Fun fact: Barzal got 2 assists in 2 games with Islanders developments camp, Senyshyn got a hat trick in one game. Yes it was different sets of kids, style of play and probably talent levels, but don't throw out our picks just yet.
Red Line Draft Summary: Bruins dominate
- Thread starter DKH
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Fun fact: Barzal got 2 assists in 2 games with Islanders developments camp, Senyshyn got a hat trick in one game. Yes it was different sets of kids, style of play and probably talent levels, but don't throw out our picks just yet.
ChargersRookie
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- Jun 30, 2014
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Well said
Once the Bruins missed the playoffs and then ford Choarelli the main board were looking for any reason to jump all over Boston and Sweeney. Some can't fathom the thought process of picking off the board of the so-called experts.
They would still find excuses rant about Conner and Barzal. Another smallsh pass first center is not what the Bruins need in the future. A big kid, for his age, who can skate and shoot right-handed is what Sweeney wanted so he took one.
Connor is a LW, maybe you are thinking of Colin White.
This is how I see Connor, he is dominating in the USHL, getting a fat head maybe. Then when he gets to the NHL we get Semin.
The Barzal kid well he is talented with no strength in his hands. Same for Konecny or Merkley, I don't which one that I read the same thing about.
When someone argues that the Bruins should have picked Barzal are doing so because they wanted them to pick their player. Pretty sure the Bruins talked to these kids and maybe their interaction did not measure to their talent.
Anyways I have no beef with what the Bruins did. They took action unlike in the recent past which was a problem with the majority here I think.
They also addressed their needs and moved to getting a more scoring lineup. Did people expect the Bruins draft Barzal so he can feed Lucic in front of the net? Next year Barzal would still be in the WHL. The Bruins in my eyes fixed those 2 things.
Connor will most likely end up left wing in Winnipeg. Kid has speed and a wicked shot, really impressed at Jets camp. The Senyschyn pick, fine, brings size and speed, maybe he will surprise me...but Debrusk I just don't like the pick there either. Connor or Konecny would have been better. I've been reading and watching Konecny lately and I think this guy is going to be the steal of the draft. I think Dom was raving about him too if I recall. Maybe it will work out, still disappointed in the early picks.
patty59
***************
I mean, most likely end up, means that they have to have development in that position.
Not all guys can just transition from center to wing (Koko and Spooner examples). The brass decided to forgo that development process and picked pure wingers.
Debrusk loves to score and hopefully that transitions to the pro level.
Seth Griffith also loved to score and did so at every level.... his lack of skills outside of shooting are holding him back.
DeBrusk albeit is SLIGHTLY bigger than Griffith and is definitely the higher rated prospect. If that translates to a more skilled version of Griffith I'll be happy.
Ice Nine
Registered User
Not seen him play, and suspending judgment until I see more.
But Louie DeBrusk was probably the most useless hockey player I've ever seen lace up a pair of skates.
So, let's hope hockey IQ is not just a product of genetics.
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Season ticket holder in kelowna, avid whl fan, former whl scout who watches prospects closely as an old habit...ya never watched him at all.
Ice Nine
Registered User
So what you're saying is that you've seen so much of him play, you've lost all perspective on how good, in reality, he is.
jdz
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- May 22, 2013
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"Your speculation from hockey beat quotes was very weak, due to my counter-speculation sourced from my opinion"
yup...
trenton1
Bergeron for Hart
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Mr. Make-Believe
The happy genius of my household
Colt.45Orr
Registered User
As another WHL guy, I'll go on record as saying I wanted Barzal as well --kid has loads of (faster) Krejci in his game. DeBrusk, to me, could turn out to be Matt Moulson 2.0 and that would be great and I think he could turn out to be 210, 215 based on his dad's thickness so that would be great.
It is the scout's job to project players down the road and they get way more access to stuff (including the players themselves) so I'm not going to question them on their pick but --to my mind-- Barzal has been the better player/prospect thus far into their lives. The the scouting brass sees something that allow them to project differently then I hope it turns out for us because there will be some real questions asked of them if DeBrusk doesn't turn out and Barzal does.
It is the scout's job to project players down the road and they get way more access to stuff (including the players themselves) so I'm not going to question them on their pick but --to my mind-- Barzal has been the better player/prospect thus far into their lives. The the scouting brass sees something that allow them to project differently then I hope it turns out for us because there will be some real questions asked of them if DeBrusk doesn't turn out and Barzal does.
Colt.45Orr
Registered User
He's an opportunistic goal scorer but there are nights where you don't notice him out there much at all. I have questions about him being able to think the game at a high level at the next level in order to be a top scoring winger. I have 0 questions about his hands though
There is lots to like about him but he needs work.
PatriceBergeronFan
Registered User
Which I did not say at all. I said it is a weak reason/defense for why we picked someone early.
The much better defense is the Bruins just wanted these kids that damn badly. Trying to justify it because some other team might have also liked the same player 10 spots later is meaningless, was and is my point.
jdz
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- May 22, 2013
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Its not exactly meaningless when it was in reply to someone saying the Bruins might have been able to trade down and still get him.
I was not justifying the pick, I was justifying why they wouldn't have been able to trade down and still get the same guy. (other teams wanted him)
Obviously the bruins wanted the kid badly. (der)
GloveSave1
*** 15 ***
If Barzal is such a God, why didn't he go in the top 10? No one reached. Nothing. I think people are going a bit overboard. At the end of the day, he's in the same boat as the two forwards we took in the first - highly talented rolls of the dice.
I still say DS prob doesn't see him as "Bruins." That thinking has been in every move it seems. A call was made...no Barzal. I don't the Bruins had too many guys they wanted to take...they passed.
I still say DS prob doesn't see him as "Bruins." That thinking has been in every move it seems. A call was made...no Barzal. I don't the Bruins had too many guys they wanted to take...they passed.
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GloryDaze4877
Barely Irrelevant
So what you're saying is that you've seen so much of him play, you've lost all perspective on how good, in reality, he is.
Swift Current played Kelowna once in Kelowna this year, in October. Maybe DeBrusk had an off game?
GloryDaze4877
Barely Irrelevant
It's really not meaningless though.
The B's got bashed for reaching, particularly for Senyshyn. However, how is it a reach when there have been multiple rumors that several teams picking right behind them were all very interested in the player? The B's, contrary to popular belief at the time, were not going to be able to trade down to the second round (or even later in the first) and get the player. From what was said at DC, he likely doesn't get past DET and definitely doesn't get past TOR.
So how was he picked early?
GloryDaze4877
Barely Irrelevant
Pure speculation on my part, but the B's the last couple of seasons have been villified for their lack of finish. I think they project both DeBrusk and Senyshyn as scoring wings who can finish, versus Barzal who is looked at as more of a "pass first, puck possession" center. The B's have that in Krejci now and they also have that already in Spooner. Also, even though he was being called a wing by reporters at DC, I watched Heinen play C all year at Denver and he's another guy I would characterize as "pass first".
Guessing that the B's had all of those guys on their board with similar ratings and went with the better shooters because it's something they lack.
TheBigBadB
Registered User
Maybe the Bruins are just comfortable with their center depth right now and opted for wingers that fit the bruin mold. I mean we are probably set at center for the next 5 years at least. Maybe they learned with Seguin, Sodeberg, koko and most recently spooner that moving a center to wing may stunt the potential growth of the player.
Eddie Munson
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I still think Barzal would have been a great choice with any one of the three picks. The guy has a great compete level and plays a good all around game. While Connor on the other hand, owns elite skill but I don't know if he has that battle factor. Just seems like another perimeter player to me.
As for Boston's picks:
13th - Love Zboril, real Bruins-esque game in that he does everything well. Good skater, transitions the puck well, has good hockey IQ on both sides of the puck, has a great shot, plays a heavy game and plays it on the edge at times. Real good upside with this player, again I don't see him being an elite #1 or even a #1 but certainly a player similar to Seabrook in that he has a great toolbox and plays with an edge allowing the #1 to do things they otherwise couldn't if paired with a lesser player.
14th - Good pick, again the theme Sweeney went with is compete. Beyond having silky smooth hands DeBrusk also doesn't mind going to those dirty areas. He'll have to be a bit more like Recchi in that he needs to get there with timing but he's deadly around the net and has the shot to be deadly out by the tops of the circles. Not the fastest skater but shifty and with a decent motor. See a bit of Michael Ryder in his game and while that may be a turn off to some fans I'm not saying he's a carbon copy but just a player that understand space and has the tools to score when he gets the puck in those spaces like Ryder, I hear his glove hand is pretty good too. Could be deadly on the PP off the halfwall or in a power I in the slot.
15th - Love this pick. About 2 months before the draft Dom was nice enough to give me a list of players to look into for the 37th pick. The one he seemed most excited about was someone I had not really heard of, Zach Senyshyn. After a little (OK a lot!) digging up of videos it was hard not to be cheering for this kid. Great motor, elite speed and skating, real good shot, size and the ability and willingness to use it whether it be hitting or taking a hit. Upside is a legit top-6 powerforward, floor is likely a 3rd line energy player with a scoring touch. Certainly has a similar skill and game to Kreider. This year could certainly be a huge coming out party for him if all his skills progress and he gets top-6 minutes.
37th - I was a little scared Boston would fall into the Carlo trap at 15. You saw mocks with the Bruins taking him because "they need to replace Chara" or "He's big and Bad so he needs to be a Bruin" yet all I could think of was "please not another Mark Stuart situation". I was shocked to see him still there at 37 and after development camp I'm really happy with this pick. The guy is a giant and plays a physical game, with an edge but his skating for his size is what stands out. If he gets anywhere close to his ceiling this could be a dangerous NHLer that can be paired with a slew of players and he'll compliment nearly any of them.
45th - Wasn't overly familiar with this pick before the draft. Real good hands, skating and two-way play. Again the Bruins scouting and development team sticking to their guns of getting harder to play against and tenacious players with high compete. JFK again is a player with the skillset and IQ to reach a top-6 role if he maxes out but the two-way play and compete to be a bottom-6er if it doesn't all come together. Another good value pick halfway through the second round.
52nd - This is my sleeper of the top-60. Kid has a massive chip on his shoulder and his compete and willingness to do whatever it takes to win is evident every second he's on the ice. Another defensemen comfortable mixing it up physically and willing to send a message. Has a good all around tool set, decent skater, good size, good shot, good transition. The overall theme amongst defensemen in this draft is guys with games that can stand on their own that don't need to be paired with a particular type of defensemen to thrive. These do it all defensemen are becoming the cornerstone of great teams while not being elite they are essential to building whatever defense you want.
You add Gabrielle and Vladar to that group and you have a solid draft, maybe low on high end skill but guys who are top-6 and top-4 ceiling talent who will leave it all out on the ice. Something sorely missing the last few years here in Boston. Really happy with the direction this team in going in.
Just my take and I'm happy RDL seems to agree.
As for Boston's picks:
13th - Love Zboril, real Bruins-esque game in that he does everything well. Good skater, transitions the puck well, has good hockey IQ on both sides of the puck, has a great shot, plays a heavy game and plays it on the edge at times. Real good upside with this player, again I don't see him being an elite #1 or even a #1 but certainly a player similar to Seabrook in that he has a great toolbox and plays with an edge allowing the #1 to do things they otherwise couldn't if paired with a lesser player.
14th - Good pick, again the theme Sweeney went with is compete. Beyond having silky smooth hands DeBrusk also doesn't mind going to those dirty areas. He'll have to be a bit more like Recchi in that he needs to get there with timing but he's deadly around the net and has the shot to be deadly out by the tops of the circles. Not the fastest skater but shifty and with a decent motor. See a bit of Michael Ryder in his game and while that may be a turn off to some fans I'm not saying he's a carbon copy but just a player that understand space and has the tools to score when he gets the puck in those spaces like Ryder, I hear his glove hand is pretty good too
. Could be deadly on the PP off the halfwall or in a power I in the slot. 15th - Love this pick. About 2 months before the draft Dom was nice enough to give me a list of players to look into for the 37th pick. The one he seemed most excited about was someone I had not really heard of, Zach Senyshyn. After a little (OK a lot!
) digging up of videos it was hard not to be cheering for this kid. Great motor, elite speed and skating, real good shot, size and the ability and willingness to use it whether it be hitting or taking a hit. Upside is a legit top-6 powerforward, floor is likely a 3rd line energy player with a scoring touch. Certainly has a similar skill and game to Kreider. This year could certainly be a huge coming out party for him if all his skills progress and he gets top-6 minutes.37th - I was a little scared Boston would fall into the Carlo trap at 15. You saw mocks with the Bruins taking him because "they need to replace Chara" or "He's big and Bad so he needs to be a Bruin" yet all I could think of was "please not another Mark Stuart situation". I was shocked to see him still there at 37 and after development camp I'm really happy with this pick. The guy is a giant and plays a physical game, with an edge but his skating for his size is what stands out. If he gets anywhere close to his ceiling this could be a dangerous NHLer that can be paired with a slew of players and he'll compliment nearly any of them.
45th - Wasn't overly familiar with this pick before the draft. Real good hands, skating and two-way play. Again the Bruins scouting and development team sticking to their guns of getting harder to play against and tenacious players with high compete. JFK again is a player with the skillset and IQ to reach a top-6 role if he maxes out but the two-way play and compete to be a bottom-6er if it doesn't all come together. Another good value pick halfway through the second round.
52nd - This is my sleeper of the top-60. Kid has a massive chip on his shoulder and his compete and willingness to do whatever it takes to win is evident every second he's on the ice. Another defensemen comfortable mixing it up physically and willing to send a message. Has a good all around tool set, decent skater, good size, good shot, good transition. The overall theme amongst defensemen in this draft is guys with games that can stand on their own that don't need to be paired with a particular type of defensemen to thrive. These do it all defensemen are becoming the cornerstone of great teams while not being elite they are essential to building whatever defense you want.
You add Gabrielle and Vladar to that group and you have a solid draft, maybe low on high end skill but guys who are top-6 and top-4 ceiling talent who will leave it all out on the ice. Something sorely missing the last few years here in Boston. Really happy with the direction this team in going in.
Just my take and I'm happy RDL seems to agree.
incidental otter
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- May 27, 2015
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Hi All,
Serious question for those who think the B's reached (or went "off board") for Senyshyn: if you're basing that opinion on various mock drafts and ratings services, why value those player estimates so highly?
I liken the situation to the beat reporters who cover a team. They have daily access that the general public does not, but they admit that closed doors hide the whole story from even them.
Why wouldn't it work the same way for independent scouts? I trust Dom and Kirk (amongst other posters) with player evaluation, but I'd be surprised if they've done the Vulcan mind meld with Sweeney.
I don't understand taking a GM to task based on the opinions of those who lack full information.
Serious question for those who think the B's reached (or went "off board") for Senyshyn: if you're basing that opinion on various mock drafts and ratings services, why value those player estimates so highly?
I liken the situation to the beat reporters who cover a team. They have daily access that the general public does not, but they admit that closed doors hide the whole story from even them.
Why wouldn't it work the same way for independent scouts? I trust Dom and Kirk (amongst other posters) with player evaluation, but I'd be surprised if they've done the Vulcan mind meld with Sweeney.
I don't understand taking a GM to task based on the opinions of those who lack full information.
Redline is one of the many draft guides I subscribe to but I don't get the monthly.
Did the piece give any insight as to the method of picking these rankings? Looking at the average rating it looks like it should go:
Winnipeg: 72.125
Boston: 76
Arizona: 98.888
Toronto: 101.667
New York Islanders: 102.142
Columbus: 138.333
Philadelphia: 170.888
I used 317 for the picks that Redline did not rank: Dzierkals, Ruopp, Nutivaara, Vorobyov, Fedotov, Song
Did the piece give any insight as to the method of picking these rankings? Looking at the average rating it looks like it should go:
Winnipeg: 72.125
Boston: 76
Arizona: 98.888
Toronto: 101.667
New York Islanders: 102.142
Columbus: 138.333
Philadelphia: 170.888
I used 317 for the picks that Redline did not rank: Dzierkals, Ruopp, Nutivaara, Vorobyov, Fedotov, Song
