Season Over?

[Tripod]

The thing to remember when looking at those forwards is that we still have 3 top 6 forwards signed for 5 more years, 1 other for 3, and another for 2.

We are missing the high end guys to replace Giroux and Voracek, but arguably the replacements for the other guys are already drafted.

With this turning into a crap year, it is very important to sell the few UFA assets we have to get more picks. Because as early as next year, we won't be sellers again for awhile.

But it is very important that we "hit" at this draft. Adding an impact, 1st line forward is a big need. And adding them while still having the current guys in the roster can only help.

With currently 9 picks and hopefully a few more to come, one more great draft could set us up nicely. We are also getting to the point that we could do a quantity for quality trade to fill a hole in the lineup too. We have WJC players who are 3rd-4th on the kids depth chart plus have the current roster guys. If we get more hits than expected, we won't have room for them all. Good problem to have.

Add 1-2 top 6 forwards at the draft and a I will be happy.

This season has been painful to watch. From bad goaltending and D, to a win streak, to now forwards not scoring. But the plan of being sellers should not have changed. Get what you can at the deadline. And see if you can use expansion to our advantage by adding someone who might not normally be available.

 

[Flyerfan13]

Great post tripod agree with all of this...I would just like to add it will also be important who hextall brings in to fill the holes in the lineup thru free agency or trade he must use his cap $ wisely and not overpay.

 

[dats81]

Could not agree more.
They need to go high upside and skill with their picks in the upcoming draft. Mediocrity doesn't cut it anyway with the way the depth chart in terms of forwards looks like.

 

[Psuhockey]

With this turning into a crap year, it is very important to sell the few UFA assets we have to get more picks. Because as early as next year, we won't be sellers again for awhile.
.

Good post but I disagree with you about next season. I think next season could be another bad one. I don't expect Hextall to bring in much veteran help, so the help will be coming from within. That means there will be a very young defense which is going to be mistake prone as they learn. Hakstol is probably not going anywhere either so you have a recipe for the same next season.

Now Hextall could surprise and add some major pieces this summer but even if the team performs the same, I don't think it would be that terrible. Next year's draft looks pretty good so a bottom 10 finish coupled with one this year and those 2 top 6 high end forward you stated the Flyers need could be filled.

Prospect wise we are just about in the exact position Chicago was before they drafted Toews and then Kane the next season.

 

[Psuhockey]

To follow up on the Chicago prospect pool comparison:

Before 2006 when Chicago drafted Toews:
2005: Hjalmarsson
2004: Barker (became Leddy) Bolland, Bickell, Brouwer
2003: Seabrook, Crawford, Byfuglien
2002: Keith

If anything the Flyers prospect pool is much better stocked. Just need a Toews and Kane over the next two drafts. No easy but can be done.

 

[Rebels57]

Good post but I disagree with you about next season. I think next season could be another bad one. I don't expect Hextall to bring in much veteran help, so the help will be coming from within. That means there will be a very young defense which is going to be mistake prone as they learn. Hakstol is probably not going anywhere either so you have a recipe for the same next season.

Now Hextall could surprise and add some major pieces this summer but even if the team performs the same, I don't think it would be that terrible. Next year's draft looks pretty good so a bottom 10 finish coupled with one this year and those 2 top 6 high end forward you stated the Flyers need could be filled.

Prospect wise we are just about in the exact position Chicago was before they drafted Toews and then Kane the next season.

I think next season could also be bad but not because of the young defensemen. They cannot possibly be worse than the play the team has gotten out of Streit, Del Zotto, Manning, and MacDonald. That and they could, along with Lindblom, possibly breath some life into the team.

The reason they could still be bad for me is the question marks around goaltending along with the Goof Troop known as Hakstol, Lappy, Murphy, & Mullen.

 

[Psuhockey]

I think next season could also be bad but not because of the young defensemen. They cannot possibly be worse than the play the team has gotten out of Streit, Del Zotto, Manning, and MacDonald. That and they could, along with Lindblom, possibly breath some life into the team.

The reason they could still be bad for me is the question marks around goaltending along with the Goof Troop known as Hakstol, Lappy, Murphy, & Mullen.

Those are good reasons as well.

I know everyone hates the idea of tanking (although this wouldn't be purposely losing but actually losing on merit), but it really wouldn't be a terrible thing to go belly up from now thru next season. It would mean two more top prospects and a brand new coaching staff likely with NHL pedrigee.

It's not like the current "competing" product is all that entertaining.

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

Those are good reasons as well.

I know everyone hates the idea of tanking (although this wouldn't be purposely losing but actually losing on merit), but it really wouldn't be a terrible thing to go belly up from now thru next season. It would mean two more top prospects and a brand new coaching staff likely with NHL pedrigee.

It's not like the current "competing" product is all that entertaining.

Yeah, it wouldn't be that bad at all. You and I and the vast majority of us want us to be truly contending for a Cup, not making meaningless appearances in the playoffs when we don't have a realistic chance of winning. I think next season might be bad in terms of results, but I also think we are going to have a lot more nice things to look at - Lindblom, Morin and Sanheim, possibly Hagg (I understand they might not all be up at the same time) will be good to follow and make it a million times more interesting, a la Ghost.

 

[renberg]

Looking at Appleyard's list, you can see why Hakstol is here. He has a track record at UND of coaching up young talent to NHL levels. Like all of you, I am disgusted by the way that this season has gone but the truth of the matter is that last year was a fluke and this season is the bottom of the trough. There just isn't that much talent on the present roster to compete. (and after Thursday night's game, I question their heart as well.) The guys on Appleyard's list are going to come into camp in the fall knowing that there are a lot of jobs available to be had here.
We'll just see how many guys are moved by the end of the month. My guess is that the Flyers will be quiet at the TDL. It won't be that players aren't available or that Hextall hasn't tried to move them. Its that they just are not very good.

 

[Appleyard]

If Isles, Leafs and Panthers win tonight... and Buffalo hold their current lead:


Atlantic 3rd seed: TOR: 65 in 57
Wildcard 2: NYI: 64 in 57
FLA: 64 in 57
BOS: 64 in 58
BUF: 62 in 59
PHI: 61 in 58

 

[Striiker]

Depressing as it is, this is the long term best case scenario for us. Increasing the odds of Hextall dumping players and getting a better draft pick is more helpful than squeaking into a playoff series that won't end well.

Plus, think of all the money MDZ and Mason are saving us by having bad years now instead of next year and into the future.

 

[bennysflyers16]

Depressing as it is, this is the long term best case scenario for us. Increasing the odds of Hextall dumping players and getting a better draft pick is more helpful than squeaking into a playoff series that won't end well.

Plus, think of all the money MDZ and Mason are saving us by having bad years now instead of next year and into the future.

Last points is the biggest things to be thankful for. Those 2 could have 5-6 year extensions at over 5 mill each , imagine that nightmare.

 

[Appleyard]

Depressing as it is, this is the long term best case scenario for us. Increasing the odds of Hextall dumping players and getting a better draft pick is more helpful than squeaking into a playoff series that won't end well.

Plus, think of all the money MDZ and Mason are saving us by having bad years now instead of next year and into the future.

Yeh. I'm most annoyed with how boring the team is to watch. At least in 2012-13 and 2014-15 they were more fun.

I would love for them to get to ~7th overall pick... will likely only take ~10-12-2 from here. Would basically guarantee a real potential impact forward was there to pick.

Though .500 would give them 85pts and likely ~9-11th pick... and at least 2 of Pettersson, Nečas, Tolvanen, Kostin and Andersson should be around that range.

 

[Striiker]

Yeh. I'm most annoyed with how boring the team is to watch. At least in 2012-13 and 2014-15 they were more fun.

I would love for them to get to ~7th overall pick... will likely only take ~10-12-2 from here. Would basically guarantee a real potential impact forward was there to pick.

Though .500 would give them 85pts and likely ~9-11th pick... and at least 2 of Pettersson, Nečas, Tolvanen, Kostin and Andersson should be around that range.

Yeah, I keep saying how I miss when they used to lose 5-6 when Bryz was here... they sucked but at least there was entertainment in the form of goals.

Also, remember how painful the last season of Berube was? Well think back and tell me if that pain was worth it since we got Provorov as a result. I say it was absolutely worth it. That awful season is merely a fading memory, Provorov is a massive piece of the present and future. Maybe this year could be the forward version of that, awful season but gain a young forward that will be part of the core of the future.

 

[backburner]

If Isles, Leafs and Panthers win tonight... and Buffalo hold their current lead:


Atlantic 3rd seed: TOR: 65 in 57
Wildcard 2: NYI: 64 in 57
FLA: 64 in 57
BOS: 64 in 58
BUF: 62 in 59
PHI: 61 in 58

those feels when youre behind buffalo

 

[Curufinwe]

If you look at their goalies numbers you'll feel even worse.

 

[Garbage Goal]

I stopped watching a good half dozen games ago or so. They're both bad and dreadfully boring now.

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

To follow up on the Chicago prospect pool comparison:

Before 2006 when Chicago drafted Toews:
2005: Hjalmarsson
2004: Barker (became Leddy) Bolland, Bickell, Brouwer
2003: Seabrook, Crawford, Byfuglien
2002: Keith

If anything the Flyers prospect pool is much better stocked. Just need a Toews and Kane over the next two drafts. No easy but can be done.

Hawks also selected Craig Anderson in 2001 (3rd round) and James Wisniewski (5th round of 2002) who both became pretty good NHL talents

Also Tuomo Ruutu (2001 1st round pick) at time of Toews selection was still highly regarded and thought of as key part of Hawks future

Also before 2006 draft Tallon moved on from four Mike Smith 1st round picks

Yakubov (2000 1st) , Vorobiev (2000 1st) , Munro (2001 1st) and Babchuk (2002 1st). Vorobiev was mishandled by organization and would have carved out a decent career IMO if Tallon didn't chase him off to Russia. Yakubov was pathetic and it was time to move on

Munro simply didn't have it as prospect and only found limited appearances with horrible Hawk teams before washing out as prospect and becoming journeyman minor leaguer

Babchuk just wanted to go home and wasn't happy in NA ,, Hawks should have let him go to Russia instead of trading him away. He went to Russia and came back with some confidence and played a few solid years with Canes flashing some of that 1st round talent

Going into 2006 the Hawks prospect pool was geared from net out

D = Seabrook , Barker , Babchuk , Keith , Byfuglien , Wisniewski , Barinka and Kukkonen
G = Crawford , Anderson , Munro and Leighton in net

People forget that Hawks original rebuild was for most part a big failure (Four 1st round picks who busted , one who never lived up to hype)

Also the loss in lotto in 2004 that cost Hawks Malkin and Skille pick in 2005 (Which quickly became apparent it was not a good pick) further held back franchise

Drafting Toews/Kane truly was turning point and shows just how important that type of talent is high in draft while the Keith , Crawford , etc show the value of finding steals/depth thru draft

You guys have the D prospect depth comparable to Hawks but I am not sure how strong or weak your G/F prospect group is. Do you see those area's as strength going forward? Or do you expect you will probably trade one of your young defenders for help in that area?

 

[Appleyard]

I saw Vorobiev live the other month.

For some reason he is now in the UK and dominating!

On a team that cannot score he is at 1.05 PPG with not too much help apart from Jared Staal!

 

[Appleyard]

As for prospect pool in terms of goalies and forwards.

Goalies are very strong. One of strongest in the NHL.

Hart, Stolarz, Lyon, Sandström, Madsen, Tomek and Fedotov has top-end talent and depth.
It is easy to see, and realistic, Stolarz, Hart and Sandström being NHL calibre goalies if they simply 'stay on track'... they are trending that way right now.


Forwards? Wings are pretty good with:

Konecny, Lindblom, Allison, Laberge, Aube-Kubel, Leier, Martel, Kase and Bunnaman.

Centers not as good... Rubtsov is only guy with realistic top 6 upside. Though Laughton, Vorobyov, Marody, Laczynski and Fazleev could well be good bottom sixers for sure.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

You guys have the D prospect depth comparable to Hawks but I am not sure how strong or weak your G/F prospect group is. Do you see those area's as strength going forward? Or do you expect you will probably trade one of your young defenders for help in that area?

Goaltending is pretty deep. They got Anthony Stolarz (2nd rounder, 2012), Alex Lyon (College UFA, 2016), Felix Sandstrom (3rd rounder, 2015), Carter Hart (2nd rounder, 2016), & Merrick Madsen (6th rounder, 2013). All those guys are progressing well at the moment. Stolarz should be in the NHL next year as one of the Flyers goalies. Sandstrom & Hart are pretty advanced for their ages. Sandstrom was a regular in the SHL as a 18-19 year old. Hart won the CHL goalie of the year last year as a 17 year old & very likely could win it again this year. Lyon was a top college UFA last year & Madsen's been a pretty solid starter the last two years at Harvard & could get an NHL contract. We have Matej Tomek (3rd rounder, 2015) & Ivan Fedotov (7th rounder, 2015) as well but those two have barely played since being drafted so tough to really feel good about them at the moment.

Forward has good depth but lacks high end players. They especially lack skilled players but the organization seems to be focusing more on good sized two-way players similar to when Hextall was in LA.

 

[Psuhockey]

Centers not as good... Rubtsov is only guy with realistic top 6 upside. Though Laughton, Vorobyov, Marody, Laczynski and Fazleev could well be good bottom sixers for sure.

The Flyers are just a center away. Unfortunately it is the one position that is hard to find later in the draft unless it is a loaded one like 2003.

The team IMO has the next two drafts to find one without having to get lucky with a later pick. By 2018-2019 I do believe the Flyers will be a perineal playoff team with their defense and goaltending alone.

 

[Appleyard]

The Flyers are just a center away. Unfortunately it is the one position that is hard to find later in the draft unless it is a loaded one like 2003.

The team IMO has the next two drafts to find one without having to get lucky with a later pick. By 2018-2019 I do believe the Flyers will be a perineal playoff team with their defense and goaltending alone.

They can solve it this draft...

Just get Pettersson in the 1st at ~7th overall.

Then draft Alexei Lipanov in the 2nd round!

And Igor Shvyryov later on.

Job done... future dynasty here we come.

 

[Psuhockey]

They can solve it this draft...

Just get Pettersson in the 1st at ~7th overall.

Then draft Alexei Lipanov in the 2nd round!

And Igor Shvyryov later on.

Job done... future dynasty here we come.

Do you like Pettersson better than Mittelstadt?

 

[Appleyard]

Do you like Pettersson better than Mittelstadt?

As a center for sure.

They are very close IMO as hockey players though. I might rank them right next to each other in rankings right now... though not totally sure. They have been within 3 slots of each other all year in my spreadsheet!

I mean, Mittelstadt would be consensus pick over Pettersson... but if a team wants a shot at a 1C I would feel Pettersson has more chance of being a 1st line player at the center position.