Rumor: Rumors and Proposals Thread | Spector: Kassian Extension Before Trade Deadline? Anything Else?
- Thread starter Cam98
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That’s great then you know points are not everything when it comes to contracts yes it’s definitely the major part but there are other aspects that are involved. And it’s my opinion that Kass as of right now is more then a 3rd liner he is proving he has the skill to be a top 6 winger. He wasn’t drafted where he was because he was void of skill. Will he end up down on the third line at some point absolutely at some point in time he will and he will be a decent 3rd liner with a decent skill set that will benefit our bottom 6 when that time comes. I guess that’s where we disagree on what we believe Kassian is
Fourier
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Johnsson has not really done much this year. He is currently being significantly outproduced by all of Timashev, Engvall, Kapanen and before he got hurt Mikhayev. So they lose very little in moving him in terms of immediate value. But they are getting killed on the back end and have a 27 year old rookie playing as their top pairing RHD.
And the reason the cap hit matters is because at full strength the Leafs are over the cap this year. They have had to play with a limited roster.
I see no evidence that Johnsson is Benson's absolute max potential. Benson had better overall numbers in the AHL, was a higher pick and has relatively speaking been considered a better player at each stage of his career. And he does not cost you anything.
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48g90a138pts
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No more buying out contracts or retaining. It's got out of hand on this team. This season the Oilers have $4.88mil in dead cap. Next year it comes down a bit to $4.58mil. That's f***ing terrible and handcuffs the team severely. Holland needs to let the buyout and Lucic retained salaries expire and don't go down that road anymore. That dead money it's a pretty decent depth player or added scoring. If the team has a player down the road that fits the bill to buyout, bury him till you can trade him if possible, if not, let the contract expire.
The 2021-22 and 2022-23 seasons the dead cap money is $2.25mil. Not that bad, still dead cap though. I sure hope Holland doesn't retain on a longterm contract or buyout any more contracts.
If Neal really falls off a cliff try and trade him, if not, just bury him till the contact is done.
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#Nomorebuyouts
The 2021-22 and 2022-23 seasons the dead cap money is $2.25mil. Not that bad, still dead cap though. I sure hope Holland doesn't retain on a longterm contract or buyout any more contracts.
If Neal really falls off a cliff try and trade him, if not, just bury him till the contact is done.
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#Nomorebuyouts
I'm not really talking about this season. I'm talking about the Oilers moving forward. Andreas Johnsson is making $3.4m for another three years after this. I sincerely hope the Oilers have their sights set on someone a lot better than AJ in their top six long term.
If he's a third line winger moving forward, that's a significant investment. And that production won't be there.
Short term? Sure. It hurts Neal's bottom line, but you might see a bit of a bump offensively overall.
Fourier
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A buyout is a legitimate tools if used wisely. Suppose that Neal had 5 g and 14 pts this year and that's what you expected to get going forward. Buying him out would be a better option than paying a guy $5.75M to ride the pine.No more buying out contracts or retaining. It's got out of hand on this team. This season the Oilers have $4.88mil in dead cap. Next year it comes down a bit to $4.58mil. That's ****ing terrible and handcuffs the team severely. Holland needs to let the buyout and Lucic retained salaries expire and don't go down that road anymore. That dead money it's a pretty decent depth player or added scoring. If the team has a player down the road that fits the bill to buyout, bury him till you can trade him if possible, if not, let the contract expire.
The 2021-22 and 2022-23 seasons the dead cap money is $2.25mil. Not that bad, still dead cap though. I sure hope Holland doesn't retain on a longterm contract or buyout any more contracts.
If Neal really falls off a cliff try and trade him, if not, just bury him till the contact is done.
Pound sign
If Benson ever scored 20 goals, 40+ points in a season, I'd consider that a major win. In fact, I'd be surprised if he ever scored 20 goals. He will most likely top out as a middle 6 winger which is what Johnsson currently is.
Nostradumbass
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I thought the Pouliot buyout was f***ing stupid at the time. The guy had a decent season, played well on RNH's wing, then had a poor playoffs and is bought out. Then we spent a couple years looking for wingers for RNH. Great f***ing plan, Special Pete.No more buying out contracts or retaining. It's got out of hand on this team. This season the Oilers have $4.88mil in dead cap. Next year it comes down a bit to $4.58mil. That's ****ing terrible and handcuffs the team severely. Holland needs to let the buyout and Lucic retained salaries expire and don't go down that road anymore. That dead money it's a pretty decent depth player or added scoring. If the team has a player down the road that fits the bill to buyout, bury him till you can trade him if possible, if not, let the contract expire.
The 2021-22 and 2022-23 seasons the dead cap money is $2.25mil. Not that bad, still dead cap though. I sure hope Holland doesn't retain on a longterm contract or buyout any more contracts.
If Neal really falls off a cliff try and trade him, if not, just bury him till the contact is done.
Pound sign
Nostradumbass
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That's a $2MM cap penalty for 6 years. Combine that with the rest of the buyouts we have and the retention on Lucic, and you're sitting at $6.5MM next year in dead space.
The irony of this, as if the Oilers aren't one point away from being out of the playoffs, with still 33 games left to play, and a Klefbom injury away from a bottom 10 finish. The Oilers aren't exactly tearing it up right now. It cuts both ways.
48g90a138pts
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I don't think 6 years at 2 mill of dead cap space is better than 3 years of a guy you could bury at 4 mill for two seasons or just PP special the guy.
Edit: 3 years left, 6 years of Neal buyout yikes
If you're expecting him to be a bottom six player, why would you overpay for his results as a top line player being carried by McDavid?
IMO Kassian isn't that far off from Alex Chiasson in terms of results. He's a better skater and plays with a bit more of an edge, but that's not worth an extra million and a half in my books.
The Oilers should make a treade by the deadline to shore up their chances of making the playoffs. Happy?
3.4m is fine value for a player capable of playing in the top 6.
I'm not saying that I'd give up Larsson for him, I just think that's who the Leafs will want.
The Oilers need a winger for the McDavid line. You seem to think there's a perfect solution out there. Johnsson would be an upgrade on anything the Oilers could plug in there. He can skate, can handle the puck and has soft hands. Good enough for me if he can be had for a reasonable price.
Fourier
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Except you are assuming that Johnsson's production last year playing with Toronto's top centers on a dynamic offensive team with high end offensive defensemen is his normal production as a third liner. Johnsson has never produced anything close to that in the NHl playing in the bottom six.
TheUltimateOiler
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I wouldn't trade Larsson unless it was involving both johnsson and kapanen.
If you have to add a bit to Larsson, do it.
Leafs are desperate. Take advantage.
If you have to add a bit to Larsson, do it.
Leafs are desperate. Take advantage.
So let's discount anybody who plays with high end talent then. It's such a silly argument Fourier.
Is he not going to play alongside high end talent here?
My point is that Johnsson is a proven producer and would be an upgrade on any other winger they would plug on McDavid's line. He's obviously not the most ideal solution but he would be a good addition at the right price. I've watched him enough to see that he's a guy who can play in the top 6 here, he has some skill and the skating to keep up.
Fourier
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Frankly, there is very little evidence to support the assertion that Johnsson would do all that much better in the role as McDavid's LW than what they already have. He has played this year with Matthews and Nylander and has not outproduced Chiasson at 1.5 times the cost. Over the last two years Chaisson has 28 g and 54 points and Johnsson has 26 and 59 points. Over the course of the two years Johnsson has probably had the better line mates/ defensive combos.
Fourier
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He has not consistently produced with those guys. And he has never produced at the NHL level without them. Yet you are convinced he is better than anyone currently on the team based on 20 goals last year. Or is there some other aspect of his game that I am missing because when I watch him I see a tweener.
Based on his play last year I would have taken Johnsson over Kapanen. Based on their play this year it is very much Kapanen over Johnsson. Johnsson has simply not been very impressive making his numbers last year look quite suspect.
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Fourier
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And $2M is less that $5.75M. The key here is when you need the cap and when you don't. Chia's problem is that he bought out contracts when he did not need to (see Pouliot and Gryba) and he brought in contracts like Manning.
Why does it matter if he didn't produce without high end talent, he would be playing with high end talent here. You're bringing him in to fill a top 6 spot. You're never going to get an ideal top line winger for McDavid with the Oilers current cap structure and certainly not in season.
He had 17 goals at even strength last year and almost 40 even strength points and he never played with any player even remotely close to as good as McDavid. Why not add him if the price is reasonable? What solution are you looking for that would be immediately better?
Jumptheshark
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Fourier
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This is the same logic that leads to the claim that Draisatl is a product of McDavid. Johnsson played most of his minutes with Mathews and Tavares along with defensemen like Rieily and Gardnier on a team that played pond hockey. He scored 17 ES goals with a 15.4% s%. This year he has been playing with even better players and he has not produced at nearly the same rate. Which is the actual player you are getting for $3.4M?? This years version or last year's.
As I said, if he came for free. So be it. But he won't. He will cost you assets and comes with a multi-year $3.4M contract. Should the Oiler be prepared to give him the LW slot with McDavid going forward because if he is not in that role he's likely not worth his contract never mind the assets it would take to get him.
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