people would do a thorough analysis on why this may not be the best idea?? No just racist and sexist.

No, the problem with this debate is angry white men who doesn’t know any person of color trying to claim everything in this country is fine and dandy and that centuries of inequality and oppression has no effect on today what so ever. Which is quite frankly, insane.

 

[daver]

Once again lying>>>>>>>

I guess trying to speak some sense and speaking facts is trying to feel moral superiority.

No, calling out my character and making assumptions that I think women and minorities are inferior to white men is you trying to feel moral superiority.

 

[daver]

And it rightfully should be. I am Asian American and I know my experience is nothing like those of other minority groups. Ask black or Hispanics if they think they have same opportunities as white men.

Crazy. How many people of color do you actually know and talk to in real life?

So you, as a privileged Asian, would be perfectly happy to step aside from a professional or educational opportunity so someone who is more oppressed can better themselves?

They are doing this at some of the universities in the name of social justice.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

No, calling out my character and making assumptions that I think women and minorities are inferior to white men is you trying to feel moral superiority.

No. You pretty much said it. White men are getting shafted because Seattle allegedly won’t hire best qualified candidate.