thats why we need to be patient and wait till guys from 1995 and later will appear on surface. 90-s were total blackout for Russia in every aspect of life! there is more kids in hockey right now and amount of invested money in to kidshockey is much bigger than it was in early 90-s till to 99/00.
WJC: Russia at the 2011 WJC
- Thread starter RussianHockey96
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thats why we need to be patient and wait till guys from 1995 and later will appear on surface. 90-s were total blackout for Russia in every aspect of life! there is more kids in hockey right now and amount of invested money in to kidshockey is much bigger than it was in early 90-s till to 99/00.
Alessandro Seren Rosso
Registered User
Yes, I agree. But this doesn't mean that our junior hockey is perfect. It's very far from being so, unfortunately.
thats for sure and fact that there were a lot of empty spaces at Superleague rosters which were fulfilled by young guns, helped a lot to be successful at international level.
Peter25
Registered User
Let's take the 2003 WCJ team for example. Players in this team were born from 1983 to 1985. They were five or six year olds when the USSR collapsed. They spent the most crucial years of their hockey development in the early and middle 1990s, when Russia's economical situation was worse then ever before or after.
It is rather impressive that Russia was able to produce such a good WJC teams with players who spent their development time in the chaotic 1990's.
And this further should tell us that Russia's economic situation (which is actually rather good now) is not a reason why Russian hockey has been declining.
Is it really so that in 1995 it was easier and cheaper for a Russian kid to start a hockey career than now? If this is true then there is something seriously wrong in the whole system.
In 1995 Russian hockey clubs were bankcrupt (some of them had trouble buying even equipment for players). I find it unbelievable, that under these circumstances, young kids could start a hockey career more easily in 1995 than today, when the money is plentiful in Russian hockey and the middle class has grown fast in the country.
Peter25
Registered User
Ah, OK. This explains something. The Russian hockey development system hit the rock bottom in 1997-2000, and the current WJC players started their hockey careers during this period.
I assume that the situation is better today than it was in those years, so we can expect better Russian age groups in the future?
Peter25
Registered User
Yep, those "democratic" years of 1990's... Boris Yeltsin boozing in Kremlin, the "human rights activist" Mikhail Khodorkovsky sending his Kavkaz goons to invade oil fields by force, another "human rights activist" Boris Berezovsky selling weapons to Chechen rebels, Russian state defaulting due to unpaid loans... who wouldn't want to go back to those golden years?
Soviet Union collapsed - yes! The hockey system, infrastructure, coaching, the cost structure, traditions, human dignity (corruption) did not simply COLLAPSE all in one day. In fact, when I was growing up in Russia in the early 90's, Sports is one of the few things that remained very strong and admirable. Coach expectations were very high. Malkin and Ovechkin themselves admitted that they have not reallly seen the corruption that is happening in kids' hockey today. I am 100% sure that economics is one of the main factors Russia is struggling today, it had a direct effect on the social structure which is changing the sports scene right now. I do think that in the long run its for the better though.
For example, I played basketball in Russia and went through the developement system in 1991-1996. The "OFP" as we called it, was a remainensce of the Soviet Overall Physical Preparation, and for 10-12 year olds the standards were very high. Such as being able to do a certain amount of push-ups sit-ups that had to be achieved. Or 5km run and so on... Way different from the western approach. In Russia we really didn't have "house leauges". You were there to develop either into a professional, or a well-accomplished athlete (regional level).
Nowadays these things are still there, but the kids don't HAVE to meet any standards, their parents just pay and they are on the 1st line.
cska78
Registered User
this...it took a while for everything to collapse...especially in marquee sports. But for example I did crew in the 93-95 years - it was awful...during late 80's they started building a NT base in my hometown - and as the country collapsed they just dropped it...The ruins stood there for years, the boats were hand-me downs, that we had to repair ourselves, the only equipment we had is a bar with weights - no machines, no free weights...
hey do you guys know anything about Nikita Kucherov?
looking at the MHL stats from the past season, and he had 42 points in just 28 games. these are pretty good numbers compared to the other MHLers, but what gets me here is that he is only 17 years old while everyone who has scored more than him is a 19 year old.
hope he has some potential!
looking at the MHL stats from the past season, and he had 42 points in just 28 games. these are pretty good numbers compared to the other MHLers, but what gets me here is that he is only 17 years old while everyone who has scored more than him is a 19 year old.
hope he has some potential!
Alessandro Seren Rosso
Registered User
Good report Alessandro!
CSKA Red Army JR. this years has a really exciting team. The only thing better than their prospect line-up is the way they play. Having watched them, you can see the CSKA touch the way their game is organized. Lots of passing, combinations and skilled forwards. When the #5 joins the attack its like watching shades of Fetisov
CSKA Red Army JR. this years has a really exciting team. The only thing better than their prospect line-up is the way they play. Having watched them, you can see the CSKA touch the way their game is organized. Lots of passing, combinations and skilled forwards. When the #5 joins the attack its like watching shades of Fetisov
So waht is/are the achillestendon/s? Not enough good coaches, number of rinks?
Wings, did you finally get to see the game? I did and it was a very entertaining game for the most part. The Russians came out hard and did display the skills they are known for but also took the body quite well. Although the Nickel City Sons are indeed a strong team, I thought the Russians would win more convincingly than 6-5. Plus, there was a disallowed Sons goal that clearly went in.
Yakushev72
In terms of decline of Russian performances in the past seven years in WJC, don't underestimate the gains that have been made by competitors like Canada, Sweden, US and even Finland. Except for Canada, the other 3 nations have developed national team development programs that have really improved the quality of their play, especially Sweden and US. Those nations weren't nearly as good or competitive with the big 2 (Russia and Canada) before they began special programs to develop national youth teams. They have had spectacular success since.
Canada didn't need a national development program, because they had 60 major junior teams competing in a high quality league where most teams play the same basic style. They could just sit back and pick the cream of the crop of 25 players for national youth teams. That approach works best for a nation that has a large hockey playing population where the goal is to develop the large available talent pool. Canada has 33 million people, whereas Sweden has 8 and Finland only 5 million. Russia has patterned its youth development program more after the Canadian model with a national junior league (32 teams) that has the potential capability to develop large numbers of talented players. Theoretically, the Russians could select a top-flight player for every roster spot.
The biggest thing the MHL could do, if it is successful, is to give Russian kids experience playing in competitive hockey situations. The lack of competitive experience really showed against Finland last night. Yes, the Russian team had more talented individuals than Finland (Kuznetsov, Tarasenko, Kitsyn), but the Finnish team looked like they knew what they wanted to do and did a better job of attacking and bottling the Russians up in their own zone. In my opinion, the lack of competitive experience is what makes the Russian defensemen look so lost and confused as to what to do at times.
In terms of decline of Russian performances in the past seven years in WJC, don't underestimate the gains that have been made by competitors like Canada, Sweden, US and even Finland. Except for Canada, the other 3 nations have developed national team development programs that have really improved the quality of their play, especially Sweden and US. Those nations weren't nearly as good or competitive with the big 2 (Russia and Canada) before they began special programs to develop national youth teams. They have had spectacular success since.
Canada didn't need a national development program, because they had 60 major junior teams competing in a high quality league where most teams play the same basic style. They could just sit back and pick the cream of the crop of 25 players for national youth teams. That approach works best for a nation that has a large hockey playing population where the goal is to develop the large available talent pool. Canada has 33 million people, whereas Sweden has 8 and Finland only 5 million. Russia has patterned its youth development program more after the Canadian model with a national junior league (32 teams) that has the potential capability to develop large numbers of talented players. Theoretically, the Russians could select a top-flight player for every roster spot.
The biggest thing the MHL could do, if it is successful, is to give Russian kids experience playing in competitive hockey situations. The lack of competitive experience really showed against Finland last night. Yes, the Russian team had more talented individuals than Finland (Kuznetsov, Tarasenko, Kitsyn), but the Finnish team looked like they knew what they wanted to do and did a better job of attacking and bottling the Russians up in their own zone. In my opinion, the lack of competitive experience is what makes the Russian defensemen look so lost and confused as to what to do at times.
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