Rumor: Rumors and Proposals Thread | Spector: Kassian Extension Before Trade Deadline? Anything Else?

[Cam98]

Whats the possibility Oilers try and acquire Kreider?

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[Anarchism]

Neal's contract is immovable. Nobody is taking that contract without the Oilers adding a ton of sweeteners.
Hell, it took a 1st to move 1 year of Marleau.

Russell is the contract that can realistically be moved this off-season and I don't think that will be easy either especially with the modified NTC.

Interesting situation with Russel ...our over paid third pairing guy that maybe could play second pairing on a few teams.....maybe Russel signs a one year lower priced extension and we make a deal with Seattle to take him....works for Russel to stay close ....
If thats in the cards maybe we could even look at that 1B....say Georgiev for Pulju and a second.....cause right now we cant.....Seattle just pickup Georgiev....
Sorry to post and run////vehicle warmed up and im late....

 

[Fourier]

.
First Andreas first full year was last year.....he scored 43 points in 73 games playing from the third line (20 of those points were goals).....this year with the way TO is built his time got reduced....
But what Andreas brings is speed and hands and willingness to play inside and he is very good defensively...these are all qualities McDavid can take advantage of ...with Andreas always going back hard it means less legs for McDavid ...which means he is fresher for the third period and on the PP...

Second Shanahan not an idiot....the management there for sure is a little desperate on D and we can take advantage....dont think they will trade sapphires for pig iron....(that might be a little extreme)

Except what you describe is not what happened,. He had the vast majority of his ES points playing with either Tavares or Matthews. This year he has 2 goals and 10 points 5 vs . All of them are while playing with Matthews. In fact he has played more minutes per game 5 vs 5 this year than he did last year.

The Leafs are a dynamic offensive team. They have skill through the lineup. This is why so many of their secondary guys put excellent numbers. For example, this year both Timashov and Engvall have out produced Johnsson 5 vs 5 as has Mikheyev. Are these guys all worth a kings ransom???

What do you think Johnsson is worth? Would you give up a 1st for him? Is he worth a solid top 4 RHD defenseman who makes $2M or less? If so who is that player, because my guess is that every team in the NHL would kill to have him.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Nailed it.

Johnsson is a tweener who plays with elite players and puts up middling numbers. Benning is a strong 3rd pair RHD. Not sure why there is a discrepancy in their value.

Real talk

Andreas Johnsson has 10 points at 5v5 in just under 500 minutes where he has been attached at the hip to Auston Matthews and William Nylander.

Joakim Nygard has 7 points at 5v5 in just over 300 minutes where his most common linemates are Riley Sheahan and Alex Chaisson.

I think Johnsson could be a good depth add for the Oilers. But he's not the player some make him out to be.

Agreed in full. I like Johnsson, and I think he’s an upgrade on some for us, but realistically I think he’s on our third line. 11 even strength points is not something to get overly excited about.
Toronto fans always overvalue their depth pieces (like Leivo) and then they end up bringing back virtually nothing (like Leivo)

 

[MessierII]

Interesting situation with Russel ...our over paid third pairing guy that maybe could play second pairing on a few teams.....maybe Russel signs a one year lower priced extension and we make a deal with Seattle to take him....works for Russel to stay close ....
If thats in the cards maybe we could even look at that 1B....say Georgiev for Pulju and a second.....cause right now we cant.....Seattle just pickup Georgiev....

Then you need to keep Russell for next year though. That’s the problem.

 

[GOilers88]

Funny how a few wins has all but silenced that extremely vocal "WE HAVE TO MAKE TRADES NOW OR THE SEASON IS OVER AND CONNOR IS LEAVING" group.

Almost like half a season isn't long enough for 7-8 new players to gel with their new team and surroundings. Crazy, I know.

 

[Anarchism]

Whats the possibility Oilers try and acquire Kreider?

Krieder has already extended the middle finger.....He was the obvious choice when we took Magnus....LOL

 

[CupofOil]

I don't think that deal is nearly so far fetched as some might. Toronto's right side is a disaster and it will be worse next year since they almost surely lose Barrie and Ceci. Holl is a 27 year old rookie who had some success playing mostly bottom pairing minutes. Everyone got all excited and then he re-signed and was eventually moved up the food chain. The Leafs went on a bit of a roll but have fallen back to earth. Justin Holl is now their top pairing RHD right now and we saw how well he played in that roll.

Benning is at least a guy with an NHL level track record. He's not a top pairing guy but he could be a passible #4 if they pair him with Muzzin next year. (Assuming they do re-sign Muzzin). He also a lot more physical than any Leaf defenseman which is something they might like. Straight-up Benning is not worth Johnsson but this deal also saves the Leafs $1.5M in cap space which for them is huge. As it is today, when Muzzin and Riley in the Leafs, are over the cap on a 23 man roster so they may have to do something a bit rash. Probably have to add a pick from the Oilers to make it work but I don't think Benning for Johnsson is that far off as a foundation. Johnsson is a small winger with 16 points making $3.4M. Leaf fans seem to think he would bring back a sure fire top 4 defenseman, or a 1st, or a blue chip. But frankly I don't see his value being anywhere close to that since he is a second line/third line tweener on most NHL teams.

Benning is a sheltered #6, he has always gotten torched when playing on a 2nd pairing. The reason why he has played better this season is because Tippett lowered his minutes. I don't see why Dubas would have any interest in trading Johnsson for a #6. Larsson is their target I'd imagine.

 

[GOilers88]

Neal's contract is immovable. Nobody is taking that contract without the Oilers adding a ton of sweeteners.
Hell, it took a 1st to move 1 year of Marleau. Neal is undoubtedly sticking around for a couple of years unless they buy him out.

Russell is the contract that can realistically be moved this off-season and I don't think that will be easy either especially with the modified NTC.

How long did people say all that stuff about Lucic, too? Neal's contract isn't even buyout proof either. I think people really need to move beyond the "That can never happen" mentality as more times than not, the impossible things in sports usually do happen. You can almost guarantee that when someone says something will never happen, it's probably going to happen.

At least on HF.

 

[CupofOil]

How long did people say all that stuff about Lucic, too? Neal's contract isn't even buyout proof either. I think people really need to move beyond the "That can never happen" mentality as more times than not, the impossible things in sports usually do happen.

They traded Lucic for another awful contract. If they trade Neal, it will be for another awful contract. Nobody is taking Neal for free. It's completely unrealistic.

 

[GOilers88]

They traded Lucic for another awful contract. If they trade Neal, it will be for another awful contract. Nobody is taking Neal for free. It's completely unrealistic.

I'd say the Neal for Lucic swap worked swimmingly for Edmonton. Neal's contract really seems like a moot point. Obviously nobody is taking a contract like that for free, and nobody said it would happen that way because that's silly.

But I really would have thought people would stop with the "That will never happen" statements as 90% of the time they're so wrong it's funny. Is it really worth being wrong 90% of the time so that the other 10% people can be like "See I was right hahaha"

Like I said, in all sports, it's usually a given that when you think something is impossible, it's probably actually going to happen.

 

[Nostradumbass]

They traded Lucic for another awful contract. If they trade Neal, it will be for another awful contract. Nobody is taking Neal for free. It's completely unrealistic.

You could probably pay Seattle to take him next year with a first round pick.

 

[CupofOil]

I'd say the Neal for Lucic swap worked swimmingly for Edmonton. Neal's contract really seems like a moot point. Obviously nobody is taking a contract like that for free, and nobody said it would happen that way because that's silly.

But I really would have thought people would stop with the "That will never happen" statements as 90% of the time they're so wrong it's funny.

People are talking about unloading Neal's contract, selling "high"on him as if he has any value. Any trade of Neal isn't likely to create cap space which would be the whole point of making the trade.

Is something like Neal for Eriksson or Okposo enticing? Seems pointless to make a trade like that since Neal is a decent fit here.

As somebody mentioned, I could see them attaching a high pick in 2 offseasons for Seattle to take him. I don't see him going anywhere until then.

 

[Ck1]

Then say goodbye to the 20-25 point player making $3.5MM...

I think it’s funny when people base contracts on points alone. And don’t take into account all the other areas of a game so called player brings to the table.
Those who base everything about a player based on points have likely never played the sport to a higher degree.

 

[GOilers88]

People are talking about unloading Neal's contract, selling "high"on him as if he has any value. Any trade of Neal isn't likely to create cap space which would be the whole point of making the trade.

Is something like Neal for Eriksson or Okposo enticing? Seems pointless to make a trade like that since Neal is a decent fit here.

When I see James Neal, I see a guy that multiple cup contenders decided was a good addition to their rosters that made deep playoff runs. Is he maybe more of a PP specialist now? Sure. But the man knows how to score goals, and I don't really care how he gets them because 20-30 goals is 20-30 goals. I doubt GMs and coaches around the league talk about PP points as a negative on players abilities like HF seems to.

That's why it kills me the way Calgary handled him. Like, the Pens, Preds and Knights all thought this guy could help them and he's seen multiple cup finals because of it, yet he gets to Calgary and their depth is so strong that he doesn't really belong? Laughable.

If a 20-30 goal scorer costs the Oilers the price of his contract for a couple more years, so be it. It's not ideal but I hardly see it as a team killer.

 

[Kaniac]

Whats the possibility Oilers try and acquire Kreider?

Zero. He has every Canadian team on his NTC.

 

[Nostradumbass]

I think it’s funny when people base contracts on points alone. And don’t take into account all the other areas of a game so called player brings to the table.
Those who base everything about a player based on points have likely never played the sport to a higher degree.

I have played with and against many players who have played in this league, with some still playing. Hell, I even played in a best-on-best tournament with one of the current Oilers. Please don't try to diminish my hockey ability/knowledge because I don't think a 3rd line winger is worth $3MM.

 

[CupofOil]

When I see James Neal, I see a guy that multiple cup contenders decided was a good addition to their rosters that made deep playoff runs. Is he maybe more of a PP specialist now? Sure. But the man knows how to score goals, and I don't really care how he gets them because 20-30 goals is 20-30 goals. I doubt GMs and coaches around the league talk about PP points as a negative on players abilities like HF seems to.

That's why it kills me the way Calgary handled him. Like, the Pens, Preds and Knights all thought this guy could help them and he's seen multiple cup finals because of it, yet he gets to Calgary and their depth is so strong that he doesn't really belong? Laughable.

If a 20-30 goal scorer costs the Oilers the price of his contract for a couple more years, so be it. It's not ideal but I hardly see it as a team killer.

I didn't say that his PP production is a negative or that he's a team killer. In fact, I think he has fit in well as a leader.

I'm just saying that a 3 year $5.75m contract for a 33+ year old PP specialist who is ideally a 3rd liner at even strength isn't moveable unless it's for a similarly bad contract. I actually like Neal in the proper role (not in the top 6) but he's a $2.5-3m player at this point in his career. Certain better than Lucic who is a $1-1.5m player but still vastly overpaid.

I think Holland will target Seattle for Neal in the summer of '21. Attach a pick for Seattle to take him.

 

[GOilers88]

I didn't say that his PP production is a negative or that he's a team killer. In fact, I think he has fit in well as a leader.

I'm just saying that a 3 year $5.75m contract for a 33+ year old PP specialist who is ideally a 3rd liner at even strength isn't moveable unless it's for a similarly bad contract. I actually like Neal in the proper role (not in the top 6) but he's a $2.5-3m player at this point in his career.

Sorry, didn't mean to make it sound like I was putting words in your mouth. But a lot of people around here try and act like points on the PP aren't actually a positive and use it to argue that a PP guy like Neal isn't actually very useful, which I vehemently disagree with.

I like your assessment of his fit on our team and I totally agree with you there. It's a really good match for both parties. I agree the contract isnt ideal for where he plays, but I also wouldn't completely rule out a cap floor team willing to take him on with some small retention, or at next year's TDL when most of his salary has been paid out, especially when he could be bought out.

I certainly think crazier things have happened.

 

[McJadeddog]

San Jose is really going to give up a lottery pick to Ottawa, aren’t they?

Ottawa is my second favorite team, and I *despise* the Sharks. So this couldn't make me happier

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Whats the possibility Oilers try and acquire Kreider?

Low to nil. Supposedly he has all the Canadian teams on his no trade list.

 

[belair]

Benning is a sheltered #6, he has always gotten torched when playing on a 2nd pairing. The reason why he has played better this season is because Tippett lowered his minutes. I don't see why Dubas would have any interest in trading Johnsson for a #6. Larsson is their target I'd imagine.

Cap savings.

If there's interest in Johnsson, we should probably look back to last season when there was rumored interest in Brown. Toronto wanted Khaira and Benning, Gretzky refused. I don't see a whole lot of a gap between Johnsson and Brown. Honestly, Brown brings more to the table.

​

That being said, where does Johnsson fit long-term?

 

[duul]

I wonder if Holland is interested in playing that classic game 'from a paper clip to a house' where you trade your way up from a Lucic to a McDavid. He did real well with his first trade, maybe he can move Neal now for something better...

 

[Fourier]

Benning is a sheltered #6, he has always gotten torched when playing on a 2nd pairing. The reason why he has played better this season is because Tippett lowered his minutes. I don't see why Dubas would have any interest in trading Johnsson for a #6. Larsson is their target I'd imagine.

Your position seems to be the common belief but is it actually true? Dubas is an analytics guy. Benning has had solid results with Kelfbom, Sekera and Nurse in roughly 1350 minutes 5 vs 5 oer the last 2 1/2 years. During that time with those three he was on the ice for 64 GF and 63 GA. His CF% with these three respectively was 51.14%, 48.98% and 52.39%. Where he got killed was while he playing the roughly 300 minutes he has played with Russell. Frankly I suspect that he would be decent option for Toronto with the LHD they have.

https://www.naturalstattrick.com/pl...&sit=5v5&stdoi=oi&rate=n&v=t&playerid=8476988

Johnsson is a tweener. That's simply a fact. Trading Larsson for him would be a huge overpay from the Oilers.

 

[CupofOil]

Cap savings.

If there's interest in Johnsson, we should probably look back to last season when there was rumored interest in Brown. Toronto wanted Khaira and Benning, Gretzky refused. I don't see a whole lot of a gap between Johnsson and Brown. Honestly, Brown brings more to the table.

​

That being said, where does Johnsson fit long-term?

The Leafs are looking to win now so I don't know why they'd trade Johnsson for the purpose of cap space.

Maybe the Oilers can offer the Khaira+Benning package again? The Leafs could use some jam in their forward group.

Where would Johnsson fit? There's a big hole on the McDavid line. People want to call up Benson and plug him in there. Well, Johnsson is probably Benson's absolute max potential so he obviously can be a fit here long term.