Post-Game Talk: SCQ #3 - 8/4/20 | hurricanes @ RANGERS

3 Least Embarrassing Players


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NikC

Registered User
Oct 7, 2008
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agreed 100% but filling the bottom 6 has never been our issue. we were missing top end talent. once that talent is in place, the bottom 6 is the easy part. plus we need to keep in mind that our cap situation impacted our depth this year. after next year when a ton of $$ comes off the books and kids like barron are hopefully ready I think things will look alot better in the bottom 6. but we need to be patient

Agreed. They're a long way, away lol!
Top 6 talent is the focus.

They have, Zib, Krauss, and Pannarin...thats it!! I want no part of Strome, and a scenario like his.

They need to strengthen the center position period! One guy isn't enough.
It needs to be a strength. They're going nowhere being weak down the middle
 

NikC

Registered User
Oct 7, 2008
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Quinn openly said after game 1 Fast is one of our best players, so NBC saying this isn't a stretch at all

The fact that ONE top 9 player is our x factor is pathetic, along with getting "knocked out" by a former scorned player, who was resting on his laurels as a ranger is beyond pathetic!

There is something wrong with the culture of the organization as a whole.
Tortorella got that one thing 100% rigbt!
 
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Fataldogg

Registered User
Mar 22, 2007
12,406
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Never been happier to see the team lose.

A. I was right.
B. Gaffe for laf
C. All the whining c lowns twisting themselves into pretzels to blame Hank absolutely deserve to see their teams lose. Goalies can elevate teams. They cannot elevate teams from not even worthy of the playoffs into cup champs. Hank got f***ed by this organization his whole career with a below par team, below par coaching and it f***ed him out of multiple cups. So how appropriate this series was. Yet dumb clowns still tried to lay it all, or even partially on hank.

Oh but Igor! Igor! His puck playing! He'd have DEFINITELY stopped every shot there bc of his better reflexes and speed!

Yea ok pal. How's that working for you? That's not how goaltending works. That's not how the sport works. Team is bad. We idiotically rushed the roster with trouba, pan and resigning ck. And a lot of you just eat it up. Yum

Its a lot of Igor fan boys because he is the shiny new toy. He looked no better than Lundqvist in his start, in fact I'd argue Lundqvist in Game 1 was easily the best goaltending we saw in this series.

Fans on here with the Igor talk was embarrassing. They were acting like he was a peak Martin Brodeur, that his puck playing was light years beyond any goaltender, that it contributes to a great transition game leading to more goals...

And we got that...

Igor fan boys need to chill until he proves something, anything, that he deserves to be mentioned in the same breath as the greatest goaltender this organization ever had.
 
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Trxjw

Retired.
May 8, 2007
28,334
11,204
Land of no calls..
Sometimes commentators wax poetic about players because it's just a story line they can create. Other times it's because they've learned from interviews and conversations with players, coaches, and front-office staff that they all consider him an important player. Based on how long Fast has been around, I'm guessing it's the latter.

A guy doesn't need to put up big points or have good underlying metrics in order to be a key guy in the eyes of coaches or other players.
 
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Fataldogg

Registered User
Mar 22, 2007
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Dude, we know that there is a lot of love for Hank, but this one is juuuust a bit over the top.

Its just. Its not over the top. People were blaming the series on him. People were saying we would have swept if Igor started the series. It was embarassing. People were literally rooting against him.

Meanwhile, Igor looked worse than him against the Islanders [or in the very least not any better], and he actually posted a better SV% [albeit insignificant the difference] than Igor against the Hurricanes.

People wanted a scape goat. They wanted to believe that this team couldn't compete this series because "Henrik is 38. He can't play at the NHL level any more." No one wanted to acknowledge that this team has huge issues, far bigger than goaltending, so they hung onto the notion that Igor could be the savior.

It was embarassing for our fan base, as divided as they are, actively rooted against a player like Lundqvist.
 

Glen Sathers Cigar

Sather 4 Ever
Feb 4, 2013
16,616
20,471
New York
The idea that Igor was going to be the difference between this team sucking and this team being a cup contender was ridiculous and is unfair to Igor. The team played horribly.

I mean, of all fanbases, we should be beyond painfully aware that an elite goalie can't get it done entirely on his own after what we've watched the last 15 years.
 

Hi ImHFNYR

Registered User
Jan 10, 2013
7,173
3,087
Wherever I'm standing atm
I'm getting tired of big money throw at top 4 defenseman who are merely good.
And for a place that's pretty overwhelming in its "sky is fallingness" we surprisingly love these moves, sight unseen, every single time.

I say sight unseen bc theres no way even a quarter of the people here watched these guys enough to actually have informed opinions.

Once the player is here it goes back to sky is falling. So I guess were a bunch of hockey romantics always hoping. Wishing. Praying for the best thing to drop into our laps.

...


....

Hmmm...


Orabunchofbullsh**artistspretendingweknowstuff
 
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Joey Bones

***** 2k16
Jul 27, 2012
10,663
4,409
Nowhere
This team is not that close and there will absolutely be a ton of changes in the coming years as a result. Forward remains a work in progress. Only defense and goalie are more or less set, and even on D the search continues for a sure fire #1/LD.

Defense is set my ass. DeAngelo throwing Hail Mary’s that connect with no one, Fox couldn’t keep up, Staal looking old, Trouba with some massive lapses in judgment, Smith taking himself out of plays trying to throw massive hits & create dumb penalties & then Lindgren. All of them couldn’t clear shit from in front of the net.

They need stronger willed players than that. Guys like Trouba, Staal & Smith should’ve been key ins on this series. I’ll give some mulligans to Lindgren & Fox, but they need to be better (although I thought Lindgren was the steadiest defenseman they had). DeAngelo, although not having any playoff experience, needs to make better decisions with the puck. Stop flinging it up ice unless you connect.

There was zero puck control, outside of Kakko. Panarin was no where, Zibanejad was no where, Kreider was no where (until this game), Strome was no where.

They need help if they want to compete & the coaching staff needs to get a clue on how playoff hockey works.
 

Shesterkybomb

Registered User
Dec 30, 2016
15,836
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Its just. Its not over the top. People were blaming the series on him. People were saying we would have swept if Igor started the series. It was embarassing. People were literally rooting against him.

Meanwhile, Igor looked worse than him against the Islanders [or in the very least not any better], and he actually posted a better SV% [albeit insignificant the difference] than Igor against the Hurricanes.

People wanted a scape goat. They wanted to believe that this team couldn't compete this series because "Henrik is 38. He can't play at the NHL level any more." No one wanted to acknowledge that this team has huge issues, far bigger than goaltending, so they hung onto the notion that Igor could be the savior.

It was embarassing for our fan base, as divided as they are, actively rooted against a player like Lundqvist.

You are allowed to like him and realise he isn't the best option for this team anymore at the same time. You don't hate him because you think another goalie is better. This is the real problem, people get bent out of shape when someone says anything negative about him, I don't think there are many if any in here that don't appreciate what he's done but he is past his prime and the magic is gone, it's not coming back no matter how much people want it to.
 

kovazub94

Enigmatic
Aug 5, 2010
12,589
8,456
No he was tremendous tonight. But not having him in first two games completely changed the series. We lost the game tonight when Chytil couldn’t bury a simple empty netter.

and of course the best players on paper Mika and Panarin were not the best players in this series. They were awful Mika especially

Between the two Panarin was several levels worse than Zibanejad.
 

NYRangers0723

Registered User
Apr 30, 2019
2,812
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I never expected that I would see a 3 game stretch where BOTH Mika and Panarin were non factors
 

Raspewtin

Registered User
May 30, 2013
43,199
18,911
Alright I slept on this and got over being personally offended that this is the culmination of 4 months of waiting and nostalgia build-up so here goes:

- Like quite a few of us........I felt we had quite a long time to let hype and good feelings build about this team between the March shutdown and now. This season was just packed with highlights and exceptional seasons from several players. Even some of the losses were kinda incredible (thinking of the almost comeback against Edmonton on NYE). It's easy to forget that this team was not a playoff team pretty consistently all year until February.

- Having said that, I am struggling to wrangle with the fact that we had 5-6 career years out of our players that we are likely not going to get repetitions of and we were still pretty bad this year and got bludgeoned in the playoffs against an (admittedly excellent) opponent. We are very likely not getting a better or same year from Panarin, Zibanejad, or Strome. I think Tony is very capable of the numbers he put up but it remains to be seen. Fox had one of the greatest rookie years from a Ranger I've seen in a long time. Dear god do I hope he can repeat it, cause we may need him to. We even had Shesterkin come in and win 10 games and lose 2 making it look easy. I'm a little disturbed at the several transcendent performances that resulted in us still being a mediocre to bad team especially considering we cannot reasonably expect a repeat of at least 3 of them.

- The Rangers were laughed off the ice in every capacity. Offensively. Defensively. Powerplay. Penalty Kill. I know Carolina's a good team, I have known they're a good, battle tested, ferocious forechecking group that you can basically only beat if they f*** up. I don't think any of this is a reasonable excuse to see 4 goals and a completely neutered top 6. Not one of them was good, in any capacity. Zibanejad and Panarin are obviously the worst cause of what we expected but Buch was a headless chicken all series, Strome is useless without Panarin being a Hart candidate, and Kreider better be f***ing hurt because he did absolute f*** all with his ability to skate and create space. None of these players deserve their own thoughts, they were all worthless.

- Our absolutely awful bottom 6 finally caught up to us, especially with Fast gone which basically necessitated another garbage AHL player taking a regular shift. McKegg should never see regular ice time. Ever. Brainless chicken that skates hard every now and then. PdG long, long overstayed his welcome on this roster and has done absolutely nothing of value since like his 1st game.

- I don't ever want to hear again about how Fast is overrated and kills offense (not that we ever will, probably). He could fight the entire Carolina unit on the ice for the puck and win it. Watching Panarin and especially f***ing Strome try to do that was embarrassing.

- Lemieux's insertion had an immediate impact likely because of the player he is and the fact that he displaced one of the many non-NHLers that are occupying the bottom 6 and I find that sad more than anything. My feelings on Lemieux wildly fluctuate because he is absolutely a useful player and when he's stirring shit up, he rocks.

- Chytil legit made me pull my hair out this "playoffs". He's moving, he's trying, but you could blink in his direction and he would lose the puck. I'm kind of at a loss at how it's so easy to displace him off of it. Obviously he's 20 and honestly I have a hard time remembering that pretty often, but f***ing hell

- Speaking of, I was thrilled to see Lemieux and Chytil take PK shifts. I think their skills allow them to succeed on the PK, particularly Lemieux, and I would really really love for them to take away the PK minutes Strome and Howden inexplicably get.

- Kakko was the best skater on the team and had 0 points. Sums it up nicely. He was an absolute treat to watch though, and I'm hyped as heck for his development.

- Not interested in the screeches of WHIPPING BOY!!! that are gonna come from this but I foam at the mouth when Brett Howden is on the ice. It's even worse than Glass. He gets 15 toi a night in all situations and he's inept at everything. I've seen on multiple occasions he just loses every puck and every battle which makes anything his linemates do useless. He has absolutely no agility or positional awareness. A truly horrendous player and I know he's just one player but players that coaches love for no good reasons get on my nerves way more than anything else.

- I'd love to say more about Gauthier but is it even worth it since he got like 20 TOI total? I'd love to talk about his size and physicality but it doesn't matter cause his intentions aren't whatever horse shit Howden does so whatever.

- Fox was ATROCIOUS in game 1 but rebounded nicely. He wasn't nearly as dynamic as I'd had hoped but it's not like any of our dipshit forwards helped his case. Lindgren was just ok. Not good or bad. Sometimes I forgot he was playing.

- Trouba was our best D all series. Smith had his moments too. He's stupid as hell but he has skill and he hustles. He's obviously not a top pair D but I think he's no doubt an NHL D.

- Don't get me started on Staal. Get rid of him by any means necessary. Yesterday.

- TDA was very clearly injured and it impacted his whole game so I'm not really mad at him.

- It's just so typical that that goofy f***face Skjei doesn't play good hockey for 3 straight years but he's Chris Pronger on the Hurricanes. My dislike for him just absolutely skyrocketed this series and I will be actively wishing he gets hammered every game we play against him.

- Shesterkin has a tangible effect on the team's performance. How or why? I don't know. But he does.

- The team, as a whole, was not prepared in any way. It was evident in everything. Skating, reaction time, intensity, positioning. I am not watching any other series because TBH I don't give a shit but I have a hard time believing there was a team as unprepared to play hockey as we were. I saw a ridiculous amount of "OH SHIT!" moments where the player makes that motion when they start skating that they were caught completely off guard by the entire team. I don't know who or what is responsible but it's extraordinarily noticable.

- This team's puck support is some of the worst in the league. Every player carrying the puck had at least two Canes draped on them. We couldn't dream of positioning and discipline like that. This team is ridiculously passive and they have been since AV's tenure. It's evident everywhere, giving a mile of gap on the PK and EVERY f***ING ZONE ENTRY, the unwillingness of D to pinch (seriously take a watch, the Hurricanes battle at the half boards for the puck in the D zone and the Rangers D are already in the f***ing neutral zone, it's maddening). This is absolutely a system issue and I hope it gets rectified with Ruff gone. I doubt it though.

All in all, this was a rough experience as a fan and as the team. It's a very rude awakening that our surge in Feb was probably a mirage and that there are many significant issues that have to be addressed. A competent bottom 6, a better 2C than Strome, at least 2 good LHD, at the least. Thankfully these aren't roster crippling issues and we have a lot of pieces to work with. I'm happy that Chytil, Kakko, Lindgren, Gauthier, and Fox got this experience but all of the veterans should be embarrassed at their performances besides Trouba. Definitely a little hurt that such a fun season is ending like this. Whatever.

12.5%!!!
 

Beer League Sniper

Homeless Man's Rick Nash
Apr 27, 2010
4,742
1,561
City in a Forest
Some thoughts now that I've had some time to cool off:
  • Our regular season stars were complete no shows. This is a weird situation to play in, to be sure, but this was more than rust. Our team was always going to rise and fall based on our Top-6, and our core players failed hard. Looking at you, Zibanejad/Panarin/Strome/Kreider/Buchnevich.
  • Kakko looked like he took a step forward over the break. Very dangerous, and just an inch away from making some huge plays. If he can take another step forward in this next calendar year, he's going to be a baller.
  • Chytil was up and down, but that's been the story of his early career. If he can establish some consistency, we'll have a very solid 2C going forward.
  • Howden, McKegg, and DiGiuseppe (and players of that ilk) don't belong getting regular minutes on a cup contender. Howden especially is frustrating. Hockey is a business, and good intentions shouldn't get you anywhere if you don't deliver results. The best thing for the kid would be to send him down to the AHL to develop his game, and staple him to Prentiss in the offseason, because the kid has no first step, and is incredibly slight for someone his height.
  • Trouba played very well this series. He made a couple mistakes, most notably that Aho goal that essentially iced the series, but he played aggressive in both ends of the ice.
  • Smith was not that bad. He's a 6/7 that brings a nasty element no one else does on our D. When he gets too many minutes or faces the other team's Top-6, he gets exposed.
  • Staal was predictably terrible. I feel bad, because he's trying, but he just can't hack it anymore. He's a stand up guy, and I hope the front office can convince him to go on IR next season and save the team the dead cap of a buyout. Bring him back in an off-ice leadership role.
  • Fox and DeAngelo both looked off. DeAngelo looked injured, and both were completely out of sync. Fox badly needs to try and improve his skating. He already has the brain for the game, but his inability to shake the forecheckers of a fast, determined opponent was noticeable. Guys aren't going to dog him that badly in the regular season, but they sure as hell will in the playoffs.
  • Lindgren's limitations were on full display this series. He's just not big enough to handle large forwards. Quinn is going to have to shelter the Lindgren/Fox pairing, because they get abused by power forwards. I did like how Lindgren jumped up into a few plays, though. He's our only LD that has the legs to join the rush.
  • Hank was the same Hank we've seen all season. He gave up a few that you'd like to see him stop, stopped a few that should have gone in, and generally played well. He was definitely not the reason we lost the first two, but he didn't really elevate his game, either. The huge problem with Hank is his inability to play the puck. It makes a huge difference in today's NHL, and really helps to stifle the opponent's dump and chase game. I know the result was the same, but Igor's ability to play the puck made a difference in how the team transitioned last night, even if the skaters couldn't ultimately bury the chances they had.
As much as I don't want to give the opponent any credit, the Canes have a hell of a team. They're big, fast, and relentless. We weren't going to beat them without our top guys going supernova, and they did the exact opposite.

Also, playoff success was never going to be sustainable with our current roster composition. Our depth is just too terrible. We have 4, maybe 5 forwards that saw ice time in this series that would not make the cut on our opponent's roster. You can't win over the course of the playoffs with that much filler in your lineup.

With that being said, I'm hopeful for the future. We need to address our depth, and add quality F and LD pieces, but I'm confident that the front office will be aggressive in trying to make a deal in the offseason.
 

Fataldogg

Registered User
Mar 22, 2007
12,406
3,704
You are allowed to like him and realise he isn't the best option for this team anymore at the same time. You don't hate him because you think another goalie is better. This is the real problem, people get bent out of shape when someone says anything negative about him, I don't think there are many if any in here that don't appreciate what he's done but he is past his prime and the magic is gone, it's not coming back no matter how much people want it to.

Its not about that. Its literally that this fan base used him as a scape goat for this series and the organizations short comings simply because he is 38. I don't think many of us expect him to look like what he did in 11-12 to 14-15. But to use him as a scape goat, while falsely bolstering Shesterkin, to me, was embarassing for this fan base.

Including the exhibition game against the Islanders, the team scored 5 goals in 4 games and the fan base was quick to blame a 38 year old future hall of famer for the teams lack of success.
 
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Shesterkybomb

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Dec 30, 2016
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Its not about that. Its literally that this fan base used him as a scape goat for this series and the organizations short comings simply because he is 38. I don't think many of us expect him to look like what he did in 11-12 to 14-15. But to use him as a scape goat, while falsely bolstering Shesterkin, to me, was embarassing for this fan base.

Including the exhibition game against the Islanders, the team scored 5 goals in 4 games and the fan base was quick to blame a 38 year old future hall of famer for the teams lack of success.

I think most knew that we had to be perfect to win this series given our makeup. Shesterkin was the reason we had such a strong run at the end of the year, without him we never would have made the play in. Hank wasn't the only reason we lost but he was never going to be the reason we won because he can't be the man anymore. People get all bent out of shape when an obvious bad goal gets pointed out and will defend to their death it wasn't even though it's right there in video to watch. People were calling Svech's goal a laser and a knuckle puck, which is like saying something is wet and dry at the same time, trying to defend the fact that it was a puck Hank should have easily stopped. One of the all time greats of the Rangers, he has been compensated greatly so I dont lose sleep over whether he plays or not because he isn't delivering on his contract. Same goes for Staal. I always hear how good of leaders the two of them are but if they really cared about the Rangers, they would accept that for the good of the team they need to move on or retire since they can't deliver on their contracts and for them to continue playing hurts the team.
 

NikC

Registered User
Oct 7, 2008
5,050
943
Its a lot of Igor fan boys because he is the shiny new toy. He looked no better than Lundqvist in his start, in fact I'd argue Lundqvist in Game 1 was easily the best goaltending we saw in this series.

Fans on here with the Igor talk was embarrassing. They were acting like he was a peak Martin Brodeur, that his puck playing was light years beyond any goaltender, that it contributes to a great transition game leading to more goals...

And we got that...

Igor fan boys need to chill until he proves something, anything, that he deserves to be mentioned in the same breath as the greatest goaltender this organization ever had.[/QUright!

Igor and Hank are at 2 different platforms in their career. Not sure there's any comparison that make sense?

I wanted Igor in, because he was playing well with this current team and was part of what was going well, well they were playing well.

Lundqvist is bitter pill to swallow and understandably so. He might be one of the best goalies ever to NOT win a cup.

Hank deserved better, but the reality is the rangers were never able to ice a team in FRONT of him to win it all.

Management should have asked him to move on after the outing to the Pens.
Hank needed to salvage his career elsewhere. He kept a team that was never good enough "in the game".

He did this for years. Not his fault. But the irony is the Rangers needed to start the rebuild a long time ago and honoring Lundqvist should not have been a priority.

And here we stand. He's got to get off the books. NOW!
 

Shesterkybomb

Registered User
Dec 30, 2016
15,836
16,679
So....technically Hank could retire, play in sweden for the year and come back and sign with another team right if he wanted to right?
 
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