Speculation: Roster Building Thread LIX: To trade or not to trade CK?

[Lion Hound]

I think these are reasonable goal expectations:

Panarin 25
Zib 25
Buchnevich 20
Kakko 20
Kravtsov 15
Chytil 15
Andersson 10
Namestnikov 10
Strome 10
Fast 10
Lemieux 10
Howden 10
Trouba 5
DeAngelo 5
Shattenkirk 5
Fox 5
Skjei 5
Nieves 5
Hajek 2
Rykov 2
Staal 2

My realistic predictions on the season. That equates to 216 goals. Not enough, even with good goaltending. We need some big time breakouts to make the playoffs.

If Kreider stays, we’re close, but that’s not the right long term decision.

25 Goals for an 11.6 million dollar cap hit? I don't think Panarin should get a pass on expectations. 30-35 Goals minimum should be the number.

 

[MetalJaws]

Strome strikes me as the type of guy who has bounced around a bit and would b just fine taking a 3-4 year deal for ~$3-3.5m per season with some sort of trade protection. I think he likes it with the Rangers and is a nice utility type of player I'd be okay re-signing. His versatility is a positive and he is a RFA at years end so they will have the opportunity to negotiate exclusively.

I'd be all for that as a depth RW guy as well.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Ya I’m gonna say no to giving Strome an extension. 4 years, 4M would be awful honestly.

25 Goals for an 11.6 million dollar cap hit? I don't think Panarin should get a pass on expectations. 30-35 Goals minimum should be the number.

His career high is 31. He’s more of a playmaker than a goal scorer

 

[Alluckks]

25 Goals for an 11.6 million dollar cap hit? I don't think Panarin should get a pass on expectations. 30-35 Goals minimum should be the number.

He scored 28 last year and 27 the year before that. What a silly way to measure a player that is so much more than goal totals.

 

[I Eat Crow]

If the Rangers keep Kreider I say we make the playoffs.

I think the Rangers can make it with or without Kreider.

I think a lot of us underestimate how much of an improvement we'll see on defense with Trouba coming on board and Pionk going out. Pionk is addition by subtraction. That move alone and having Hajek or Rykov on LD instead of Smith is going to make a big difference.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

I think the Rangers can make it with or without Kreider.

I think a lot of us underestimate how much of an improvement we'll see on defense with Trouba coming on board and Pionk going out. Pionk is addition by subtraction. That move alone and having Hajek or Rykov on LD instead of Smith is going to make a big difference.

Ya I think Howden and Chytil will take slight steps forward as well. I think they each can put up ~40 points next season, give or take.

 

[QJL]

25 Goals for an 11.6 million dollar cap hit? I don't think Panarin should get a pass on expectations. 30-35 Goals minimum should be the number.

He has averaged 29 in his career with a better supporting cast. I’m expecting the player we have seen since he entered the league. The player we paid for. I have expectations and I have predictions. I think Panarin finishes around 30 goals, 80 points.

 

[Avery16]

Toronto signed their big contract in Tavares the year they had to pay Nylander and the year before they had to pay Matthews and Marner.

The Rangers signed Panarin three years before those guys are up for new contracts. And Zibanejad is signed for three years as well. We have massive hits like Hank, Smith, Staal, and Shattenkirk coming off the books before we have to sign any of Mika. Kakko, Kravtsov, Chytil, Fox, etc.

If the team is any good, of course there’ll be a cap crunch, but Gorton has basically set himself up for three years of a healthy cap.

And yet we’re still trying to find a way to get Trouba and Buch signed and not get shortchanged in trading Kreider, Names and Fast.

 

[Tawnos]

I think the Rangers can make it with or without Kreider.

I think a lot of us underestimate how much of an improvement we'll see on defense with Trouba coming on board and Pionk going out. Pionk is addition by subtraction. That move alone and having Hajek or Rykov on LD instead of Smith is going to make a big difference.

I don't think we should necessarily expect Hajek or Rykov to be an immediate improvement. They're both going to have rookie struggles. Smith doesn't have those, but is not very good... so I think that will wash out in the end. Also, Staal might decline further. Shattenkirk might decline further. Until those guys are gone and their replacements get some experience, I wouldn't bank on major improvements on D.

 

[GordonGecko]

The simple truth is that every really good team has cap issues. Some more pressing than others. Every team has to move out players to stay cap compliant.

That’s not a bad thing. It means you have a really good team.

But the best way to avoid a long term issue is have a pipeline of young players ready to step in. One of the reasons I am bullish on the Rangers future is that they are stocked with prospects, many of whom are in college or Europe with longer fuses.

 

[Cag29]

The simple truth is that every really good team has cap issues. Some more pressing than others. Every team has to move out players to stay cap compliant.

That’s not a bad thing. It means you have a really good team.

But the best way to avoid a long term issue is have a pipeline of young players ready to step in. One of the reasons I am bullish on the Rangers future is that they are stocked with prospects, many of whom are in college or Europe with longer fuses.

 

[Mikos87]

Strome strikes me as the type of guy who has bounced around a bit and would b just fine taking a 3-4 year deal for ~$3-3.5m per season with some sort of trade protection. I think he likes it with the Rangers and is a nice utility type of player I'd be okay re-signing. His versatility is a positive and he is a RFA at years end so they will have the opportunity to negotiate exclusively.

I think you're right and that's a valuable commodity. He's a great utility guy, I was clamoring for a player of Strome's profile for two years. He's not a proven playoff performer, but all things considered, having a 20-20 third liner that can kill penalties would be great. I hope he gets a little better on the PK though.

 

[mas0764]

And yet we’re still trying to find a way to get Trouba and Buch signed and not get shortchanged in trading Kreider, Names and Fast.

Who cares if we get shortchanged trading Names and Fast?

 

[Kovalev27]

I think the Rangers can make it with or without Kreider.

I think a lot of us underestimate how much of an improvement we'll see on defense with Trouba coming on board and Pionk going out. Pionk is addition by subtraction. That move alone and having Hajek or Rykov on LD instead of Smith is going to make a big difference.

I’m not underestimating the improvement at all that’s why I’m putting them in the playoffs. Replacing Pionk with Trouba alone will do it. But that’s with Kreider in the lineup. Without him think we fall short.

 

[pld459666]

25 Goals for an 11.6 million dollar cap hit? I don't think Panarin should get a pass on expectations. 30-35 Goals minimum should be the number.

That's a ridiculous statement

 

[DutchShamrock]

There is a HUGE difference between Toronto and the Rangers. Toronto barely sold off anyone in their years of ineptitude. Yes, they had high picks who have developed into leaders in their forward group but they are missing the secondary pieces later in the 1st round the Rangers have snagged over the last few years. Nash, McDonagh, Hayes, Zuccarello, Brassard, Stepan, soon to be Kreider. These trades were done at a time when those players still had significant value and allowed Gorton the ability to add those secondary pieces a team like Toronto is missing. It's one of the reasons Gorton is looking like such a genius, he didn't wait too long to make a course correcting decision and he has been able to build depth throughout the system at nearly every position.

I don't know. They had Bozak, Kadri, JVR, and Gardner as some pretty decent depth pieces. Some tough players that score ugly goals, do dirty work. They lost that depth because of Marleau and Tavares.

Toronto stripped it down decently. Sure it could have been better, and Lupul and Horton didn't help. We have dead cap too. Girardi this year, whoever gets bought out for probably 4 more years. Who ever doesnt get bought out for 2 more years. It's a better situation here, but not to the extent we can just shrug it off.

I don't know, maybe I'm pessimistic. Cap flexibility would have been nice to lock up Trouba long term, then ADA and Buchnevich long term at a future steal. Now we have to eat up future cap with buyouts, forego a bargain signing for bridge deals. Do we go to arbitration with trouba and then eat a mega signing next summer?

We project huge cap space down the line but $11.6 is going to a winger, a chance that our $7.5 #1 d will turn out to be $8+ next summer, Buch and ADA at 6 x $4.5 are $6.5 per in 2 summers, Kakko and Kravtsov are $8+ coming off ELC. Then the other dozen players we have to sign, but we are projecting 2019 dollars because they will be ignorant to the new TV and won't know about inflation.

I guess I'm not buying into the idea that if we have cap problems later on, it means our players are awesome. It sounds like a bannable offense meme from the Oilers board.

 

[Avery16]

Who cares if we get shortchanged trading Names and Fast?

I do.

 

[mas0764]

I do.

Namestnikov has no role and no future on this team, really. He’s proven he’s about a third line player on most teams; or a guy who can be the spare part and not embarrass himself playing with superstars, but he’s not the driver.

That’s worth like a second or third round pick at best, under ideal conditions. You are actually worried that we’re not gonna capitalize on that amazing value?

Fast is the same thing.

I can see being worried about having to ship Kreider off for pennies on the dollar, as he’s actually valuable to both the team, and should be valuable to other teams. But, if losing Kreider for less than market value is the price to pay for acquiring Panarin, then doing so was still a smart move you should make ten times out of ten. I’ll give away Kreider for free before I have regret about signing Panarin. Kreider’s value is not comparable to Panarin’s.

 

[Avery16]

Namestnikov has no role and no future on this team, really. He’s proven he’s about a third line player on most teams; or a guy who can be the spare part and not embarrass himself playing with superstars, but he’s not the driver.

That’s worth like a second or third round pick at best, under ideal conditions. You are actually worried that we’re not gonna capitalize on that amazing value?

Fast is the same thing.

I can see being worried about having to ship Kreider off for pennies on the dollar, as he’s actually valuable to both the team, and should be valuable to other teams. But, if losing Kreider for less than market value is the price to pay for acquiring Panarin, then doing so was still a smart move you should make ten times out of ten. I’ll give away Kreider for free before I have regret about signing Panarin. Kreider’s value is not comparable to Panarin’s.

I disagree with... all of this.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I think you're right and that's a valuable commodity. He's a great utility guy, I was clamoring for a player of Strome's profile for two years. He's not a proven playoff performer, but all things considered, having a 20-20 third liner that can kill penalties would be great. I hope he gets a little better on the PK though.

I hope he gets a lot better 5 on 5

 

[mas0764]

I disagree with... all of this.

That’s silly of you.

 

[bobbop]

You might could get a King's Ransom for Kreider!

Royalty ain’t what it used to be.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

We are not a really good team yet. Not even close.

 

[Machinehead]

If they do trade Kreider, you can forget about the talk of sneaking into the playoffs.

The last three years, this team doesn't know what a puck is if Kreider's not on the ice. Panarin isn't solving that completely.

 

[Machinehead]

Who cares if we get shortchanged trading Names and Fast?

Namestnikov is whatever but I would want something back for Fast.

He's a good player and he's really cheap. It would have to be something worth my while.