Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XVII What will Santa Gorton bring us?

[GoAwayPanarin]

No, that's not enough

You wouldn't do it?!?

I mean Colorado wouldn't even consider it but yeah, I'd do that in a second.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Things I learned on the main board today:

Kevin Hayes is barely worth a late 1st.

Carl Soderberg is better than Kevin hayes

Boston really doesn't want Kevin Hayes (though this has more to do with how Jimmy played there, I can't really blame them)

Carl Soderberg can't hold Hayes jockstrap ( I know what you're referencing). I also can't blame Boston on Hayes. Probably not a good fit.

Would you guys do Hayes, Buch and Smith (50% retained) for Colorado's (OTT) 1st + 2nd rd pick if Hayes signs there?

I know people say this but I would literally do it, drive to NY, pick up Hayes and then shuttle his ass to Colorado for that deal. There is zero chance Colorado gives up the OTT first for anything short of Peitrangelo or Tarasenko (considering the Blues are looking at blowing things up). Hayes is Colorado 1st round pick material (with an add), not Ottawa 1st rounder material.

 

[effen]

The Rangers want to rebuild and be good at the same time.

The same nonsense from 1997 when they Messier went to Vancouver. The Garden thought the Rangers could just continue to be competitive as long as they had Leetch, Richter and Graves. They would use their money to fill the holes.

The bottom fell out and they crashed for a long time.

They kept going back to the same playbook.

Insanity. Repeating the same mistakes and expecting different results.

You didn't read anything I wrote.

 

[Edge]

Is this from one of your sources or are you speculating. Oh my God I am getting so excited, I can't contain myself!

You should see Mrs. Edge's reaction.

She smiled and wished me the best of luck with my future endeavors.

 

[Off Sides]

Just Hayes without the Rangers adding and without any extension in place or worked out?

I am guessing

-A teams 2019 1st (late round)

-fourth or fifth favorite prospect (I am thinking something like a Howden, Hajek or Lindgren from last years deadline, maybe that is their 3rd favorite?)

-A conditional pick (perhaps a 2020 3rd or 4th that turns to a 2nd should that team sign/extend Hayes)(I'd like to make that a conditional 1st/2nd but I think that is pushing it)

-And something(s) that team does not really want for next season (Spooner for example)

Gives the Rangers another chance at another possible Miller/Chytil level prospect, plus some prospect they like who's ceiling is likely limited but useful none the less and could surprise, the conditional gets better if that team like Hayes and he likes them enough to extend, and maybe they can move the next Spooner for something that seems to fit better if whoever that is does not fit.

I don't love it, but it's similar to the Nash trade and it has some extras in there that could come around favorably.

 

[xsniper11x]

I think the next few years are going to be very interesting in terms how how teams are allocating their cap dollars. The good teams seem to be getting more and more top heavy in terms of how much they are paying each player. If your team is allocating most of your cap money to your top line and top D pairing, does that open up the opportunity for a team to run 4 real good balanced lines at you along with 3 good pairs of D with no great pair. Basically try to get your first two lines to play even with the top heavy teams and let your bottom pair and your 3rd and 4th lines feast on their matchup.

Just a thought, and curious to see a team try that approach instead of copying what has been done. Be a trendsetter. The NYR had it for a couple years and came pretty close to winning, just couldn't finish the job. Makes you wonder if that is what they are going for this time around, only with a little more talent throughout the lineup.

I remember discussing this last year when people had finally come to grips that Vegas was for real. Obviously you need elite talent, but this isn’t the NBA. Support players are vital in the NHL, especially the playoffs. It’s a long grueling season and rarely do 1 or even 2 line teams accomplish much.

I think we’re in the early stages of the evolution of this “depth strategy”, and those caught with top heavy cap allocations will find it’s a difficult problem to solve. If this forces the window for the dynasty style team to close earlier, it opens it up for others to find a new way in. We’re in a prime position to capitalize on this potential trend.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Rangers will be playing the Yotes tomorrow who are playing the 3rd in 4th and on the tail of B2B's. Rangers will be playing their 3rd game in like 12 days.

Rangers have also yet to play a set of b2b's where their opponents weren't also doing the same.

Why couldn't we have had this kind of schedule when we were competing?

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

Rangers will be playing the Yotes tomorrow who are playing the 3rd in 4th and on the tail of B2B's. Rangers will be playing their 3rd game in like 12 days.

Rangers have also yet to play a set of b2b's where their opponents were also doing the same.

Why couldn't we have had this kind of schedule when we were competing?

Turns out it’s the league who wants us in the dreaded middle

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Turns out it’s the league who wants us in the dreaded middle

Well things turn around pretty quickly but it's insane how easy their schedule has been both in competition and rest days.

It gets pretty hellacious soon, but still.

 

[NY Lito]

I get the same feeling in my head reading RangerBoy posts that I got when I was painting my house for too long.

 

[aufheben]

Would you guys do Hayes, Buch and Smith (50% retained) for Colorado's (OTT) 1st + 2nd rd pick if Hayes signs there?

That 1st untouchable.

 

[Graves94]

Colorado would not. There's practically zero chance they move that pick before the draft lottery. Would you give up a chance a Jack Hughes or Kakko for that package?

Yeah, that pick could be 1/2 but could also likely be 7/8/9/10...

 

[Kupo]

If you believe this is a bottom 5 team, then what are you complaining about? You keep provided statistics to show how bad this team is, then complain that the team isn't bad enough and Gorton hasn't done enough to make them bad. Make up your mind.

RB would complain if he hit the powerball jackpot.

 

[True Blue]

That 1st untouchable.

I agree. Though it could be a "protected", I guess but then what is the substitution? Their own first plus maybe their own next? No idea.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I agree. Though it could be a "protected", I guess but then what is the substitution? Their own first plus maybe their own next? No idea.

Their own first would for sure be in play.

 

[True Blue]

This is why I’m against re-signing Hayes, and why I’m starting to get apprehensive about pursuing Panarin. The forward group will be very good, but the defense will be so far behind.

I do no think that this team will be able to afford Panarin at what he is likely to get full stop. And frankly, they are not at the point where they need to bring in a $10m forward.

 

[True Blue]

The league is rigged if both Chicago and LA both get top 5 picks this year.

Under Bettman, no way to the Rangers get the top two picks. In fact, they are probably heading out of the top 5

 

[NYR Viper]

RB isn't wrong. I'm not sure where the 'pile on RB' sentiment has come from but the guy knows his shit and has been around for a long time adding serious value to these boards. Okay, so he has a different viewpoint than I, or others have, but this new game of attack RB has kind of run its course by now, no?

He wants this team to get out of the middle. I agree. Some of Gorton's decisions have been somewhat curious, namely Smith and Shattenkirk after trading Stepan. I get the feeling that some of that was not him but instead others within saying they could remain competitive and retool quickly. I thought he did a VERY good job at last years trade deadline. Guys like Spooner and Namestnikov were brought back for insulation and future trade chips. Hayes on a 1 year deal along with Zuccarello and a depth defenseman in McQuaid, all of whom should be moved this year.

I guess I like the approach of trying to accrue as many future assets as possible in lieu of just tanking and having crap pieces on the NHL roster (when no one would want them at the deadline as rentals). I am hopeful he will make the right decisions again with some selling in the next couple of months that will continue the course he started a couple of years ago.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

RB isn't wrong. I'm not sure where the 'pile on RB' sentiment has come from but the guy knows his **** and has been around for a long time adding serious value to these boards. Okay, so he has a different viewpoint than I, or others have, but this new game of attack RB has kind of run its course by now, no?

He wants this team to get out of the middle. I agree. Some of Gorton's decisions have been somewhat curious, namely Smith and Shattenkirk after trading Stepan. I get the feeling that some of that was not him but instead others within saying they could remain competitive and retool quickly. I thought he did a VERY good job at last years trade deadline. Guys like Spooner and Namestnikov were brought back for insulation and future trade chips. Hayes on a 1 year deal along with Zuccarello and a depth defenseman in McQuaid, all of whom should be moved this year.

I guess I like the approach of trying to accrue as many future assets as possible in lieu of just tanking and having crap pieces on the NHL roster (when no one would want them at the deadline as rentals). I am hopeful he will make the right decisions again with some selling in the next couple of months that will continue the course he started a couple of years ago.

He was complaining that they don't suck enough and then turned around and said that this is basically a bottom 5 team.

Which one is it?

This team blows. A half decent team would be at the top of the division and challenging for the conference with the schedule they've had. Instead they're out of a playoff and in a tie for 10th from the bottom.

 

[Drew4u]

Things I learned on the main board today:

Kevin Hayes is barely worth a late 1st.

Carl Soderberg is better than Kevin hayes

Boston really doesn't want Kevin Hayes (though this has more to do with how Jimmy played there, I can't really blame them)

I remember last year they thought Nash was worth a 2nd at best...

 

[Riche16]

If @Edge has that type of value at this stage of his career, that deal has to be considered.

@Edge is absolutely ELITE

You are not going to find anyone on the Peg board remotely close to what he brings.

You're hoping to find elite / generational... whatever you wanna label it by trading away that very asset. Foolish

 

[NY Lito]

RB isn't wrong. I'm not sure where the 'pile on RB' sentiment has come from but the guy knows his **** and has been around for a long time adding serious value to these boards. Okay, so he has a different viewpoint than I, or others have, but this new game of attack RB has kind of run its course by now, no?

He wants this team to get out of the middle. I agree. Some of Gorton's decisions have been somewhat curious, namely Smith and Shattenkirk after trading Stepan. I get the feeling that some of that was not him but instead others within saying they could remain competitive and retool quickly. I thought he did a VERY good job at last years trade deadline. Guys like Spooner and Namestnikov were brought back for insulation and future trade chips. Hayes on a 1 year deal along with Zuccarello and a depth defenseman in McQuaid, all of whom should be moved this year.

I guess I like the approach of trying to accrue as many future assets as possible in lieu of just tanking and having crap pieces on the NHL roster (when no one would want them at the deadline as rentals). I am hopeful he will make the right decisions again with some selling in the next couple of months that will continue the course he started a couple of years ago.

Reading posts in a style reminiscent of Trump tweets has run its course.

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

RB isn't wrong. I'm not sure where the 'pile on RB' sentiment has come from but the guy knows his **** and has been around for a long time adding serious value to these boards. Okay, so he has a different viewpoint than I, or others have, but this new game of attack RB has kind of run its course by now, no?

He wants this team to get out of the middle. I agree. Some of Gorton's decisions have been somewhat curious, namely Smith and Shattenkirk after trading Stepan. I get the feeling that some of that was not him but instead others within saying they could remain competitive and retool quickly. I thought he did a VERY good job at last years trade deadline. Guys like Spooner and Namestnikov were brought back for insulation and future trade chips. Hayes on a 1 year deal along with Zuccarello and a depth defenseman in McQuaid, all of whom should be moved this year.

I guess I like the approach of trying to accrue as many future assets as possible in lieu of just tanking and having crap pieces on the NHL roster (when no one would want them at the deadline as rentals). I am hopeful he will make the right decisions again with some selling in the next couple of months that will continue the course he started a couple of years ago.

The problem is that he refuses see nuance and can’t have a discussion when people show him the flaws in his logic

 

[NYR Viper]

Reading posts in a style reminiscent of Trump tweets has run its course.

The problem is that he refuses see nuance and can’t have a discussion when people show him the flaws in his logic

The recommendation would be to place him on ignore if you don't want to read his stuff.

 

[NY Lito]

The recommendation would be to place him on ignore if you don't want to read his stuff.

It’s entirely too much fun, kind of like the whole can’t look away from a crash thing.