Roster Speculation 15-16, Part IX

[SoFFacet]

I just dont see the appeal to Gologoski - Hes a top 4 defender, he allready 30 - in the 3 years time it'll take to contend again we would have used the best years of his contract allready and would be left with, what a 34 / 35 year old.

My 2nd issue, is he's a top 4 - And honestly where do we fit him in - Already have Bogo / RR / Pysyk / Gorges / Franson - The first 3 are allready top 4 D and Gorges is pretty much a bottom 4 pairing anyway. I just dont think he'll bring anything we dont allready have.

Arrival as contenders will depend on year to year improvement, which will be best facilitated if we have a quality team supporting the core. If some of that support is toast by the time we arrive, that's fine as those players will have served their purpose.

In any case he's much different and better than Gorges and Franson. He'd be the best LHD on the team for years.

 

[Husko]

I just dont see the appeal to Gologoski - Hes a top 4 defender, he allready 30 - in the 3 years time it'll take to contend again we would have used the best years of his contract allready and would be left with, what a 34 / 35 year old.

My 2nd issue, is he's a top 4 - And honestly where do we fit him in - Already have Bogo / RR / Pysyk / Gorges / Franson - The first 3 are allready top 4 D and Gorges is pretty much a bottom 4 pairing anyway. I just dont think he'll bring anything we dont allready have.

Well he'd be the only top 4 LHD we have. And the only puck moving LHD we'd have.

 

[Zip15]

I'm interested in seeing how things play out with Hoffman in Ottawa. The sides ended up in arbitration last year with Hoffman asking for a one-year deal for $3.4m. The arbitrator awarded him $2m, largely on the basis that he had only one year of NHL experience. He's an RFA for the last time this offseason. He has 22 goals in 45 games this season. I have to imagine he knows there's a big payday waiting for him in summer 2017 if Ottawa isn't willing to pony up this summer.

When TM was hired, Sens fans listed Hoffman as one of Tim's guys, along with players like Wiercioch, Prince, and Lehner. I believe Tim is probably keeping a keen eye on that situation.

 

[sabrebuild]

I'm interested in seeing how things play out with Hoffman in Ottawa. The sides ended up in arbitration last year with Hoffman asking for a one-year deal for $3.4m. The arbitrator awarded him $2m, largely on the basis that he had only one year of NHL experience. He's an RFA for the last time this offseason. He has 22 goals in 45 games this season. I have to imagine he knows there's a big payday waiting for him in summer 2017 if Ottawa isn't willing to pony up this summer.

When TM was hired, Sens fans listed Hoffman as one of Tim's guys, along with players like Wiercioch, Prince, and Lehner. I believe Tim is probably keeping a keen eye on that situation.

Offersheet... or trade?

 

[EichHart]

I'm interested in seeing how things play out with Hoffman in Ottawa. The sides ended up in arbitration last year with Hoffman asking for a one-year deal for $3.4m. The arbitrator awarded him $2m, largely on the basis that he had only one year of NHL experience. He's an RFA for the last time this offseason. He has 22 goals in 45 games this season. I have to imagine he knows there's a big payday waiting for him in summer 2017 if Ottawa isn't willing to pony up this summer.

When TM was hired, Sens fans listed Hoffman as one of Tim's guys, along with players like Wiercioch, Prince, and Lehner. I believe Tim is probably keeping a keen eye on that situation.

Would love him on this team. That guy is incredibly fast. Would be able to keep up with Eichel for sure.

 

[haseoke39]

I just dont see the appeal to Gologoski - Hes a top 4 defender, he allready 30 - in the 3 years time it'll take to contend again we would have used the best years of his contract allready and would be left with, what a 34 / 35 year old.

My 2nd issue, is he's a top 4 - And honestly where do we fit him in - Already have Bogo / RR / Pysyk / Gorges / Franson - The first 3 are allready top 4 D and Gorges is pretty much a bottom 4 pairing anyway. I just dont think he'll bring anything we dont allready have.

You just listed four righties and a "bottom 4" guy. I think that's your answer.

 

[Jame]

we should re-sign Weber

 

[1972]

Despite playing different positions, I wonder if Barkov will be the benchmark for Risto's contract.

 

[SamsonReinFart]

we should re-sign Weber

We have to, right? Our situation on the left-side is terrible.... they HAVE to resign him, right?

It's not like he'll break the bank... He's a competent bottom pair defensemen that can fill in from time to time higher in the line-up as long as he's paired with a better player. He played really well with Risto down the stretch last year. Something to think about...

 

[stokes84]

we should re-sign Weber

2 months of relatively decent play and w can just forget about the last three years of train wreck. Pass.

 

[Zip15]

Despite playing different positions, I wonder if Barkov will be the benchmark for Risto's contract.

It'll be interesting to see if Risto wants to do what Barkov did. That is, get long-term financial security but sign nothing longer than six years so that he can reach UFA at a still-optimal age to get a giant deal. Barkov will become UFA two months before his 27th birthday. Provided he continues trending up, that could set him up for a gigantic UFA payday.

Just looking at the deal, it looks like both sides got something. Florida buys two UFA years and Barkov gets to be UFA at a young age so that he can get a second mega-contract.

I hope Risto takes eight years, but we'll see.

 

[Irving Zisman]

we should re-sign Weber

Unless Gorges is moved (unlikely), there's no room and no need:

Bogosian-Ristolainen
XXXX-Pysyk
McCabe-Franson
x. Gorges

 

[SamsonReinFart]

Unless Gorges is moved (unlikely), there's no room and no need:

Bogosian-Ristolainen
XXXX-Pysyk
McCabe-Franson
x. Gorges

What about helping fill in those XXXX's? I think it's far from a foregone conclusion that they find a 2nd pair defensemen somewhere. And even then why not carry Weber as an 8th D?

The 8th defensemen on this team (Colaiacovo) has already played 20 games, will probably end up playing more due to injuries. I'd rather have a vet like Weber there as insurance for the very small cap hit he will cost us.

On top of that, I'm not sold on Bogosian as LD yet at all. More depth on the left side will do nothing but help.

 

[Zip15]

Offersheet... or trade?

I'm not sure I'd offer sheet him or meet The Lisp's asking price. Just something to keep an eye on for now. He's going to get paid. With UFA less than 18 months away, he doesn't have any reason to accept a deal that isn't long-term. He should pot 30 relatively easily this season, and teams will pay big for that in summer 2017, even if he only scores in the 20's next year.

 

[SoFFacet]

Can't understand people wanting to get rid of Weber at this stage. He's one of the few Sabres actually executing his role properly this year. Did people forget what else was going on with this team during the two previous years? He's not going to command significant term or salary, and we have a pathetic LHD situation as it already is.

 

[brian_griffin]

we should re-sign Weber

Agreed.

2 months of relatively decent play and w can just forget about the last three years of train wreck. Pass.

Nor should we forget that not only has he played with every other Sabre defenseman - and there is value in that familiarity - he has also helped to complement several of them.

Unless Gorges is moved (unlikely), there's no room and no need:

Bogosian-Ristolainen
XXXX-Pysyk
McCabe-Franson
x. Gorges

There is absolutely a need until the XXXX is filled. So sign Weber as a "plan D" or whatever.
And, even if XXXX is filled, there is still room.
If there isn't room after camp, deal with it then (trade, waive/keep up, waive /assign).

My strategy:
Trade him at deadline as a thank-you, and give him some playoff experience.
Handshake offer to re-sign in BUF in July.
It's Weber's choice.
Weber absolutely knows where he stands in the Sabres organizational depth.
Offer a 1-way 1-year, or a 2-way 2-year.

Every team has a Mike Weber. BUF has one of the better ones.

 

[Zip15]

With Weber, as with most UFAs, the answer is "it depends." How many years and for how much? Would I bring him back in a third-pairing role on a one-year deal with a slight bump from his $2m base salary this year? Probably. Would I give him another three years (the length of his current contract) if he requests north of $3m AAV in the hope that he'll cash in on his current season? Probably not. Something in the middle of those two deals? I don't know yet.

At this moment, given the state of our LHD position, I'd offer him 2 yrs/$5m and hope he takes it.

 

[dkollidas]

Agreed.

Nor should we forget that not only has he played with every other Sabre defenseman - and there is value in that familiarity - he has also helped to complement several of them.


There is absolutely a need until the XXXX is filled. So sign Weber as a "plan D" or whatever.
And, even if XXXX is filled, there is still room.
If there isn't room after camp, deal with it then (trade, waive/keep up, waive /assign).

My strategy:
Trade him at deadline as a thank-you, and give him some playoff experience.
Handshake offer to re-sign in BUF in July.
It's Weber's choice.
Weber absolutely knows where he stands in the Sabres organizational depth.
Offer a 1-way 1-year, or a 2-way 2-year.

Every team has a Mike Weber. BUF has one of the better ones.

Agreed.

 

[Jame]

2 months of relatively decent play and w can just forget about the last three years of train wreck. Pass.

A half season of good play, in the appropriate role, in an NHL system... yes, I think we can forget the play of the Nolan/Rolston era.

I also think it's simply smart roster management given our current roster construction.

 

[Jame]

Unless Gorges is moved (unlikely), there's no room and no need:

Bogosian-Ristolainen
XXXX-Pysyk
McCabe-Franson
x. Gorges

I think that's pretty silly...

If you ask me it looks like this:

XXXX-Risto
XXXX-Pysyk
XXXX-XXXX

Gorges, Franson, and Weber are all very temporary.

What I find value in is building some continuity in down the lineup, while we try to figure out the top 4. Weber has shown a lot this year. Stay at home, 1 dimensional defensemen don't show very well on historically awful rosters. He's shown this year that he's a solid NHL 3rd pair stay at home defender. People can hold on to misplaced anger if they want.

When the cost is going to be so insignificant. I am not sure why anyone would be opposed to keeping him for a year or two. Hatred for the past aside, there is really no good argument. If McCabe develops, if Bogo solidifies in an LD role, etc What's the worst thing that happens? Weber becomes a #7? Weber hits waivers? OH MY GOD SEASON RUINED ZOMG!!!

 

[Zman5778]

we should re-sign Weber

Ideally I'd like to see an upgrade on the 3rd pairing LHD spot, but if he's taking a decent deal and is willing to eventually be a healthy scratch, I've got no issue with that.

 

[Jame]

With Weber, as with most UFAs, the answer is "it depends." How many years and for how much? Would I bring him back in a third-pairing role on a one-year deal with a slight bump from his $2m base salary this year? Probably. Would I give him another three years (the length of his current contract) if he requests north of $3m AAV in the hope that he'll cash in on his current season? Probably not. Something in the middle of those two deals? I don't know yet.

At this moment, given the state of our LHD position, I'd offer him 2 yrs/$5m and hope he takes it.

Agreed. I would not do more than 2 years.

 

[struckbyaparkedcar]

With Weber I think you see if a team is all "WE NEED BLUELINE TUFFNESS" and gives him Stoner money and go from there.

I'd take him back on short term deals to cycle between the bottom pairing and pressbox.

 

[Jame]

Ideally I'd like to see an upgrade on the 3rd pairing LHD spot, but if he's taking a decent deal and is willing to eventually be a healthy scratch, I've got no issue with that.

How do you upgrade these 3rd pair numbers...

GF 1.81
GA 1.40
GF% 56.5
CF 49.95
CA 45.63
CF% 52.3

I know everyone hate metrics that don't conform to previously held beliefs... but those are downright excellent 3rd pair D numbers...

Here's what he's done when 2/3 of his ice time is spent carrying Franson around...

1.21
1.21
50.0
47.88
45.45
51.3

and here's Franson without Weber
1.27
2.07
38.1
48.31
54.82
46.8

Franson is completely useless.

And while the narrative is going to be the boost that Pysyk has brought to Weber's metrics (it's true). Weber has also been an excellent compliment to Pysyk.

Pysyk w/ Weber
2.81
1.41
66.7
66.12
36.58
64.4

Pysyk w/o Weber
1.13
2.27
33.3
51.66
51.21
50.2

Weber's been on the ice for 10 ES goals against this year. TEN. Every other defensemen on the team has a negative GF/GA differential. Yea. he's playing easy competition, with good forward lines. It's a 3rd pairing role. But hes playing it as good as anyone can play it. And when asked to step up and play with Pysyk, they don't lose a step.

 

[TehDoak]

we should re-sign Weber

Disagree.

You want Gorges to move into the role he's already filling (5/6 d-man) over the next two years.

IMHO, Ideally, the left side will look like:

XXXX- Acquired Puck moving D-man to play with Risto
Gorges
McCabe/Other young d-man

With McCabe or the "other" young d-man (Guhle/2016 pick/someone picked up via trade), the plan will be for him to eventually push Gorges down to bottom pairing minutes over the course of Jorges remaining two years.

Now, if you want to talk about TRADING Gorges for an asset and keeping Weber to anchor the bottom pair while we go:

XXXX
McCabe/Other D-man
Weber

That'd I be ok with. i think a healthy Gorges is a better d-man than Weber, but Weber has been better-ish this year.