Confirmed with Link: [RFA] Drake Caggiula reups for 2 Years ($1.5M per)

[CornKicker]

Caggiula scored 13 goals last season so if he's a fourth liner he's a pretty darn good one.

He plays up and down the lineup which is actually what we had hoped for with Kassian.

The thing is he still has room to grow. Some of the hits he threw this past season to create energy were pretty good. He needs to be more consistent in that regard and work on his play without the puck.

I'll be honest, I'm not a big fan of his but I do see a base for a player that can be useful if he puts it together.

There are players that are overpaid on this team. He's not one of them.

I'll add to this, Cagguila played 1/3 of the season with a fishbowl coving his face. He has shown flashes of being a good scorer and does generate chances and the potential is there for him to be a 20 goal scorer.

That might be hard to swallow considering he hasn't even played 2 full NHL seasons so like Pujluarvi we should just write him off. He cant and wont improve even though he nearly doubled his goal total from the year before.

If a guy who scored 13 goals and has potential to score 20 on his trajectory is overpaid at 1.5M then LOL everyone is overpaid.

 

[CornKicker]

he also scored 3Gs in the playoffs in 13 games as a rookie. gotta hate players who show up when the games matter the most

 

[Drivesaitl]

nope


-and he got a 1-year deal
-and he's 30
-and he's cap% was more than Caggulia's
-overpayment I guess?



-1 year deal
-cap % more than Caggulia's.
-overpayment I guess?

-signed 2 years ago when cap was lower
-older player than Drake
-if Byron can become productive at 28, why can't Drake at 23?


they are?

why does it matter if a bottomsix player is older. As per Vet team success in the NHL oft times I would rather have that. Its not like Cagg is a ready to break out player. He's a runt, easy to play against, weak in 200ft play, should never touch the pk. The guy has 20pts rotating in and out of topsix and getting liberal PP minutes and is not a good all round player, is not particularly good at anything, does not bring intangibles, and people figure that's a reason to have a spot? Vegas has around 10 wingers in org I would rather have than Caggiulia. Maybe why they are a good club.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

why does it matter if a bottomsix player is older. As per Vet team success in the NHL oft times I would rather have that. Its not like Cagg is a ready to break out player. He's a runt, easy to play against, weak in 200ft play, should never touch the pk. The guy has 20pts rotating in and out of topsix and getting liberal PP minutes and is not a good all round player, is not particularly good at anything, does not bring intangibles, and people figure that's a reason to have a spot? Vegas has around 10 wingers in org I would rather have than Caggiulia. Maybe why they are a good club.

because he's played less than 2 full seasons and has plenty of room to grow
you may not think so but the organization does

 

[TheNumber4]

What were all these guys earning before they re-signed?

Ryan earned 600000 previously so he got a 825000 raise.

AA from what I could ascertain was approx 630000 cap hit, so he received an over 700000 raise and he's an RFA again this year with arbitration rights.

Byron earned 900000 on his last deal before his extension, but it's important to note he had signed a series of one year deals before that so perhaps a three year deal with a slight bump in pay was more appealing because of the stability it provided and also taking his age into consideration.

Caggiula got a 575000 raise so actually his raise from his previous pay wasn't as large as Ryan's or AA's.

Context is everything.

When trying to build a team you need to find value. How much of a raise they got previously doesn't change the fact that Caggs doesn't play like a 1.5M dollar player. So what if he was paid 925K previous to this, he was probably overpaid then too.

 

[CycloneSweep]

because he's played less than 2 full seasons and has plenty of room to grow
you may not think so but the organization does

Just because he has room to grow, doesnt mean he will. Kid should be in the AHL, should of been his first 2 years cause he isn't good enough to be an nhl regular yet.

 

[PaPaDee]

I think he’ll become a decent third line player for us.

 

[CupofOil]

You’re exactly right. The contract seems a little high to me. Which, in a vacuum, isn’t a big deal. Just like the 2.5 million dollar unproven back up, or Kassian’s contract. Do we ever get a team friendly deal? We can’t afford these small over pays with the big dogs making top dollar.

You called it a paper cut and that seems appropriate. What did Chia have to say when he was flabbergasted that last season went off the rails?

Death by a thousand paper cuts.

Now here he is putting the same eggs in the same baskets.

Is it really an overpay? What do you guys think the going rate is for a player that had a strong close to his rookie season (some big goals down the stretch) followed by a 13 goal sophomore campaign? You're not getting him for a $1M, that's just not realistic so is $1.2-$1.4 the average rate for a player like this? Keep in mind also the rising cap so 1.5M now isn't what 1.5M was even last offseason.

I think we are all aware of his flaws but I just don't see the big deal in giving the absolute slightest of overpays (if it is even an overpay) for a young player of his ilk. Is it worth cutting bait with him because this contract is just a smidge too pricey? I get the frustration with the Koskinen contract because he could very well be a flop in the NHL but this player has proven that he can at least score at a decent rate at this level and bring other things like energy and physicality.

As far as team friendly deals are concerned, aren't Klefbom and Larsson team friendly? Every team has little overpays like this. It's not the little overpays that are hurting the Oilers, it's the NMC's and losing too many value trades.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Just because he has room to grow, doesnt mean he will. Kid should be in the AHL, should of been his first 2 years cause he isn't good enough to be an nhl regular yet.

you could literally say that about any young player lol
and AHLers don't score 13 goals in the NHL

 

[North]

When trying to build a team you need to find value. How much of a raise they got previously doesn't change the fact that Caggs doesn't play like a 1.5M dollar player. So what if he was paid 925K previous to this, he was probably overpaid then too.

He was a highly sought after college free agent who was going to get a max ELC from whatever team he signed with.

He scored 7 goals one season and 13 goals the next.

He's actually one of the few players who showed some improvement in an area (goal scoring) and before people chime in with he was playing with McDavid, how did that work out for Lucic?

He hasn't done anything to not warrant this raise.

People complaining about $100000 to $200000 for signings like this are exhausting.

 

[Drivesaitl]

because he's played less than 2 full seasons and has plenty of room to grow
you may not think so but the organization does

Well the org hasn't been particularly good at evaluating these kinds of things. I don't have the confidence Cagg is going to grow his game appreciably. I don't believe he thinks the game well enough. He's a busy player, and as such has his fans just based on that but is more of a random molecule than somebody making great reads. He chases out of position regularly.

The org just let two better young wingers walk in Slepychev and Pakarinen. Slepy showed me signs of elite NHL skill but who needed better minutes than he got and some time to unpack it here. His hands are better than Cagg, he's harder to play against, can be a beast on the boards, and the team found no use for him. Pacman was one of the best 200ft players this club had left and also with bone jarring hits and who played a smart game up and down the ice. The org doesn't value guys like that but value Cagg. Its hard to understand.

 

[CycloneSweep]

you could literally say that about any young player lol
and AHLers don't score 13 goals in the NHL

Brandon Pirri is an ahler. He scored 22 goals once and spent the majority of the year again this year in the AHL. He was also much better at Caggiulas age and was spending time in the ahl. So....yeah...

If Caggs was good or average defensively then he could be an NHLer. Like Pirri the only thing they have to their game really is offense but that is not enough.

 

[TheNumber4]

nope


-and he got a 1-year deal
-and he's 30
-and he's cap% was more than Caggulia's
-overpayment I guess?



-1 year deal
-cap % more than Caggulia's.
-overpayment I guess?

-signed 2 years ago when cap was lower
-older player than Drake
-if Byron can become productive at 28, why can't Drake at 23?


they are?

You ignore that Ryan and Athenisou are better players than the Drake, production wise and intangles. So lets look at their Cap% numbers, Ryan would be at 1.867% of Cap when he signed, Athenisou would be at 1.849%. NHL salary cap is projected to rise to 78-82M for the coming season, lets take 80M as the middle ground, this puts him at 1.875% of the Cap. So Caggiulla's Cap% is still higher than those players while providing about 9 less points and in the case of Ryan a lot less overall utility.

I don't agree with overpaying a player based on age when talking about low potential, low upside 4th liners especially when you are signing them on short term deals. You pay for what you get, and if it doesn't work out with a 4th liner you just swap in another one at around the same salary.

 

[nabob]

Just because he has room to grow, doesnt mean he will. Kid should be in the AHL, should of been his first 2 years cause he isn't good enough to be an nhl regular yet.

He grew from a 7 goal scorer to a 13 goal scorer. To say that he has peaked would be quite foolish. Should we just realease every player who almost doubles their scoring output from one season to the next.
Say he continues to improve at a slower rate and is a 20-22 goal scorer by the end of this contract, would you be against resigning him then if it meant a slight bump to around 3% of the salary cap? Or should we let him go because we might be able to find the one UFA who exceeds his contract that year. Expecting to have a bottom six where every player makes less than $1M just isn't a reality with a salary cap that is over $80M

 

[TheNumber4]

He was a highly sought after college free agent who was going to get a max ELC from whatever team he signed with.

He scored 7 goals one season and 13 goals the next.

He's actually one of the few players who showed some improvement in an area (goal scoring) and before people chime in with he was playing with McDavid, how did that work out for Lucic?

He hasn't done anything to not warrant this raise.

People complaining about $100000 to $200000 for signings like this are exhausting.

Does Drake's pre-NHL hype really matter anymore when trying to assess whether you are building a good team or not in the present? A good team consists of good contracts, how much a player was paid for before that is really irrelevant when trying to build the best possible team. You look at what he provides to your team and you pay him appropriately. If you have to overpay because he did well in College then you are overpaying plain and simple. I said before it's a SLIGHT overpay, its really not the end of the world when you look at just this one contract. It's looking at Chia's overall negotiations with all his players is when the concern comes in. Every single player he signs ranged from Slight overpay to way overpaid, and it all adds up in a league where other GMs are pulling off deals where players are paid appropriately or at a discount. How are we ever going to compete if every one of our contracts is slightly higher than our competition.

 

[CupofOil]

He grew from a 7 goal scorer to a 13 goal scorer. To say that he has peaked would be quite foolish. Should we just realease every player who almost doubles their scoring output from one season to the next.

But... advanced stats.

 

[CycloneSweep]

He grew from a 7 goal scorer to a 13 goal scorer. To say that he has peaked would be quite foolish. Should we just realease every player who almost doubles their scoring output from one season to the next.

He also went from 11 assist to 7. His point pace was identical to the year before but his goals and assists flipped.

He doubled his PIM and his defensive game continued to flounder.

I'm not saying we should release him. He is a 4th liner/ahl tweeter who shouldn't be making what he makes. His cap percentage usually goes to players that have a similar offensive output to him but actually have a good defensive game. Again the best comparable to him is Brandon Pirri who cap% wise would put Caggiula around 1.1 mill.

Yes it's not the end of the world that we overpaid him but it's a continued cycle of overpaying everyone.

People saying he would of made that in arbitration and I heavily disagree. They would look at the whole picture, not only his goals.

Marchessault after 18 points in 45 games signed for 0.750 mill x 2 years. Yeah he is great now but he was signed to a fair contract after the season he put up, a season at a higher points pace than Caggiula.

 

[Little Fury]

When you're a top heavy team, finding efficiencies at the bottom of the roster is a good way to improve.

You aren't doing that by bringing back the worst player on the team with a healthy raise. $1.5 M for a bottom six./fourth line player isn't gonna kill you if that player actually lives up to the number. Based on what we've seen from Cagguila, I'd say the chances of that happening are pretty slim.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Vegas just showed us how much hard nosed and airtight bottomsix players that play a complete game can do.

We had two rugged hard to play against wingers in Slepy and Pac to grow into that mold. We get rid of both of them and re-up Cagg. sigh.

In the last calendar year we have lost Maroon, Pouliot, Eberle, Pitlick, Slepy, Pac, Hendricks, Lander. All guys that could play the game. Who have we replaced them with? Are we getting better? Deeper?

This team was so desperate we were converting Nuge to wing, playing Auvitu as winger, signing Jokinen lmao, Walker, Malone.

We get rid of wingers that actually have an NHL game and keep rotating in the latest batch of prospects and hope.

Given this its not hard to see how under Chia the Winger talent of this team has been completely decimated.

if you looked at the sum winger depth in this org you would think we are still in tanking mode.

 

[nabob]

He also went from 11 assist to 7. His point pace was identical to the year before but his goals and assists flipped.

He doubled his PIM and his defensive game continued to flounder.

I'm not saying we should release him. He is a 4th liner/ahl tweeter who shouldn't be making what he makes. His cap percentage usually goes to players that have a similar offensive output to him but actually have a good defensive game. Again the best comparable to him is Brandon Pirri who cap% wise would put Caggiula around 1.1 mill.

Yes it's not the end of the world that we overpaid him but it's a continued cycle of overpaying everyone.

People saying he would of made that in arbitration and I heavily disagree. They would look at the whole picture, not only his goals.

Marchessault after 18 points in 45 games signed for 0.750 mill x 2 years. Yeah he is great now but he was signed to a fair contract after the season he put up, a season at a higher points pace than Caggiula.

Using a player whonplayer 45 games in a different role doesn't really make sense.

 

[CycloneSweep]

Vegas just showed us how much hard nosed and airtight bottomsix players that play a complete game can do.

We had two rugged hard to play against wingers in Slepy and Pac to grow into that mold. We get rid of both of them and re-up Cagg. sigh.

In the last calendar year we have lost Maroon, Pouliot, Eberle, Pitlick, Slepy, Pac, Hendricks, Lander. All guys that could play the game. Who have we replaced them with? Are we getting better? Deeper?

This team was so desperate we were converting Nuge to wing, playing Auvitu as winger, signing Jokinen lmao, Walker, Malone.

We get rid of wingers that actually have an NHL game and keep rotating in the latest batch of prospects and hope.

I agree with some of this. I consider Caggiula and Slepy both in the same boat as non nhl guys.

Pakarainen was good in his role but I think he wanted to make more overseas. I believe Patrick Russell is his replacement. They have similar aspects to their games but I think Russell had a better hockey iq. So...at last we have that

 

[CupofOil]

Slepy is a zero dimensional player, what complete game has he ever shown?
Pak was fine as a 13th forward but there was absolutely no upside with this player.

 

[CycloneSweep]

Using a player whonplayer 45 games in a different role doesn't really make sense.

Yeah both Pirri and Marchessault were bottom 6 guys being played in a bottom 6 role putting up more points than Caggiula was when Caggiula had playing time with our 2 best centers and a decent amount of pp time. Caggiula in his bottom 6 time was putting up worse numbers than those guys did.

You put those guys at the time with McDavid they would of done better.

Doesnt negate the fact that even cap % wise, we overpaid compared to what comparable young players are normally signed for.

 

[TheNumber4]

Oh you guys are looking for a complete player that this team gave up on and dropped the ball on? Let's talk Tyler Pitlick, who signed at 1M and provided 27 points for the Stars, while being a faster and grittier version of Drake. And don't tell me that Chia couldn't have stole Pitlick from the Stars with a 1.25 or 1.5M offer. And don't tell me he was oft injured so it makes sense that we moved on, cause Dallas's GM knew about Pitlicks injury problems as well and still made the call Chia couldn't make.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Slepy is a zero dimensional player, what complete game has he ever shown?
Pak was fine as a 13th forward but there was absolutely no upside with this player.

Pac again was the best shutdown winger this club had. Its best pk winger. He was knocking it out of the ballpark in that regard. In addition he was tough as nails to play against which perfectly befits WC conference bottomsix play. I doubt too there couldn't be upside. Guy has a hard shot, needed to get some confidence taking offensive chances but was a good depth player that always sports a very low GA either EV or pk. He also won a lot of pucks through his tenacity. Vegas have Carrier. A similar player to Pac who does not produce but is a consistently hard player to play against that pressures opponents effectively and limits ice. I have all day for those kinds of players in bottomsix or bottomline. These are honest hard nosed players that never hurt you.

Slepy has more talent, has exhibited the ability to win one on one battles and to find openings on the fly. On the rush Slepy is far more adept than Cagg just that he rarely had topsix or PP looks on this team. Additionally Slepy is hard to control, strong on the puck and punishing along the boards. A type of winger suited to Draisaitl that the coaching staff rarely played with Drai this season.

Instead it seems this org just decides in advance who it will keep and retain and on some basis other than whole evaluation of the players.


People get enticed with a one dimensional player like Cagg because he scores some goals with choice minutes. He costs the team more goals.