Captain Dave Poulin
Imaginary Cat
You had me at "It was a stupid idea and a huge waste of money to sign Kevin Hayes." Great post.
Prospect Info: Round 4, Pick 104: Mikhail Vorobyov, C, Tolpar Ufa (MHL --> KHL)
- Thread starter GKJ
- Start date
You had me at "It was a stupid idea and a huge waste of money to sign Kevin Hayes." Great post.
Tripod
I hate this team
Look at the positive.
He had to clear waivers so we had to keep him up or possibly lose him for nothing....and right now, is a tweener.
Now, he is "protected" from anyone taking him while he gets 3 more years of development time and let's see if those 3 years he turns into a better player. If he doesn't, he stays home or comes over for a shot. If he improves greatly, he will likely be chomping at the bit to prove he belongs.
Given how he played here, our current depth, etc... it could be the best thing for him AND the Flyers.
He had to clear waivers so we had to keep him up or possibly lose him for nothing....and right now, is a tweener.
Now, he is "protected" from anyone taking him while he gets 3 more years of development time and let's see if those 3 years he turns into a better player. If he doesn't, he stays home or comes over for a shot. If he improves greatly, he will likely be chomping at the bit to prove he belongs.
Given how he played here, our current depth, etc... it could be the best thing for him AND the Flyers.
deadhead
Registered User
- Feb 26, 2014
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Given that Bunnaman is a year behind contract wise, and is a better 4C, and Frost has 2 low cost years left, don't see where Vorobyev would have been cheaper - and Patrick isn't going to get much of a first RFA contract (probably 2 years at a low cost rate while he shows he can stay healthy).
We do need to build more center depth, but entry level (4 years away) depth.
renberg
Registered User
Vorobyov flunked two coaches and GMs. There are flaws in his game that made him, at best, a Phantom. He doesn't have the speed or hands to be a top sixer and lacks the grit to be a center on the checking line. Some guys come out of Russia with skills that work there but do not translate to the NHL. Vorobyov may be one of those players.
tymed
Registered User
This is the current best case scenario for him and us both imo.
I'll take the perspective that this is just a bittersweet symptom that comes with having an increasingly robust prospect pool. Not every prospect is going to have that "fair" shot because of competition, it just is what it is. He was out-competed in our system and he knew it better than anyone else.
3 years remaining on his rights while our prospect pool continues to get increasingly competitive and hold at least some attractiveness to newcomers? Yes, please.
Hope he finds some footing over there and eventually comes back to the orange and black, but I'm happy to open space for younger more promising prospects in the meantime, even if all that it simply means is that we don't have to continue hearing the same posters cry about "fair" shots. "Fair" is a subjective term that has thankfully evolved for us as Flyers fans. It's best for fans to adjust, because it's the reality of having a stronger organization.
Just one guy's opinion.
I'll take the perspective that this is just a bittersweet symptom that comes with having an increasingly robust prospect pool. Not every prospect is going to have that "fair" shot because of competition, it just is what it is. He was out-competed in our system and he knew it better than anyone else.
3 years remaining on his rights while our prospect pool continues to get increasingly competitive and hold at least some attractiveness to newcomers? Yes, please.
Hope he finds some footing over there and eventually comes back to the orange and black, but I'm happy to open space for younger more promising prospects in the meantime, even if all that it simply means is that we don't have to continue hearing the same posters cry about "fair" shots. "Fair" is a subjective term that has thankfully evolved for us as Flyers fans. It's best for fans to adjust, because it's the reality of having a stronger organization.
Just one guy's opinion.
renberg
Registered User
Two or three years ago the organization was so desperate to fill out its roster that it looked to several players that wouldn’t stand a chance to make this year’s club. These guys like (fill in the blank) were given a shot and didn’t make it. Vorobyev was one of these. We fans were pulling for them to be more than they are. Now it’s time to look elsewhere. The talent on the team is so much better. If you’re not good, you’re not going to make it here.
He was nice passer but he wasn't able to show it enough in the NHL.
In any case I wish him well. I'm sure it was a difficult decision.
Tripod
I hate this team
Really, we swapped out Pimp for Sandin as an option for next years team. Does it really make a difference?
FLYguy3911
Sanheim Lover
- Oct 19, 2006
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BritainStix
F**k Cutter Gauthier
- Oct 20, 2016
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But you have a contract limit. You can't keep every player on the books. If they aren't going to make the roster then what else are you meant to do?
FLYguy3911
Sanheim Lover
- Oct 19, 2006
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I think they can manage the extremely stringent contract limit for the best player on the Phantoms last season (a center no less) while the likes of Andreoff, Prosser, Bigras, Wotherspoon, and whatever career minor leaguer gets signed this offseason, occupy an NHL contract slot.
Striiker
Earthquake Survivor
You want to throw away this much experience and intangibles, which is absolutely essential to a team winning games?!?!
Vorobyev - 22 years old
vs
Andreoff - 28 years old
Prosser - 33 years old
Bigras - 24 years old
Wotherspoon - 26 years old
Fletcher went out and got these guys himself. As we quickly learned, the guy is a master at building a winning roster, which we saw when he turned a horrible and hopeless Flyers roster into an elite squad in mere days, all by himself.
Those vet AHL guys were the foundation that the Phantoms success was built on this year, as they lead them to a record of... oh... um... 24-28-3-7...
Last edited:
- Sep 28, 2014
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And im sure they would have gladly kept him around on the Phantoms. It was his choice to sign with the KHL.
TCTC
Registered User
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That's always the risk when you draft a Russian player in the later rounds. Most of them aren't good enough to immidiately (if ever) make the jump to the NHL and most of them don't want to play in the AHL either and I don't blame them.
BritainStix
F**k Cutter Gauthier
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I don't think you understand. Vorobyev wasn't making the flyers starting roster, now next year with Frost and hopefully Patrick returning he's even further down the pecking order.
Couturier
Hayes
Patrick
Frost
Grant
Thompson
Raffl
Laughton
Why would he stick around in the AHL when he can earn a far bigger wage in his homeland?
Why would the flyers keep him on the books contract wise when he really has no realistic chance at the starting roster, now or next year. Eventually you have to let prospects go.
deadhead
Registered User
- Feb 26, 2014
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Actually, next year the list is:
Couturier
Hayes
Patrick
Frost
Bunnaman
Laczynski
Rubtsov
While Laczynski is more likely to play RW, he certainly could push for time at 4C. And with Sandin on board at RW, that's a viable option.
Vorobyev has outplayed Rubtsov, but Rubtsov is 18 months younger and has more upside.
Couturier
Hayes
Patrick
Frost
Bunnaman
Laczynski
Rubtsov
While Laczynski is more likely to play RW, he certainly could push for time at 4C. And with Sandin on board at RW, that's a viable option.
Vorobyev has outplayed Rubtsov, but Rubtsov is 18 months younger and has more upside.
BackToTheBrierePatch
Nope not today.
Well you cannot blame him. He was never going to be a regular here. I wish him the best in the KHL
Striiker
Earthquake Survivor
The problem with the whole situation is he was never given a legit shot, under either GM or coach.
He averaged 10:26 per game and his most common linemate was Chris Stewart... That's as clear of a case of being set up to fail as you can realistically imagine.
Vorobyev with Stewart (68:07)
35.92 CF%
26.77 xGF%
Vorobyev without Stewart (123:25)
51.70 CF%
41.42 xGF%
Stewart without Vorobyev (54:45)
31.03 CF%
24.08 xGF%
Pretty significant difference. As always, teammates and usage matter a lot.
On top of that, it's hard to believe (even as a Vorobyev doubter) that he couldn't do just as good of a job as the one they're asking of Thompson. Plus, then we're also not wasting a pick on someone we don't need.
Couturier
Hayes
Frost
Grant
Vorobyev
...down the middle is infinitely better than...
Couturier
Hayes
Grant
Thompson
Frost
He averaged 10:26 per game and his most common linemate was Chris Stewart... That's as clear of a case of being set up to fail as you can realistically imagine.
Vorobyev with Stewart (68:07)
35.92 CF%
26.77 xGF%
Vorobyev without Stewart (123:25)
51.70 CF%
41.42 xGF%
Stewart without Vorobyev (54:45)
31.03 CF%
24.08 xGF%
Pretty significant difference. As always, teammates and usage matter a lot.
On top of that, it's hard to believe (even as a Vorobyev doubter) that he couldn't do just as good of a job as the one they're asking of Thompson. Plus, then we're also not wasting a pick on someone we don't need.
Couturier
Hayes
Frost
Grant
Vorobyev
...down the middle is infinitely better than...
Couturier
Hayes
Grant
Thompson
Frost
Laczynski is an interesting option at C. They could really use a RH face-off option other than G. He seemed like more of a winger option but if he can do it and be reliable then maybe that's his path to making the team and earning playing time, at least initially. He can alway move to wing later if they prefer Bunny or someone else there but it makes sense to work him out there in camp at least and see how he looks. Options are good.
rinaldo
Ignored Mmber
- Apr 7, 2019
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do you ever hold any players accountable? or is it always the coach, GM, or organizations fault? love the well he needs to play with better players mantra. You can make that excuse with pretty much any player in many sports
so having Vorobyev makes the team infinitely better down the middle. Sure why not.
