Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XLIV

[East Coast Bias]

 

[egelband]

What if the offers weren’t there?

This post reminds me of Bern crying about how we should have listened to him and traded Girardi to Edmonton a few years back. Did Edm want Girardi...lol? And even if we did agree to Berns 21 player swap, does that mean management would have gone ahead and approved a trade they heard about on HFBOARDS?

We ended up embarrassing Edmonton by flipping Spooner/Strome. We got very good value for Hayes. And the Zucc trade was almost an amazing trade if a couple of bounces went Dallas’s way. If he re-sign there then that’s another quality display of asset management by Gorton.

Yes. And to add, Gorton has proven he's Ong to be patient. So teams in theory should be making their best offers earlier. Of course, situation is always evolving. So my point isn't very salient. But it's still a positive for JG.

 

[haohmaru]

Booby Mac says Buffalo is closing in on signing Jeff Skinner to an 8 year, $72 million contract.

Yowie Wowie.

Skinner is a 9M player? Yikes. Picked a good season to have a career year. Buffalol can keep him.

 

[NYR Viper]

I wonder if the Rangers were one of the teams heavily interested in Zaitsev when he was a UFA in Russia.

 

[bobbop]

What do you mean? Like if he wasn’t willing to resign with anyone? Why wouldn’t he? I’ve never heard of anyone not being willing to sign with anyone. You think he will retire?

I'm not interested in trading for a rental. He would not come cheaply. Some teams may be willing to go the rental route but I don't see that as an option for the Rangers. Similarly, there are teams that might trade for Kreider as a rental (Arizona is one) but others would not.

 

[I Eat Crow]

We also need someone that can PK at RD. So which two of Fox, TDA and Pionk sits why Shattenkirk “try to rebuild his value? Is it worth it to destroy TDA/Fox for whatever gain to Shatty’s value that we might see?

And why on earth would he improve his value? I just don’t get this. Why??

There's a lot to digest here, so I'll have at it one thing at a time.

Shattenkirk's value will never be lower than it is now. There's no where to go but up from here in terms of value for him. I'm not sure he even nets a 2nd rounder at half salary retention at this point. Let him play up his value a little more. He can still put up at least 40 points in a season if he's healthy. RHD that put up points and can QB a power play have value.

Next, I don't see both Pionk and DeAngelo on the team next year. They're redundant pieces.

Also, I'm not so sure that Fox plays at the NHL level as much as some think. He's going to need some time in the AHL at some point next season.

Who PK's out of Pionk, DeAngelo, and Fox? Pionk did last season...poorly. I don't think anybody's (in)ability to PK has any bearing on whether Shattenkirk plays or not. That's flawed logic.

 

[Kupo]

Yes. And to add, Gorton has proven he's Ong to be patient. So teams in theory should be making their best offers earlier. Of course, situation is always evolving. So my point isn't very salient. But it's still a positive for JG.

Absolutely. I’d rather have a patient GM running our team than some impulsive bumbling moron. There’s no point trying to rush through a chess match.

I also accept the fact that every trade he makes will not be a landslide in our favor. Or signing. Nobody bats 100%.

The Smith + Shattenkirk signings we’re misses. But most of his trades were Good to Very Good, imo.

 

[Kupo]

The idea of Pionk needing to play a shutdown role is reminiscent of how AV utilized Glass when we needed goals.

I’m going to go find a hooker and expect her to be wifey material.

 

[Irishguy42]

Shatty@50% to the Islanders for Komarov and Ho-sang....

...would be awful

Shattenkirk is the best player in that proposal AINEC

 

[NernieBichols]

It’s very very typical of Gorts to keep Shatty and think that TDA or Fox can play at LD, just so ‘Shatty can build up his value’. We will screw the kids development, and best case scenario Gorts might be able to retain a little less on Shatty or like get a 3rd round pick or whatever.

I just hate it that the NY media always is playing along with that crap. Shatty was a bad signing to start with, half the posters at this place knew it. He shows up out of shape. Doesn’t seem like he is the biggest role model around. He is the worst possible fit for us given that he plays the exact same role as — THREE — kids we have at the same position.

But he is friends with the Maloneys. Families knows each other or whatever. He is paid a lot and is a big UFA signing — so he gets away with anything. It’s only those guys this franchise respects. Nobody ever thought twice about moving the other guys who gave their heart and soul for this team.

Players don’t recover their value, vets don’t. It never happens. How often haven’t we heard that from other places? Oh we aren’t trading X now, his value is at an all time low, let’s wait and see.

To Be fair. Maloney was very critical of him on his and giannone’s pregame podcast from about mid season through

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Skinner is a 9M player? Yikes. Picked a good season to have a career year. Buffalol can keep him.

Yea that feels like a lockout leading indicator.

 

[NernieBichols]

There's a lot to digest here, so I'll have at it one thing at a time.

Shattenkirk's value will never be lower than it is now. There's no where to go but up from here in terms of value for him. I'm not sure he even nets a 2nd rounder at half salary retention at this point. Let him play up his value a little more. He can still put up at least 40 points in a season if he's healthy. RHD that put up points and can QB a power play have value.

Next, I don't see both Pionk and DeAngelo on the team next year. They're redundant pieces.

Also, I'm not so sure that Fox plays at the NHL level as much as some think. He's going to need some time in the AHL at some point next season.

Who PK's out of Pionk, DeAngelo, and Fox? Pionk did last season...poorly. I don't think anybody's (in)ability to PK has any bearing on whether Shattenkirk plays or not. That's flawed logic.

Shortly after the trade in the comment section of his article, Carp said he thinks fox will be spending miminal if any time in Hartford. Got the feeling carp talks to Drury a lot

 

[Avery16]

I wonder if the Rangers were one of the teams heavily interested in Zaitsev when he was a UFA in Russia.

Regardless, they wouldn’t be interested now.

 

[NernieBichols]

Yea that feels like a lockout leading indicator.

I think it’s just the buffalo GM coming to terms with his reality, it’s just buffalo knowing they have to overpay to secure guys like skinner when they are willing to sign there as an UFA. GM probably thinks his opportunities will be few and far between and that this number won’t be a big deal bc they aren’t a cap ceiling team.

But geez did skinner play his hand well

 

[NernieBichols]

also I think Chevy is negotiating with acquiring teams on trouba through the media here. I agree it will be an expensive rental price as those things go, bc it seems clear Chevy plans to sort it out during the summer so it will be a full season rental. But I mean seriously I know it’s conjecture,’ but I’d bet unless the money is dramatically more from another contender with a decent market, that trouba looking to sign someone in the northeast or maybe Chicago/Detroit/Pittsburgh. Let’s add rangers, flyers, bruins, caps. Which teams need him, which teams are contenders who would pay to a big rental price or the premium to get him extended this summer. One two clubs?

So I still believe he’s going as a rental for a good rental price, or he’s going to one of 2-3 teams extended, and if it’s the rangers, it’s not gonna be bc gorts overpaid to get him in this year, it will be bc Chevy Knows trouba wants to be in NY, and so do other teams, and then that Chevy prefers our offer to his best rental offer

 

[NYR Viper]

Regardless, they wouldn’t be interested now.

Probably not but if Toronto retained some money? Maybe they’d take Smith as a return and the team has liked Zaitsev for a while.

I don’t think he was as bad as the Toronto fans make us all believe

 

[effen]

Probably not but if Toronto retained some money? Maybe they’d take Smith as a return and the team has liked Zaitsev for a while.

I don’t think he was as bad as the Toronto fans make us all believe

TOR isn't retaining any money with their situation. They're also not taking back and equivalent contract for the same reason.

 

[Leetch3]

Probably not but if Toronto retained some money? Maybe they’d take Smith as a return and the team has liked Zaitsev for a while.

I don’t think he was as bad as the Toronto fans make us all believe

not as bad as they believe and actually good aren't necessarily the same thing...he's got 5 more years left on his deal not sure we wouldn't be better off just riding out smith's contract the next 2 years

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Probably not but if Toronto retained some money? Maybe they’d take Smith as a return and the team has liked Zaitsev for a while.

I don’t think he was as bad as the Toronto fans make us all believe

No but hes still pretty bad.

 

[Avery16]

Probably not but if Toronto retained some money? Maybe they’d take Smith as a return and the team has liked Zaitsev for a while.

I don’t think he was as bad as the Toronto fans make us all believe

So our RD depth would be…

ADA
Shattenkirk
Zaitsev
Fox
Pionk

I don't see that coming to pass.

 

[Machinehead]

I like Pionk being 5th. Sign me up for that.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Zaitsev came to our prospect camp multiple times. The organization is familiar with him.

If his contract wasn’t so long I’d take a flyer on him depending on the price

 

[bobbop]

Once Babcock fully instituted his system, Zaitsev’s offense fell off a cliff. He’s much more an offensive player than a shutdown defenseman. If he produced like he did earlier in his career, his contract would be very reasonable. Someone will take a flyer, but probably not the Rangers.

 

[Barnaby]

Zaitsev may recover some value, but the risk is not worth the potential reward. He might make sense someplace, but not here. Contract is just waaaay too long to roll those dice.

 

[Beacon]

So do I but what young guy do we have will grow into that role? Chytl is more suited for wing, kratsov wing, howden? Anderson? We are razor thin at center and unless we get trade to get another top 10 pick like zegras or trade for a William nylander, I don't see a 1st or 2nd line center in the group.

I think Chytil is more suited for the center, but the wing is easier to play and he was 18 years old at the start of the last camp. His vision is out of this world. You didnt get to see it in the NHL yet, but it was crazy in the AHL. The disappointment with Chytil is wrong. He's a hell of a prospect.