Salary Cap: Salary Cap + Roster Building | Cap Details + Links in First Post | We can't pay the D this much...

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66-30-33

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Jan 24, 2006
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Would a Maatta, Kessel to Minny for Spurgeon, Zucker trade work? then keep one of JJ or Gud and have Pettersson as the other LD and Schultz will be set to be UFA after.

Dumo-Letang
Petts-Spurgeon
JJ-Schultz

Expensive for a year but we keep Spurgeon (re-signs) over Schultz (walks). Use our AHLers to fill out the bottom 6 for hungry cheap players.
 

madinsomniac

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Jul 3, 2012
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If his last 2 games is your version of being "adequate" then you'll never be happy with our blueline, regardless of who we have playing there. Sure our expectations of him after his time in Vancouver were very low (at least mine were), but he wasn't just "adequate" in his last two games, he was legitimately good. And if (big if) he keeps up this level of play for us, he would actually be well worth his contract/cap hit to us.

I tend to agree but two game isn’t exactly the sample size you want for that decision... hell until the D is fully healthy we really won’t know how he fits or not....
 
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Peat

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@mpp9 I don´t think Rutherford will take a run at Duchene. First thing he´ll do is to sort out the defense and decide if Kessel is being traded.

We need more young, fast Guys like McCann and Blueger. We don´t need any big names anymore. Bring in a lot of hungry players that want to win and play with more urgency in the regular season.

I'm not sure I agree with all of that. I definitely agree about the value of the young hungry guys, but getting a high skill player that really slots in could make a huge difference - and those guys can be pretty hungry too.

Also - Rutherford really likes Duchene. I can see him taking that run.

If JR had any sense about him 2 of Olli, JJ, Guds are gone this summer no matter if Phil is traded or not.
You gotta gut the cash you're paying for a not very good D core.

And for the love of Pete, don't spend cash on the Grant's in FA'y just cuz you have $ to spend.

Grant's minimum wage and was better than most of our AHLers would be. If he actually gets the right guy he likes, I don't see why he should avoid them. And even getting it wrong got us Blandisi.

They have one in WBS.

Adam Johnson should be up, I know others think mid season next year, but he's been just fine up here too. What they are waiting on they allow guys with less skill/speed have regular positions now.

Johnson's not been up here in the regular season?
 

LawnyIris

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Feb 22, 2009
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If Letang is out the rest of this season due to injury, do you move him if his injury is not career ending over the summer or is that blasphemy?

Moving Ollie and Letang frees up 11 mil, depending on what you get in return.
 

Riptide

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Dec 29, 2011
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I tend to agree but two game isn’t exactly the sample size you want for that decision... hell until the D is fully healthy we really won’t know how he fits or not....

No argument here. I just find it funny that some posters can't actually admit when they were wrong, even when referencing just those 2 games.
 

madinsomniac

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No argument here. I just find it funny that some posters can't actually admit when they were wrong, even when referencing just those 2 games.

Lol welcome to the world of internet messageboards... we all do it from time to time... i will happily be wrong about my hot takes if it helps the pens....
 

Big Friggin Dummy

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Feb 22, 2019
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Only way you move Letang is if you have an inside track on Karlsson. Even then, Karlsson's an elite, dynamic guy offensively but I'm not sure he's got the same ceiling Letang has defensively.

Is it worth it to add an offensive juggernaut like Karlsson to your blueline if it means further weakening an already defensively inept blueline corps?
 

NMK11

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Apr 6, 2013
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If anyones worried about Maattas trde value dont.

4 million dollar, Vancouver version of Eric Gudbranson, who has been one of the worst defenders in the league got a functional mid 6 forward.

Maatta has the same AAV, two cup rings and has been inarguably better even in his down years.

We are good
So that's great, but the question is who's the better defenseman, Maatta or Gudbranson? If it's the former, and he's the only D you move for a forward, you just downgraded the defense. Maatta will return a decent package, I think some people here are definitely selling him short, but doesn't change the fact that he's better than both JJ and Gudbranson but may possibly be moved despite that for cap reasons.
 

mpp9

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Dec 5, 2010
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@mpp9 I don´t think Rutherford will take a run at Duchene. First thing he´ll do is to sort out the defense and decide if Kessel is being traded.

We need more young, fast Guys like McCann and Blueger. We don´t need any big names anymore. Bring in a lot of hungry players that want to win and play with more urgency in the regular season.

I don't disagree the defense needs sorted out first. This team still can score with the best of them, but we're starting to see Malkin not be able to do it all on his own anymore. At some point, this team is gonna need some offensive players to pick up the slack for an aging 87 and 71 if we want this window to continue into their mid thirties.

For next season, I'd be cool with signing a guy like Zuc in free agency, trading Phil for a D and moving Maatta for some cap relief. But the season after? I'm not counting on that being enough.
 

Peat

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Jun 14, 2016
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Just on the Bjoog thing - like Brassard (and so many before him), you kinda have to break down what he's been doing with who to get a true idea of what he's doing here as a centre, although its really difficult to be sure with a sample size this small.

Here's the NST of Bjoogs with Geno, Sid and Kessel - and here's the interesting take aways as that stat chart is horrible to look like -

Bjoogs, Geno, Kessel got its face smashed in despite princely zone starts. I don't think we'll see that again in a hurry. Hasn't really played with Geno other than that.

Bjoogs and Sid worked okay but I don't see why you'd see it again this season when Sid's got so many RWs that work.

The actual interesting parts -

Bjoogs has split his time as a centre pretty evenly for having Phil and not having Phil.

With Phil, his possession stats were awful and they got outscored despite getting generous zone starts.

Without however, the possession stats aren't much better but he seems to be absolutely killing the opposition's higher danger chances and that's why the opposition haven't scored in this scenario yet. Possession's a bit underwhelming but as a shut down line that gets lots of defensive zone starts there seems to be potential.

And when that's possible, that's something to build off.

I don't know how we use Bjoogs best going forwards. He's got a lot of talent but I'm not sure I'm seeing a lot of fits. But at the very least I think he can be a shutdown centre and that's something.

He's been up for two preseasons and didn't look out of place. If you're going to give Zar the rope, why not Johnson?

Pre-season's a short time with a lot of variables. I'd be reluctant to place more weight on it than consistency in the AHL and, at least in terms of production, that's something ZAR's done a lot better than Johnson.

If Letang is out the rest of this season due to injury, do you move him if his injury is not career ending over the summer or is that blasphemy?

Moving Ollie and Letang frees up 11 mil, depending on what you get in return.

Blasphemy. Big blasphemy. He's been so important for us and you're not finding a better use of his cap hit in free agency.
 
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mpp9

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If JR had any sense about him 2 of Olli, JJ, Guds are gone this summer no matter if Phil is traded or not.
You gotta gut the cash you're paying for a not very good D core.

And for the love of Pete, don't spend cash on the Grant's in FA'y just cuz you have $ to spend.

This summer could be some serious fireworks, but I'm not holding my breath that they're going to trade two D off the roster. They just traded for Gud, Maatta is loved by the organization and JJ will still have 4 years on his deal.

I think they'll want to keep a RHD like Gud. And one of Maatta/JJ will stay as insurance on Pettersson. Maybe things change a little if Kessel for example is moved for a D.
 
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JimmyTwoTimes

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I'm not sure I agree with all of that. I definitely agree about the value of the young hungry guys, but getting a high skill player that really slots in could make a huge difference - and those guys can be pretty hungry too.

Also - Rutherford really likes Duchene. I can see him taking that run.



Grant's minimum wage and was better than most of our AHLers would be. If he actually gets the right guy he likes, I don't see why he should avoid them. And even getting it wrong got us Blandisi.



Johnson's not been up here in the regular season?

Agree we should add another top guy like Duchene. And guys like Bjorkqvist arent far off. Johnson hasnt been up, but good news with Kasper is they are very high on him and I doubt hed have to play 3-4 years in WBS.

Blueger centering Bjorkvist and whoever else on the 4th line would be solid.
 

Riptide

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Only way you move Letang is if you have an inside track on Karlsson. Even then, Karlsson's an elite, dynamic guy offensively but I'm not sure he's got the same ceiling Letang has defensively.

Is it worth it to add an offensive juggernaut like Karlsson to your blueline if it means further weakening an already defensively inept blueline corps?

For me Karlsson's biggest asset in addition to his individual skill level is the fact that he regularly plays 70+ games a season. However is that worth 4m+ a season over what Letang makes? IDK.
 
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WayneSid9987

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Nov 24, 2009
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Only way you move Letang is if you have an inside track on Karlsson. Even then, Karlsson's an elite, dynamic guy offensively but I'm not sure he's got the same ceiling Letang has defensively.

Is it worth it to add an offensive juggernaut like Karlsson to your blueline if it means further weakening an already defensively inept blueline corps?

If i had the inside track on EK, Phil and Olli(10.8M) would be GONE in less than an hour. That + the cap hike pays for EK.
I'm keepin' Tanger.
Then i shed $ from the JJ, Guds, Bjugs, ZAR group.
 
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KIRK

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Aug 2, 2005
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Just on the Bjoog thing - like Brassard (and so many before him), you kinda have to break down what he's been doing with who to get a true idea of what he's doing here as a centre, although its really difficult to be sure with a sample size this small.

Here's the NST of Bjoogs with Geno, Sid and Kessel - and here's the interesting take aways as that stat chart is horrible to look like -

Bjoogs, Geno, Kessel got its face smashed in despite princely zone starts. I don't think we'll see that again in a hurry. Hasn't really played with Geno other than that.

Bjoogs and Sid worked okay but I don't see why you'd see it again this season when Sid's got so many RWs that work.

The actual interesting parts -

Bjoogs has split his time as a centre pretty evenly for having Phil and not having Phil.

With Phil, his possession stats were awful and they got outscored despite getting generous zone starts.

Without however, the possession stats aren't much better but he seems to be absolutely killing the opposition's higher danger chances and that's why the opposition haven't scored in this scenario yet. Possession's a bit underwhelming but as a shut down line that gets lots of defensive zone starts there seems to be potential.

And when that's possible, that's something to build off.

I don't know how we use Bjoogs best going forwards. He's got a lot of talent but I'm not sure I'm seeing a lot of fits. But at the very least I think he can be a shutdown centre and that's something.



Pre-season's a short time with a lot of variables. I'd be reluctant to place more weight on it than consistency in the AHL and, at least in terms of production, that's something ZAR's done a lot better than Johnson.



Blasphemy. Big blasphemy. He's been so important for us and you're not finding a better use of his cap hit in free agency.

Everyone who plays with Phil sees his possession stats go into the toilet.
 
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MeinerEiner

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Dec 9, 2013
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Agree we should add another top guy like Duchene. And guys like Bjorkqvist arent far off. Johnson hasnt been up, but good news with Kasper is they are very high on him and I doubt hed have to play 3-4 years in WBS.

Blueger centering Bjorkvist and whoever else on the 4th line would be solid.
Do you bring Duchene in to play C or LW? I'm not sure if he's a good option for the 3rd line C spot. Kind of the same as Brass was
 

Empoleon8771

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Aug 25, 2015
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Bjugstad has been solid for the Penguins, I don't have any reasons to complain about him. Expecting more than he has provided out of the 3C spot is expecting too much, IMO. He's producing at a good pace, playing in all situations, using his size and reach to his advantage....I don't have much of a reason to complain about him. He hasn't been as good as McCann, but that doesn't mean he has been bad. I think you can do way worse than Bjugstad as your 3C, and I'd put Bjugstad closer to Bonino's level than Sheahan's level.
 

JimmyTwoTimes

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Apr 13, 2010
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Do you bring Duchene in to play C or LW? I'm not sure if he's a good option for the 3rd line C spot. Kind of the same as Brass was

Id play him with Malkin. Sid has Jake...Malkin will have Duchene. McCann or Bjugstad can center the 3rd. Whoever works out best..we'll find that out the rest of this season. And starting to have high hopes for McCann..not saying he will be Guentzel but he has the pedigree and only 22. Those 2 with Rust on the 3rd line would be solid. Blueger will likely be centering the 4th.

Guentzel - Crosby - Hornqvist
Duchene - Malkin - x
McCann - Bjugstad - Rust
ZAR - Blueger - Simon

Its too bad Bjorkqvist isnt ready yet since I think hed compliment that 2nd line perfectly. That aside that lineup has plenty of options with guys who can play both Center and Wing. Duchene, McCann, Bjugstad, and Blueger. And yes I know Sid doesnt like Horny on his line but 1. We get the most out of him there...and Rust can do well without being on the 1st. 2 . Would love to see that 3rd line.
 

The GM

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Jun 7, 2012
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If Letang is out the rest of this season due to injury, do you move him if his injury is not career ending over the summer or is that blasphemy?

Moving Ollie and Letang frees up 11 mil, depending on what you get in return.
Yes, we trade him and then continue to pursue adding toughness by seeing what billy Tibbetts is up to these days.
 

Big Friggin Dummy

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Feb 22, 2019
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If i had the inside track on EK, Phil and Olli(10.8M) would be GONE in less than an hour. That + the cap hike pays for EK.
I'm keepin' Tanger.
Then i shed $ from the JJ, Guds, Bjugs, ZAR group.
This is the proper decision, but is it a realistic one?

I mean, not that any of this is realistic, but y'know. :laugh:
 
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