Speculation: Roster Building Thread LIV: Free Agency Hasn't Even Started

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duhmetreE

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You think it's fair value for Panarin. That doesn't actually mean it's true. Don't assume your opinion is a fact. You've become so hellbent on Panarin that you've become oblivious to certain facts.

The Kucherov comparison isn't accurate either. He was the best player in the league last season. Panarin half assed it during the playoffs last season. He coasted. His lack of back checking led to goals against. His effort can be mediocre. Go on the Blue Jackets board and look at their GDT's.

You're not going to convince the Anti-Panarin crowd that signing him to the largest contract in our franchises history is a good investment.
Kucherov signed it before the season started. What he did this past season is irrelevant to his contract. He also had 1 year of RFA left.

You should look in the mirror. You're the one hellbent and oblivious.

Someone should point Gorton to that GDT ASAP
 

Thirty One

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It is if you didn’t watch the games, which some posters here clearly didn’t because they would acknowledge that fact about Panarin’s game.

Hell, I remember a blue jackets fan who came here and mentioned that as well.

For 10, 11 or 12m, I don’t want someone who coasts and neglects the defensive side of the game.
So Blue Jackets fans have negative things to say about him? Have you asked his ex-girlfriends?
 

TheBPA

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It is if you didn’t watch the games, which some posters here clearly didn’t because they would acknowledge that fact about Panarin’s game.

Hell, I remember a blue jackets fan who came here and mentioned that as well.

For 10, 11 or 12m, I don’t want someone who coasts and neglects the defensive side of the game.

In 27 career playoff games he is at 59% Corsi and has 26 points. This “coasting in the playoffs” narrative is nonsense. He unquestionably positively influences play and scores.
 

Anzi

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Fact of the matter is that you're going to have to pay more than you may be comfortable with to get a top UFA. The alternative is to draft and develop your own elite talent but the odds are stacked against you unless you get top picks in several years. If we pass on Panarin, the chances of us adding a player like him in the next few years are going to be slim unless we get a top pick next year or we luck out and draft a star with a lower pick.
 

DanielBrassard

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Kucherov makes 9.5M and is coming off back to back 100P seasons.

Kane makes 10.5M and is coming off a 100P season.

Gaudreau makes 6.75M and is coming off a 99P season.

MacKinnon makes 6.3M and is coming off a 99P season.

Crosby makes 8.7M and is coming off a 100P season.

Giroux makes 8.275M and is coming off a 85P season (102P last season).

Panarin @12M, or 11M is just straight up stupid. He's not a 12M player for starters. Despite the space we have now, we'll have to do a lot of maneuvering to fit him in. Some of you guys can't resist temptation. He's a very good player but he's not in the same tier as most of the guys you mentioned above. But, he'll get paid more than all of them.

Look at MacKinnon and Gaudreau's contracts. That's what you want. Top end production at a bargain. I understand not every team is that lucky, but the point still remains.
Kucherov signed his contract as an RFA in an tax-friendly state
Kane signed his contract when the cap was 71.4M
Gaudreau was an RFA
Mackinnon signed as an 20 year old RFA before he broke out
Crosby signed when the cap was 64.3M and was signed when there were no contract length limits officially
Giroux signed when the cap was 69M and was not a UFA

None of these are comparable to Panarin when it comes to contract status, and he absolutely is in the same tier as these players.
 

Kupo

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Kucherov signed it before the season started. What he did this past season is irrelevant to his contract. He also had 1 year of RFA left.

You should look in the mirror. You're the one hellbent and oblivious.

Someone should point Gorton to that GDT ASAP

You should probably visit some of those GDT's and read up on him instead of watching his highlight reels.

So Blue Jackets fans have negative things to say about him? Have you asked his ex-girlfriends?

Blue Jacket fans criticized his effort. I criticized his effort as well when the games mattered most.

In 27 career playoff games he is at 59% Corsi and has 26 points. This “coasting in the playoffs” narrative is nonsense. He unquestionably positively influences play and scores.

His Corsi % has nothing to do with the fact that he has lazy tendencies.
 

TheBPA

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You should probably visit some of those GDT's and read up on him instead of watching his highlight reels.



Blue Jacket fans criticized his effort. I criticized his effort as well when the games mattered most.



His Corsi % has nothing to do with the fact that he has lazy tendencies.

So to sum up:

Instead of watching the player, we should read what some fans wrote after they were disappointed that their team was eliminated from the playoffs.

Additionally, his scoring stats and possession numbers are irrelevant because some people sometimes think he looks lazy.
 

Amazing Kreiderman

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You think it's fair value for Panarin. That doesn't actually mean it's true. Don't assume your opinion is a fact. You've become so hellbent on Panarin that you've become oblivious to certain facts.

The Kucherov comparison isn't accurate either. He was the best player in the league last season. Panarin half assed it during the playoffs last season. He coasted. His lack of back checking led to goals against. His effort can be mediocre. Go on the Blue Jackets board and look at their GDT's.

You're not going to convince the Anti-Panarin crowd that signing him to the largest contract in our franchises history is a good investment.

The largest contract (AAV) for the Rangers in the cap era is 8.5m and was signed 5 years ago. The Rangers haven't "gone all out" in half a decade. Panarin's cap hit will be 14.7% if he signs for 12m. That's not as crazy as people think for a 27-year old consistent 70+ point player. Before Zibanejad, the last Ranger to hit 70 points was Marian Gaborik
 

Kupo

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Kucherov signed his contract as an RFA in an tax-friendly state
Kane signed his contract when the cap was 71.4M
Gaudreau was an RFA
Mackinnon signed as an 20 year old RFA before he broke out
Crosby signed when the cap was 64.3M and was signed when there were no contract length limits officially
Giroux signed when the cap was 69M and was not a UFA

None of these are comparable to Panarin when it comes to contract status, and he absolutely is in the same tier as these players.

Panarin will make more than all of those players and he hasn't produced as much as any of them aside for Matthews, who's just a 21 year old kid.
 

Amazing Kreiderman

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Panarin will make more than all of those players and he hasn't produced as much as any of them aside for Matthews, who's just a 21 year old kid.

Panarin is also the only one who is UFA when you compare him to MacKinnon, Matthews, McDavid etc
 

duhmetreE

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Kupo

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So to sum up:

Instead of watching the player, we should read what some fans wrote after they were disappointed that their team was eliminated from the playoffs.

Additionally, his scoring stats and possession numbers are irrelevant because some people sometimes think he looks lazy.

Get your facts straight man.

GDT's take place during games, not after. I suggested reading the GDT's because Panarin does have holes in his game which some of you guys neglect. I never suggested not watching a player either so stop making **** up.

The largest contract (AAV) for the Rangers in the cap era is 8.5m and was signed 5 years ago. The Rangers haven't "gone all out" in half a decade. Panarin's cap hit will be 14.7% if he signs for 12m. That's not as crazy as people think for a 27-year old consistent 70+ point player. Before Zibanejad, the last Ranger to hit 70 points was Marian Gaborik

15% of our entire teams cap space is insane, unless you're talking about a generational talent which Panarin is not. I like Artemi a lot but there are a number of reason's why I want to avoid seeing us sign him.
 

egelband

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Kucherov makes 9.5M and is coming off back to back 100P seasons.

Kane makes 10.5M and is coming off a 100P season.

Gaudreau makes 6.75M and is coming off a 99P season.

MacKinnon makes 6.3M and is coming off a 99P season.

Crosby makes 8.7M and is coming off a 100P season.

Giroux makes 8.275M and is coming off a 85P season (102P last season).

Panarin @12M, or 11M is just straight up stupid. He's not a 12M player for starters. Despite the space we have now, we'll have to do a lot of maneuvering to fit him in. Some of you guys can't resist temptation. He's a very good player but he's not in the same tier as most of the guys you mentioned above. But, he'll get paid more than all of them.

Look at MacKinnon and Gaudreau's contracts. That's what you want. Top end production at a bargain. I understand not every team is that lucky, but the point still remains.
Well said. I'd add that if your team has Panarin as it's best player, you're Columbus. That's a good team but not a champion. You want to leave room for a player better than Panarin in the salary structure. And I don't think giving Panarin 12m or thereabouts allows the Rangers to pay another guy 12m. Anyhow I'm no cap expert obviously but I hope they don't handcuff themselves. Cap side is huge right now and probably for another year or two until the next CBA. Thats a lot of time to make hay.
 

Amazing Kreiderman

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15% of our entire teams cap space is insane, unless you're talking about a generational talent which Panarin is not. I like Artemi a lot but there are a number of reason's why I want to avoid seeing us sign him.

Kopitar, E. Staal, P. Kane, Toews aren't generational and their cap hit percentage was similar to Panarin's if we use 12m AAV as a benchmark
 
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Off Sides

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Panarin is a very good player, my argument is not against that notion, my argument is simply based on timing and cap space.

Even if we use a pretty optimistic timeline, most of these prospects they have who are 18-19-20 years old will probably not be in their prime until they are 21-22. Panarin will be ~9 -10 years older.

If we also use an optimistic end of prime age of 33 years old, the two parties would share approximately a 1-2 year period where they are both in their primes.

Primes meaning where the player is putting up the most points per game they will in their careers.

If one wants to debate that Panarin will still be good, by all means that I think is somewhat plausible, if one wants to say he'll be in his prime still, I think that is kind of far fetched.

That does not seem to leave a ton of room for the pessimistic scenario's to not come into play.

I don't think I need to go over the cap space, Rangers have like 12 prospects and some RFAs who will all need bigger contacts all while Panarin would still be on their books. All the optimistic cap growth predictions over the years have proven to never quite match up to reality.
 
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TheBPA

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Get your facts straight man.

GDT's take place during games, not after. I suggested reading the GDT's because Panarin does have holes in his game which some of you guys neglect. I never suggested not watching a player either so stop making **** up.



15% of our entire teams cap space is insane, unless you're talking about a generational talent which Panarin is not. I like Artemi a lot but there are a number of reason's why I want to avoid seeing us sign him.

You said read GDTs instead of watching highlights.

In any event, GDTs are already an emotionally charged place, and during the playoffs only moreso, and god knows who is posting in there. I’m not sure why it should be a measure of anything.

You don’t want to sign him, fine. There are reasons not to and I get that. But him not being an effective playoff player to this point is simply not true.
 
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